Ready to graduate to DSLR

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Freedom55, Sep 17, 2005.

  1. Freedom55

    Pete D Guest

    "David J Taylor"
    Only on some, the Pentax's at least do have replaceable screen.
     
    Pete D, Sep 18, 2005
    #61
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  2. Freedom55

    Freedom55 Guest

    Thanks but rec.photo.digital.slr-systems is not offered as an NG from my
    ISP.

    --
    And it really doesn't matter if
    I'm wrong I'm right
    Where I belong I'm right
    Where I belong.

    Lennon & McCartney
     
    Freedom55, Sep 18, 2005
    #62
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  3. Freedom55

    Alfred Molon Guest

    I get sharp handheld shots down to 1/13-1/15s when framing with the
    viewfinder, with the camera approx. 20-30 cm from the eyes. But I don't
    get sharp shots at 1/13s when framing through the viewfinder. My guess
    is that the arms act as a shock absorber, reducing the movement of the
    body.

    You still have to keep the eyes close to this angle finder, so you are
    kind of limited there.

    60 pounds is approx. 30 Kg, right ? I can't imagine a full day of
    shooting with a 30Kg backpack on my shoulders.
     
    Alfred Molon, Sep 18, 2005
    #63
  4. Freedom55

    Alfred Molon Guest

    By this definition also an SLR is a point and shoot.
     
    Alfred Molon, Sep 18, 2005
    #64
  5. Freedom55

    ASAAR Guest

    What was implied was P&S&NT. There may have been a little bit of
    snobbery involved since most of the early P&S cameras didn't have
    manual modes. So those little "pissant" Point & Shoot & No Think
    cameras couldn't do what SLR's could. Unless, of course, SLRs are
    used in Auto mode. Nowadays many P&S cameras allow far greater
    control than many of the most sophisticated SLRs from yesteryear.
     
    ASAAR, Sep 18, 2005
    #65
  6. Freedom55

    Chris Brown Guest

    Reflex means that the viewfinder uses a mirror. The "single lens" bit means
    you use the same lens for viewing and taking the picture (as opposed to a
    Twin Lens Reflex).
     
    Chris Brown, Sep 18, 2005
    #66
  7. This is incorrect. Do a google search of this newsgroup and you
    will find a lot of discussion on that subject. Current digital cameras
    have a much larger dynamic range than film. 11+ stops for
    DSLRs.

    Roger
     
    Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark), Sep 18, 2005
    #67
  8. Then this is like looking through the viewfinder of an SLR except
    not the real scene but a video of it? If so, then can you
    change the angle like so many our touting as a benefit of EVFs?
    Well, when you don't have a 500 mm f/4 lens you will not
    get that wildlife shot. When you don't have 4x5, you won't get
    the spectacular landscape that you can make a sharp wall-size
    print from. Sometimes I carry both. That's when I carry
    60+ pounds.

    There is nothing wrong with a P&S. Just understand the
    limitations. One can get great pictures from a P&S in limited
    situations. But, as I said, if you want top images, you need
    the proper equipment that will deliver.

    The OP wanted to step up to a DSLR and look at all the people
    making a big deal out of that decision. Talk about snobbery,
    and it is not the DSLR people!

    Roger
     
    Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark), Sep 18, 2005
    #68
  9. Freedom55

    Mark² Guest

    That's just not correct.
    Digital has surpassed film in terms of stops.
    I think it's well over 10 with Canon CMOS sensors.
     
    Mark², Sep 18, 2005
    #69
  10. I guess it depends on how you define sharp. At 1/15 second, I doubt
    most pictures whould be sharp hand held, from any camera.
    Acceptable perhaps, but not sharp in my opinion. There are
    always exceptions, but generally one needs a tripod for the
    sharpest images.
    I've never found it limiting. I have found swivel LCD screens limiting,
    e.g. in sunlight.
    No pain, no gain ;-)
    I carried about 45-50 pounds of gear for these grizzly bear images:
    http://www.clarkvision.com/galleries/gallery.bear
    That includes rain gear, but no food (didn't want a pack with food
    around bears). Photo gear included 2 DSLR bodies, 24 to 500 MM lenses,
    carbon fiber tripod, warm clothes, rain gear.

    Roger
     
    Roger N. Clark (change username to rnclark), Sep 18, 2005
    #70
  11. It's not snobbery, it's stupidity. As in, "it's the image quality, stupid".

    David J. Littleboy
    Tokyo, Japan
     
    David J. Littleboy, Sep 19, 2005
    #71
  12. This is a joke, right?

    Gary Eickmeier
     
    Gary Eickmeier, Sep 19, 2005
    #72
  13. Nope. As someone who shoots mostly film, I assure you, the claimed latitude
    of film is basically a lie. Shadows turn to incredibly ugly mush, and
    highlights blow out. DSLR digital shot at ISO 100 has a lot of room (several
    stops) for rescuing shadow detail. (P&S digital has gotten worse over the
    years, though.)

    David J. Littleboy
    Tokyo, Japan
     
    David J. Littleboy, Sep 19, 2005
    #73
  14. Freedom55

    Freedom55 Guest

    I agree somewhat. I want to move up to D-SLR because I regret being
    unable to take that special shot because of the limitations of a P&S.
    For example I went to the F1 race in Montreal last June and really
    wished I was able to "get up close" to the action. I don't think I would
    mind having to lug around a little extra equipment (lens, tripod etc.)
    to accomplish this. However, I think I would always keep a P&S camera
    around for backup.

    Ron

    --
    And it really doesn't matter if
    I'm wrong I'm right
    Where I belong I'm right
    Where I belong.

    Lennon & McCartney
     
    Freedom55, Sep 19, 2005
    #74
  15. Freedom55

    Skip M Guest

    My normal kit, in a back pack, includes, one each, Canon 20D, 16-35 f2.8L,
    24-70 f2.8L, 100-400 f4.5-5.6L, flash, filters, flash cards, extra
    batteries, asstd. tools and monopod. About 20Kg, or less. And not a
    problem to carry.
     
    Skip M, Sep 19, 2005
    #75
  16. Freedom55

    Skip M Guest

    Hardly, they only provide more "no think" modes, as do many SLRs, now.
     
    Skip M, Sep 19, 2005
    #76
  17. Freedom55

    ASAAR Guest

    Sorry, but you're wrong here. Some P&S cameras may have a
    bewildering number of "thinking is futile" modes, but I was
    referring to the more advanced features that they have, and it only
    requires a single example to disprove your "only . . . 'no think'
    modes". My Nikon SLRs never showed things such as the parts of the
    images that would be either grossly overexposed or underexposed.
    Nor did it have user memory to preset custom settings including
    focus point. I'm not talking about advanced features today's DSLRs
    may also have. Note above the words "sophisticated SLRs from
    yesteryear". My old Nikon SLR is still superior in many ways to my
    current P&S. But at the same time it lacks many useful features.
    Couldn't do bracketing either (manual bracketing is much slower and
    doesn't count), but with the cost of film and processing, it's not
    anything I would have lusted after.
     
    ASAAR, Sep 19, 2005
    #77
  18. Freedom55

    MarkH Guest

    I would suggest that you keep your P&S camera when you buy a D-SLR.
    There are good and bad points to each system and having both is the
    ideal way to cover almost any situation.
    The strength of the SLR design is the interchangeable lenses, buying
    Canon or Nikon ensures a huge range of lenses in all price ranges to
    choose from (from Canon or Nikon as well as Sigma, Tamron and Tokina).
    I would also suggest considering the Canon 20D as well, it would be a
    good idea to handle the Rebel XT and the 20D and the Nikon D70 to see
    which you like the feel of better. Maybe being used to small P&S
    cameras you will like the small size of the Rebel XT, maybe you will
    prefer a larger more solid feeling camera.

    One thing to keep in mind when asking advice here is that there are a
    few one-eyed crackpots that only see things their way and can't
    understand other points of view.

    A D-SLR is better than a non SLR digital in many ways, and worse in many
    ways to.

    D-SLR strengths include the ability to change lenses for whatever suits
    best, low noise even at high ISO settings, fast AF and very short
    shutter lag.

    D-SLR weaknesses/limitations include the much greater size and weight, a
    much higher price once you have the good lenses, no movie mode and you
    can't compose with the LCD.

    So for fast action where you need a long zoom (motor racing, sports,
    wildlife, birds, etc) it is hard to find a non-SLR digital that offers
    the right mix of features, but an interchangeable lens D-SLR will easily
    do the job.

    For the times you want to have a camera in your pocket just in case, a
    small P&S will be the best choice.

    The new Sony Cyber-shot DSC-R1 may seem like the perfect non-SLR with
    low noise to ISO 1600 due to the larger sensor. but the lens only offers
    up to the equivalent of 120mm, also due to the larger sensor. If you
    compare the 24-120 that the Sony is capable of to what you can get with
    a D-SLR (at a greater cost and with more bulk and weight) you can see
    that the Canon Rebel XT can use a 10-22 lens for the equivalent of 16mm
    wide (a lot wider field of view than 24mm) and with a lens like the
    100-400L IS lens it can provide the equivalent field of view of 640mm
    with image stabilisation. So the Sony might be the perfect choice for
    some people, but wholly inadequate for others. It is also worth noting
    that the Sony does NOT offer video, so if someone wants a non-SLR
    digital for the movie mode then they will not get it on the Sony. The
    shutter lag on the Sony is not as good as on most D-SLRs, I wouldn't
    want to use one for sports personally.


    --
    Mark Heyes (New Zealand)
    See my pics at www.gigatech.co.nz (last updated 5-September-05)
    "The person on the other side was a young woman. Very obviously a
    young woman. There was no possible way she could have been mistaken
    for a young man in any language, especially Braille."
    Maskerade
     
    MarkH, Sep 19, 2005
    #78
  19. Freedom55

    Stacey Guest

    I'm happy with the screen in my E300. The bitch is it get's complaints from
    reviewers because it isn't as bright as the "viewer screens" other makers
    use which you can't see the focus point! you'll never see a review where
    they talk about how well you can manually focus the different camera
    bodies..
     
    Stacey, Sep 19, 2005
    #79
  20. Freedom55

    Stacey Guest

    Because they rightly assume 99% of the users will never turn off the AF,
    many probably don't even understand what "focus" is?
     
    Stacey, Sep 19, 2005
    #80
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