Blu-ray optical drives now in laptops sold in NZ

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by JBS, Jul 6, 2006.

  1. JBS

    JBS Guest

    It's interesting to see that blu-ray optical drives are now available in
    laptops sold in New Zealand. For example, the specifications of the DVD
    drive included with one laptop that is on sale read as follows:

    Blu-ray Disc Drive (supports BD-R / RE / ROM; DVD+-R DL / RW / RAM)
    Max.Read(BD-RE, BD-R:1x / BD-ROM:1.6x / DVD-ROM, DVD+-R:8x / DVD+-RW, DVD+-R
    DL:6x / DVD-RAM:5x / CD-R, CD-RW, CD-ROM:24x) Max.Write(BD-RE, BD-R:1x /
    DVD-RAM:5x / DVD+-RW:4x / DVD+R DL:2.4x / DVD-R DL:2x / DVDR, CD-RW,

    It's good to see that this drive is backward compatible and supports all the
    main types of DVD discs that have been on sale to date! However, the RRP in
    NZ dollars of this top end laptop is a hefty $6,000.

    There is quite a lot of information about blu-ray equipment and media here:

    The media that can be used is shown here:

    The media includes 25GB discs and 50GB for the dual layer ones.

    Some further information about media is available here:

    It says on the above sites that: "The Blu-ray Disc media offers a 2x high
    speed equivalent to a data transfer rate of 72 Mbps (9MB/second). For the
    single layer 25GB Blu-ray Disc media, it can store approximately 2 hours and
    15 minutes of video at a bit rate of 24Mbps or 10 hours and 30 minutes at
    5Mbps. These discs will be avalable available in BD-R (write-once) and BD-RE
    (rewritable) formats.

    The 25GB discs have an RRP of US$20 for BD-R (write once) and US$25 for
    BD-RW (rewritable). The 50GB dual layer discs, will cost, US$48 for BD-R and
    US$60 for BD-RE."

    It's all pretty expensive at the moment, but at least we're on the way, and
    I guess prices will gradually ease as demand picks up.

    JBS, Jul 6, 2006
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  2. JBS

    GraB Guest

    It will be a while before that happens.
    GraB, Jul 7, 2006
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  3. JBS

    zipdisk Guest

    And why would you need them..?

    I just can't see any use for them at all.
    zipdisk, Jul 7, 2006
  4. JBS

    JBS Guest

    Whenever major new developments first hit the market, they tend to be
    expensive and it's understandable that people don't always see a need to
    rush in and buy the latest. For example, people used to say that they
    couldn't see any use in DVDs because they could do everything they wanted to
    with CDs. Not only that, when DVDs first arrived in the stores, a single DVD
    was on sale for $45, but you can now get DVDs for less than $1.

    Blu-ray DVD players are capable of playing high definition video. For
    example, Hollywood films and television shows will be distributed on Blu-ray
    discs providing HD quality video. Because our current DVDs compress video
    considerably, we are not getting the full benefit of the quality of video
    that was recorded originally. High definition home movie cameras are now
    available and becoming more affordable, so enthusiasts will benefit from
    having a DVD player that can play HD video.

    If you are into making your own movies, you will know that just one hour of
    DV tape takes up about 12GB of space, so it is worthwhile to be able to buy
    DVDs that can record up to 50GB of data if you want to keep all your edited
    movies without compressing them and thus reducing their quality. As the
    price of blu-ray DVDs comes down, they will be a good storage option in
    comparison with the cost of filling up hard drives.

    It's likely that blu-ray DVDs will ultimately replace our current DVDs, so
    it's just the start of things now, but if you want to play high definition
    video, then you will need a blu-ray player. Incidentally, it's interesting
    that the laptop computer referred to in this thread (that has a blu-ray DVD
    player), also has HDMI output. It's a really good idea to make sure that the
    next TV you buy has HDMI inputs so that it will be compatible with the HD
    video that you can get from your new blu-ray player!
    JBS, Jul 7, 2006
  5. JBS

    Invisible Guest

    You said that about DVD writers.
    Invisible, Jul 7, 2006
  6. JBS

    zipdisk Guest

    And no monitors or Video cards support them here..

    Never as it has a Very high error rate, just no good for data..

    We are referring to PC's not TV's..

    It will never take off here NZ is a very pore country.
    zipdisk, Jul 8, 2006
  7. JBS

    GraB Guest

    It is patently obvious you have an interest in the success of this new
    format. Who do you represent?

    Current DVD quality has all the quality needed by most people.

    Up to this time, most people who have outlayed on large panel monitors
    will not be able to play the new format DVD movies as their panels
    won't have HDCP.
    GraB, Jul 8, 2006
  8. JBS

    JBS Guest

    Not true, blu-ray adopts a new error correction system which is more robust
    and efficient than the one used for DVDs. (see the write up here)
    A PC that has an HDMI output can be connected to TVs etc which have HDMI
    Not as poor as your spelling, but prices will come down and it will take
    over from today's DVDs, just as VHS tapes are becoming a thing of the past.
    JBS, Jul 8, 2006
  9. JBS

    JBS Guest

    I don't represent anybody, I am not in the industry, and whether it is a
    financial success or not is of no interest whatever to me!
    That's what they said about VHS tapes when DVDs were first introduced.
    I guess there always has to be a changeover period, but HDMI and HDCP have
    been in the wind for quite a long time, so keeping up to date with
    technological advances can help you to future proof yourself when you invest
    in TVs etc. There are still a lot of TVs on the market which don't have HDMI
    / HDCP, so I guess these will be gradually phased out, but people who
    haven't kept up to date, or people who don't want TVs that are guaranteed to
    receive future SKY hi def broadcasts, will no doubt buy the older models.
    JBS, Jul 8, 2006
  10. JBS

    shannon Guest

    And Windows XP
    shannon, Jul 8, 2006
  11. JBS

    -=rjh=- Guest

    Fine in theory - but hey, what speed will I be able to rip them at ;-)

    see also:

    "1.10 Will Blu-ray discs require a cartridge?

    No, the development of new low cost hard-coating technologies has made
    the cartridge obsolete. Blu-ray will instead rely on hard-coating for
    protection, which when applied will make the discs even more resistant
    to scratches and fingerprints than today's DVDs, while still preserving
    the same look and feel. Blu-ray also adopts a new error correction
    system which is more robust and efficient than the one used for DVDs."

    Again, fine in theory, but it seems Blur-ay will need all the error
    correction it can get. (Ignoring the view that if said hard-coating was
    available, why isn't it already being used on CDs and DVDs? And I'm
    willing to bet that the industry is more interested in copy protection
    than surface protection).
    covered Blu-ray in a recent episode and had some pretty interesting
    things to say about it. Pretty much concluded that there is little
    incentive to use it at this stage, and problems with loading times and
    errors introduced by poor handling - even a hint of a fingerprint will
    cause problems - are also a disincentive.

    The real lack of content of high enough quality for playback at present
    makes it look best used for data storage at present, and realistically
    that won't be used by many people. And anyway for backup it is really
    too little, too late - backing up 300GB drives still requires multiple

    Why? What's wrong with HD-DVD?

    Incidentally, it's interesting
    Maybe, but look at audio formats that tried to improve on CD. SACD was
    another brilliant Sony* product - visited
    lately? The market had basically decided it wasn't worth upgrading as
    what they had already was "good enough".

    I'd say that DVD is far better than good enough, given what the vast
    majority of the market is actually watching them on. It is a huge step
    up from VHS to DVD - something that far exceeds PAL capability - and I'm
    willing to bet that for most, that is "good enough".

    When I see how most people have their TV setup just for normal viewing
    (usually with saturation as high as possible) I don't think most people
    are going to care about Blu-ray, or even be able to see the difference.
    What they will see is that their neighbours have got one, and the price
    tag. Maybe it will take off when these players are $100 in Woolworths
    and discs are $10.00 at The Warehouse - in which case the industry will
    already be looking around for the next shiny new thing to shaft the
    consumer with. I just don't see this format being driven by consumer demand.

    There is a huge leap from vinyl or tape to CD, from VHS to DVD, and the
    difference is as much to do with convenience and not entirely to do with
    higher quality. The jump from DVD to Blu-ray isn't perceived as being as
    large, may people won't make it.

    I think there is a real possibility that Blu-ray might crash completely.
    Wouldn't be unusual for something from Sony, but unlike roger I wouldn't
    say "never".

    All IMHO, BTW :)

    *I wonder how many people here have even seen (let alone heard) a Sony
    1/4" audio cassette player. I seriously wonder how Sony can take such
    disastrous products to market, again and again.
    -=rjh=-, Jul 8, 2006
  12. JBS

    GraB Guest

    I don't recall a single incidence of that!
    GraB, Jul 8, 2006
  13. JBS

    zipdisk Guest

    And tell me a DVD Recorder that can record for 10 hours with VHS LP

    SKY broadcasts will be of low quality as it does not have the bandwidth..
    zipdisk, Jul 8, 2006
  14. JBS

    JBS Guest

    At this early stage, I think it's important that you keep the overall
    concept of HDTV in mind, and what has been achieved so far. But the posters
    here are grasping at a few negative straws from internet, and it's obvious
    they've never seen a HDTV picture. The HDTV I've seen gives a greatly
    improved picture over SD (standard definition) , but if some peoples' eyes
    aren't capable of seeing this, then I feel very sorry for them. But the
    purpose of this thread wasn't to enter into a debate about the theoretical
    qualities of HDTV, but merely to tell you that it's already in New Zealand
    for you to look at and for you to take into account when deciding upon
    future equipment purchases. A more informed level of debate amongst people
    who are very experienced with HDTV, is available on various overseas forums,
    and I suggest you read this.

    This extract from the web site is worth reading:

    Why should I upgrade from DVD to Blu-ray?

    The simple answer is HDTV. If you've ever seen high-definition (HD)
    video on an HDTV, then you know just how incredibly sharp the picture is and
    how vivid the colors are. In fact, HD offers five times the amount of detail
    compared to standard-definition (SD). The problem with today's DVDs is that
    they only support SD and don't have the necessary storage capacity to
    satisfy the needs of HD. That's where Blu-ray comes in, it offers up to 50GB
    of storage capacity and enables playback, recording and rewriting of HD in
    all of the HD resolutions including 1080p. The format also supports
    high-definition audio formats and lossless audio.

    In addition to the greater video and audio quality, the extra storage
    capacity also means there will be plenty of room for additional content and
    special features. This combined with the new BD-J interactivity layer
    adopted by Blu-ray will bring the menus, graphics and special features to a
    whole new level. For example, you will be able to bring up the menu system
    as an overlay without stopping the movie, and you could have the director of
    the movie on the screen explaining the shooting of a scene while the scene
    is playing in the background. The advanced interactivity combined with the
    networking features of Blu-ray will also allow content producers to support
    new innovative features such as downloading extras, updating content via the
    web, and watching live broadcasts of special events.

    Thanks to the greatly enhanced HD video and audio quality as well as
    the advanced interactivity and networking features, Blu-ray represents a
    huge leap forward in the DVD viewing experience and will offer consumers an
    unprecedented HD experience.

    JBS, Jul 8, 2006
  15. JBS

    jasen Guest

    Is this different to "8-track" and to the cartridge hardware that was used
    in radio stations 20+ years ago.

    Sony goes to market with risky products, some are hits some flop.
    jasen, Jul 8, 2006
  16. JBS

    Brendan Guest

    HDMI and HDCP are not technological advances - they are copy protection
    schemes whose sole purpose is to restrict what you watch and how in order
    to extort more money from you for shoddy products.


    .... Brendan

    #85514 +(4870)- [X]

    <Reverend> IRC is just multiplayer notepad.

    Note: All my comments are copyright 8/07/2006 12:39:07 p.m. and are opinion only where not otherwise stated and always "to the best of my recollection".
    Brendan, Jul 8, 2006
  17. JBS

    GraB Guest

    High definition and sharp is good, vivid is not, natural is.
    GraB, Jul 8, 2006
  18. JBS

    Robert Cooze Guest

    But I remember the difference between my first $2000 VHS machine and the
    $250 one both HiFi and NICAM the $2000 one woped the ass of the $250
    one. The Picture quality of the $2000 one was excellent for both
    recording and payback.

    Humble opinion here the quality was better than current DVD technology.
    I can not verify this any more as this VCR killed it's heads a long time
    ago as do many VCR's. I have a strong suspicion that the pressers of the
    marketplace forced the quality of the vcr down to make it cheaper for
    the masses. One day in the future there might be a perfect transport for
    content, be it disk card or transmission or something not thought of
    yet. It may be just around the corner in the 5 to 10 year mark or it may
    be in the next 50 to 100 years, or will we amused ourself to death.
    -- home of the RecyclerMan aka Robert Cooze

    / __/ / / / / /__ / / ___/ / __/ / / / |/ / /__ /
    / / / /_/ / / /_/ / _-' / __/ / / / /_/ / / /| / _-'
    ___\ ____/ ____/ /___/ /____/ /_/ ___\ ____/ /_/ /_/ |_/ /___/
    Robert Cooze, Jul 8, 2006
  19. JBS

    Sticky Guest

    Some are hits for a while : Minidisk.
    Sticky, Jul 9, 2006
  20. JBS

    -=rjh=- Guest

    Very different; I used both. The Sony product was the Elcaset.

    The Elcaset was just that - a larger (and expensive - it was high end
    gear) cassette - just like a standard 1/8" cassette, but with 1/4" tape
    in it. Better frequency response (up to ~25kHz I think, used chrome
    tape, ran at 3 3/4ips, 45min/side play time), lower S/N, lower W&F. More
    convenient than 1/4" RTR machines, more expensive than 1/8" cassette,
    and much larger; totally incompatible with anything else.

    Excellent quality.

    Went absolutely nowhere. This format is *so* dead that not even Google
    is very helpful.
    Everybody goes to market with risky products, but Sony have a history of
    being especially arrogant and dogmatic about this. It took them ages
    to get mp3 onto their portable players, and when they finally
    capitulated, it was too late. Same with MS vs SD - they are finally just
    now using formats other than their own MS in cameras. I would have
    bought a Clie rather than a Palm if not for the storage format; likewise
    with cameras.

    UMD has been a complete failure, as was their vision that everyone would
    be watching video on their PSP. If they'd used a small and CD compatible
    format they would have had at least a chance of success. As it is, it
    took less than a year for Hollywood to walk away from UMD.

    IMHO, companies who put too much emphasis on the technical
    specifications of products and ignore the social aspects are in for a
    hiding. Just because the details are of interest to them will not make
    the product successful, most people really don't give a toss.
    -=rjh=-, Jul 9, 2006
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