braindumps aren't all that bad are they?

Discussion in 'Microsoft Certification' started by peter, Mar 18, 2006.

  1. peter

    peter Guest

    I've been seeing lots of posts about braindumps on here. I work with a guy
    that uses braindumps to get his IT certs. He tells me there is an obvious
    advantage to them. In an industry that is already swamped with paper-certs,
    it makes no sense spending time studying the real books. The only way an
    employer can differentiate between someone who knows his stuff, to someone
    that doesnt, is by how well they perform their job tasks and their success
    at project delivery. This guy is very successful at his job. He is no fool.
    The guy is a solutions architect and has degrees in engineering and
    mathematics, and has many cisco and microsoft certs. He just doesnt want to
    waste time. He tells me he has more meaningful things to do with his spare
    time i.e. investing.
     
    peter, Mar 18, 2006
    #1
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  2. **peter's** the one who fcukin said it
    [email protected] ARE bad......they contain questions that were procured illegally
    from actual exams. One would need to "waste" time memorizing the questions
    on the [email protected] anyways...so why not take a few legitimate practice exams
    and go take the test?

    If the guy was really that smart, then he would have no problem taking a
    couple of practice exams (NOT [email protected]). If you already know what you're
    doing, then there is no need to even study. The study guides are there for
    the people that want to get started in the field.

    Besides, what does he need to get certs for if he has those degrees? And why
    does he need to "prove" himself to potential employers if he has degrees?
    Degrees speak for themselves. Personally, I think this guy is BSing you and
    everyone around you. From the sounds of it, I wouldn't doubt if he paid for
    the paper degrees too.

    The Microsoft NDA:
    http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcpexams/policies/nda.asp

    Non-Disclosure Agreement and General Terms of Use
    For Exams Developed for the Microsoft Certified Professional Program

    This exam is Microsoft confidential and is protected by trade secret law. It
    is made available to you, the examinee, solely for the purpose of becoming
    certified in the technical area referenced in the title of this exam. You
    are expressly prohibited from disclosing, publishing, reproducing, or
    transmitting this exam, in whole or in part, in any form or by any means,
    verbal or written, electronic or mechanical, for any purpose, without the
    prior express written permission of Microsoft Corporation.

    What those a$$fsuking [email protected] are doing is illegal. And what he is
    doing is condoning illegal behavior. If he is found to have cheated on any
    one exam, he will be *permanently* barred from all other MS Exams. An I
    hope he does get caught.

    Do *yourself* a favor and study.
     
    Bigus Di©kus, Mar 18, 2006
    #2
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  3. peter

    peter Guest

    Yeah he uses the study guides as well. Everyone doesnt know everything. He
    just tried to economise his time and thus utilises the dumps as a final
    preparation to the exams. He's also doing a masters degree so he hasnt got
    lots of time at hand.
    sounds boring...
     
    peter, Mar 18, 2006
    #3
  4. peter

    J. Clarke Guest

    Legal contracts are boring as Hell until you find yourself on the wrong end
    of a lawsuit for having violated one, then they get very exciting very
    quickly.
     
    J. Clarke, Mar 18, 2006
    #4
  5. I've been seeing lots of posts about braindumps on here. I work with a guy
    This is rationalizing. The question is not about consequenses, the question
    is "are you a liar?" your friend is a liar. Don't make it complicated by
    saying the others do this and that, I suspect you are not a child...

    Test question:

    Q: Choose the most appropriate way of living your life, all rationalizations
    and other bullshit aside

    a) Say whatever you think can give you short-term gain
    b) Say whatever can give you long-term gain
    c) Be a stand-up guy

    Thor
     
    Gorm Braarvig, Mar 18, 2006
    #5
  6. I've been seeing lots of posts about braindumps on here. I work with a
    Obvious. NOW.
     
    Gorm Braarvig, Mar 18, 2006
    #6
  7. peter

    peter Guest

    I've been seeing lots of posts about braindumps on here. I work with a
    Thory, you are overgeneralizing the situation and applying it to life. The
    application is towards IT and the bullshit certifications :) Why waste your
    effort in preparing for these certifications if 1) you believe them to be
    meaningless, 2) it is a requirement by your employer, and 3) you have better
    things to do with your life.
     
    peter, Mar 18, 2006
    #7
  8. Thory, you are overgeneralizing the situation and applying it to life. The
    I think people are the sum of their decisions.
    Still, I can appreciate the problem: The certs are too hard to measure the
    skills needed to do the jobs for which the titles are needed. If a person
    tells me he has all MS certifications, it tells me nothing.
    If a person tells me he is MCSE and proves it with actual knowledge from
    real world (no courses, no books, no mentoring, just experience). I will be
    amazed, I think it is very rare.

    Myself, I have no certs at all. I have tried the new TS- and PRO- exams with
    _just experience_ and almost passed a PRO- exam (678?), TS-exams were much
    worse (500, 583 I think). I have a lot of experience with this stuff
    (Yukon/Whidbey), but I haven't touched every single consept of what the
    exams covers. Still, you can take two weeks of training and pass a TS- exam.
    There is something seriously wrong with this, I think; the solution however
    is hard to find.

    I would rather fail exams than use the braindumps. Braindumps will pollute
    your character, I think.
     
    Gorm Braarvig, Mar 18, 2006
    #8
  9. Test question:
    So your answer to my question (and your life) would be a) or b)?
    I think braindumps implies a). Not that this is wrong for everybody.
     
    Gorm Braarvig, Mar 18, 2006
    #9
  10. peter

    peter Guest

    I'd like to say 'C', but it's really 'all the above', well... more like 5%A
    + 5%B + 90%C ... or there abouts. Its a function of situation.
     
    peter, Mar 18, 2006
    #10
  11. Test question:
    I figured, since you are honest enough to post here, stay away from the
    braindumps, it's like shoplifting or adultery: respectable persons might do
    it, but that does not make it respectable to do it.
     
    Gorm Braarvig, Mar 18, 2006
    #11
  12. peter

    TechGeekPro Guest

    They wouldn't be "bullshit" certifications if everyone who held one
    actually took the time to *earn* it instead of just cheating their way
    through. You sir, and your "friend", are a stain on the whole industry.
     
    TechGeekPro, Mar 18, 2006
    #12
  13. peter

    TechGeekPro Guest

    Actually, it's a function of honesty and integrity. You obviously lack both.
     
    TechGeekPro, Mar 18, 2006
    #13
  14. **J. Clarke's** the one who fcukin said it
    Precisely...and from the sounds of it, that is exacly where this guy's
    "friend" will be. Let's hope anyways.
     
    Bigus Di©kus, Mar 19, 2006
    #14
  15. **TechGeekPro's** the one who fcukin said it
    Looks like somebody added some naughty words to the previous 7 posts.


    Tsk, Tsk, Tsk
     
    Bigus Di©kus, Mar 19, 2006
    #15
  16. I'd like to say 'C', but it's really 'all the above', well... more
    Not really, too personal, maybe
     
    Gorm Braarvig, Mar 20, 2006
    #16
  17. peter

    Guest Guest

    Yes, and some of us really study hard for exams and certifications. Some of
    us do not want to be just paper tigers. A certification is a way to force
    yourself to gain more knowledge in a field but on the same time no one forces
    you to do it.
    Is learening a waste of time?
    Then I guess watching TV and eating popcorn the whole day is a better choice
    for your friend. That probably is not a waste of time.
    Then why bother taking these exame?
    Ok. So he can make a lot of money investing. What does he need a certificate
    for? Does he collect "papers" with his names and lots of acronyms?

    Danut
    MCSD.NET
    MCDBA
     
    Guest, Mar 31, 2006
    #17
  18. peter

    Guest Guest

    Hey Bigus,

    I would like to start by stating I do not condone the use of exam crams or
    even course boot camps as discussed in many formus these people do give the
    MCSE qualification a bad name.
    I have held certification since 1997 and continually gain re-certification
    the good old hard way with experience and study.
    Last thing I want to see is a nit wit with a paper certification whom can't
    even deploy a 40 user AD Network.

    Now the part of your response I do take offence to however is " Besides,
    what does he need to get certs for if he has those degrees? And why
    does he need to "prove" himself to potential employers if he has degrees?
    Degrees speak for themselves."

    I have hired many IT "experts" with degrees and under 40 percent of them
    could even explain basic TCP/IP principles. A degree shows that you have
    dedicated a proportion to understand theory of many principles (Many IT
    technologies and principles are out dated prior to the graduate completing
    their study)

    MCSE if completed properly (without exam crams) should display a benchmark
    of knowledge and understanding. It shows we have not only the knowledge of
    all products and technologies reflected in the certain certifications but
    also the ability to identify the best way(s) that theses products should be
    used in specific circumstances.

    I hope I have misinterpreted your response I have now stepped off of my SOAP
    BOX
     
    Guest, Apr 1, 2006
    #18
  19. **Ross's** the one who fcukin said it
    ExamCram, is a legit company (although not all that great) that has been
    publishing books for many years. I've read a few myself. As for the
    BootCamps, I have not attended any myself, but I have read about them and
    they don't look bad. You pay $1500 -$2000 and they give you the hands-on
    training you need to run a network (and pass the battery of exams).

    The bad guy here (I think this is what you meant to refer to) is the
    [email protected] [email protected] contain questions that were taken from actual exams
    (illegally, I might add). These halfwits go to a dumpsite and memorize the
    questions, then go and take the exam. They haven't learned a thing except
    how to read.

    Ok, I kind of agree with you there, but then I kind of don't. Let me
    explain. The IT Experts you are describing sound like kids. Either they are
    fresh out of college with a BS or they may have a couple years of experience
    in the real world. But, they still find in difficult to keep up with
    everything in IT, because they are too worried about their party life, or
    getting [email protected], or whatever, to spend a little time reading and learning what
    is going on around them. Or, they are too focused on what they are learning
    in class and not watching what is building up around them. In this case,
    you are correct, I totally see your point. I've run into people like that
    too. And yes, the CERTs do say "I'm focusing on ...." (add what you want).

    BUT....Degrees say that a person is dedicated. How long does it take to get
    a cert? 2 weeks, 4 weeks, a year? Doesn't matter. 3 Years absolute minimum
    to get a BS. 5-6 Years for the MS, and 8+ Years for the PhD. THAT, is
    dedication, and THAT is what companies look at when they hire individuals to
    run their company in the future. Because they know those individuals have
    the potential to do it.

    With that said, I still stand by what I stated in the previous post. This
    guy that peter was describing just sounded like he was taking the exams
    because he found a way to cheat the system and get the certs with very
    little dedication. If he was truly smart enough, he wouldn't need to cheat
    with the [email protected] I know MANY MANY individuals that can just walk in and
    take and exam (and pass them) with little to no exam prep whatsoever.
    I agree, but the way this other guy is going about it screws the people that
    are working diligently to get their certs the proper way.
    Nah...s'all good. I like conversations like this. Hopefully others will
    read them and think about staying away from the dumpsites.
     
    Bigus Di©kus, Apr 8, 2006
    #19
  20. peter

    Guest Guest

    Thanks for the respose.

    I agree with all aspect of your response and understand your view of the
    degree.
    Dedication is important to show an employer and as long as the graduate
    hasn't spent thier life golfing or at parties they may actually have
    something of substance to offer an employer. The last two I have hired to
    work for me haven't and personally I would have been better of with an MCP
    employee.

    Yes it does only take a short amount of time to complete an MCSE however we
    still have to remain current to satisfy many large company contractual
    arangements.

    For all of you out there whom still plan to screw with the system then
    become an ACTOR - if you can memorise enough to pass an exam without proper
    study then I am sure you can remember enough lines to complete a shoot.

    For all of you who still plan to cheat just think of any popstar out thier
    who lip sinked and were found out. Where are they now? Not in thier chosen
    industry they have been discraced. You Brain Dumpers make me sick and will do
    to the Microsoft certifications as were done to the novell certification
    (Make it worthless if you haven't been around long enoug).

    A little bit of study will get you through and if braindumpers aren't
    stopped I believe we should all be certified as Cisco Engineers are (In a
    practical environmet with a examiner. Lets see how you Braindumpers would get
    around that).

    Sorry to get back back on the Soap box Bigus but I see you are like me and
    wish to protect our certs (Would you be one for both a theoretical & hands on
    practical examination with examiner). If it is good enough for Cisco why not
    Microsoft.

    By the way does yousr Dispaly name come from Monty Python.

    Good to see some one else is discraced by these cheats




    of there degree but I can honestly tell you tha
     
    Guest, Apr 8, 2006
    #20
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