How old is the youngest MCSD?

Discussion in 'MCSD' started by Joakim, Nov 18, 2003.

  1. Joakim

    Joakim Guest

    Hi, I have a quite different question; Do you know how old
    the youngest MCSD-certified is? And the youngest MCSD
    Early Achiever?

    (Hoping to be among the youngest)

    Joakim, Nov 18, 2003
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  2. Joakim

    Mat Guest

    Mat, Nov 19, 2003
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  3. Joakim

    Guest Guest

    Quite Frankly, the youngest MCAD, MCDBA, or MCSD.Net means
    just the opposite of maturity and knowledge. I want a full
    grown man or woman that works bedies me, not some kid that
    just memorized some braindump and passed the test. I need
    someone with real world knowledge backing me up, not
    someone that still depends on mom and dad for food and
    shelter and transportation. I believe there should be an
    age limit vefore you can even take a cert test. Lets say
    21 so if you are not 21, go back to mommy please.
    Guest, Nov 19, 2003
  4. Joakim

    Charlie Guest

    Come on!

    Cut him some slack!

    You don't have to insult the fellow.

    You don't know what his personal situation is so don't
    Ass-U-Me so much...

    Joakim if you really love this stuff you'll do fine.
    Experience is really good to have, but proper training,
    a quick mind and the drive to learn will go a long way.

    Don't let the disparaging statements about your youth
    put you down. Not everybody here feels the same way.
    We all learn from each other.
    Charlie, Nov 19, 2003
  5. Joakim

    Tobin Guest

    Quite Frankly, the youngest MCAD, MCDBA, or MCSD.Net

    This is rediculous. If you want to get an MCSD at the age
    of 13, you should be allowed. If someone wants to hire
    someone who is 13 with an MCSD, why shouldn't they be
    allowed? You would allow someone to have voting rights
    for three years before being allowed to get certified?

    I was 10 years old when I started writing software. If I
    wanted to get certified, I shouldn't have to ask your
    permission to do so. And employers shoudln't have to ask
    your permission to hire me either. I'm 26 now and if I
    found some kid who was ambitous enough to get certified at
    13 and understood how to write basic software, I'd give
    him an entry level position and teach him what he needed
    to know. If you don't like the early competition, perhaps
    you are in the wrong business yourself.
    Tobin, Nov 19, 2003
  6. Joakim

    Guest Guest

    Tobin I work with multi-million dollar a day transactions.
    First, no company would hire for that reason alone. Please
    don't tell me you would hire a 13 year old banker for your
    business needs, a 13 year old for your realestate sale of
    your home, and a 13 year old to represent you in a murder
    trial. You were so quick to be defensive that you
    completely left out laws not even allowing 13 year olds to
    be left alone over-night by themselves. That 13 year olds
    take care of other children in their infant age. Doogie
    Hooser MD was a TV show. Get over your donkey kong
    programming days. People in most programming and DBA jobs
    today not only handle money, but their resposibilities
    affect families and their livelihood. I for one am not
    going to trust a 13 year old and for that matter someone
    just turning 18 to handle life decisions that affect
    families and companies. It is just FREAKIN COMMON SENSE!
    With that said, it is a useless for one to get the cert at
    that time.

    BTW - 21 was just an expression but it made its impression
    didn't it.

    Again, before you go spouting off your mouth about if a
    company wants to hire a 13 year old, step up to the plate
    and let me know if your girlfriend or wife wants a
    gynecologist that just graduated med school at 15.

    Oh I am sure your two guys would.. Right!!!!
    Guest, Nov 19, 2003
  7. .....

    I kinda with you on that, the problem is that I got a MCSD with the age of
    17. I'm quite sure that certifications don't means knowledge. I know lots of
    certified people that don't know absolutely nothing, who don't know how to
    get the simplest answer to the most stupid question. But please don't
    generalize the things :)

    Sometimes I get "insulted" because of my age and the certs, guys like you
    saing that I just read some braindumps and passed the tests. I didn't liked
    the comment of a fella at the MSDN brazilian forum some time ago. He was
    publishing braindump stuff on the forums, I replied saying about the NDA and
    he said that was ironic a guy like me arguing about braindumps. My answer
    was not very kind, and the guy never showed up again on that forum, in fact
    I even received a phone call (don't know from who) apologizing about the
    posts. That post was a bit unconfortable for me and for the guy, so I won't
    do it again :p But I still think that is unfair your saing this; I studied
    6 months to pass on the C++ tests, even thinking after the tests that I
    did't needed to study all that time.

    About the grown man, the kid stuff and the non real world knowledge, the mom
    and dad (!!) for food; all I have to say is: Ask the people that I work for,
    the team that I manage, some of my C++ students.... My mom and dad, my car,
    my fridge :p... I'm suspicious to say things about me ;)
    Guilherme Magalhaes, Nov 19, 2003
  8. That's exactly why I choosed the tech job :)

    In the medical area you have only one change to do things right. The same
    thing happens on the bank and the law area.

    On IT it's different, if you're a programmer all you have to do is write
    good quality code. It's like math, it's logical, and it can be audicted
    later by some experienced engineer. After some time those experienced
    engineers get confident on you. But it don't takes 30 years like the medical
    area do ;)
    Managing people is even simpler. If you're a IT Manager all you have to
    know is the entire process, how things works technically and see bits like
    part of your own :) As you were a engineer before, you know very well your
    teamates capabilities and how the process work. Then you build your LEGO
    toy, get some components done here and there, some objects connecting here
    and there.... Get a cool UI and u're done. On the day after you have 300 SQL
    servers running your toy, 4000 sales people using your LEGO thing, millions
    being made; as you wish.

    Kid's stuff.
    Guilherme Magalhaes, Nov 19, 2003
  9. Joakim

    Guest Guest

    I'm not really certain that anyone is "spouting" off at
    the mouth more than yourself.

    No one, including myself, said that we would put this
    programmer "in charge". In fact, I stated that if a
    child this young showed this much initiative, I'd have no
    problem with bringing him in and showing him the ropes of
    real-life development at an entry level. Now someone
    your thick skull equated that to being a female doctor or
    being in charge of architecting software. Maybe your
    mind can't understand the difference, but I'll just bet
    most everyone else here can.

    While your statement doesn't really have anything to do
    with the argument, I'll address your silly little remark
    that a 13 year old can't live alone legally. This is
    actually wrong. Exception children of this age have
    gained "emancipated child" status -- meaning they have
    shown sufficient and overwhelming evidence that they can
    handle themselves physically, psychologically,
    financially and otherwise. However, I don't see how
    being an entry level software programmer would have to
    mean you live alone. Hell, I have friends that work at
    Microsoft for the last two years that don't live alone.
    But once again, you can't make that distinction because
    you are too scared this 13 year old is gonna take your
    fictional job writing software that handles "multi-
    million dollar a day transactions."

    Saying a kid has no business getting certified at this
    age is silly. It's healthy for a child to develop goal-
    oriented habits early in life. And once again, he has no
    reason to need your approval to do so. At last I checked -
    - he doesn't.

    So, if you don't want to hire someone, feel free to hold
    that position. However, I'm sure there are plenty of
    people in this world that would be glad to see kids
    learning to program over learning to score their next
    high on street.
    Guest, Nov 19, 2003
  10. Joakim

    Rick Guest

    Being a manager is definitely not easier. As a managr you have to also
    understand the human psyche. You most be able to address the concerns of
    users i.e. resistance to change and the managerial responsibilities for the
    IT department. All of this hinges on respect which must be earned. Many
    people would be hesitant to respect a new boss who was 10 years younger then
    them. The user community would also have an empression of who is this kid.
    Oh yes you may have some brilliant plans because your young but what is your
    real world experience. I say all of this from personal experince. I ran into
    these issues at 25 so how is it going to be for someone who is 17?

    Just my two cents worth
    Rick, Nov 19, 2003
  11. Joakim

    Consultant Guest

    Consultant, Nov 19, 2003
  12. I never said that it is a easy task. It's simpler.

    I totally with you about the behavior of a team. For me it was complicated
    at first as I don't have any natural manager talent. After reading some
    psychology books I got over it, and today I changed by Computer Science
    degree for a Psychology path. I'll learn much more doing Psychology.
    As I wrote earlier, if someone worked on the dev team before managing
    it'll be alot easyer to do the job because this someone will know how the
    process work and where the possible problems will happend. I belive that
    people that you work with won't judge you by your age, but by your actions.
    Showing that you're not a "boss" but a part of the team obviously helps too.
    Doesn't matter if you're 16 or 60, if your actions shows a mature person
    you'll be seen as one, and have credit for it. The same thing happens with
    the quality of your job. But it's kinda complicated to notice that when you
    just know the person by news posts....
    I'm saying this by personal experience, acctually I'm the technology
    manager for a big software house. What helps me it's the I look older than I
    am :) (I'm 19 now, got the manager position at 18)
    Guilherme Magalhaes, Nov 19, 2003
  13. Joakim

    Barry Hurt Guest

    I was five (5) when I got mine. Of course that's in dog years.
    Barry Hurt, Nov 19, 2003
  14. Joakim

    Consultant Guest

    i helped my 6 year old son get his

    Consultant, Nov 19, 2003
  15. The kid says he wants to be Bill Gates.

    Bill didn't get where he is by being smart. He got there by being smart
    and ruthless.
    General Protection Fault, Nov 19, 2003
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