Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by geopelia, Mar 7, 2014.

1. ### geopeliaGuest

Nope, because that's not how you write fractions - that's how they are
typed on a computer (when not using the proper fraction symbols
available in some fonts).

A proper fraction is a vertical stack with a horizontal line, looking
something like this:

3
-
4

..........................

Yes, that's what I was trying to do without the gaps. But now we have to use
0.75

Decimal stuff is fine until you come to a third. Or Pi. "How I need a
drink" - remember that one?
And we had a great money system until it went decimal. Look at all the
fractions of a shilling.
And the good old farthings, in Britain.
Now 10 cents is New Zealand's smallest coin.
About the same size as a farthing - and worth about as much these days.

geopelia, Mar 10, 2014

2. ### geopeliaGuest

"geoff" wrote in message

No normal person make such sweeping and wrong comments.

I ( and thousands of others) daily need to work out the GST component of
prices, for tax purposes and invoicing. I think I am reasonably 'normal'.

geoff

I find invoices I have to pay show the GST separately, and added for the
total.

I think it's mean sticking it on the cost of operations and ambulance call
outs.
I hope the hospitals and St John get given the GST as donations. That would
be fair enough.
But I doubt if the government does that!

geopelia, Mar 11, 2014

3. ### geopeliaGuest

"geopelia" wrote in message

"geoff" wrote in message

So fractions weren't written as (eg) " 3/4 " back then ?

geoff

No. Like 3_ I've tried all sorts of things but can't get _ between the
figures. You can see what I mean, I hope.
4

4
...............................
What on earth has this computer done now? That's not what I typed.

geopelia, Mar 11, 2014
4. ### geopeliaGuest

"geoff" wrote in message

No we don't. 3/4 is fine. Don't remember typewriters ever being able to
do fractions'vertically'.
So that's why you write the fraction 1/3. Fractions and decimal are not
mutually-exclusive.

Or Pi.

Pi is still Pi. Never has been a way to write it out 'longhand', at
least not "in full" ;-).
Since humans evolved from twelve fingers to ten, I see nothing
advantageous in using anything but decimal, especially our numerical
system, for currency, weight, distance, temperature. Apart from
Possibly less.

geoff

Pi is 3 and 1/7 Three and a seventh.
Or three and a bit, which is near enough unless you are manufacturing wheels
etc.

geopelia, Mar 11, 2014

Typewriters could do (at worst by manually adjusting the paper up and
down), but most people probably didn't bother or did it the way I did
by putting each number and the hyphen on separate lines.

0.3333 and then put a dot above the last 3.

I've got it written out on a piece of paper to 1,000 decimal places.

This website has Pi to 100million decimal places:
http://archive.org/stream/Pi_to_100000000_places/pi.txt
(NOTE: May take a while to load!)

3.1415 isn't very accurate though.

Except of course for Americans, who are too stupid / lazy to change to
decimal measurements. :-(

Then of course there's computer which work in powers of 2 (hence 256MB,
512MB, 1024MB) ... except that some fool decided they knew better and
now some devices use a decimal version instead. So a 1GB of hard drive
space might be 1024MB or it might be 1000MB, depending on what the
manufacturer feels like using. :-(

I meant "normal" in the sense of people in everyday life. Nobody walks
around the shops trying to work out what the price is without GST,
because (as I said), unless it's a business, they have to pay the GST
and can't get it back, so it's a waste of their time bothering.

You're reading Usenet Newsgroups ... so you being "normal" highly
unlikely. ;-)

You can get fonts that have a wider range of fractions and other
mathematical symbols. Of course any word processor or page layout
application these days can do superscript and subscript with makes
typing "weird" fractions a little easier (even if not quite correctly).
Some can even do proper vertical fractions with a bit of messy fiddling
of the character spacing.

Yep. Rockets still use "gallons" of fuel. :-\

Look out! Basil Brush has entered the newsgroup. ;-)

That's what computers are for. ;-)

The Government "donates" to politicians' freebie travel and other
perks. :-(

9. ### geopeliaGuest

That's what computers are for. ;-)

The Government "donates" to politicians' freebie travel and other
perks. :-(

Fair enough if they are travelling on official business, or going to and
from Wellington if they live elsewhere.
Otherwise only the wealthy could afford to be MPs.
For what they do, they are paid comparatively little. They would make more
Would any of us like the job?

geopelia, Mar 12, 2014
10. ### geopeliaGuest

Typewriters could do (at worst by manually adjusting the paper up and
down), but most people probably didn't bother or did it the way I did
by putting each number and the hyphen on separate lines.

0.3333 and then put a dot above the last 3.

I've got it written out on a piece of paper to 1,000 decimal places.

This website has Pi to 100million decimal places:
http://archive.org/stream/Pi_to_100000000_places/pi.txt
(NOTE: May take a while to load!)

3.1415 isn't very accurate though.
............
Accurate enough for most purposes. I doubt if anyone riding a bicycle would
notice if pi was 3.1415 or 3.1416.
On a long production run, how much steel could you save by shaving a ten
thousandth off each wheel?
Except of course for Americans, who are too stupid / lazy to change to
decimal measurements. :-(

Then of course there's computer which work in powers of 2 (hence 256MB,
512MB, 1024MB) ... except that some fool decided they knew better and
now some devices use a decimal version instead. So a 1GB of hard drive
space might be 1024MB or it might be 1000MB, depending on what the
manufacturer feels like using. :-(

geopelia, Mar 12, 2014
11. ### Bruce SinclairGuest

Except of course for Americans, who are too stupid / lazy to change to
decimal measurements. :-([/QUOTE]

The US actually changed to the Sl system "officially" in 1975 ? ...

USA using SI units ...
Why is most of the statistical information in the Factbook given in metric
units, rather than the units standard to US measure?
US Federal agencies are required by the Metric Conversion Act of 1975 (Public
Law 94-168) and by Executive Order 12770 of July 1991 to use the International
System of Units, commonly referred to as the metric system or SI. In addition,
the metric system is used by over 95 percent of the world's population.
From the CIA world factbook FAQ
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/docs/faqs.html

As you can see, I found this so ... odd, that I kept the note.
Then there's the whole ... "why would they keep on using units from their
colonial past (ie from England) when they could change?" question.

... and that redefining, at first by laziness, and more recently, on purpose,
still defies belief.

Bruce Sinclair, Mar 12, 2014

Because Americans like to be self-important and do things their own
way. The same reason they have their own spelling and meanings for
*Engligh* words. :-\

A couple of the American states still have the British Union Jack in
the corner of their flag.

Then to add to the confusion, a "500GB" hard drive formatted for
Windows or Mac use doesn't actually have 500GB of free space because
some of the space is used up by the drive's information / cataloguing /
etc. system.

Nope. I've got numerous old books, school test papers, etc. that prove
you wrong.

Yes, some lazy people did it incorrectly, and then more and more people
got lazy, which is why the incorrect version is so commonplace today.

Time consuming, especially when setting out a mathematics test paper
for example, but it is the correct way to do it, whether or not lazy
people do it that way.

It's little different to lazy Americans leaving out the "u" in "colour"
and numerous other words ... mainly because self-asorbed Americans
don't believe in "you". ;-)

True, but I simply said it adds confusion. When someone buys a "500GB"
hard drive, has it installed and then complains that it's only "480GB"
(or whatever) of space.

The amount of space used up by the drive's internal needs is dependant
on the format, block size, etc. and can be quite a sizeable chunk of
"missing" space.

They do now because everyone has become lazy and/or doesn't know about
the fraction symbols (some applications like Microsoft Word have an
option to automatically replace them with correct versions), but as
both Geo and I have told you, it's not actually the correct way nor the
way in which it *was* done in the past.

17. ### Dave DoeGuest

Approximately. That is; 22/7 is an *approximation*.

Today is Pi day.

Dave Doe, Mar 14, 2014
18. ### victorGuest

American Pi

victor, Mar 14, 2014

Not a particularly good one either since it fails at the third decimal
place: 3.142857

Only if you use silly backwards American dates.

20. ### Dave DoeGuest

Well they came up with it, so...

Same with Pi Approximation Day

Bloody Americans.

Dave Doe, Mar 15, 2014