Home network - boroadband, wired and wirless with printer!

Discussion in 'Home Networking' started by Martyn Lawrie, Jul 18, 2005.

  1. Hi everyone (first time poster)

    I really want to install a home network in my house! Unfortunately my walls
    are very thick and require me to install a wired network! Although i have
    only 3 computers(other family members laptopts included) i would like to
    hardwire at least 6 different wallmounted connections! The actual wiring of
    the network is not a problem but I am stuck on finding the cheapest and best
    kit!

    I would like an adsl switch/router with about 12 ports But i would aslo like
    wirelss ports too - just 2 or 3! My house has 2mbps boradband and is going
    to go to 4 at some point in the future so i think it can handle 3 computers
    at once (max)! What kit should i buy to wire about 12 ports and have
    wireless too??? Will probably need a firewall built in to!!!

    Thanks in advance!
     
    Martyn Lawrie, Jul 18, 2005
    #1
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  2. Martyn Lawrie

    George Guest


    What I would suggest is buying any decent ADSL wireless router. This
    will take care of as many wireless connections as you would
    realistically use, as well as some (usually 1 or 4) wired connections. I
    see no reason why you couldn't simply add a switch or a hub to one (or
    more) of the ethernet ports. In practice, I've used a Netgear DG834G
    used with a 4 port hub (via the uplink port), giving a total of 7 wired
    connections. If there are any 12 port ADSL wireless routers available, I
    bet they are much more expensive than a 4 port router with a hub or
    switch.

    George
     
    George, Jul 18, 2005
    #2
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  3. Will this not affect the speed at which all the computers can speak if
    essentially 4 ports are going through one uplink port???


    THanks for the reply!

    Martyn
     
    Martyn Lawrie, Jul 18, 2005
    #3
  4. Martyn Lawrie

    McSpreader Guest

    The uplink will operate at 100Mbps, your broadband is 2Mbps. No
    problem.

    Before you go off down the cabling + wireless route:

    Get yourself a wireless modem/router per George's suggestion
    and install it centrally in the building and as high up as
    convenient.

    Get a laptop PC with WiFi capability and set it up to use the
    broadband connection.

    Go walkies around the premises with the laptop and check for
    wireless connectivity in the rooms you require Internet access. If
    you get poor results, try a different location for the router.

    You may find your cabling requirements are less than you'd assumed.
     
    McSpreader, Jul 19, 2005
    #4
  5. Martyn Lawrie

    George Guest

    Imagine using a switch, rather than a hub. And just for talking sake,
    lets say you using 100Mb/s Full Duplex throughout. The switch allows
    communication between one of it's ports and the router at 100Mb/s. If
    you are using the top DSL speeds available in the UK just now, you have
    8Mb/s downstream. I really can't see there being a major issue with the
    switch causing a bottle-neck. Using a hub may cause minor problems, as
    they are only half duplex, but with the difference between DSL speed and
    LAN speed, you shouldn't notice it. Before doing this, I'd have a look
    at what McSpreader suggests. Another point worth noting is that there
    are some high gain WiFi antennas available - these may be of help to
    you.

    George
     
    George, Jul 19, 2005
    #5
  6. Martyn Lawrie

    poster Guest

    Good news... it will mean life is so much easier, with fast connections and
    less fiddling about :)

    faceplates and solid core cable aren't very expensive... 300m of cable would
    probably be found at 25-30 pounds (I have about 250m left :)
    Then you will probably still be looking in 2007. The majority of ADSL modem/
    router units have 1 or 4 ports, though I think there might be one or two that
    have 5 ports. Adding a switch (of 8 or 12 ports) will probably be the best.
    You're kidding... Think of all the offices where a dozen or more staff PCs
    may share a 500 kbps connection... Obviously they're not all trying to view
    streaming movies, but the (view a page, read the text, click a link)... use.

    Anyway, back to the point... Do you need wireless from wherever the ADSL
    modem is currently placed, or in some other part of the house ? Peter M.
     
    poster, Jul 19, 2005
    #6
  7. Thanks very much for all the replies!

    The house i am in at the minute is actually quite big and i have a central
    cupboard downstatirs that i hope to keeop all the network equipment in! Then
    add boosters throughout the house (probably 2 - 1 each way!)

    Am i right in thinking i can have a hub with a built in dsl modem (say an 8
    port one) and then i can add (via uplink) only one extra switch for wirelees
    say 4 ports??

    If this is the case i will buy the wirelss first to test it!

    Thanks again!
     
    Martyn Lawrie, Jul 19, 2005
    #7
  8. Sorry could i for instance lik these two together:

    http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos...rements/ref=ed_tec_dp_2_1/026-8747881-7667642

    and

    http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000087H94/ref=pd_ecc_rvi_2/026-8747881-7667642

    Thanks,

    Martyn


     
    Martyn Lawrie, Jul 19, 2005
    #8
  9. I haven't seen anything more than 4 ports on a combined ADSL modem
    router, but I used to have a one port ethernet modem/router plugged
    into an 8 way switch with two access points wired to that.

    For cabling simplicity in a big house it may be appropriate to have a
    switch or hub upstairs / remote with a single uplink cable then
    distribute off that.

    Phil
     
    Phil Thompson, Jul 19, 2005
    #9
  10. Martyn Lawrie

    George Guest

    You shouldn't need too much space for the equipment - A wireless router
    about the size of a VHS cassette and a switch about the size of a mobile
    phone. Also, how long are the cables you plan on running? I've seen
    massive runs of Cat5 cable (corporate LAN) without boosters!

    It doesn't even have to be that complicated! Buy something like a
    Netgear DG834G or Speedtouch 580 (or anything similar!) Take the
    Netgear - on it's own, it acts as a DSL modem, a router, a 4 port
    switch, a wireless access point and a firewall - everything you need
    minus a few ethernet ports! You can connect any port (not just an
    uplink) to one or more of the four ports using either straight or
    cross-wired cable! The ports have a technology called 'Auto-uplink' that
    allows for this. So to clarify - all you need is a box like this, plus a
    suitable hub or switch to expand the number of ethernet ports you have!
    The cost? Should be less than £100 all in!
     
    George, Jul 19, 2005
    #10
  11. Brilliant thank you very much!

    The only thing i am trying to do is to keep my bt broadband seperate from a
    computer so it can be accessed 24/7! And i want access points in rooms just
    incase computers have to be used from them! Each room just needs 1 wall
    socket, and the cable to this will be travelling no more than say 40 metres
    so shouldn't need boosted!

    Right lets see if i have this right, i can start by buying a 4port adsl
    router (wireless) and use it roudn the house homefully! And after that, if i
    want to add a wired network to each room i can add basic switches to this to
    give me wired connections! I could for instance add two 8 port switches amd
    wire these up fully?? And these switches can be kept to together or
    seperated remotley?? And you connect the adsl router to the switches using
    standard cat5!

    Thanks again - you wouldn't guess I have a computer degree (no joke) thanks!
     
    Martyn Lawrie, Jul 20, 2005
    #11
  12. yes, the switches will either autodetect or have an uplink port so it
    can all be standard Cat5. You can daisy chain them Router - switch -
    switch too.

    Phil
     
    Phil Thompson, Jul 20, 2005
    #12
  13. Martyn Lawrie

    George Guest

    You sure could!! One thing though, I'd look at Netgear's new router -
    DG834GT. It's identical to the one mentioned in the link, but the
    wireless connection is twice as fast. It may be worth while looking at
    other brands too. Belkin, Linksys, Speedtouch and MANY more companies
    make equipment like this at ever falling prices.


    George
     
    George, Jul 20, 2005
    #13
  14. Thanks very much! Ok can you recommend which one you think is the best
    please??

    What do you thin of the pre n belkin stuff! PC World told me they have a
    wireless adsl router arriving soon in t his range! What are the current
    standards i should be aiming for in terms of speed for my network! I mean
    will 108mbps be fast enough for 4 computers for instance or is there faster
    out there?

    THanks again to everyone!
     
    Martyn Lawrie, Jul 21, 2005
    #14
  15. Martyn Lawrie

    George Guest

    To be honest, if you are only using the wireless connection for internet
    access, then even to dated 11 Mb/s would be fine. Obviously, for
    transferring files etc, then a faster connection is desirable, and, to
    my knowledge the GT standard (108 Mb/s) is the fastest at the moment -
    This is potentially faster than the wired connections found on most DSL
    routers. As for brands, in practice, there is little difference in
    performance between them. I've found Belkin and Netgear the easist to
    set-up in the past. I tried a Speedtouch 580 too, which was fine, but my
    only grumble was that it masked out the WEP key as you typed it, and
    didn't support Passphrase (although for some reason, their wireless
    adapters do..)

    You should also look at other factors - How much does it cost for
    telephone support? (Belkin's is free, Speedtouch is £1/min), How long
    is the warranty? - I'm sure you can come up with more questions.

    George
     
    George, Jul 21, 2005
    #15
  16. George i can't thank you enough! After using my local PC World for reading
    the boxes etc i think i have come up with a plan! As most of the
    transferring etc will be done using a wired connection i looked at a few of
    the best boxees!

    I found a 'new' 8 port belkin 1gb ethernet switch, which would certainly
    appear future proof! All i have to do is find a wireless adsl modem router
    to connect it to and bob's your mothers brother! Am i right in thinking i
    will need an adsl router with 1gb connections on it to fully utilise it
    throughout the network! If so i am sure these aren't available yet with adsl
    routers only going to 100mbps at the minute! Is there plans to bring out a 4
    port wireless adsl router in the future! I do realise the 3 remaining
    wireless connections will probably only go to 125mbps which is still good
    enough!

    Cheers for all the help,

    Martyn
     
    Martyn Lawrie, Jul 21, 2005
    #16
  17.  
    Martyn Lawrie, Jul 21, 2005
    #17
  18. Martyn Lawrie

    poster Guest

    Yes, it would seem that way, but just as with 100 Mbps (only) switches, it is
    not difficult to find some item of kit which as yet has no compatible speed,
    so your 1000 Mbps unit will sit sulking unless you find other kit which is
    similar. Far better to go for something which is 10/100/1000 or 100/1000
    if you are feeling it worth buying for the next 20 years (some of my kit
    is *deliberately* connected at 10 Mbps since the ADSL speeds I will get
    for the next X months will be below 10 Mbps, for sure, and even if I had
    a Bulldog 8064 kbps connection, it would be handled within my LAN without
    needing 100 (let alone 1000) Mbps.
    Most of the wireless routers I've seen already have 4 wired ports !
    Not sure what you're on about in the above... 108 Mbps is the upper speed
    being claimed from a few bits of kit. At present I don't have any wireless
    kit here (though I see the BT Freeview box includes browsing and so on and
    would need a wireless link to allow it onto the ADSL service!) but seeing
    the comments George made, it's quite likely 11 or 54 Mbps would be OK!
     
    poster, Jul 21, 2005
    #18
  19. Thanks poster! Right i have selected my two items which give me enough wired
    and wireless connections!

    I have chosen this as the main adsl router
    http://catalog.belkin.com/IWCatProd...rking/WirelessNetworking/80211gWi...tworking/

    And this as the switch to give me extra ports!
    http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0006374VE/ref=br_lf_ce_11/026-8747881-7667642

    So am i right in thinking all i need is an rj45 cable connector to connect
    one port from the router to one port on the switch! Thus leaving me with 3
    wireless (or wired) ports on the router and 7 on the switch?? And say if for
    some bizarre reason i had 7 computers on the switch would i notice the
    difference in speed between them (ie does the routers single 100mbps speed
    hold them back?)??? I think that is my last question! Thanks,

    Martyn

    PS I think i will use Belkins access points and print servers too!
     
    Martyn Lawrie, Jul 21, 2005
    #19
  20. Martyn Lawrie

    poster Guest

    Belkin F5D5141ea8
    Yes. But out of interest, do you actually have anything with such high speed
    ethernet ports ? I think you are paying from 30 to 50 quid too much if you're
    buying the 10/100/1000 8 port switch now, when in 5 years the prices will be a
    lot lower and you might actually have kit connecting that needs that speed...

    There's a Belkin F5D5131UK8 (8 port 10/100) on Ebuyer at 17.28 +VAT which is
    likely to do just as good a job, for the next few years, IMO.

    wireless ports ?????????? Sorry, you will have some limit to the number
    of wireless devices which are active (probably a theoretical limit of ~ 128
    and a practical limit well below that for one of these lower cost units) but
    they're only ever described as *wired* ports (or ports, more likely, meaning
    the ones where a physical plug is used).
    No you should notice no speed difference between having something plugged into
    the 8-port switch or the 4-port ADSL/router unit. A firm I deal with has 2x
    24 port 10/100 switches. Most of the traffic is to/from their file server
    when people load or save documents they're working on, but they all share
    a single 500 kbps ADSL router (a separate router to connect to another ISP
    is also connected to the LAN, but used primarily for e-mail to / from their
    mail server...) You must remember the lower speed of the ADSL connection
    is always going to be the limiting factor, and for most LANs, it would all
    work just as well at 10 Mbps. I've used 10 Mbps for the last 20+ years on
    various home and office networks, and while I have 100 Mpbs available, its
    really not been significant for me to need it, except that nowadays you'll
    get a 10/100 Mbps kit for perhaps less than any 10 Mbps kit :) Peter M.

    --

    A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
    Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
    A: Top-posting.
    Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet and in e-mail?
     
    poster, Jul 22, 2005
    #20
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