Wanadoo SMTP server - grrrrrrrrrr!

Discussion in 'Home Networking' started by Martin Underwood, Mar 29, 2006.

  1. I have a "how do I set this up" question concerned with POP/SMTP email.

    A customer has a laptop which he sometimes uses at work (via ADSL to
    Wanadoo) and sometimes at home or in a hotel. He wants to be able to
    send/receive email using Outlook Express or Outlook no matter how he's
    connected to the internet.

    Receiving email is no problem: irrespective of the connection he can contact
    the POP server of the third-party company (not Wanadoo) which hosts his
    mailbox.

    But outgoing is more of a problem because of the restriction that you can
    normally only send via a server that belongs to the ISP by whom you are
    accessing the internet.

    The two possibilities are:

    1. Use Wanadoo's SMTP server smtp.wanadoo.co.uk, specifiying that OE must
    authenticate when connecting to the server; normally this overcomes the
    "foreign ISP" restriction.

    2. Use the SMTP server that corresponds to his POP server, again with SMTP
    authentication turned on.

    However both these fail because Wanadoo's security seems to be rather
    draconian.

    1. From outside of Wanadoo, I cannot even get a reply from
    smtp.wanadoo.co.uk (there's no response to "telnet smtp.wandoo.co.uk 25"),
    never mind getting as far as authentication.

    2. The other SMTP server works fine for connections from a variety of ISPs
    (I've tried Force 9, Virgin and another one), but Wanadoo block access to
    non-Wanadoo SMTP servers: OE gets a reply saying "You must use
    smtp.wanadoo.co.uk" if I configure it to use anything else. The same is true
    with "telnet other-server 25" - the response to this command is the same
    error message: it's presumably coming from Wanadoo rather than from the
    server I'm trying to telnet to.


    So I'm a bit stuck: I can't use Wanadoo's SMTP server because this is only
    accessible from a Wanadoo connection, and I can't use a non-Wanadoo server
    because this isn't accessible from Wanadoo. Any suggestions? I don't really
    want to have to recommend that he sends via a web interface because he
    wants a consistent, professional setup which gives him offline access to
    historical sent and received mail.
     
    Martin Underwood, Mar 29, 2006
    #1
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  2. Martin Underwood

    norm Guest

    SNIP

    try www.mail2web, might work.
     
    norm, Mar 29, 2006
    #2
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  3. Martin Underwood

    Rob Morley Guest

    <snip>

    Two other solutions -

    Run a SMTP server on the laptop - other servers may refuse to talk to it
    because spammers use this technique

    Run a SMTP proxy on a machine in the office and let him connect to the
    Wanadoo server through that - make sure it's secure or spammers may find
    it and abuse it.
     
    Rob Morley, Mar 29, 2006
    #3
  4. norm wrote in message
    :
    For the benefit of anyone else, it seems that this address should be
    www.mail2web.com

    This is a web interface, which is fine, especially if the ISP doesn't
    provide one of its own.

    However ideally I'm looking for a solution the customer's problem of using a
    POP/SMTP program such as Outlook, and being able to send emails through the
    same server no matter whether he's connected to Wandaoo (which blocks access
    to all non-Wanadoo SMTP servers) or to any other ISP (which allow access to
    the SMTP server associated with his POP one, but which can't be used to
    access the Wanadoo server). Spot the Catch 22! Access to his POP server is
    fine from anywhere; it's only SMTP that's the problem.

    I know he could send from a web interface, but ideally he'd like a record of
    all his outgoing emails in one central place in Outlook on his PC.
     
    Martin Underwood, Mar 29, 2006
    #4
  5. Martin Underwood

    deKay Guest

    Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Wed, 29 Mar
    2006 09:40:58 GMT, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
    uk.comp.home-networking, yawatina tan reek esk (norm)
    fornis do marikano es bono tan el:
    "I don't really
    want to have to recommend that he sends via a web interface because he
    wants a consistent, professional setup which gives him offline access to
    historical sent and received mail. "

    deKay
     
    deKay, Mar 29, 2006
    #5
  6. Martin Underwood

    Gaz Guest

    Or find a hosting company that will allow you to use their smtp servers, for
    probable about £10 a year, who wont block you..

    Gaz
     
    Gaz, Mar 29, 2006
    #6
  7. Martin Underwood

    Alex Fraser Guest

    [snip]
    Wanadoo's interference means you can't route mail when connected via
    Wanadoo, regardless of whether the intended server would refuse it anyway.
    It would probably make more sense to do as Gaz described and pay someone
    else to run the server; this saves effort and avoids risk. But the server
    must be accessible via a non-standard port to circumvent Wanadoo's
    interference.

    Alex
     
    Alex Fraser, Mar 29, 2006
    #7
  8. Martin Underwood

    Clint Sharp Guest

    Is this the same customer who wants the VPN? If it is, why not set him
    up a cheap P3 machine with something like Mercury/32 and let him use the
    IMAP server in said mail server from Outlook?
    Ditch Wanadoo, not because I can think of any particular ISP to replace
    them with but at least get him with a business oriented ISP.
     
    Clint Sharp, Mar 29, 2006
    #8
  9. Martin Underwood

    Rob Morley Guest

    You mean they're selectively blocking internet connections to certain
    ports?
    I guess you do mean that.
     
    Rob Morley, Mar 30, 2006
    #9
  10. Martin Underwood

    Fred Guest

    Create 2 accounts in Outlook Express. One account using the Wanadoo's SMTP
    server and the other with all the same details using your preferred
    non-Wanadoo server. Only use the first account to get email from the POP3
    server so you only get one lot of mail.

    If you're elsewhere in the world use the second (non Wanadoo) account in the
    drop down "from:" in the create mail window.

    Not ideal but it would work and if there was any error you'd get to see the
    problem as soon as you tried sending the email.
     
    Fred, Mar 30, 2006
    #10
  11. Fred wrote in
    442bf110$0$8347$:
    I was coming round to thinking that I'd need to go for a two-account
    solution :-(
     
    Martin Underwood, Mar 30, 2006
    #11
  12. Martin Underwood

    Alex Fraser Guest

    Not blocking, intercepting. See the original post. Last I heard, which was
    in the days of Freeserve, you would be connected to a Freeserve SMTP server
    instead of what appears to be a "stub" server that simply gives an error
    message.

    Alex
     
    Alex Fraser, Mar 30, 2006
    #12
  13. Martin Underwood

    Dave J. Guest

    Am I right in thinking that they intercept any port 25 connection and
    route it to their (working) email server?

    So, if that is the case, would a setup aimed toward a paid for server
    elsewhere be intercepted by wanadoo and still (appear to) work over
    wanadoo's link?

    IOW if you're connecting via a proper connection then it would do what you
    tell it and link to the paid for SMTP account, but if connecting via
    Wanadon't then it would be diverted to their server, and still appear to
    work?

    Only snag I can think of is that most paid for servers require you to log
    in before use, and that would probably fail on wannadoo's system.

    Still, I suppose it'd reduce the settings that need changing to just the
    UID/PW. You might be lucky and find that wanadoo's smtp doesn't care if
    you log in with an irrelevant userID but I doubt it.

    Alternately some mail providers do a 'read before write' setting, where
    logging in to your pop account temporarily authorises that IP for sending
    mail as well. Then there's less hassle, all you have to do is collect the
    (nonexistent) mail via your pop client before sending.

    Dave J.
     
    Dave J., Mar 31, 2006
    #13
  14. Martin Underwood

    Alex Fraser Guest

    That is certainly what they used to do. But the original post suggests this
    has been changed: instead of being able to send email, you get an error
    message telling you to use the appropriate server.

    Alex
     
    Alex Fraser, Mar 31, 2006
    #14
  15. Martin Underwood

    David Wade Guest

    This fails for many ISPs, not just Wanadoo

    I think that the spammers, and the draconian black lists have forced this on
    many ISPs especially Wanadoo.
    Most ISPs block access to port 25. Did you try any other servers....
    Thats odd. Wanadoo used to trap all port 25 and pass transparenlty..
    This is a fairly common problem. How about two accounts in OE.... Whats
    wrong with Wanadoo dialup when out and about...
    You could try using having two "hosts" files that override the address
    lookup?
     
    David Wade, Mar 31, 2006
    #15
  16. Martin Underwood

    David Wade Guest

    Why not ditch Wanadoo and swap to an more flexible ISP like Eclipse, Zen or
    A&A. Wanadoo will convert his account to a Pay as You Go and so long as he
    dials in every 90 days he can keep the e-mail address. And Eclipse and ZEN
    will let him use other SMTP servers.... The big problem with big ISPs such
    as Wanadoo, BT, NTL and AOL is that they can't be flexible with what they
    offer.
     
    David Wade, Mar 31, 2006
    #16
  17. David Wade wrote in
    :
    I might suggest this: I'm not impressed with the flexibility and customer
    service of the big names like BT, Wanadoo and AOL. I'd recommend my
    customers to avoid them and go for someone like Tiscali. PlusNet or
    Freedom2Surf, from the point of view of technical knowledge and customer
    service.

    BT don't even allow domains to be used for forwarding email (at least on a
    non-business account) - as I found when I tried to transfer a customer's
    domain from a BT dial-up business account to a BT broadband domestic
    account.
     
    Martin Underwood, Mar 31, 2006
    #17
  18. David Wade wrote in
    :
    I could cope with two accounts, and the need to select the correct one when
    sending outgoing mail, but I think the customer might get confused.

    He wants to use whatever broadband connection he can find on a customer's
    site or at home, not be forced to use dial-up simply in order to satisfy the
    requirement that it's still Wanadoo.

    I can't work out why Wanadoo are being so restrictive. I can understand them
    requiring an non-Wanadoo connection to authenticate when sending via a
    Wanadoo server, whereas they allow non-authenticated for theri own
    connection. But why do they block their own connection talking to an
    external SMTP server?

    I know Freedom2Surf allow email to be sent via their SMTP server from a
    non-F2S connection such as BT, because I've got a customer who used this
    configuration.
     
    Martin Underwood, Mar 31, 2006
    #18
  19. Martin Underwood

    Rob Morley Guest

    Because a hacker could run a mail server on a compromised machine
    connected to the Wanadoo network to send bulk spam.
     
    Rob Morley, Apr 1, 2006
    #19
  20. Rob Morley wrote in
    :
    So why are other ISPs not so concerned about this? Maybe because they allow
    "foreign" connections to use their SMTP server providing a genuine email
    account (the same as for their POP server) is used.

    And if there is a genuine problem, what is the proper solution to the very
    common situation of a laptop that needs to be able to send and receive email
    with a single email config (Outlook or Outlook Express) no matter which
    network it is connected to? Webmail has the very serious restriction that
    you don't have offline access to saved incoming and sent email.
     
    Martin Underwood, Apr 1, 2006
    #20
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