Router keeps needing resetting: Why?

Discussion in 'Computer Support' started by rfdjr1, Jun 5, 2004.

  1. rfdjr1

    rfdjr1 Guest

    I have a Belkin router hooked up to a single computer, using it only
    as a hardware firewall. But I keep having to reset it by unplugging it
    and then plugging it back in. I use a cable modem, Windows XP Pro, on
    a P4 3.2 Ghz system with 1 Gb of RAM (in case any of that matters).
    What causes the router to have to be reset? Is there a way to stop the
    problem? It's getting to be annoying. Thanks.
    rfdjr1, Jun 5, 2004
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  2. rfdjr1

    doS Guest

    Its a belkin is why...get a linksys....
    doS, Jun 6, 2004
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  3. rfdjr1

    Duane Arnold Guest


    The router doesn't like spikes on the line from household appliances, lost
    power suddenly, and brownouts. If it happens too often, the router can
    become defective. The router likes constant and clean power.

    A UPS is a good investment in protecting such equipment.
    has them under $100.

    Duane :)
    Duane Arnold, Jun 6, 2004
  4. rfdjr1

    doS Guest

  5. rfdjr1

    rfdjr1 Guest

    Okay, so I looked up Linksys, and all that I saw were wireless, unless
    I missed something. I'm not networking any other computers in the
    house. There are none. So which of the Linksys routers would be the
    simplest, most basic, I could use? Thanks.
    rfdjr1, Jun 6, 2004
  6. rfdjr1

    rfdjr1 Guest

    I went to this link and read the reviews. One of them mentioned the
    low speed. I just went to the same site,'s bandwidth meter,
    and if I can believe the test, I was running at 1427.1 kbps. Doesn't
    seem to shabby to me. I also did a Googel search for reviews of
    Linksys and here's one I found:

    "I have had my share of bad luck with Linksys products and no longer
    buy what I classify as low-end router products so I was not surprised
    when I saw a critical Linksys review. Folks before you go out and buy
    that latest gadget take a few moments and do some research and read
    some non-biased consumer reviews and dig thru the tech sites and find
    professional reviews of gear you are going to purchase. [ZDNet]"

    So is Linksys any better than Belkin? I realize that's one comment.
    Too each his own I guess. I just don't want to have to keep resetting.
    And doesn't the router being plugged into a surge protector keep it
    from the power spikes someone said routers don't like?
    rfdjr1, Jun 6, 2004
  7. rfdjr1

    doS Guest

  8. rfdjr1

    Duane Arnold Guest

    wrote in
    You walk into any computer room in a business environment and you'll not
    find a router or anything of that nature plugged into a cheap surge
    protector alone. There is always a UPS that equipment like that is
    protected by.

    The cheap surge protector is just that a cheap surge protector. The cheap
    surge protector cannot keep the power at peak level, which equipment such
    as a router needs.

    I have had my Linksys BEFW11S4 v1 router since 2001 without a peek out of
    it running like a champ 24/7. Why, because the UPS has protected it and
    kept the power constant.

    As far as which one is the best, Linksys, D-link, Netgear, Belkin etc.
    etc, they all have problems because they make them like pop corn and one
    can certainly get one that can be somewhat defective or flat-out
    defective. It's the luck of the draw with the routers.

    You'll most likely face the problem again if you don't protect the
    equipment properly.

    Duane :)
    Duane Arnold, Jun 6, 2004
  9. rfdjr1

    Unk Guest

    Try the Belkin site for a firmware update.
    A relative had the same problem and a firmware update cured it.
    I believe there's a link to the update site from the administrative menu in
    the router.
    Unk, Jun 6, 2004
  10. rfdjr1

    w_tom Guest

    UPSes are installed in business facilities to maintain the
    network during power loss. They connect facility routers
    direct to AC mains when UPS is not in battery backup mode. So
    where is the spike protection? UPS output some of the most
    dirty and spiky power when in battery backup mode. So where
    is the protection?

    Protection from little spikes, more commonly called noise,
    is already inside every electronic power supply. Noise from
    household appliances being so trivial as to be irrelevant.
    Router should even work when 120 VAC voltage drops below 100
    volts - as required by industry standards. Voltage drops that
    low would be obvious due to less than 50% dimming of all
    incandescent lamps.

    For serious spikes, a protector connect each incoming wire
    less than 10 feet to earth ground. Earth ground is the
    protector - not some mythical plug-in protection. In fact,
    the protection circuit inside a UPS is the same circuit found
    in power strip protectors. Why do serious facilities not use
    plug-in protectors? Because it is the same ineffective
    circuit found in plug-in UPSes AND because they install
    superior protectors that cost tens of times less money where
    utility wires enter the building.

    First - modem is on cable. That cable, if properly
    installed, must be earthed where it enters the building AND to
    the same earth ground rod used by AC electric and telephone.
    Without that essential connection - as even required by
    National Electrical Code - then a major transients would
    overwhelm protection that already exists inside the Belkin,
    Linksys, and other routers. Smaller transients created by
    improper earthing also could cause router problems.

    Second, router power should share same properly safety
    grounded power receptacle as computer.

    Third, what kind of interconnection from router to CPU?

    Fourth, consult manufacturer web site for any updates,
    notices, or corrections.

    Fifth, if all others fail, return modem for a replacement.
    It may be the one that has the defect.

    Sixth, the plug-in protector claims protection from surges
    that don't typically exist. They just forget to mention the
    other destructive type of surge and the all so important earth
    ground. A plain $3 power strip is just as effective as the
    $20 surge protector power strip - once one learns basic
    electrical principles. Since such surges occur typically once
    every 8 years, then the surge protector is not even part of a
    'failing Belkin' solution.

    w_tom, Jun 6, 2004
  11. rfdjr1

    Duane Arnold Guest

    Maybe my comparison to a computer installation UPS and UPS AVR is a
    little over the top.

    But that fact remains that an UPS with Automatic Voltage Regulation
    technology monitors incoming electricity and smoothes out under and over
    voltage conditions and delivers only safe *clean* electricity* (110-120
    volts), which protects against errant line voltage levels such as
    brownouts, surges or spikes.

    Before I implemented the UPS AVR system, the Linksys router needed to be
    reset on a routine basis. That went away when put the Belkin UPS AVR in
    to place. I just purchased a WatchGuard Firebox III SOHO that cost a
    pretty penny or two.

    There is absolutely no way I am going plug that kind of investment into
    some kind of surge protector power strip that's on the floor plugged into
    some wall outlet.

    An UPS AVR is a good investment.

    Duane :)
    Duane Arnold, Jun 6, 2004
  12. rfdjr1

    w_tom Guest

    Look at requirements that every electronic device should
    meet. Minimal CBEMA standard says 600 volts for a 120 volt
    unit. What kind of noise or transients are generated inside
    the house? No where near to 600 volts. Big problem (IOW does
    not exist) when such transients add 10 volt transients to 120
    VAC electric.

    However lets look at the output from a battery backup UPS.
    When in battery backup mode, 120 VAC output from this UPS is 2
    200 volt square waves with a 270 volt spike between those
    square waves. If computers were so sensitive, then the
    plug-in UPS in battery backup mode must damage electronics.
    It does not damage electronics because such noise and
    transients do not adversely effect electronics.

    Electronics already contain internal protection. Protection
    that assumes all incoming wires are first properly earthed at
    the building entrance. Earthing either by a direct wire
    connect to the single point earth ground OR same 'less than 10
    foot' connection made via a 'whole house' protector. (Notice
    that a protector is not protection. It is only effective when
    it is a temporary connection to earth ground.)

    This protection is so effective and so inexpensive as to be
    installed, standard and free, by the telco. Installed even
    before PCs existed. Earthing is for destructive transients
    (and other functions).

    So what about voltage brownouts? Computers are required to
    work even when the 120 VAC electric drops to 90 VAC. That
    means incandescent bulbs would be dimmed at less than 40%
    intensity while computer works just fine. This is even
    bluntly demanded in Intel specs. IOW the plug-in UPS serves
    one important function. To maintain voltage when 120 VAC
    lines droop to less than 100 volts.

    Of course such voltage drops are not destructive. They only
    cause temporary loss of service which is why we install
    plug-in UPSes. The plug in UPS is not a solution to the OP's
    original problem. All electronics must work just fine even
    with major voltage variations. UPS keeps electronics working
    when voltage temporarily disappears.

    So we are left with some basic questions. Does the Belkin
    meet standards that electronic equipment performed even 30
    years ago? A variac would be informative. That Belkin should
    work just fine even when 120 VAC is lowered to 95 VAC.

    Again, and very important. Is the incoming cable properly
    earthed to AC electric and telephone earth ground rod before
    cable enters the building? If not, then cable modem could be
    susceptible to other problems. Is building AC electric even
    properly earthed? I have observed two out of ten older house
    do not even have their original earth ground. Furthermore,
    earth ground requirements for AC electric have since been
    upgraded by post 1990 National Electrical Code (NEC)
    requirements. Does the earth ground even exist?

    Before buying and installing various expensive and
    mysterious solutions, a first step is to confirm that simple
    wire installation is minimally acceptable. Strange things
    happen when the building does not even meet those trivial and
    minimal earthing standards and when building safety grounds
    are compromised. Even worse are cable installers who don't
    understand nor appreciate what and why makes earthing so
    important to reliable modem operation.

    In the meantime, no power strip nor UPS protector will keep
    spikes from interfering with modem operation. Does not even
    claim to perform that function. Read numerical specs.

    There is no way either a power strip surge protector or a
    UPS (both having same protection circuits) is going to protect
    expensive electronics. Those electronics already contain any
    protection that will work adjacent to the machine. Existing
    internal protection assumes essential 'whole house' protectors
    and the most critical system component - single point earth
    ground - exists for that building. No earth ground means no
    effective protection - today as it was important even before
    w_tom, Jun 6, 2004
  13. rfdjr1

    doS Guest

    Come on guys, the belkins have a connection issue, doesnt have anything to
    do with electricity spikes.
    doS, Jun 6, 2004
  14. rfdjr1

    Duane Arnold Guest

    Look, let's not be going off the deep end with this. All of your
    information is appreciated. I am using an UPS AVR to protect the equipment
    as do many others. What ever works and one is happy with the results is the
    bottom line that counts -- nothing else. :)

    Duane :)

    You may get this post twice.

    You know I really was not looking for some kind of debate about
    Duane Arnold, Jun 6, 2004
  15. rfdjr1

    Duane Arnold Guest

    Look, let's not be going off the deep end with this. All of your
    information is appreciated. I am using an UPS AVR to protect the equipment
    as do many others. What ever works and one is happy with the results is the
    bottom line that counts -- nothing else. :)

    Duane :)
    Duane Arnold, Jun 6, 2004
  16. rfdjr1

    w_tom Guest

    This is not just a discussion about spikes. Strange
    problems that can even affect network connection may occur
    when different incoming utilities do not share the common
    earth ground. As noted in a first post, a visual inspection
    of connection from cable to earth ground may be necessary.
    Also important is the connection from AC electric to same

    Many older homes are missing that important earth ground.
    Many cable installers don't appreciate and therefore don't
    install that common ground connection. This can result in
    intermittent operation.

    If the router does not like spikes, then earthing (and not a
    protector) is also a necessary solution. Not that this
    earthing will provide THE solution. List of possible
    solutions was posted earlier. But good reasons exist why
    cable and AC electric both connect to same ground. Additional
    reason is because that is the spike protection.
    w_tom, Jun 7, 2004
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