NZ Linux users engage in Govt-MS bashing

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Alex Axolotl, Nov 25, 2004.

  1. Alex Axolotl

    AD. Guest

    Only because XP is itself 3 years old :)
     
    AD., Nov 28, 2004
    #81
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  2. Alex Axolotl

    Peter Guest

    Yes - even then !
     
    Peter, Nov 28, 2004
    #82
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  3. Alex Axolotl

    Guest Guest

    Micro$oft would only need to settle 6 or so large suits akin to the one
    between itself and Novell over WordPerfect and most of it's cash reserves
    would be smoke.


    Divine
     
    Guest, Nov 28, 2004
    #83
  4. Alex Axolotl

    Peter Guest

    The TCP / IP stack code used by Microsoft is generally acknowledged to
    be open source originally. I am not saying that Microsoft's use of it
    is unlawful, merely pointing out that Miucrosoft does use such code in
    its products. Moreover GPL code has been found in Microsoft products.
    Again there is nothing wrong with this as long as this noted in the
    binaries or some or appropriate place and the source code (including
    additions / altrations) is publically accessible (as it apparently
    is).
     
    Peter, Nov 28, 2004
    #84
  5. If you want to pay for bleeding edge hardware to run bleeding edge OS,
    that's wholly different from buying older hardware to run the less up to
    date software. We still have machines running Windows 98.
     
    Patrick Dunford, Nov 28, 2004
    #85
  6. I don't really care. Who cares if Mickey Mouse is still covered by
    copyright?
    It is actually the copyright holder - an individual or their agent, or a
    corporation
     
    Patrick Dunford, Nov 28, 2004
    #86
  7. The govt is NOT aligned to the Greens. We currently have a
    Labour-Progressive coalition. The Greens are not in the cabinet.

    There is no bill that gives a directive as to what sort of software govt
    depts purchase.

    The only point that I agree with you on this is that the Greens do
    promote OSS. That does not mean anti-Microsoft. OSS and Microsoft can
    coexist.

    http://www.greens.org.nz/searchdocs/other7387.html
     
    Alan Liefting, Nov 28, 2004
    #87
  8. The Greens have never been in the Cabinet, they had a formal association
    with the government last time and more than likely will again next time.
    The only real point of difference is the GE policy, they generally
    support the Labour government on most things.
     
    Patrick Dunford, Nov 28, 2004
    #88
  9. *SNIP*

    A lot of MS's networking software has the required copyrights for BSD in
    it. That's stuff that ships with XP, not just stuff from the "dark old
    days."
    NT3.5 shipped with the BSD IP stack basically transplanted straight in.
    Since then MS have written their own, but it was only with XP that
    Windows got most of the base IP functionality that the Unix world has
    taken for granted forever - Source routing, to name but one feature.

    --
    Matthew Poole Auckland, New Zealand
    "Veni, vidi, velcro...
    I came, I saw, I stuck around"

    My real e-mail is mattATp00leDOTnet
     
    Matthew Poole, Nov 28, 2004
    #89
  10. I don't know about you, but I consider death plus 70 years to be just a
    little on the ridiculous side.
    To put that into perspective: If I were to copyright something tomorrow,
    age 25, have kids between 30 and 35, and live my current projected
    average lifespan of 79 years, my kids (assuming today's average
    lifespan) would be DEAD before my copyrighted creation of tomorrow
    became public domain.

    Anything beyond the death of the creator is licence-to-print-money
    stuff. The person responsible for the work is no longer deriving any
    benefit from it, therefore it should revert to public domain. Only
    corporations benefit from term extensions, which is why Disney get down
    on their knees before Congress on a regular basis - to ensure that
    Mickey and Donald don't become public domain.

    --
    Matthew Poole Auckland, New Zealand
    "Veni, vidi, velcro...
    I came, I saw, I stuck around"

    My real e-mail is mattATp00leDOTnet
     
    Matthew Poole, Nov 28, 2004
    #90
  11. Alex Axolotl

    Allistar Guest

    Java is not OSS, but I agree with your sentiment.

    Allistar.
     
    Allistar, Nov 28, 2004
    #91
  12. Alex Axolotl

    AD. Guest

    That wasn't my point, the current discussion was how well Longhorn would
    run on todays hardware - ie hardware that will on average be 2-3 years old
    by the time Longhorn is released.

    Bringing up the fact that XP runs well on 3 year old hardware isn't a good
    supporting argument as XP was itself released 3 years ago and that
    hardware would've been new when XP was released. You would have to compare
    XP on 5-6 year old hardware to get the same comparison.

    Most of the machines here (including the one I'm using now) are 5-6 years
    old and XP can be pretty painful on them when multitasking.

    Cheers
    Anton
     
    AD., Nov 28, 2004
    #92
  13. Alex Axolotl

    Chris Hope Guest

    Thing is though, will there be any compelling reason to upgrade to Longhorn?
    Many of the "nifty" features they were going to introduce seem to have been
    shelved so they can get the product out the door without causing several
    more years delay. I was never particularly interested in all the crap they
    were going to add anyway because you end up having to have a really souped
    up machine just to run an OS.

    I only use Windows for Photoshop, Dreamweaver, gaming and testing websites
    in IE on their native platform. I don't really want to have to buy Longhorn
    when it comes out but I'm guessing I'll need to in order to be able to test
    the latest version of IE. I'm *not* looking forward to having to shell out
    for a new computer to run it on; there's no way the Windows machine I have
    here will be able to run Longhorn on it without a motherboard upgrade which
    would mean having to get a whole heap of other new hardware, so easier to
    just get a new machine...
     
    Chris Hope, Nov 28, 2004
    #93
  14. No, but the previous poster claimed we were forced to spend unnecessarily
    to buy new hardware to run newer versions.

    If you don't run the latest version of everything, we don't, there isn't
    such an issue.
    Now what is this bizarre reasoning?

    The point is... we can buy 3 year old machines at a good price (way below
    new cost), they run XP well and that is economical for us.
    A pentium 400. Well that is no surprise to me. But I did not advocate any
    such thing. All our XP machines are around 3 - 4 years old (Celeron 700
    or better) and run XP well.
     
    Patrick Dunford, Nov 28, 2004
    #94
  15. Alex Axolotl

    Matthias Guest

    "The WLUG are not about either Government *OR* Microsoft bashing. We
    are about Linux and Open Source advocacy."

    -- Greig McGill, President, Waikato Linux Users Group Inc.

    In other words, we believe that Linux competes very well on its own
    merits. No Microsoft bashing required.

    -- Matthias
     
    Matthias, Nov 28, 2004
    #95
  16. Hi there,

    A fair few of those firewalls still let RPC thru, since Windows relies
    so heavily on that exploit. An OSS environ with software iptables will
    be cheap as chips to configure and protect...
     
    Chris Wilkinson, Nov 29, 2004
    #96
  17. *SNIP*

    And when MS stop supporting their products, you're left with unpatchable
    software. Meaning you have to upgrade. And the logical upgrade is to
    the latest version of whatever it was you used to run. Meaning you have
    to upgrade the hardware.
    With OSS, even if the software is no longer supported by the original
    vendor, you can still find someone to write patches for you. You can
    even write them yourself.

    --
    Matthew Poole Auckland, New Zealand
    "Veni, vidi, velcro...
    I came, I saw, I stuck around"

    My real e-mail is mattATp00leDOTnet
     
    Matthew Poole, Nov 29, 2004
    #97
  18. RPC is only an intranet thing isn't it? What service would require RPC on
    the internet?
     
    Patrick Dunford, Nov 29, 2004
    #98
  19. They stop supporting after 6 -8 years by which time the hardware is
    creakingly old and the software belongs in a museum.

    I'm typing this on a Pentium 166MMX running Windows 98. About an 8 year
    old computer. Windows 98 is still supported by Microsoft and will be for
    another 18 months. By the time I finally get around to replacing this PC
    I won't miss it, just as I don't miss the 386 that preceded it.

    It's worth about $10, and I can get a 3 year old machine for about $300,
    which is not really a lot of money.
    Writing a patch for your own machine is a different proposition from
    being Microsoft and releasing patches for millions of machines. They have
    to be tested enough to work everywhere without causing problems. Look at
    all the problems reported with SP2.
     
    Patrick Dunford, Nov 29, 2004
    #99
  20. Alex Axolotl

    Chris Hope Guest

    However Apache doesn't have to care about the underlying hardware or
    variety of other software installed whereas Windows does. Makes them
    quite a different kettle of fish.
     
    Chris Hope, Nov 29, 2004
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