Prosumer vs. DLSR thoughts

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Mike, Nov 12, 2004.

  1. Mike

    Aerticus Guest

    I thought the same until ...

    I hope the photographer of this image does not object to a link being placed
    here

    http://www.pbase.com/bret/image/36264486/original

    That is one aesthetic image - almost edible

    Acknowledgements and respect to Annika

    Aerticus

    ps - Annika, if you object I don't mind this reply being removed from this
    thread

    A

    <snipped>
     
    Aerticus, Nov 13, 2004
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  2. Mike

    Larry Guest

    You know, the two Sonys (F 717, F 828)I have include that
    feature, and the only reason I haven't taken advantage of
    it is HABIT...

    I did give it a try this AM on some landscapes (we had our
    first snow of the season today) and it seemed to work ok.

    I'll know better when I get the images into PhotoShop later
    tonight.


    I'm STILL leary of taking a DSLR into the horse show ring
    because of the dust, dirt and crud.. So far a soft
    cleaning brush is all I've needed to keep the P&S gear
    cleaned, but my ONLY experience in the ring with a DSLR was
    a disaster... Had to pay to have the INSIDE of the camera
    cleaned even though I had never removed the lens during the
    day.
     
    Larry, Nov 13, 2004
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  3. Mike

    Alfred Molon Guest

    If the lens is bad and blurs the image, the CCD will still record 8
    million pixels, but the information content will be less than that. You
    could be down to just 3 million pixels for instance.
     
    Alfred Molon, Nov 13, 2004
  4. The 8080 does very well at ISO 50. Check out the top comparison in this
    page.

    http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos20d/page26.asp

    But if you look at the bottom comparison, you'll see it's problematic
    at ISO 400. The noise does serious damage to the fine detail, while the 20D
    at ISO 1600 retains a lot more of the detail.

    David J. Littleboy
    Tokyo, Japan
     
    David J. Littleboy, Nov 13, 2004
  5. Mike

    YAG-ART Guest

    Great the snow is comming (not)

    There are tricks to keeping it clean, unless you have one of the Canon
    (probably others) that has good dust and water seals built in.
     
    YAG-ART, Nov 13, 2004
  6. Mike

    YAG-ART Guest

    I lens would have to be very bad to blur the image.
     
    YAG-ART, Nov 13, 2004
  7. Mike

    dj_nme Guest

    My Dimage 7i (5 MP) has no perceivable shutter lag when I use it the
    manual focusing setting.
    It does obviously take some time for the lens to focus when set to
    autofocus, but once focused (with shutter button half pressed) fires the
    instant the button is fully depressed.

    Maybe other prosumer digicams focus and release the shutter in one go
    with a press of the shutter button, and that would be slower than the
    pre-focus then fire method than what the (konica-)Minolta models do.
     
    dj_nme, Nov 13, 2004
  8. Mike

    Alfred Molon Guest

    Then have a look at this beautiful sharp image:
    http://www.molon.de/F21_35.jpg

    The shot was taken with a Minolta SLR and a Tamron 28-200 lens, scanned
    with a 4000 dpi Nikon LS 50 scanner.
     
    Alfred Molon, Nov 13, 2004
  9. Mike

    dj_nme Guest

    What is more likely imho is that a "el cheapo" SLR lens on your
    expensive DSLR will probably give you worse purple fringing, slower
    focusing and slower apeture than a lens designed specificaly for and
    built into a high-end prosumer digicam.

    An image taken in ideal condition that still must be heavily "worked
    over" in photoshop to make it look acceptable because of the lens is not
    a great outcome.

    When a prosumer high-megapixel camera with a great intregral lens can
    cost _less_ than the price of a DSLR and a 35mm (or 4/3) lens that has
    the same parameters, then I think the prosumer models wins.
     
    dj_nme, Nov 13, 2004
  10. Mike

    MarkH Guest

    I have been thinking about an ideal setup, for me that would be something
    like:

    Canon 1DMkII
    Selection of 'L' series lenses + Sigma 120-300 f2.8
    1.4x Teleconverter
    Canon 580EX Speedlite
    Canon A95


    The Canon A95 has a swivel LCD and built in flash, small, light and offers
    good macro. The Canon 1DMkII focuses FAST, shoots fast, has low noise even
    at ISO 1600, has flash hotshoe, can use a wide variety of lenses. Having
    both gives the versatility that cannot be matched in any one camera.

    I think that my ideal setup would be hard to beat on anything but the
    price.

    My current setup is a Canon 10D + some lenses, I will consider adding a
    Canon A95 at some point to give me a small light camera with swivel LCD,
    for when those features are preferred.
     
    MarkH, Nov 13, 2004
  11. Mike

    YAG-ART Guest

    I use a cheap Canon EF 50mm lens on my Canon D2000, and have no
    problems.
     
    YAG-ART, Nov 14, 2004
  12. When I have the camera on a tripod, I find it much easier to compose via the
    LCD of my prosumer camera than to try and crane my neck so I can peer into the
    electronic viewfinder.
     
    Michael Meissner, Nov 14, 2004
  13. Mike

    bob Guest

    My LCD works in bright light -- If the sun is shining directly on it it's
    not so good.

    A few days ago I took a number of photos at a school assembly. The view
    from an arms length over my head was much better than the view from eye
    level. How does your angle viewfinder help in that circumstance.

    For work I take pictures of buildings. The LCD lets me position the camera
    outside of the car, which has the great advantage of not including the
    mirror on the picture. I don't think your angle viewfinder would help with
    that either.

    Since I'm seriously considering buying a D70, I have been thinking through
    these issues too.

    Bob
     
    bob, Nov 14, 2004
  14. Mike

    YAG-ART Guest

    Have you thought about moving?
    Why are you inside the car? Get out to take the photo. I just don't
    understand.
     
    YAG-ART, Nov 14, 2004
  15. Mike

    Annika1980 Guest

    From: bob
    I'll admit that the swivel screen on my Mini-DV recorder comes in handy when
    I'm shooting over people at golf tournaments.
    I can't say I've ever missed that feature on my DSLR, however. There have been
    1 or 2 times when I wished I had a right-angle viewfinder for when I'm shooting
    with the cammy on the ground (pet photos).
     
    Annika1980, Nov 14, 2004
  16. Mike

    Matt Ion Guest

    Very few P&S cameras allow you to control aperture, at least to the
    degree available in SLRs. Depth of field is directly affected by
    aperture. Even a "cheap" SLR zoom, like my 300D's bundled 18-55mm, can
    run anywhere from f/3.5 to f/32 (that'll give you about 15' to infinity
    at 50mm), and with adjustable ISO of 100 to 3200 and shutter speeds up
    to 1/4000 (or better in some cameras), the user has COMPLETE control
    over depth of field.
    Many digital P&S cameras actually create an artificial shutter noise,
    because people expect it; most wouldn't know that the picture had
    actually been taken without a little electronically-produced
    "click-whirrr" from the camera.
    Greater overall mass makes for less jitter (conservation of inertia),
    suitable for hand-holding with longer shutter times. Jitter caused by a
    flipping mirror is irrelevant next the movement of hand-holding anyway,
    and jitter caused by the shutter is practically unmeasureable, let alone
    noticeable to the human eye.
     
    Matt Ion, Nov 14, 2004
  17. Mike

    Matt Ion Guest

    Yes, there are advantages. No, they do not come close to proving an
    all-encompassing argument for "P&S/ZLR is better than SLR". There are
    serious disadvantages to the live preview as well.
     
    Matt Ion, Nov 14, 2004
  18. Mike

    Matt Ion Guest

    The point was that DSLRs have the same "feature" that he claims for
    ZLRs. That you can ALSO use all-manual lenses on some DSLRs only adds
    to their flexibility.
    Irrelevant. Camera lenses are round. Sensors are rectangular. ANY
    camera is going to "waste" a portion of the light by cropping the top,
    bottom and sides.
     
    Matt Ion, Nov 14, 2004
  19. Mike

    MarkH Guest

    This reminds me of the guy shooting with a prosumer digicam, when he was
    looking through his images deleting the duds, I asked him what his high
    score was. He explained that his camera only had sounds settings for on or
    off, set to off meant he had no audio feedback when he took a shot, he
    preferred to know when the camera had taken the shot.

    My 10D was much quieter, it only makes a noise while the shot is being
    taken.
     
    MarkH, Nov 14, 2004
  20. Gary Hendricks, Nov 14, 2004
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