What is a photographer?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by AustinBoston, Oct 12, 2004.

  1. AustinBoston

    GT40 Guest

    I didn't say that there was a reference to a camera, only that a
    photocopier doesn't work the same was as a camera does.
     
    GT40, Oct 17, 2004
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  2. AustinBoston

    Bruce Murphy Guest

    *cough* scanning backs for LF cameras *cough*

    B>
     
    Bruce Murphy, Oct 17, 2004
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  3. AustinBoston

    Bruce Murphy Guest

    I'm not comment on his 'disagreeing with me'. I'm commenting on how,
    with NO JUSTIFICATION WHATSOEVER after I explicitly said "Digital
    cameras can take photographs under exactly the same conditions as film
    photographs" this insecure little idiot comes back and says "well
    before you claim I'm not a photographer, I did blah blah blah".

    Or better yet where I offer a computer generated image as example of
    something which would be fairly uniformly accepted as not being a
    photograph he leaps into the fray with:

    "
    So in your view if someone uses a digital camera then they aren't a
    photographer because there is no photograph. So only cameras that use
    film can produce a photograph?
    "

    Frankly, this isn't him disgreeing with me, this is random gibberish
    triggerd by keywords.

    B>
     
    Bruce Murphy, Oct 17, 2004
  4. AustinBoston

    Big Bill Guest

    Why should your addition be accepted as part of the definition of a
    photographer?
    It's obvious from the addition itself that your snobbishness is the
    reason *you* think it should ("Well, they aren't real photographs,
    now, are they, really?"), but why should *we* accept it?
    Bill Funk
    Change "g" to "a"
     
    Big Bill, Oct 17, 2004
  5. AustinBoston

    Big Bill Guest

    I see that you don't answer.
    I did see your addition to reality earlier, and commented on it then.
    Your addition is only an expression of your ego, and is not rooted in
    reality.

    Bill Funk
    Change "g" to "a"
     
    Big Bill, Oct 17, 2004
  6. AustinBoston

    Bruce Murphy Guest

    Have you ever for a second thought about what makes your view
    'reality' and anyone else's view 'additions to reality'?

    B>
     
    Bruce Murphy, Oct 17, 2004
  7. AustinBoston

    Big Bill Guest

    According to Bruce, it does:
    "Mine would be "A photographer is one who uses mechanical and/or
    electronic devices to create an image that uses photons as an
    integral part of the process of creating the image." "
    A photocopier does just that.

    I've not included his addition, since that covers the intent of the
    photographer, not the act of taking a photograph.

    Bill Funk
    Change "g" to "a"
     
    Big Bill, Oct 17, 2004
  8. AustinBoston

    Big Bill Guest

    I'd take care of that, if I were you.
    Flu season's coming.
    Bill Funk
    Change "g" to "a"
     
    Big Bill, Oct 17, 2004
  9. AustinBoston

    Bruce Murphy Guest

    I suggest you get your quoting straight. While I keep asking people
    whether they intended to include photocopiers in their definitions, I
    have never made the below statement.
    Yes, a common flaw of these definitions. One that my additions fixed
    in a fairly elegant way.
    So you feel that someone who falls accidently onto a camera is a
    photographer? If you remove all the intent parts you will include this
    case.

    B>
     
    Bruce Murphy, Oct 17, 2004
  10. AustinBoston

    Big Bill Guest

    In many cases, it's an indication of an insecurity on the part of the
    person who tries hard to qualify the word; he feels that if just
    *anyone* with a camera can be a photographer, it somehow cheapens the
    efforts of all who are *really* photographers. So, it becomes
    necessary to keep out the huddled unwashed who have no real
    appreciation of the finer points. That's why P&S cameras are looked
    down on by some; they represent all that's 'bad' about the lower ranks
    of photographers.
    I've seen it here in many guises, as I'm sure many others have, too.
    The Phoenix Zoo used to have an elephant named Ruby; she was an
    "artist" because she could manage to put paint mostly on a canvas.
    Her "art" was sold as fund raising, and many people paid a pretty
    penny to be able to hang Ruby's 'art' on their walls.
    Does an elephant have the actual intelligence to make "art"? I don't
    know. If the act of putting paint (or other such) on canvas makes one
    an artist, I guess so. I have no ability to judge art. I don't even
    know why "The Gleaners" is good art.

    Bill Funk
    Change "g" to "a"
     
    Big Bill, Oct 17, 2004
  11. AustinBoston

    Bruce Murphy Guest

    Whereas I'm delighted to consider anyone a photographer who takes
    steps to care about the properties of the image they're taking. Hardly
    an insurmountable obstacle.
    Mostly they're just incredibly frustrating. Of course, people who only
    respond to keywords not infrequently make this sort of mistake.

    B>
     
    Bruce Murphy, Oct 17, 2004
  12. AustinBoston

    GT40 Guest

    Go to www.howstuffworks.com and look at how a photocopier works. Its
    not the same as a camera.
     
    GT40, Oct 17, 2004
  13. Reading the camera owner's manual cover to cover would be a start. ;-)
    And you'd be wrong.

    Would you call a person who owns the tools of a carpenter, but is
    mostly unskilled or ignorant in the craft of carpentry, a carpenter?
    Of course not. The same can be said of photography. To be a
    photographer entails more than the ability to record an image on a
    piece of film or a computer chip. You, like so many others, have
    been deluded by a lifetime barrage of photographic marketing hype
    that photography, and being a photographer, is only about the
    equipment you own and the film you use, and nothing more: To be a
    great photographer, buy this camera; or great photographers use this
    film. Nothing could be further from the truth.

    As a self-taught, professional photographer with 30 years experience,
    you don't know how many times my expert advice has been solicited by
    aspiring shooters on which camera to buy or film to use to take
    "great" pictures. I've always replied, that it's not the film or
    camera that makes great pictures; great pictures are directly
    proportional to the skills of the person taking them. The type of
    equipment or the make of film used are, for the most part,
    irrelevent.

    You may disagree. But you'd be wrong.
    How so? My little definition implies nothing of the "types" or
    "sorts" of photographers. It applies to ALL photographers, in
    general. Actually, it is applicable to any craftsman. Just
    substitue the appropriate craft.
     
    Stefan Patric, Oct 18, 2004
  14. AustinBoston

    Frank ess Guest

    And a person who owns a camera is not a photographer.

    When either of them produces a pertinent product, then s/he becomes,
    respectively, a carpenter and a photographer.

    You may disagree, but you'd be wrong.

    <snip>
     
    Frank ess, Oct 18, 2004
  15. AustinBoston

    Crownfield Guest

    what is an ignorant carpenter,
    or what is a bad carpenter?
     
    Crownfield, Oct 18, 2004
  16. AustinBoston

    George Guest

    The best way to define what a photographer is, is to explain
    what he is not.

    mark_

    Ok I will give you an example. A person who is not or doesn't consider
    himself a photographer doesn't have the right frame of mind for it.
    See? That was easy.

    mark_ (again)

    Doesn't work for me. Following that logic, all BMW owners are "drivers"
    and everyone owning something else is a "pylon".

    Back to the photographer issue, nobody said (s)he had to be a GOOD
    photographer.
    So, a photographer is someone with access to a camera who DOES push the
    button
    (sorry Leica collectors, ya gotta push the button).

    George (wearing flameproof underwear)
     
    George, Oct 18, 2004
  17. AustinBoston

    kashe Guest

    Perhaps one who thinks that owning a lot of new power tools
    makes him a carpenter, but still can't drive a nail straight or join
    two pieces of wood so the edges are square with each other?
     
    kashe, Oct 19, 2004
  18. How much time has to lapse between using and not using a camera
    before one considers themselves not a photographer?
     
    mark_digital©, Oct 19, 2004
  19. AustinBoston

    JPS Guest

    In message <>,
    Do the words "camera" and "photograph" look alike to you?
    --
     
    JPS, Oct 19, 2004
  20. AustinBoston

    bob Guest


    And maybe we should make up new meanings for other words too. That way we
    can all speak our own private language and no one will know what the hell
    we're talking about. That's a good plan.

    Bob
     
    bob, Oct 19, 2004
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