How to import digital photos from iPad to Linux using USB cable?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Pat Wilson, May 9, 2014.

  1. Pat Wilson

    Guest Guest

    But iOS devices are extremely vulnerable to it, because they are
    designed to interact automatically and 'back up' and 'update' everything
    every time they are plugged in to a 'trusted' computer - and the user
    only has to 'trust' that computer once for the life of the iOS device.
    That's jolly handy for iPad users, but also jolly handy for anyone who
    wants to get inside your iPad without you knowing.[/QUOTE]

    all mobile devices are vulnerable to juice jacking.
    complete nonsense.

    the usual criticism is the opposite, that ios devices are locked down,
    a 'walled garden', not that they are promiscuous.

    99% of mobile malware targeted android:
    <http://www.cisco.com/web/offers/lp/2014-annual-security-report/index.ht
    ml>
    many people do that since there are usb ports everywhere, including on
    airplanes and hotels.

    why should someone fear what is basically a +5v power supply?
    nonsense. the drivers are only required for syncing. it can connect,
    charge and copy photos without drivers.
    it is talking and it's talking ptp.

    android on the other hand, doesn't even do that much. i just plugged in
    my android phone to my computer and lightroom didn't see it at all
    because unlike ios devices, it doesn't show up as a standard digital
    camera.

    in other words, you are bashing the wrong product for not being
    standards compliant.
    they didn't put a security hole there.

    they *removed* a security hole, which still exists on other mobile
    devices.

    that's one reason why android has 99% of mobile malware.
    i know what juice jacking is and i know how the pairing trust ticket
    mechanism works and i know how enterprise customers disable it (no
    jailbreaking required).

    you do not.
     
    Guest, May 12, 2014
    #41
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  2. Pat Wilson

    Guest Guest

    Not if you're connecting your iPad to an Apple computer, or a Windows
    computer with the "iPad drivers" installed. But Apple do not provide
    any "drivers" for connecting their devices to other operating systems,
    nor do they reveal the code in the device firmware to make it easy for
    anyone else to provide such "drivers".[/QUOTE]

    the drivers are not needed to copy photos.

    they are used for other services.
    what they changed was asking the user to trust the computer to which it
    is connected and that's a good thing.

    and the volunteers didn't need to reverse engineer anything. the method
    by which the pairing works has not changed. the only thing that changed
    is it now asks the user to trust the device when the keys are
    exchanged. if it worked properly in the first place there would not be
    a problem. in other words, their first attempt was buggy and
    incomplete.
    yes they absolutely do look like digital cameras and *any* software
    that can copy photos from a camera will work.

    android devices on the other hand, do *not* do that. one of the most
    popular image processing apps, lightroom, does not see my android
    phone.
    which is where the usb cable comes in.
     
    Guest, May 12, 2014
    #42
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  3. Pat Wilson

    Aragorn Guest

    No, that is incorrect. The reason why Apple refuses to support
    GNU/Linux is because they know that GNU/Linux comes from an entirely
    different social ecosystem, where software is usually free in every
    sense, including the financial aspect.

    Given that Apple is a proprietary software maker and that they expect
    not to be able to make a single dime out of GNU/Linux, they refuse to
    support it. It's that simple.
    Shhh, don't tell my computer, and don't tell my friends who use
    GNU/Linux as their day-to-day workstations. I've only been using it for
    the last 14+ years, and I've never needed (or wanted) anything else.
    If your definition of "normal" means what an intelligent person would
    construe as "brain-dead", then I agree with you.
     
    Aragorn, May 12, 2014
    #43
  4. Pat Wilson

    PeterN Guest

    Conversely discussion of English errors made by a participant were
    frowned upon on a tech writing list I used to participate in.
     
    PeterN, May 12, 2014
    #44
  5. Pat Wilson

    PeterN Guest

    :-0
     
    PeterN, May 13, 2014
    #45
  6. Pat Wilson

    Aragorn Guest

    Yes, and like I said, the GNU/Linux ecosystem is slightly different.
    Isn't that what I was saying, then?
    Personally I disagree with that, but I will grant you that not everyone
    in the GNU/Linux and FLOSS community feels the same about that as I do.
    More like 5% at the least, and possibly 8%, which is not bad for an
    operating system that doesn't have any marketing behind it at all, and
    which is effectively being boycotted in the corporately controlled
    mainstream media.
    You consider "versatile and configurable" a sign of poor design?
    Indeed not. It is *very clear* that you are trapped in the MacIntosh
    mind warp.
     
    Aragorn, May 13, 2014
    #46
  7. Pat Wilson

    Tony Cooper Guest

    I'm a bit puzzled by your seeming objection. "Conversely" is used to
    mean the opposite. It was stated that it is not appropriate to give
    English lessons in a photo group, and then it was said that it is was
    frowned upon to discuss English errors in a tech writing group.

    There's a parallel, but also an opposite. The parallel is the two
    statements that indicated that it is not appropriate to give English
    lessons in the groups. The opposite is the incongruity of not
    correcting English in a *writing* group.

    Peter's sentence is not how I'd write it, but I can see how he came up
    with "conversely". What he's saying is that one would expect the
    opposite in a writing group, but the opposite of what was expected is
    what happened.
     
    Tony Cooper, May 13, 2014
    #47
  8. Pat Wilson

    Tony Cooper Guest

    It is the opposite of what one might expect. You don't expect English
    lessons in a photo group, but you do expect the discussion of errors
    in English in a writing group. Yet, it was frowned upon.

    Not well phrased or punctuated, but not beyond understanding.
     
    Tony Cooper, May 13, 2014
    #48
  9. Pat Wilson

    Tony Cooper Guest

    It would not be my phrasing. I could use the word in that comparison,
    but I probably wouldn't. My point is that I do understand what he was
    going for.
     
    Tony Cooper, May 13, 2014
    #49
  10. Pat Wilson

    Guest Guest

    it's a business decision. nothing more.
    you seriously think people should work for free??
    not on the desktop it isn't. it's market share is for servers and
    embedded devices, where it's well suited. for the desktop, its share is
    *very* low.

    but even if those numbers were true (and they aren't), it's still not
    worth the bother to support it. companies can get over 90% of users
    with just two platforms and the remaining users generally won't pay for
    anything anyway.

    that's not a boycott. it's smart business.
    it can be.

    what matters is how efficient and productive someone can get their work
    done, not how configurable something might be.

    having the most features and options is generally a sign of *no* design.
    it has nothing to do with any so called macintosh mind warp, something
    made up by apple haters.

    people want to get stuff done, not tweak their systems all day long.
     
    Guest, May 13, 2014
    #50
  11. Pat Wilson

    Whiskers Guest

    all mobile devices are vulnerable to juice jacking.[/QUOTE]

    Potentially, yes; but only iOS devices are designed by default and
    without involving the user, to allow a connected computer to do almost
    anything it wants to with them.
    It's an orgy inside that wall.
    A USB socket is not basically a power supply. It's a data transfer
    device that happens to have the ability to deliver power as well. If
    you don't know what the socket has behind it, you should not plug
    anything into it. Find a 'mains' socket (or in a car, the 'cigar
    lighter' 12v socket) and use your own power adaptor/charger.
    No it can't; that's the problem that started this thread.
    No, the iOS device is talking Apple.
    I'm glad to hear that your Android is behaving correctly. If you don't
    know how to tell the Android device to make it's data files accessible
    to your computer, and then tell your computer how to do it, the only
    safe thing for the Android and your computer to do is nothing.

    In Android 4.2.2 go to Settings - Storage and touch the three-dots
    'menu' icon and then choose 'USB computer connection' and select
    'Connect as Media Device (MTP)' or 'Camera (PTP)' whichever is
    appropriate for the computer software you want to use it with - or leave
    both options unselected if all you want is to charge the Android.

    Older Android versions allow you to give computers access to the microSD
    card as a simple 'USB mass storage device' which your computer can
    'mount' and 'unmount' just like a USB memory stick or disc drive. Many
    digital cameras and music players do the same.
    The problem being discussed here is that the iOS 'pairing trust
    certificate mechanism' doesn't always 'work'.
     
    Whiskers, May 13, 2014
    #51
  12. Pat Wilson

    -hh Guest

    What conflates the numbers is how Android is getting
    lumped in by some site trackers. For example, the
    version of AWStats I'm running is a bit older and
    it doesn't delineate by default Andriod or iOS.
    Drilling down slightly allows me to ID Linux-vs-Android,
    but iOS is still a mystery. Case in point, here's
    numbers from my one domain for this week:


    Windows 1,335 56.3 %
    Windows XP 117 4.9 %
    Windows Vista 210 8.8 %
    Windows (unknown) 2 0 %
    Windows ME 1 0 %
    WinV(LongHorn) 53 2.2 %
    Windows 7 915 38.6 %
    Windows 2003 37 1.5 %

    Linux 189 7.9 %
    Red Hat 1 0 %
    Google Android 137 5.7 %
    GNU (Unknown) 51 2.1 %

    Macintosh 693 29.2 %
    Mac OS X 693 29.2 %

    Others 153 6.4 %
    Unknown 123 5.1 %
    Unknown Unix 25 1 %
    BlackBerry 4 0.1 %
    Java 1 0 %


    To summarize from the above:

    Windows: 56%
    Mac OSX: 29%
    Android: 6%
    iOS: 5%?
    Linux: 2%(Note 1)
    Others: 2%


    And checking another of my domains:


    Windows 4124 66.3 %
    Windows XP 214 3.4 %
    Windows Vista 368 5.9 %
    Windows (unknown) 1 0 %
    WinV(LongHorn) 3 0 %
    Windows 98 1 0 %
    Windows 2008 3535 56.8 %
    Windows 2003 1 0 %
    Windows 2000 1 0 %

    Linux 357 5.7 %
    Ubuntu 1 0 %
    GNU (Unknown) 356 5.7 %

    Macintosh 1619 26 %
    Mac OS X 1619 26 %

    Others 114 1.8 %
    Unknown 67 1 %
    Unknown Unix 47 0.7 %

    To summarize from the above:

    Windows: 66%
    Mac OSX: 26%
    Android: ?
    iOS: ?
    Linux: 2% (Note 1)
    Others: 2%


    Note 1: this value also includes Google & similar
    automated web crawlers, which are not live humans.

    Particularly in a photography-centric discussion group.


    IT Systems don't exist for us to simply run an OS: they
    exist so that we can run and apply productivity applications.


    -hh
     
    -hh, May 13, 2014
    #52
  13. Pat Wilson

    TJ Guest

    "Unsuspecting, normal people" are usually one breed of sheep or another,
    often several breeds at once. They feel safety in being part of a large
    herd.

    Thank (Deity of your choice) that I'm not "normal." Linux does
    everything I want to do, and it does it well. I don't need to waste $$$$
    on Microsoft or Apple products. Sure, it's OK to make money on software
    and content, if you can. It's also OK for me to *not* spend $$$ if I can
    do the job I want to do without it.

    YMMV. That's OK, too.

    TJ
     
    TJ, May 13, 2014
    #53
  14. Pat Wilson

    J. Clarke Guest

    Just an aside but I came back from a break yesterday to find a coworker
    charging her phone from my laptop. If she knew me she wouldn't have
    done that. I don't have it set up to suck every detail of her life out
    of an attached phone but mostly because it never occurred to me that
    someone other than me would attach a phone to it.
     
    J. Clarke, May 13, 2014
    #54
  15. Pat Wilson

    Guest Guest

    true.

    the actual market share of linux on the desktop, which is what matters
    to software developers, is *very* low, in the 1-2% range, but even if
    it was 5% or even 10% as some linux fans claim, it's still not worth
    bothering with, especially when they expect everything for free which
    is not an incentive either.

    ....snip...
    exactly.

    what matters are the apps, not the os, and with linux, the choices are
    very limited.

    if there were compelling apps on linux, people would use linux. there
    aren't and they don't.
     
    Guest, May 13, 2014
    #55
  16. Pat Wilson

    Guest Guest

    "Unsuspecting, normal people" are usually one breed of sheep or another,
    often several breeds at once. They feel safety in being part of a large
    herd.[/QUOTE]

    nonsense. people make their own choices based on their needs. nobody is
    following any herd.
    if you can do it for free, that's wonderful, but your needs must be
    incredibly simple.

    the cost of quality software is not a waste. it pays for itself very
    quickly in productivity gains.

    as they say, you get what you pay for.
     
    Guest, May 13, 2014
    #56
  17. Pat Wilson

    Guest Guest

    Potentially, yes; but only iOS devices are designed by default and
    without involving the user, to allow a connected computer to do almost
    anything it wants to with them.
    incorrect.
    It's an orgy inside that wall.
    incorrect.
    A USB socket is not basically a power supply. It's a data transfer
    device that happens to have the ability to deliver power as well. If
    you don't know what the socket has behind it, you should not plug
    anything into it. Find a 'mains' socket (or in a car, the 'cigar
    lighter' 12v socket) and use your own power adaptor/charger.[/QUOTE]

    that is true but why should someone fear a public charging station?

    it's a convenience so that they don't need to carry a charger, and in
    some cases, a cable as well.

    the fact that they can be juice jacked is a problem that needs to be
    solved. the reality is that there are public charging kiosks/ports and
    people *will* use them, which means the devices *must* do something to
    block juice jacking. apple addressed it, while other mobile devices are
    still vulnerable.

    on the other hand, many of those ports are not fully usb compliant and
    don't always charge a device anyway.
    incorrect.

    it absolutely can copy photos without custom drivers. i tested it prior
    to posting.

    you said earlier you don't have an ios device so how would you even
    know what it does or doesn't do?
    burdening the user to manage all of those details is a shitty user
    experience, which is why android almost always defaults to giving full
    access to the device too.

    this is why apple went one step further, so that the ios device shows
    up as a normal digital camera and can be seen by photo management
    software so that photos can be easily copied and in many cases,
    automatically (depending on the configuration of said software), as
    well as not requiring the user to manually unmount a mass storage
    device each time they plug and unplug the device.
    it works fine on mac and windows.

    as i originally said, the problem is with linux.
     
    Guest, May 13, 2014
    #57
  18. Because it need not be just a charging station. It could be attached to
    a computer which downloads stuff from you phone when you plug it in. Do
    you know where the wire from that charging station goes?
    So you understand the problem and still ask "why should someone fear a
    public charging station"?
    Their current levels could be too low ( and that is not a "usb
    complient" thing).
    Thus when the phone tries to draw 1-2 amps the voltage drops well below
    the charging level.
     
    William Unruh, May 13, 2014
    #58
  19. Pat Wilson

    J. Clarke Guest

    I'm willing to waive the courteous exchange. She's seriously pretty and
    I'm an old goat. But the security issues are another matter.
    I seldom take breaks and she hasn't been there long. I guess I should
    talk to her about it.
    No. She doesn't have a computer.
    Actually hers is an android phone, but the same principles apply.
     
    J. Clarke, May 13, 2014
    #59
  20. Pat Wilson

    Guest Guest

    so what? why should someone need to worry about that?

    there is *currently* a problem with juice jacking, which is something
    that needs to be fixed.

    people are going to avail themselves of a public charging station
    whether you approve of it or not.
    see above.

    telling people to avoid public charging stations to not be juice jacked
    is like trying to solve teen pregnancy by telling teenagers not to have
    sex.

    the exploit needs to be fixed.
    it absolutely is a usb compliant thing and if the voltage drops below
    5v for any reason, it's also non-compliant.

    the way usb charging works is that the charger and device must
    negotiate how much power is needed and how much is available.

    a lot of chargers do not do that properly (or at all) and therefore the
    device will not charge. some devices don't care (and are themselves
    non-compliant) and will work with a non-compliant charger.

    this isn't just charging stations either. a lot of cheap noname usb
    chargers have this same problem.

    there's a lot of crap out there.
     
    Guest, May 13, 2014
    #60
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