Evil Apple's patent infringement of Nokia cost them

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by RichA, Jun 15, 2011.

  1. RichA

    tony cooper Guest

    Sure, but that does not rule them out as admissible evidence. Just as
    CCTV, phone images, and videos by bystanders can be admissible
    evidence.

    You seem to be taking the position that the only forensic photographs
    that are admissible are the ones taken under the conditions you've
    stated above, and that is not the case. And, what you describe are
    post-crime photographs of the crime scene.

    We routinely see in-store CCTV video used to identify a robber or
    attacker. Defense may argue, but the film can be admitted.
    Conversely, a tape of a television program showing the accused
    attending a sports event 100 miles away at the time of the crime can
    be admitted.
    I thought it was Eric, not Bruce, who was hired as a forensic
    photographer. How can we judge that either is incapable of providing
    usable forensic photographs of theft of IT equipment by what we know
    of them in a newsgroup?
     
    tony cooper, Jun 18, 2011
    #41
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  2. RichA

    tony cooper Guest

    I'm not a law enforcement officer, and have never played one on TV,
    but I can't accept the above as anything close to a valid position.

    You seem to be implying that the police routinely have their
    photographers photograph all crime scenes. That, I cannot imagine.

    Let's say that Savage Enterprises reports a break-in and theft of four
    computer stations. You think the PD is going to send out a crime
    scene photographer to record the scene? Or that all investigating
    officers are qualified crime scene photographers?

    The owner of Savage Enterprises, though, knows that to make a
    comprehensive insurance claim that he has to document *all* damage
    including any cut cables, damage to the workstations, other damages to
    the office, and damage to the premises incurred by the break-in. The
    police don't care about these damages and the resulting cost to Savage
    Enterprises.

    The owner might be contemplating a civil suit against the security
    service that provided the alarm system or the watchman or the building
    landlord.

    A sharp owner could employ a private photographer to document the
    damage beyond the loss of the four computer stations. The difference
    between what an experienced private photographer would come up with in
    photographs and what the owner might do himself could make a
    significant difference in the insurance or suit recovery amount would
    be.

    The insurance adjuster might take photographs, but his brief is to
    minimize the amount of the claim. The owner would be well-served to
    have his interests represented by hiring his own photographer.

    Even in better economic times, the PD has to prioritize their assets.
    There are enough crimes with violence where crime scene photography is
    called for without deploying their staff on break-ins and property
    damage.
    I really don't care about Bruce's credentials or that he hasn't
    presented any proof of credentials. This is a newsgroup, for God's
    sake, not a trial where expert witnesses have to submit their bona
    fides. If Bruce says he's done this type of work, I'm willing to
    accept his word.

    Have you presented your bona fides as a retired police officer?
    You've said you are, and I believe you, but we really don't have any
    more proof of that than we have of Bruce's bona fides as someone who
    has been hired for this type of work. Just because we don't like
    someone's postings doesn't mean they are not being truthful in their
    claims. (Mothboy is an exception to this)
    Why is Eric any different? We have only his written comments here
    that he has engineering expertise. While I'm as willing to accept
    that Eric has engineering expertise as I am willing to accept that you
    have policing experience, we have only postings here to support the
    claims. The fact that Eric is more likable in his posts than Bruce
    shouldn't factor in.
     
    tony cooper, Jun 18, 2011
    #42
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  3. RichA

    RichA Guest

    Subject changed back because those who hijack subject lines are
    internet "scoundrels." Sorry to have ruffled so many APPLE GEEK
    feathers!! :) Now run along to the Apple Store where the "Geniuses"
    can prove you AREN'T one by selling you some more of their CRAP.
     
    RichA, Jun 18, 2011
    #43
  4. RichA

    tony cooper Guest

    That, I find very difficult to accept. I guess it depends on the
    definition of "investigating officers". When Savage called in the
    burglary, the police respondents would most likely be the patrolmen
    closest to the scene who were not otherwise occupied. In any major
    city, there are going to be hundreds of officers assigned to routine
    patrol. Are you saying that the PD has trained all of these officers
    in photographic skills for evidentiary purposes? Or that even "most"
    squad cars are equipped with a camera?

    I know that most major police departments have officers specifically
    assigned to burglary offenses, but would the theft of four computers
    stations result in them being sent out? Or, would the patrol officers
    write up a report and basically end the investigation at that point?
    Unless, of course, there's been a spate of similar break-ins and some
    sort of organized computer theft activity.

    Last question: Would the owner of Savage Enterprises get copies of
    any photographs taken by the police? If not, and he wants to pursue
    his insurance claim or lawsuit, he'd engage a private photographer
    regardless of the forensic photography of the police.
    But damage control is what can spawn the mini-industry of private
    photographers taking (non-violent) crime scene photographs.
    I hope you didn't think I was challenging your word. I don't.
    However, because I'm an argumentative git, how do we know that wasn't
    purchased in a pawn shop?
     
    tony cooper, Jun 18, 2011
    #44
  5. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    Technically you are correct. However, a jury is more likely to be
    impressed with a 16 x 20 glossy, properly mounted than a postcard sized
    image. It's simply a matter of human nature.
     
    PeterN, Jun 18, 2011
    #45
  6. RichA

    tony cooper Guest

    It depends on the image, and the detail required, but a P&S photo can
    be blown up and mounted. Some sort of projector could be used, too.
     
    tony cooper, Jun 18, 2011
    #46
  7. RichA

    RichA Guest

    It takes all of about 30 minutes to download and set-up in a dual-boot
    system. I love how people pretend they just have "no time" to do
    anything. Like someone asked them to build a frigging cathedral...
     
    RichA, Jun 19, 2011
    #47
  8. RichA

    Guest Guest

    since mac os x, which was released in 2001.
     
    Guest, Jun 19, 2011
    #48
  9. So are those who verb nouns.
     
    John McWilliams, Jun 19, 2011
    #49
  10. RichA

    Guest Guest

    pick a different store. best buy has a big mac section and an dedicated
    apple salesperson. the apple stores of course are all mac, and always
    crowded.
    actually, macs have the widest variety of software, since they can run
    all mac, windows and unix software natively without the need to dual
    boot, and the apps can share data and access the same files. for
    example, you can copy/paste from windows apps to mac apps and vice
    versa.
    macs are not higher priced for the same specs.
     
    Guest, Jun 20, 2011
    #50
  11. RichA

    Whisky-dave Guest

    I don't understand that, I can built a PC but prefer Macs for the
    reasons mentioned
    so I have 4 in my front room at home although only 2 in regular use.
    if I want a car I wouldn't build one, same with a boat, house and
    most other things.
    And cameras lets not forget cameras ;-)
    I can almost understand the thrill and battle cries of building a PC,
    is it like
    climbing Everest ;-)

    Well that is a good reason at least.
    Maybe there's a reason for that.
    Apple laptops seem to retain their price better in the 2nd hand market
    because they are well spect'd machines even when years old they
    desirable.
    True but the best is the best and sometimes the specs don't tell the
    whole story.
    Which is another reason why Apple laptops hold their value, it's
    amazing just
    how much you have to pay for an old Apple even the faulty ones are
    worth more
    than some of the new laptops.
     
    Whisky-dave, Jun 20, 2011
    #51
  12. RichA

    Whisky-dave Guest

    I just find it ugly, it's difficult to make small but still visible it
    seems.
    I don't like the large icons or the layout, it's getting ugly like
    previous M$
    I wondering if they'll find a way of using advertising, banners or
    something really ugly
    that pops up during you're skype session.
     
    Whisky-dave, Jun 20, 2011
    #52
  13. RichA

    Whisky-dave Guest

    What does this investment consist of ......
    Perhaps Photoshop and I can;t think of much else ....
    that isn't available for Mac OS X or something very similar.
    So maybe now's is the time as some say W7 looks like a Mac OS .
    I do know PC users that have problems with Mac OS but I've no idea why
    except that they seem to want to have to click on multiple things to
    get
    something simple done.
    Since it became OS 10.2 I think, that's when they were certified as
    being unix
    although before that they were but weren't certified but not too sure
    on that Leopard was certifies in 2007 .
    Semi floppy sounded sexual I guess.
    Yes it is difficult you could go by sales but then again there are
    many old Macs
    that are still in use today which doesn't happen so much in the PC
    world.
    I have only recently retired my 500 MHz G4 tower which I brought at
    the end of 2000 or beg. 2001.
    I even installed Leopard on it which worked fine even though it is
    unsupported .
    The major reason was running costs 140W G4 less than 10W mac mini,
    the price we pay of electricity in the UK meant I'd get my money back
    in 2.5 years .

    That is a problem then as you might need help, most of the people I
    know run macs
    but they are more interested in graphics apps than text based.
    In some companies there's a large base of computer support they like
    the idea of
    being needed and continued employment they like computers that cause
    problems.
    Yes you tend to have to protect things that are worth more.
    it's easier and cheaper to teach on PCs, we can repair them far more
    easily
    than most macs, but that's partly because they go wrong so often.
    Out of the 24 PCs that are on here in my lab 3 or 4 are faulty.
    But it keeps people employed, with Macs, with edu discount you get a 3
    year
    on-site warranty, so no need to employ systems people to repair them.

    Most don;t even know that Word can be run under Mac OS X
    I think most people use P&S cameras too what does that tell you
    about their choice, that they have chosen the best ?
    Most internet cafes are windows.
    Even in London there are more streets paved with dog shit than gold.
    Good luck to them then, I'm sure most of them haven't got clean
    drinking
    water either and the PCs they get are the ones were fed up with
    repairing.

    If I was advising someone on what camera to buy, I wouldn't use the
    'rest of the worlds' from the people of Bongo Bongo or
    Kazimakiframistan
    to advise which camera type to get.
    There will always be more people with cheap cameras than expensive
    ones
    same goes for computers, cars, toasters,.......
     
    Whisky-dave, Jun 20, 2011
    #53
  14. RichA

    Whisky-dave Guest

    I wonder how many PCs still run W2000 more than run Mac OS X. I
    wonder.
    Apple being one of the most successful, well financially according to
    the stock market.
    So. I didn't know those stores sold quality goods.

    Anyway why are there so many PC stores that advertise repairs ....

    Here in the UK PC World sells Apple computers but I doubt they sell
    that many, as those that know what they are doing wouldn't go there to
    buy one.
    I've brought my new macs from an Apple on-line store.
    Did you buy your camera from walmart ?

    I'm not sure where people in the USA by their cameras and I'm talking
    about those
    interested in photography rather than family photos.
    How many here brought their last camera from Staples or walmart
    if not then why not.

    True but few need 100 WPs one will do, I can't think of anything a
    person on
    a PC can do that I can't except have loads of viruses.
    I can run windows on my iMac, I have XP on it if I need it.

    it is but it's not relevant.
    Some pay more for a lens hood that I would do for a camera.

    You should check out which systems hold the viruses
    and which are used as bots they are all PCs.
     
    Whisky-dave, Jun 20, 2011
    #54
  15. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    A projected image requires a larger futz factor than a print. if the
    jury requests to see it again.
     
    PeterN, Jun 20, 2011
    #55
  16. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    Mirror, mirror on the wall
     
    PeterN, Jun 20, 2011
    #56
  17. RichA

    Whisky-dave Guest

    Being in the UK I've no idea ....
    But our cheap stores tend not to sell quality goods.
    I'm talking of real physical stores not on-line ones.

    could be, but I work with PCs and so do a few here where I work.
    We do have far more problems with PCs than Macs.
    We have labs with Macs in them but they seem to run themselves
    they don't need so much TLC.

    I do mostly although I did buy a printer on Saturday reserved on-line
    collected
    in person.if your interested.
    http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Product/partNumber/9313561/Trail/searchtext>PRINTER.htm



    Yes that's the key perhaps ordinary consumers I don;t consider myself
    ordinary when buying a computer any more than I do when buying a
    camera.
    My expectations are somewhat higher.

    Well me too, but Apple are the sort of company that attract certain
    types of buyers,
    mostly those that know what they want rather than the sort that want a
    camera for taking photos,
    or a computer to send email.
    It does seem that quite a number of people in the creative industries
    prefer Macs.
     
    Whisky-dave, Jun 21, 2011
    #57
  18. RichA

    RichA Guest

    Because they aren't very bright in most cases. Most are a group of
    posers who can't WAIT to hit Starbucks with the iPad so everyone can
    see them. They used to make commercials making fun of types like that
    when cellphones first appeared.
     
    RichA, Jun 21, 2011
    #58
  19. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    You are a sad and sick specimen. I suspect that most of them earn a lot
    more money in a year than you will earn in ten years. You said you were
    in marketing, a field that requires a combination of creativity and
    intelligence. I leave the rest of my statement to the reader to fill in
    the blanks.
     
    PeterN, Jun 21, 2011
    #59
  20. RichA

    Whisky-dave Guest

    Depends what you mean by bright doesn't it.
    By bright if you mean they can't build their own computers or compile
    their own software then you are right.
    Their job is to get something done quickly and efficiently.
    I guess you didn't see the MS financial report that was done on the
    Mac version
    of office.

    Admin, managers, those that are getting rid of 'tech' support.
    yep, but the majority of criminals are PC users,
    the majority of virus writers are PC users.
    The majority of gamers are PC users although mobile gaming
    is in the increase.
     
    Whisky-dave, Jun 22, 2011
    #60
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