Need a low shutter lag point and shoot digital

Hi. I need some help. I want to get a small
point and shoot digital camera, but I am concerned
about the shutter lag. Please do not recommend a
DSLR, as I have a Canon 1D Mark II and 10D cameras
and plenty of lenses to go with them. I'm looking
for something small, some specs that are important
to me:

5 megapixels or larger,
auto, manual, aperture priority modes,
3x optical zoom minimum, with autofocus,
built in flash,
compact flash I (and type II would be nice) cards,
under about $500,
reasonably low shutter lag for this type of camera.

Nice but not necessary: raw mode output.

The question is, what is a reasonably low shutter
lag on such cameras these days? I can't seem to find
many specs. Lag only seems to be mentioned rarely
in reviews, and the manufacturers do not seem to
give it. Does someone know of a site (especially a
table that compares the lag times, measured in a uniform
way) with lag times? I want lag time from shutter press,
autofocus, exposure calculation to release of the shutter,
and I do not consider lag time with manual focus to be
relevant for my purposes.

I have a Canon G1 and shutter lag is awful. It often seems
to take 0.5 to 1 second or longer to acquire focus and shoot.
(Of course this is quite maddening after using the 1D Mark II
with its 40 millisecond lag ;-).

One camera that I am looking at is the Canon A95, but I
can not find shutter lag info. It also only uses
compact flash type I.

Any help would be appreciated,
Thanks in advance,

Roger
photography, digital info at: http://www.clarkvision.com

 

Table no, but I believe all the reviews at http://www.dpreview have the
results of lag time tests.
________________________________________________________
Ed Ruf Lifetime AMA# 344007 ()
http://EdwardGRuf.com

 

I'm no expert on any of this, but one thing to make sure of is that you
can turn off the flash. If you need to make multiple sequential shots,
charging a flash can be a limiting factor rather than shutter lag.
Likewise, if you _need_ the flash, make sure that you check the specs for
flash charge time.

 

Not really what you're specs are but you could also look at the
KonicaMinolta G530 or (G500 or G600). The shutter lag is almost
unnoticable after focus. No CF card, but SD...
Also quite a nr of manual setting possible, no RAW output.

Alain

 

Even if you can find the specs, the formal definition of shutter lag
excludes the AF time.

The P&S cameras use the CCD for AF and have to read out several frames to
focus. So the fastest P&S is going to be a lot slower than the slowest dSLR.

Even worse, the CCD-based AF systems often focus on something contrasty in
the background instead of your subject. This makes the EVF cameras
attractive, since you can see when the AF is messing up.

David J. Littleboy
Tokyo, Japan

 

I've seen my Canon PS-400 do exactly the opposite; focus on something in
the foreground when my subject was further away.

 

Well, yes. I should have said "focus on something other than the subject
when the subject has relatively low contrast". It's _really_ irritating.

As I understand it, the dSLRs can do that also, but the AF sensors are quite
a bit smaller so it's much less of a problem (if you select the AF sensor
manually<g>).

David J. Littleboy
Tokyo, Japan

 

Remember the camrera doent know what the subject is, only the
photogrpaher does.

 

Come to think of it, My S85 used to do that for landscape shots. It would
focus on the pavement at my feet even though the center 1/3 of the image was
all a long way away.

Yes, but that's not the only/major problem. You careful place the (single)
AF point over the subject but the camera finds something in the background
or foreground to focus on. The focus area in a lot of P&S cameras is just
too large.

David J. Littleboy
Tokyo, Japan

 

I didn't know that. Shooting a DSLR I guess the p&s just don't come
close.

 

David J. Littleboy wrote:
[]

The Nikon 8400 includes an additional focus sensor in addition to contrast
detection and is much faster in focussing.

In the Nikon 990 (IIRC) the logic is to focus on the nearer part of the
scene. On the Nikon 5700 and 8400 you can get a red rectangle showing to
highlight the actual area of the scene which has been used for focus - I
always have this enabled and find it invaluable.

Later cameras offer you the optional choice of scene area to focus on,
just like an SLR.

David

 

It seems you are wrong on this.

"A half-press of the shutter release results in focus lock in just under
half a second in most cases. It can take around a second or so in more
difficult focusing situations. Low light focusing was better than average
(thanks to the AF-assist lamp), but not the best I've seen."

In other words, a lot slower than the slowest dSLR.

That only works if some sensor area actually finds the nearest part of the
scene. The problem is that contrast detection finds contrast in the
sensitive area, and the sensitive areas tend to be too large. The general
recommendation (even with dSLRs) is to only use one AF sensor, point at the
subject, half press, and recompose.

If you think there is _anything_ about small-sensor cameras that is "just
like an SLR", I've got a bridge to sell you.

David J. Littleboy
Tokyo, Japan

 

When I bought my Minolta Dimage A1 it was reviewed as having the shortest
lag of any digital non-SLR. I was very disappointed with it. Although it was
indeed faster than any other camera I had owned to that point, it focuses
too softly, defaults to 72 dpi for jpeg compression, and has a lot of
digital noise. The A2 supposedly corrected all these faults and was even
faster.

The smallest cameras are going almost entirely to SD cards. I really love
Jane's Nikon 5200. It is very fast, too, but uses only the SD cards.

 

David J. Littleboy wrote:
[]

I have the camera in front of me and can see the additional sensor! The
8400 is faster in focussing than comparable cameras, in my experience.

[]

David, are you saying that SLRs do /not/ offer you a choice of focus area?
If that's the case, then they are less versatile than I thought.

Cheers,
David

 

How about a pointer to a page in a review that discusses this. The best I
could find was "spot AF" which didn't sound like a separate sensor.

I was talking about _performance_.

David J. Littleboy
Tokyo, Japan

 

I got my wife an Olympus 5060 last year for Christmas. B&H has 'em now for
$500. She's really happy with it. I'm impressed with it. I really like
that it can remember my settings. With a twist of a knob, I can get it off
the regular settings, zoom to 50mm equivalent, put gridlines on the screen,
and set the flash exposure compensation.

Compared to a 1 series Canon, the shutter lag is horrendous. Compared to
other P&S digitals, it's ok. You can partially depress the shutter to set
exposure and focus, and then the lag isn't so bad...probably on the order of
100-200 mS. Short enough to sometimes capture a quick-moving child. Long
enough to make me long for a Mark II.

Here are a couple examples, using the built-in flash in both:

http://canid.com/pics/christmas2003.jpg
http://canid.com/pics/jbm_boiler_hat.jpg

 

<I posted this earlier, but didn't see it on any outside servers.>

Hope it's not too late, but you may want to take a look at the Sony V3
here: http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/V3/V3A7.HTM

The V3 and several other Sony cameras appear to to have shutter lag
arround 9-11ms, which is 4 times shorter than that of your 1D-II. They
also have some of the fastest focusing and shot to shot cycle times among
P&S digicams too. It's just Sony's JPEG quality is not up to Canon's
level, however, IMO. It meets all of your requirements except priced at
more than $500.

You can also compare lag times of many cameras on www.imaging-
resource.com which I think has the best time measurements out there.