Send a message by voting for Nader

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Ron Hunter, Jun 20, 2004.

  1. Ron Hunter

    ArtKramr Guest

    Subject: Re: Send a message by voting for Nader
    Bush did not won by a narrow margin.He lost by a narrow margin. He was
    appointed to the presidency. Not elected.



    Arthur Kramer
    344th BG 494th BS
    England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
    Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
    http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer
     
    ArtKramr, Jul 1, 2004
    1. Advertisements

  2. Why? Democracy is simply mob rule and hence a perpetual failure.

    The only legitimate solution is global corporate rule where one dollar = one
    vote.

    One Dollar, One Vote.

    Vote Libertarian.
     
    Vendicar Decarian, Jul 1, 2004
    1. Advertisements

  3. Ron Hunter

    bob Guest

    It's "thick as a brick" and/or "dumb as a box of rocks". I'm sure you
    knew that back when you were a real boy.
     
    bob, Jul 1, 2004
  4. Ron Hunter

    bob Guest

    VD cranked up the 'ole search engine!!!
    Maniacal laughter at that!!!
     
    bob, Jul 1, 2004
  5. Ron Hunter

    bob Guest

    Typical kook response. Posting the same thing again and again and
    again. So, have you looked up the quantum scalar chick yet?
     
    bob, Jul 1, 2004
  6. Hay Maggot... You haven't answered the question yet.

    What will be the best method of execution to use to end the life of George
    Bush Jr. once he has been tortured and we have convicted him of treason
    against the American people and war crimes?

    1. Hanging?
    2. Cyanide gas?
    3. Electrocution?
    4. Firing Squad?
    5. Lethal Injection?
    6. Other -> Specify
     
    Vendicar Decarian, Jul 1, 2004
  7. Yup. Just as it was when Hitler was elected "right" for Germany.

    Only problem is... Bush wasn't elected. He was appointed by a corrupt
    Republicans on the supreme court after his corrupt Brother Jebb (govenor of
    Florida) - engaged in vote fraud in Florida.


    Is this the same U.S. constitution that Bush has repeatedly violated?

    Now it's unofficial: Gore did win Florida
    Ed Vulliamy in New York
    Observer

    Sunday December 24, 2000


    As George W. Bush handed further key government posts to hardline Republican
    right-wingers, an unofficial recount of votes in Florida appeared to confirm
    that Bush lost the US presidential election.

    Despite the decision by the US Supreme Court to halt the Florida recount in
    the contested counties, American media organisations, includ ing Knight
    Ridder - owner of the Miami Herald - have commissioned their own counts,
    gaining access to the ballots under Freedom of Information legislation. The
    result so far, with the recounting of so-called 'undervotes' in only one
    county completed by Friday night, indicates that Al Gore is ahead by 140
    votes.

    Florida's 25 electoral college votes won Bush the presidency by two seats
    last Monday after the Supreme Court refused to allow the counting of 45,000
    discarded votes. But as the media recount was suspended for Christmas, the
    votes so far tallied in Lake and Broward counties have Gore ahead in the
    race for the pivotal state, and hence the White House.

    Gore's lead is expected to soar when counting resumes in the New Year and
    Miami votes are counted. In a separate exercise, the Miami Herald
    commissioned a team of political analysts and pollsters to make a
    statistical calculation based on projections of votes by county, concluding
    that Gore won the state by 23,000.

    The media initiative is likely to bedevil Bush in the weeks to come,
    thickening the pall of illegitimacy that will hang over his inauguration on
    20 January.

    It has already led to a face-off between almost all the news media
    organisations in the state and Bush's presidential team. In the most extreme
    example of the Bush camp's desperation to avoid a recount, the new director
    of the Environment Protection Agency, Christine Todd Whitman, has proposed
    that the Florida ballots be sealed for 10 years.

    Bush's spokesman Tucker Eskew dismissed the recount as 'mischief-making' and
    'inflaming public passions' while his brother, Florida governor Jeb Bush,
    accused the papers of 'trying to rewrite history'.

    Meanwhile, Bush made his boldest ideological statement yet with the
    appointment of John Ashcroft as Attorney General.

    The appointment is especially significant, because as head of the Justice
    Department Ashcroft would be the man to bring any felony charges against
    President Bill Clinton over the Lewinsky affair. During the scandal,
    Ashcroft was among the loudest and shrillest voices for impeachment.

    There have been many calls to President-elect Bush to pardon his predecessor
    as a sign of peace, but he made a point of rejecting them.

    Ashcroft lost his Missouri Senate seat to the widow of the state's popular
    Democrat governor, Mel Carnahan. From the family of a Pentacostal minister,
    he is an outspoken social conservative and an ally of the extremist Pat
    Robertson.

    Ashcroft represents a host of militant committees and activist groups, of
    which the Christian Coalition is most prominent. He is an opponent not only
    of abortion but even - as he said in one speech - of dancing.
     
    Vendicar Decarian, Jul 1, 2004
  8. From the Libertarian party platform - Immigration
    "We <therefore> call for the elimination of all restrictions on
    immigration, the abolition of the Immigration and Naturalization
    Service and the Border Patrol, and a declaration of full amnesty
    for all people who have entered the country illegally. We oppose
    government welfare and resettlement payments to non-citizens just
    as we oppose government welfare payments to all other persons."
     
    Vendicar Decarian, Jul 1, 2004
  9. Is this really Michael Moore?
     
    Randall Ainsworth, Jul 2, 2004
  10. Ron Hunter

    bob Guest

    Let's do the kookdance again!
     
    bob, Jul 3, 2004
  11. You find the concept of a constitutional republic kooky?

    --
    "You're right. I was Bo Derek that night in Palermo."

    REPTILIAN WATCH WANTS TO EAT YOUR CHILDREN
    http://www.bedoper.com/reptilian

    And some other stuff
    http://www.bedoper.com/
     
    Curtis Blofeld, Jul 3, 2004
  12. Ron Hunter

    bob Guest

    That's Jeb with one b. His full name is John Ellis Bush (J.E.B.) He'll
    run for president in 2008. Think about it, a Republican wasp who can
    speak spanish fluently with a catholic wife who was born in Mexico.
     
    bob, Jul 3, 2004
  13. Ron Hunter

    bob Guest

    bob, Jul 3, 2004
  14. A good discription of Bush and his supporters...

    Wars throughout history have been waged for conquest and plunder. In the
    Middle Ages when the feudal lords who inhabited the castles whose towers may
    still be seen along the Rhine concluded to enlarge their domains, to
    increase their power, their prestige and their wealth they declared war upon
    one another. But they themselves did not go to war any more than the modern
    feudal lords, the barons of Wall Street go to war.

    The feudal barons of the Middle Ages, the economic predecessors of the
    capitalists of our day, declared all wars. And their miserable serfs fought
    all the battles. The poor, ignorant serfs had been taught to revere their
    masters; to believe that when their masters declared war upon one another,
    it was their patriotic duty to fall upon one another and to cut one
    another's throats for the profit and glory of the lords and barons who held
    them in contempt. And that is war in a nutshell. The master class has always
    declared the wars; the subject class has always fought the battles. The
    master class has had all to gain and nothing to lose, while the subject
    class has had nothing to gain and all to lose--especially their lives.

    They have always taught and trained you to believe it to be your patriotic
    duty to go to war and to have yourselves slaughtered at their command. But
    in all the history of the world you, the people, have never had a voice in
    declaring war, and strange as it certainly appears, no war by any nation in
    any age has ever been declared by the people.

    And here let me emphasize the fact--and it cannot be repeated too
    often--that the working class who fight all the battles, the working class
    who make the supreme sacrifices, the working class who freely shed their
    blood and furnish the corpses, have never yet had a voice in either
    declaring war or making peace. It is the ruling class that invariably does
    both. They alone declare war and they alone make peace. Yours not to reason
    why; Yours but to do and die. That is their motto and we object on the part
    of the awakening workers of this nation. If war is right let it be declared
    by the people. You who have your lives to lose, you certainly above all
    others have the right to decide the momentous issue of war or peace....

    You need at this time especially to know that you are fit for something
    better than slavery and cannon fodder. You need to know that you were not
    created to work and produce and impoverish yourself to enrich an idle
    exploiter. You need to know that you have a mind to improve, a soul to
    develop, and a manhood to sustain....

    They are continually talking about your patriotic duty. It is not their but
    your patriotic duty that they are concerned about. There is a decided
    difference. Their patriotic duty never takes them to the firing line or
    chucks them into the trenches. And now among other things they are urging
    you to "cultivate" war gardens, while at the same time a government war
    report just issued shows that practically 52 percent of the arable, tillable
    soil is held out of use by the landlords, speculators and profiteers. They
    themselves do not cultivate the soil. Nor do they allow others to cultivate
    it. They keep it idle to enrich themselves, to pocket the millions of
    dollars of unearned increment....

    And now for all of us to do our duty! The clarion call is ringing in our
    ears and we cannot falter without being convicted of treason to ourselves
    and to our great cause.

    Do not worry over the charge of treason to your masters, but be concerned
    about the treason that involves yourselves. Be true to yourself and you
    cannot be a traitor to any good cause on earth.
     
    Vendicar Decarian, Jul 3, 2004
  15. Again? You have yet to stop Boob.

    Wars throughout history have been waged for conquest and plunder. In the
    Middle Ages when the feudal lords who inhabited the castles whose towers may
    still be seen along the Rhine concluded to enlarge their domains, to
    increase their power, their prestige and their wealth they declared war upon
    one another. But they themselves did not go to war any more than the modern
    feudal lords, the barons of Wall Street go to war.

    The feudal barons of the Middle Ages, the economic predecessors of the
    capitalists of our day, declared all wars. And their miserable serfs fought
    all the battles. The poor, ignorant serfs had been taught to revere their
    masters; to believe that when their masters declared war upon one another,
    it was their patriotic duty to fall upon one another and to cut one
    another's throats for the profit and glory of the lords and barons who held
    them in contempt. And that is war in a nutshell. The master class has always
    declared the wars; the subject class has always fought the battles. The
    master class has had all to gain and nothing to lose, while the subject
    class has had nothing to gain and all to lose--especially their lives.

    They have always taught and trained you to believe it to be your patriotic
    duty to go to war and to have yourselves slaughtered at their command. But
    in all the history of the world you, the people, have never had a voice in
    declaring war, and strange as it certainly appears, no war by any nation in
    any age has ever been declared by the people.

    And here let me emphasize the fact--and it cannot be repeated too
    often--that the working class who fight all the battles, the working class
    who make the supreme sacrifices, the working class who freely shed their
    blood and furnish the corpses, have never yet had a voice in either
    declaring war or making peace. It is the ruling class that invariably does
    both. They alone declare war and they alone make peace. Yours not to reason
    why; Yours but to do and die. That is their motto and we object on the part
    of the awakening workers of this nation. If war is right let it be declared
    by the people. You who have your lives to lose, you certainly above all
    others have the right to decide the momentous issue of war or peace....

    You need at this time especially to know that you are fit for something
    better than slavery and cannon fodder. You need to know that you were not
    created to work and produce and impoverish yourself to enrich an idle
    exploiter. You need to know that you have a mind to improve, a soul to
    develop, and a manhood to sustain....

    They are continually talking about your patriotic duty. It is not their but
    your patriotic duty that they are concerned about. There is a decided
    difference. Their patriotic duty never takes them to the firing line or
    chucks them into the trenches. And now among other things they are urging
    you to "cultivate" war gardens, while at the same time a government war
    report just issued shows that practically 52 percent of the arable, tillable
    soil is held out of use by the landlords, speculators and profiteers. They
    themselves do not cultivate the soil. Nor do they allow others to cultivate
    it. They keep it idle to enrich themselves, to pocket the millions of
    dollars of unearned increment....

    And now for all of us to do our duty! The clarion call is ringing in our
    ears and we cannot falter without being convicted of treason to ourselves
    and to our great cause.

    Do not worry over the charge of treason to your masters, but be concerned
    about the treason that involves yourselves. Be true to yourself and you
    cannot be a traitor to any good cause on earth.
     
    Vendicar Decarian, Jul 3, 2004
  16. Being tired of lurking, on Sat, 03 Jul 2004 17:36:16 -0400, Vendicar
    Decarian posted:
    Flamewars not!


    --
    mhm 27x12
    smeeter #28
    Usenet Valhalla Circle #19 & #21
    Bartlo's hate lits #1: <>
    CEO Alcatroll Labs Inc.

    The Way of the Kook:
    http://www.insurgent.org/~jhd/kookway.htm
     
    Dr. Flonkenstein, Jul 3, 2004
  17. Oh, Jeb will be on the run in 2008. But it won't be for any presidency.

    This Ain't Fifth-Century Athens - Strike The Root Libertarians
    by Fred Reed

    Autumn looms and presidential elections will soon roll around, like
    droppings pushed by dung beetles. We will be exhorted to vote. Better
    advice would be not to vote. The proper response toward what we
    occasionally imagine to be democracy, methinks, is to retain one's
    self-respect by not participating in it.

    Voting in particular is an embarrassment, being a public display of weak
    character and low intelligence. Let us face the truth: Democracy, like
    spitting in public or the Roman games, is the proper activity of the
    lower intellectual and moral classes. It amounts to collusion in one's
    own suckering.

    The United States of course is not a democracy but a wonderfully crafted
    pretense. We have separated the results of elections from the
    formulation of policy. It is a neat trick: Voting distracts the rabble
    without disturbing the government. You cannot possibly-can you?-believe
    that your vote will change anything of importance? That it will end the
    flood of semi-literate Mexican proletarians who join our own? Divert the
    schools from their ghettoish apotheosis of the mentally lame and halt?
    Cause governmental behavior to rely on merit instead of race, creed,
    color, sex, and national origin?

    No. These things are determined remotely by lobbies, by criminals, and
    by forces that have no name. If you are lucky, you may be able to change
    parking regulations.

    Given that democracy is pointless, and participation in it a sign of a
    weak mind, what is the wisest attitude toward the government?
    That of a tick toward a cow. Nothing else makes sense. The central
    question of American government is not what mountebank shall be
    president or what eructations of mendacity he may devise. The question,
    almost the only question, is whether the government can get more from
    you than you can get from it. One picks pockets, or one's pockets are
    picked.

    The clever or well represented-the racial lobbies, defense industry,
    teachers unions, feminists, AIPAC, big pharma, oil, corporations-suck
    money from the government. In turn the government gnaws like a hagfish
    at the entrails of middle-class people moldering in cubicles. These
    spend their lives in jobs they hate to buy things they don't want, such
    as half-million-dollar houses in the suburbs, so as to pay taxes.
    Elections give them a sense of having a stake in their flensing: The
    government is their hagfish.

    Clearly taking part in this is unwise. What then do you do?
    First, and most important, stop regarding yourself as part of
    government. Government doesn't concern itself with you; why should you
    concern yourself with it? The change of attitude provides both
    relaxation and perspective.

    Next, avoid governmental impositions. There are many. Military service
    is the worst of them. Don't go. A little man in Washington, whom you
    have never met and wouldn't talk to over a back fence, tells you to kill
    people who have done nothing to you in a foreign country you may never
    have heard of. Does this seem reasonable?

    Finally, cultivate apathy, which is cheaper than Prozac and works
    better. You do not worry about what you do not care about. I do not
    propose a depressed scowl at life, but merely a wholesome indifference
    toward those forces malign and otherwise over which you can have no
    influence.

    Better yet, enjoy the onrushing atrophy. Is the United States going to
    hell, western civilization being subverted, knaves scuttling like fetid
    crabs through the corridors of power and nitwits ravaging the schools in
    the manner of monkeys in a fruit store? (Yes, actually.) Relish it for
    the splendid historical theater that it is. A better spectacle there
    cannot be.

    I say this seriously. If you regard yourself as audience rather than
    participant, the accelerating collapse becomes entertainment. You read
    each morning's headlines with zest to see what new and preposterous
    clownishness erupts from Washington. It is high comedy. Just now Mr.
    Bush wants to tighten the embargo on Cuba because of its violations of
    human rights; meanwhile Mr. Bush is running a torture camp at
    Guantanamo. We have a war on poverty that perpetuates poverty, a war on
    drugs that guarantees availability by keeping prices up.

    I doubt that Mark Twain could make such things up.

    A huge gap separates those who, on the one hand, eat their souls up over
    things they can't change, and those who, on the other, focus on their
    friends, family, children. You probably have a sense of what is right,
    wrong, moral, decent, and just. To these, I say, you owe allegiance. To
    nothing else.

    A wholesome apathy does not mean giving up a love of music or travel or
    dogs or books or contemplation of starry skies should the pollution
    clear momentarily. Nor does it mean lack of concern for those around
    you. It does mean, or more correctly require, moral self-determination
    insofar as it is possible.

    The wise recognize that they are insignificant atoms and set their
    course accordingly. Yes, in a small town enjoying sovereignty over its
    institutions, participation might make sense. You might expect to have
    an influence over matters material to you. If you wanted the high school
    to offer advanced classes in mathematics for your advanced child, you
    would stand a reasonable chance of persuading the school board, and
    finding a volunteer teacher if need be.

    But today you are merely a minor source of taxes. It is reasonable
    therefore to regard governments not as enemies-they are larger than you
    are and will usually win-but as intricate puzzles. If the government
    won't school your children, do you home-school? Move to France? Can you
    qualify for some form of welfare and have the government support you
    instead of you, it? Are laws more to your liking in Thailand?

    To what, then, you might ask, does one owe allegiance? A better question
    might be: Why should one owe allegiance to any distant group beyond
    one's influence? Yes, I know: The dog-pack instinct dominates human
    behavior. It is why we have wars and teen-age gangs and attach ourselves
    furiously to football teams. Patriotism, meaning an irrational
    attachment to whatever country we were born in, comes naturally. But
    does it come reasonably? To use the tired but effective example, should
    you be loyal to your country's government if it begins operating torture
    camps in, say, Bergen-Belsen or Treblinka or, once more, Guantanamo?
    Or should you do what you believe to be right, decline to be herded like
    cattle, and live decently in the interstices of things? These at least
    are choices not as humiliating as voting. Those who wash regularly
    should not stoop to democracy.

    June 24, 2004
     
    Vendicar Decarian, Jul 4, 2004
  18. I didn't know that!
    --
    V.G.

    Change pobox dot alaska to gci.
    "I wanted a car I could run down pedestrians with. But one with a comfy ride, like a sofa on wheels." - Father Haskell

    "No doubt about it, 9-11 was orchestrated by Lockheed." - *lexa 'connects the dots' ()
    (This sig file contains not less than 80% recycled SPAM)

    Sarcasm is my sword, Apathy is my shield.
     
    Vanilla Gorilla (Monkey Boy), Jul 4, 2004
  19. That's enough for me, he is *plonk*ed. Plus he poasts to co.politics,
    ack -- another local loon.


    -=-=-=-=-

    Official AFA-B Bully, Pest, Antagonist, Gubmint Disinformation
    Agent, "Dr. Green" Sockpuppet, and Chief AFA-B Vote Rustler.
     
    C.R. Osterwald, Jul 4, 2004

  20. Oregon's Gen. McPeak joins other ex-military in calling for Bush
    ouster

    05:38 PM PDT on Wednesday, June 16, 2004

    By ABE ESTIMADA, kgw.com Staff

    NEW YORK CITY - Retired U.S. Air Force chief of staff Merrill "Tony"
    McPeak of Oregon denounced President Bush's foreign policy as
    "incompetent," and the source of worldwide condemnation that has
    resulted in American popularity reaching an all-time low.

    Retired Air Force general Tony McPeak. (KGW Photo)

    Gen. McPeak, who directed the U.S. air campaign against Iraq during
    the first Persian Gulf War and who now resides in Lake Oswego, joined
    former, high-level ambassadors and generals calling themselves
    Diplomats and Military Commanders for Change in urging the American
    public to vote against Bush in November.

    "I can recognize incompetence when I see it," McPeak said by phone
    from New York City on Wednesday. "This administration is not competent
    to handle the foreign affairs of this nation. It's letting the country
    down. This is my opinion, and it's the opinion of all these
    distinguished retired guys, most of whom are Republicans."

    McPeak, who is now a security affairs advisor for the John Kerry
    presidential campaign and military expert for KGW, opposed the Iraq
    war. While the Bush administration did the right thing in rallying
    international support for ejecting the Taliban and fighting al-Qaida
    in Afghanistan after Sept. 11, it has alienated allies with the
    conflict in Iraq.

    In countries such as Britain and Italy - who have contributed soldiers
    to the fight in Iraq - approval of the American government is low. In
    France, Germany and Russia, "it's all downhill from there," McPeak
    said.

    "Our popularity is at an all-time low, in my memory," said McPeak, who
    recently visited Italy. "Right now, in any country in the world, if
    you're a supporter of the United States, it's a kiss of death."

    The group has not endorsed Kerry, a Massachusetts Senator who is
    likely the Democratic presidential candidate.

    "This is not political partisanship," McPeak said. "This is just a
    straight deal where we don't like to see the interests of this country
    and its citizens subverted and sabotaged in a way that this
    administration has done."

    "We agreed that we had just lost confidence in the ability of the Bush
    administration to advocate for American interests or to provide the
    kind of leadership that we think is essential," said William Harrop,
    the first President Bush's ambassador to Israel, and earlier to four
    African countries.

    The Bush-Cheney campaign did not immediately have a response to the
    group's formally issued statement at a news conference at the National
    Press Club in Washington, D.C. on Wednesday.

    Among the group are 20 former ambassadors, appointed by both
    Democratic and Republican presidents, and other former State
    Department officials and military leaders.

    Other prominent members include Gen. Joseph Hoar, who led American
    forces in the Middle East during the administration of Bush's father;
    Admiral William Crowe Jr., ambassador to Britain under President Bill
    Clinton and chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff under President
    Ronald Reagan; and Jack Matlock Jr., a member of the National Security
    Council under Reagan and ambassador to the Soviet Union from 1987 to
    1991.

    McPeak said the Bush administration foreign policy transgressions
    include refusal to talk about the Kyoto Protocols, a compact signed in
    1997 by the Clinton administration, the European Union and Japan to
    fight global warming.

    "We told them to stick it where the sun don't shine," McPeak said of
    the Kyoto agreement.

    The Bush administration has also pulled out of the Anti-Ballistic
    Missile Treaty with Russia, refused to negotiate any further on an
    anti-land mine treaty with 150 other nations and withdrew support from
    the International Criminal Court system, he said.

    "(President Bush and his advisors) are tone deaf," McPeak said.
    "They've been acting with arrogance. They haven't been pleasant to
    deal with."
     
    Vendicar Decarian, Jul 4, 2004
    1. Advertisements

Ask a Question

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments (here). After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.