TSA strikes again

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark), Dec 9, 2005.

  1. Well, going through the San Francisco airport today, it seems
    like TSA found something terrible in my bag. As I went through
    security, they found a problem. The x-ray line was stopped and
    my bag was put through again. Uh-OH! They think there is
    something terrible in there. They take it all apart, desperately
    searching for something "hidden" in the bag. Take things
    out. Put them in trays. Put the trays through x-ray. Can't
    find it. Search some more. About 20 minutes, it seemed,
    and they finally say what they are searching for: "Do you
    have allen wrenches?" Gee, I don't think so, only computer
    equipment, I said. The search continued. They finally found
    the allen wrench, about 2 mm in diameter. It is in a plastic
    bag with spare screws for my camera quick release wimberly
    plates. I must have put it in the wrong backpack on my photo
    trip to New Mexico last week. "I thought those were OK now"
    I said. The TSA guy said "We've seen the news reports on TV,
    but we have not received guidance, so these are still banned.
    Lesson: the terrorists will send advance people armed with
    tiny allen wrenches to divert attention from the real stuff.

    Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark), Dec 9, 2005
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  2. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    cjcampbell Guest

    I wonder just how helpless the American public has to be before we are
    'safe' for, er, from terrorists?

    Maybe it would be better if TSA just issued baseball bats to all
    airline passengers.

    But, speaking as a pilot, there will never be another hijacking where a
    plane is deliberately flown into a building. 9/11 happened in the
    context of pilots complying with whatever hijackers asked of them.
    Nowadays, a pilot will take whatever measures are necessary to render a
    hijacker helpless, no matter who or what the terrorist takes hostage.
    Roll the airplane, violent maneuvers, depressurize the cabin, fly into
    the ground, call for the Air Force to shoot you down -- no matter what,
    the terrorist does not get the airplane.

    The most practical method for preventing hijackings has yet to be
    implemented: take out the first few rows of seats and paint a yellow
    line on the floor. Give an armed uniformed officer a seat by the
    pilots' door. If anyone, no matter who, crosses the yellow line while
    the plane is in flight, he dies. Hijackers can only come up the center
    aisle single file, and then only slowly.

    Those measures leave blowing up the airplane as the terrorists' only
    alternative. Somehow I don't think confiscating Allen wrenches and
    naiil clippers will prevent that. Other measures must be used.
    cjcampbell, Dec 9, 2005
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  3. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    This old Bob Guest

    It could be used to put something else together as well as used to take
    something apart.

    In any event, thanks for the heads up.
    This old Bob, Dec 9, 2005
  4. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Paul Rubin Guest

    A much more practical scheme is used by airlines like El Al which care
    about actual security rather than just inconveniencing passengers for
    show or for intimidation. El Al simply has a reinforced door closing
    off the cockpit, which is locked on the ground before takeoff and
    can't be unlocked except by ground personnel after the plane lands.
    No amount of mayhem or hostage taking in the passenger compartment can
    possibly get the pilots to unlock the cockpit, because they're not
    able to.

    The downside is that the cockpit section needs its own washroom and
    possibly its own emergency exit, since the pilots can't use the the
    regular ones in the passenger cabin. This stuff takes space on the
    plane, requiring removing a few seats and decreasing revenue. That
    seems to be why US airlines haven't been willing to use that simple
    Paul Rubin, Dec 9, 2005
  5. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    c Guest

    Or maybe we're simply not bright enough to implement something that works,
    even though it was someone else's idea. I wonder how much revenue is lost
    due to the security measures taken at US airports. Think of the cost of the
    security equipment, the labor, and the unknown number of people that no
    longer fly on shorter trips because of the hassles and the increased time of
    getting through the airport.

    This thread interests me because I am flying to the Philippines next month
    along with a friend of mine. He requires an IPAP? machine, and I wonder how
    that will affect us. I am bringing my camera of course, and would like to
    bring my laptop as well, but I'm thinking this is going to be a big hassle.
    It might just be easier to buy a couple extra memory cards and leave the PC
    at home.

    c, Dec 9, 2005
  6. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Paul Rubin Guest

    Flying with a laptop is no big deal. They make you take it out of your
    bag and send it through the x-ray on a tray, and then they swab it with
    something that's supposed to detect explosives, but it's a routine thing,
    no worse hassle than the other hassles they already put you through.

    I don't expect the CPAP (I think that's what you meant) to cause any
    problem, but just to be sure, your friend should bring his doctor's
    prescription for it along, and maybe its operating manual that
    explains what it is.


    mentions some issues of travelling with CPAP machines, especially if
    your friend has to use the machine on the plane.
    Paul Rubin, Dec 9, 2005
  7. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    RobG Guest

    Yeah... and I know an ex-SAS chap who can kill you about 100 different
    ways, mostly silent, mostly without anything anyone would recognise as a
    'weapon'. If you want extreme pain without actually getting too close to
    being dead, he's your man for that too.

    This whole anti-terror thing s***s me to tears.

    RobG, Dec 9, 2005
  8. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    c Guest

    Actually, I was wrong, it is a BiPAP machine. The difference being CPAP is
    constant pressure and BiPAP changes pressure for inhaling and exhaling.

    c, Dec 9, 2005
  9. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Paul Rubin Guest

    I expect the travel issues are about the same.
    Paul Rubin, Dec 9, 2005
  10. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Bucky Guest

    Very interesting, thanks for sharing this piece of info.
    That can't be the real reason (I hope). Much more money is being spent
    on staff, equipment, etc. than lost revenue from a few seats. They
    could just use the security fee to subsidize the seat revenue.
    Bucky, Dec 9, 2005
  11. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    c Guest

    Yeah I'm sure they are, the machines are similar in size.

    c, Dec 9, 2005
  12. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Ron Hunter Guest

    Wow! An Allen wrench. This guy must be a terorist. What's next,
    bridgework? Sigh.
    Ron Hunter, Dec 9, 2005
  13. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Ron Hunter Guest

    I agree. Before 9/11, a hijacking was a relatively harmless event in
    most cases. Now, everyone from the pilot to the last passenger in coach
    sees it as a case of life or death. TSA is a case of the usual
    government approach. APPEAR do so something, anything, but don't really
    make an effort to prevent what won't happen again, and spend a LOT of
    money appearing to do something. Oh, and if it can inconvenience the
    innocent, all the better.
    Ron Hunter, Dec 9, 2005
  14. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Ron Hunter Guest

    US airlines HAVE reinforced doors, and the ARE locked on the ground
    before takeoff. On at least one airline, when the cockpit doors are
    opened in flight so the crew can take a 'nature break', a serving cart
    is locked in place across the aisle, and the 'cabin attendents' are
    watching for any indication of trouble.
    Only first class passengers are in a position to notice this action, so
    most people may not be aware of it.
    Ron Hunter, Dec 9, 2005
  15. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Ron Hunter Guest

    I have been flying for many years, and have found the increased security
    adds 10 to 15 minutes to the process, except in rare cases where
    everyone seems to be trying to get through security at the last minute.
    Go early, and you will have no trouble. And be patient!
    Ron Hunter, Dec 9, 2005
  16. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Ron Hunter Guest

    I find that going through security in most airports with a laptop is
    much less trouble than having to take off my shoes, and put them back
    on. Slipping the laptop out of the bag, and then back in after it is
    checked for nitrates is easy, and fast.
    Ron Hunter, Dec 9, 2005
  17. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Matt Ion Guest

    Once or twice I've been asked to turn my laptop on, to prove it's a
    working, functioning machine... but as you say, that's generally about
    the worst of it.

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    Matt Ion, Dec 9, 2005
  18. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Charles Self Guest

    No SAS needed. A tightly rolled magazine kills as well as one of these fancy
    striking batons. A sharp pencil into the diaphragm incapacitates immediately
    and leads to death. Same pencil through an ear. The list goes on.

    The stupidity of the TSA regulations is almost beyond belief, but it has
    probably helped generate a lot of business for cuticle trimmer manufacturers
    and others.
    Charles Self, Dec 9, 2005
  19. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    Ron Hunter Guest

    I have been asked to boot the laptop (I use hibernate, so this is
    trivial), and to turn on my digital camera. Not a bit deal.
    Ron Hunter, Dec 9, 2005
  20. Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark)

    RK Guest

    I travel all the time and have had not a single unpleasant experience
    witih TSA people, even though I am usually taken aside for a check
    because I refuse to take my shoes off. This said, there is an air of
    lunacy about a lot of this, the confused policies, inconsistent
    checking, total vulnerability to missle attack, and, of course, the
    larger national panic that has been induced by politicians who want
    pork and votes. Anyhow, the next attack will be more than flying planes
    into something. Katrina redux.

    Oh, I don't know what airline you fly on but more than once in the past
    couple of years I have been on flights in which the door to the flight
    deck was left open well after the plane left the gate.
    RK, Dec 9, 2005
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