phone socket wiring

Discussion in 'Broadband' started by Gordon Freeman, Nov 8, 2014.

  1. I decided to replace my old style master socket with an NTE5 one so I could
    fit one of these here much vaunted filtered faceplates, but the socket came
    with no instructions at all, just two connections marked A and B. The old
    socket has a blue/white wire on 5 and a white/blue one on 2. Comparing the
    two circuit boards it looks like A = 5 and B = 2, is that right?

    Another thing, is the colouring on wires always used systematically or does
    it vary by installation? I ask becaase the ADSL faceplate did come with
    instructions and they say that when wiring in an extension you should
    connect the blue/white wire to 2 and the white/blue one to 5 which is the
    opposite of my existing master socket. (Or does the numbering scheme vary
    on different pieces of kit?)


    A young lad was taken by his mother to the Temple at Wong Tai Sin.
    He shook the tsim and took the stick to the fortune teller, who said:
    "You will have a long life, happiness... but not much money.
    You will have success... but nobody will know.
    You will create great things... but others will get the credit.
    You will be beautiful in your heart... but not in your looks.
    It is your destiny to be an engineer."
    Gordon Freeman, Nov 8, 2014
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  2. Gordon Freeman

    David Guest

    Is this helpful
    David, Nov 8, 2014
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  3. Gordon Freeman

    Graham. Guest

    Yes, what you have done is right.

    In a domestic situation it doesn't really matter which colour pair you
    use although convention dictates you use the blue pair first, then if
    you have a second or subsequent lines you use orange green and brown
    pairs in that order. The list goes on but you are unlikely to
    encounter more than 4 pair cables in a domestic setting.

    What is more important is that you don't split the pairs, always use
    the same colour (plus white) as the second conductor of the pair.
    This is because these are mutually twisted to improve interference
    immunity, and reduce cross-talk.
    Graham., Nov 8, 2014
  4. Others have already commented on the wiring methodology. One possible
    reason there were no instructions with your master socket is that the
    master socket belongs to your service provider and they (in theory!) are
    the only people who should change it and therefore know how to do it.
    That said its often done and doesn't cause any issues if done correctly!

    Peter Andrews, Nov 9, 2014
  5. Oops! Oh well it's done now, sadly it has made zero difference to the
    connection speed or SNR I am getting! Maybe it will improve line
    stability though, it's too early to tell. When I was comparing the old-
    style socket's innards to the NTE5 the only electrical difference I could
    see was that the old one had a surge protector, though I'm not sure how
    that was supposed to work, it looks rather like a small fat capacitor. The
    ADSL faceplate innards are sealed behind plastic rivets though so I don't
    know how that differs from the microfilter I was using before as I didn't
    feel inclined to break it open unnecessarily.
    Gordon Freeman, Nov 10, 2014
  6. Gordon Freeman

    Graham. Guest

    If you think about the topography:

    Without the central faceplate filter the ADSL signal is split and goes
    to all your extension sockets then a filter at each active socket is

    With the faceplate filter the ADSL RF signal is stopped from reaching
    the extension wiring.

    If there is no extension wiring, there is little to be gained apart
    from ascetics.

    I use an ordinary dongle type filter as a central filter it doesn't
    look pretty.
    Graham., Nov 11, 2014
  7. Gordon Freeman

    Woody Guest

    It will likely only make a difference if you have any
    extension wiring that can act as an aerial as the filtering
    is only on the bell wire (assuming your extension wiring
    still has a bell wire.)

    I obtained a vDSL iPlate through eBay for not much money and
    fitted that for a neighbour (I am on cable) whereafter
    Speedtest showed a download speed increase of over 50%. I am
    told though - cannot vouch for it - that said plate not only
    has a filter but is also a line rebalancer.
    Woody, Nov 11, 2014
  8. Gordon Freeman

    Martin Brown Guest

    I also got a roughly 50% speed increase on a rural line after applying
    just the bellwire hack. The internal phone wiring was very simple single
    line so I was surprised that it made such a big difference.

    We are fairly close to a powerful TV/radio transmitter...
    (not that it allows decent DAB reception)
    Martin Brown, Nov 11, 2014
  9. Gordon Freeman

    nemo Guest

    nemo, Nov 11, 2014
  10. As others have said, it's the internal extension wiring (if you have
    any) that acts as an antenna and slows down your broadband speed.
    An i-Plate will help in that respect but the best way of obtaining the
    maximum speed for your line would be to get rid of all extension wiring,
    fit a two-outlet filtered socket (one with a socket for phone and the
    other for broadband) and run everything you use just from the master
    socket. If you have extension phone requirements, do like many of us and
    get a DECT wireless system.
    George Weston, Nov 11, 2014
  11. ....or use a old fashioned analogue or hybrid PABX..
    The Natural Philosopher, Nov 11, 2014
  12. Gordon Freeman

    Peter Able Guest

    On 11/11/2014 08:15, Woody wrote:

    .. I am
    It does.

    Peter Able, Nov 11, 2014
  13. Gordon Freeman

    NY Guest

    I'm all for eliminating house wiring that's not needed, especially if it's
    unfiltered and especially if the house is a long way from the exchange. One
    of my customers lives about 3 miles from the exchange and the cable comes
    across the fields (either on overhead cables or underground). She's been
    told that even though North Yorkshire is rolling out FTTC to almost
    everywhere, there are very few people and those that there are live hundreds
    of yards apart, so FTTC is unlikely and may still give long lengths of
    copper if a cabinet is installed somewhere nearby: wherever it is put, some
    people will still live a long way from it. So she's stuck with about 500
    kbit/sec downstream.

    How much will ADSL be degraded by RF pickup in the house wiring, compared
    with the amount picked up on the wire between the pole and the house
    (assuming overhead wiring)? I presume it's twisted pair from the pole to the
    exchange, but untwisted from the point at which each house's feed leaves the
    bundled cable in the street.

    The problem with BT's modern approach is that they put the master socket in
    one place and you are stuffed if you want your router anywhere else so as to
    be able to connect it by Ethernet to PCs and don't want to use Homeplug to
    achieve this. A least with the older strategy you have unfiltered throughout
    the house and can choose where to put the router.

    I wonder what they do in new houses? My house, 10 years old, had its master
    socket right by the front door where there was no room for a router and no
    mains socket to power it. At least because I had unfiltered throughout the
    house, I could plug the router into any of the sockets that the builder had
    installed and connected back to the (unfiltered) faceplate of the master

    I've always wondered: even when you have an underground cable, why is it
    that BT usually have the cable coming up out of the ground on the *outside*
    of the house where anyone can cut it between there and the point where it
    goes through the wall. Why not have the trunking come up through the
    concrete floor inside the house?
    NY, Nov 11, 2014
  14. Gordon Freeman

    Roger Mills Guest

    Mine *does* come up through the concrete floor (house built in 1960's).
    Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
    Roger Mills, Nov 11, 2014
  15. Gordon Freeman

    NY Guest

    My previous house (built 2000) had trunking that came up through the flower
    bed and ran up the wall to a hole about 6" above ground. Various houses of
    1960s-1990s vintage that I've looked at when tracing the course of the cable
    (to locate the master socket when it's not obvious by having two parts) have
    also had trunking that came up outside the wall.

    Most houses that have overhead cable (like ours built in the 1930s) have the
    cable running down the wall to an entry hole a foot or so from the ground,
    rather than entering through the eaves and running down to the ground floor
    via an internal route. The only overhead house with internal wiring is my
    parents' bungalow, where the line runs along the sides of the joists and
    then down inside the wall to the socket.
    NY, Nov 11, 2014
  16. Gordon Freeman

    David Guest

    My BT/OR Master is in the hall a few feet from outside door now one or
    two of you have said you not like where it is as you plug your BB
    router/ Modems into it but would have preferred to have done that in
    another part of the house if the Master had been there.

    Well I think my Master has a couple of connections in it for running a
    cable to somewhere else in the house is it not possible to run a cable
    and put another "master" where you want and plug BB and connect phone
    extension from this second "master"?

    David, Nov 11, 2014
  17. Gordon Freeman

    NY Guest

    I was thinking particularly of new builds where even if the builder puts in
    extension wiring to other sockets (bedrooms, lounge etc) it will almost
    certainly be on the wrong side of the filter in the master socket. OK, so if
    you know what you are doing you can unwire one of the extension lines and
    wire it into the unfiltered side, or you can lay a completely new cable down
    the side of skirting boards and under doorway carpet strips and plug this
    into the unfiltered socket.

    When you change from ADSL to VDSL and FTTC, I wonder how amenable BT
    Openreach (maybe on behalf of your ISP) are to moving the master socket from
    where it is at present to the location where you want the router and then
    back-cabling from there to the other phone sockets?
    NY, Nov 11, 2014
  18. Gordon Freeman

    David Guest

    BT did not attend at any of my changes of system or ISP, I'm on FTTC now.
    David, Nov 11, 2014
  19. Gordon Freeman

    Roger Mills Guest

    Did *anyone* attend when you switched to FTTC? If so, who? If not, how
    was it done?
    Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
    Roger Mills, Nov 11, 2014
  20. Gordon Freeman

    Woody Guest

    For a start all BT cable <should> be twisted pair right to
    your delivery point but some overheads (like mine, but I'm
    on cable) may not be. In theory if it has been done properly
    any internal extension wiring in candy cable should also be
    twisted pair. The only cable that will not be is the flat
    cable from the socket to the phone.

    ADSL degradation, as I said in an earlier post, is almost
    entirely due to the bell wire acting as an aerial. If you
    don't need a bell wire (and most modern phones do not) then
    extension wiring in twisted pair should not degrade the ADSL
    provided it is kept away from RF or electrical noise sources
    of which DECT phones are a good example. There is no reason
    why you should not remove the master socket filter plate (it
    unplugs) or change the master socket to a non-filtered type
    and move the filtered master to where you need it. BT badged
    sockets are easy enough to get hold of.
    Woody, Nov 11, 2014
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