Why Pentium?

Discussion in 'Computer Information' started by Talal Itani, Jul 3, 2006.

  1. Talal Itani

    kony Guest

    I already did in another post, to protect themselves from
    incompetent system integrators/assemblers/etc. I'm sure
    they don't mind having it as a feature on an spec sheet
    either.



    .... because you don't know how to made sound system design
    decisions.


    .... because even after being given a strong hint about how
    to combat such things you still prefer to focus on events
    that are outside a reasonable expectation, instead of taking
    the prudent steps to combat them first.


    I knew you'd try to grasp at straws. Reread my past posts,
    I'd stated as much already.

    Read more carefully next time.


    You overlooked what I wrote in previous posts, will you
    overlook what I wrote above so I need repeat it again?
     
    kony, Jul 5, 2006
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  2. Talal Itani

    kony Guest

    On Thu, 6 Jul 2006 05:09:04 +1000, "Rod Speed"



    So when faced with the fact that you can't keep a system
    running and need a protection mechanism, you crash into an
    endless loop?
     
    kony, Jul 5, 2006
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  3. Talal Itani

    kony Guest


    No duh about it, if you have built systems that had CPU
    'sink fan failures it was an incompetent build. If merely
    citing 3rd party builds, avoid them if they haven't bothered
    to set up the system properly for long term use.

    In this day and age, a system with a fan failure before the
    system is completely obsolete, is defective.
     
    kony, Jul 5, 2006
  4. Talal Itani

    Conor Guest

    You've never worked in a proper company have you?


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    Conor, Jul 5, 2006
  5. Talal Itani

    Conor Guest

    Because once every two to three years, a fan may pack up.

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    Conor, Jul 5, 2006
  6. Talal Itani

    Rod Speed Guest

    Yep, in spite of what kony keeps proclaiming.
     
    Rod Speed, Jul 5, 2006
  7. Talal Itani

    Rod Speed Guest

    Have fun explaining why even amd now has thermal shutdown.
     
    Rod Speed, Jul 5, 2006
  8. Talal Itani

    Rod Speed Guest

    No you didnt. You just mindlessly waffled.
    Anyone with a clue realises that its never going to be
    feasible to ensure that the cpu fan wont fail, and when
    thermal shutdown costs peanuts to implement, does that.

    And lets not forget that amd was stupid enough to try
    to do without thermal shutdown in the days when their
    cpus generally werent supplied with boxed fans too.
    Mindless stuff.
    They did that just for me eh ? How odd that I
    dont generally use their cpus for other reasons.
    Wrong again. I actually choose to use intel cpus most of the
    time for other reasons, like the fact that the chipset and cpu
    are designed by the same operation, and that the pre prescott
    cpus were nice and quiet and I insist on quiet systems that
    dont have any extra fans over the cpu and PSU fans.
    You're lying about what I ever said.
    Never ever could bullshit its way out of its predicament.
    Nope, it was always mindless pig ignorant shit.

    Clearly amd actually has a clue NOW about
    how to design cpus even if you dont.
     
    Rod Speed, Jul 5, 2006
  9. Talal Itani

    Rod Speed Guest

    Never ever could bullshit its way out of a wet paper bag.

    Fortunately no one was ever stupid enough to
    let you have any say what so ever on cpu design.
     
    Rod Speed, Jul 5, 2006
  10. Talal Itani

    Rod Speed Guest

    Precisely, in spite of what kony mindlessly pig ignorantly claims.
     
    Rod Speed, Jul 5, 2006
  11. Talal Itani

    kony Guest


    I suppose I should feel pity if you can't set a system up
    and expect more than a couple years inbetween fan failures?

    Good quality CPU 'sink fans implemented with moderate RPM do
    not fail in two to three years. Just as one can buy a
    crap power supply with fradulent ratings, one could buy a
    crap fan with fradulent ratings, but when speaking of good
    quality fans, they are rated for 50-100K hours and there is
    no reasonable expectation that such a fan will fail within a
    decade.

    In the end it boils down to your pretending to know what
    you're talking about vs actually having experience
    implementing high quality fans. Instead of accepting that
    you are not competent to select high quality components to
    directly address the problem, you seek a safety net to limit
    the damage your ineptitude causes.

    There is one quite limited scenario where good quality fans
    are more likely to fail prematurely (or rather, too great a
    variable to predict with specs), in very extreme
    environments such a desert sand, rock dust, certain
    industrial chemical environments where even a filtration
    system is ineffective or cost prohibitive. Such systems are
    pulled out of service on regular intervals instead of left
    running till the fans fail.
     
    kony, Jul 5, 2006
  12. Talal Itani

    kony Guest


    You are example enough, you have no idea how to mitigate
    system failures and minimize downtime.
     
    kony, Jul 5, 2006
  13. Talal Itani

    Rod Speed Guest

    Never ever could bullshit its way out of a wet paper bag.
     
    Rod Speed, Jul 6, 2006
  14. Talal Itani

    Rod Speed Guest

    Never ever could bullshit its way out of a wet paper bag.
    Have fun explaining why even amd now has thermal shutdown.
    Have fun explaining why even amd now has thermal shutdown.
    Have fun explaining why even amd now has thermal shutdown.
    Another pig ignorant lie. I choose to use the boxed fans thanks.
    Have fun explaining why even amd now has thermal shutdown.
    Have fun explaining why even amd now has thermal shutdown.

    The reason is that it costs peanuts and only a fool would
    actually be stupid enough to risk damage to the most
    expensive component in the system. You qualify in spades.
     
    Rod Speed, Jul 6, 2006
  15. Talal Itani

    kony Guest


    Yes you're right on one count, that implementation wasn't at
    great expense within the context of overall CPU design.

    Stupidity would have to be your assumption that a properly
    implemented cooling system is at significant risk of fan
    failure. How many systems have you managed to turn into
    unreliable time-bombs with this attitude? Apparently quite
    a few else you'd not think the shutdown mechanism was
    important.
     
    kony, Jul 6, 2006
  16. Talal Itani

    Tony Hill Guest

    Sadly you're right, this is far too common.
    Actually it does happen quite often in my experience. By far the most
    common cause of a heatsink coming lose from a CPU, not counting
    improper installation, is when it does so in shipping (either via a
    courier company or simply someone moving their computer). Most of the
    time the end result is that the heatsink tears totally lose from the
    motherboard and is sitting in the bottom of the case. The processor
    often comes along with it because cold thermal paste is pretty darn
    sticky stuff, more than sticky enough to yank the CPU out of the
    socket.

    Interesting side note: I haven't seen this happen often enough with
    the new LGA-775 sockets to know how this would affect things vs. the
    old pin-on-CPU style sockets. I suspect the new pin-on-motherboard
    design would be better for surviving such a crash. Of course, the new
    LGA-775 sockets also hold the CPU in place MUCH more securely, so the
    chips probably wouldn't get yanked out in the first place.
    I never had any issues with the CPU top on AMD chips, but I didn't
    much like how tough it was to clamp the heatsinks down. I was always
    more worried about accidentally scratching up the system board with
    the screwdriver used to mount the thing. AMD and Intel's newer
    solutions are much better.
    I've been using nVidia chipsets for about 4 years now, and in my books
    their track record easily matches Intel's for reliability and drivers.
    Even if I were buying an Intel CPU I would strongly consider one of
    nVidia's chipsets for some of their features.
    1GB of memory is cheap these days, no need to limit a system to any
    less. Beyond 1GB the performance advantage for most users is VERY
    small, much smaller than a faster CPU.
    I think you're underestimating the average computer user. People DO
    notice differences in performance. They might not *care* that much,
    but that's not to say they won't notice it. This is true even for
    fairly simple tasks like web browsing, e-mail, word processing, etc.
    Note that when I mention the 20% number I'm talking about actual
    application performance, not some synthetic CPU benchmark or anything
    like that. Often times it takes much more than a 20% improvement in
    CPU performance to equal a 20% improvement in overall system
    performance.
     
    Tony Hill, Jul 6, 2006
  17. Talal Itani

    Rod Speed Guest

    Wrong with the choice between single and dual core
    cpus with what most do on their personal desktop
    systems apart from games and transcoding.
    No they dont with 20% in cpu benchmarks.
    Oh bullshit with 20% in the cpu benchmark the only
    difference between two otherwise identical systems.
    We were clearly discussing that dual core cpu question.
     
    Rod Speed, Jul 6, 2006
  18. Talal Itani

    Rod Speed Guest

    Peanuts, like I said.
    Tell amd, dont be too surprised when they laugh in your face.
    None, zero, nada, ziltch.
    Never ever could bullshit its way out of a wet paper bag.
     
    Rod Speed, Jul 6, 2006
  19. Talal Itani

    kony Guest


    Then you are your own evidence as to why it doesn't matter
    as much as the proper cooling components, that they are the
    priority.
     
    kony, Jul 6, 2006
  20. Talal Itani

    Rod Speed Guest

    Separate matter entirely to whether anyone but a fool would include
    thermal shutdown in the cpu design WHEN IT COSTS PEANUTS TO
    DO THAT AND THAT WILL PREVENT DESTRUCTION OF THE MOST
    EXPENSIVE COMPONENT IN MOST SYSTEMS IF THE FAN DOES FAIL.

    You cant actually be THAT thick.

    You're clearly just being mindlessly argumentative.
     
    Rod Speed, Jul 6, 2006
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