Blu Ray and HD DVD compomise over

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,1851280,00.asp

 

I am sure consumers will be thrilled to learn that the two separate formats
will be available for a limited time before a unified format is later
released!

 

It wouldn't bother me one bit to wait for a unified format.

 

If you read the statements correctly, they really say a unified format *may*
be released. Who is going to buy into this mess even at the start to
provide sufficient revenue for success of a high density format?

 

If one (Blu Ray/HDDVD) doesn't prove clearly superior over the other,
then a third or forth format will replace them both. OR:

Machines will be made compatible with both.. Maybe not right away, but
eventually.

 

On your last point, every article I have read says it will require a
'techonological breakthrough' to have compatible machines. I wonder if
there will be enough revenue or interest to produce such a breakthrough.

 

Another article. Why do they mostly show Blu Ray as a cartridge format

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4176240.stm

 

It took a 'techonological breakthrough' to put color video on a home
video recorder, then it took a 'techonological breakthrough' to make
those vcr machines for less than 2000 dollars, then it took a
'techonological breakthrough' to put half a movie on a 12 inch disk,
then a 'techonological breakthrough' to put a 2 hour movie on a 5" disk,
then a 'techonological breakthrough' to put dual layers et al.

They keep doin' stuff that cant be done.

 

However I think it's wrong to say that a technological breakthrough is
needed in this case. Just as Beta and VHS never shared a machine, I
think Blu-Ray and HD-TV wont be playable on the same machine due to
political and licensing issues.

Oh and there ARE DVD-VHS machines, there were also Hi-8/SVHS decks, so
a player with two lasers, if necessary, is not a technolgical hurdle.
And as for any differences in the hub and rotation speed, laserdiscs
and DVD use the same spindle in the Pioneer DVR series.

... Steve ..

 

No, Steve. This is not at ALL like simply having a player with two lasers.
Not at all. As I think we went over, you will recall how expensive dual
spindle laser disc systems were (CD and LD)...they never were mainstream.
This will require that plus different tracking mechanisms, etc.

 

Let me clarify,

The architectures require micro-adjustments with different geometries of
fine-tuning of the laser. Recall the different thickness etc. of the discs,
etc. How will this be done with one laser unit? This is unknown, and
requires a technological breakthrough.

 

You missed my point entirely. Whether it is technically feasible or
not, the bitter battle between the format camps now will assure that
they will not license production of one machine able to play both
formats. And anyway speaking as a technician who has serviced laser
and DVD players I don't see anything particularly insurmounatable in
the different focus angles required for optimal reading of the two
different densities of disc surface.

On the latter point I was practically the lone voice here saying that
a DVD writer designed to write one layer could be turned into a
dual-layer writer with a simple firmware upgrade. While only one or
two units were literally the same except for firmware, the principal
of the adaption being simpler than everyone thought, remains.

.. Steve ..

 

??? As soon as digital audio was added to LD, LD players became dual
purpose LD/CD players. As mainstream as LD ever got.

 

Yeah, I didn't understand that comment either. I was unfortunate
enough to own the first laserdisc player to play CDs, the Pioneer
CLV-900, or some such. - Neverending problems with belts and the
microswitches activated by the turnover mechanism, which used separate
motors and spindles for the two disc types. But shortly afterwards,
in succeeding models, a spring loaded larger hub on a single motor
that could run at a wide range of speed reduced the cost and
complexity of a combined machine to very little more than handling
just laserdiscs alone. All post-1988 NTSC laserdisc players handled
CDs except for a few high-end units. They were most definitely
mainstream enough, and certainloy not somehow reduced in market
penetration BECAUSE they handled CDs as well.

My point is that Blu-Ray and HD-DVD use different manufacturing
techniques, with Blu-Ray requiring an investment in new die-making
equipment, but for playback the matter of track depth and different
data densities are nothing compared with one unit being able to read
DVDs and CDs; or lasers, single-layer DVDs, double-layer DVDs, and
CDs, all with one laser assembly! And it's too bad that this format
war is taking place at all since all the major pressing plants have
expressed willingness to install new Blu-Ray equipment, if necessary.
And Blu-Ray does have technological advantages over HD-DVD. Lest we
forget, RCA's CED format was the answer to the supposed complexity of
manufactuirng optical video discs, but quality won out in this case.


Steve .

 

You mean like Dolby/DTS and DVD-Audio/SACD?

 

Kimba W Lion wrote on [Wed, 24 Aug 2005 07:48:51 -0400]:

There were some LD/DVD players too.

 

In 1983 I bought the RCA Selectavision CED system which went belly-up a
year later.

I bought into VHS which is now on its way out.

I bought into LaserDisc because it was the only way to see Dario
Argento's films clearly at that time. We all know how that format
ended...

I bought into DVD because it was irresistible...

Now they are rolling out High Definition DVDs.

I honestly wish that consumers would refuse to buy into this format
because Hollywood is in the business of re-issuing their products
countless times over and making money off of fools like us who buy
these movies in different formats and carp about their aspect ratios,
lack of extras, box art, etc. We rarely are satisfied anyway...

We should all sit back and tell Hollywood to go f--- itself because
guaranteed something else will come out to supersede 1080 High
Definition, and ebay will once again be flooded with unwanted DVDs...

F--- you, Hollywood!

 

So, by your logic, in the past 22 years home video technology should
have never advanced past "needlevision" CED?

 

I think Jstryker is being ridiculous. VHS and its improvement SVHS
have had a 26-year run so far, laserdisc lasted 18 years (from 1981)
as a format for videophiles who wanted quality, DVD, well, it's less
than 8 years and is soon to be challenged. CED is the one format on
this list that went nowhere, because it was just plain Bad.

As for double-dipping, that's nothing to do with the format.

.. Steve .

 

My frustration stems from the fact that I am in possession of old
formats that are no longer supported. Movies are my addiction, and I
have spent an obscene amount of money on them since April 1983. I
know, it's really my fault, and I acknowledge that, I do. I've bought
THE SHINING, PSYCHO, and ALIEN (just a few examples) five times in all
these different formats, and now with this Blu-Ray & HD-DVD situation I
must resist the temptation to get involved with this because they will
just give way to something else later on, perhaps the holographic DVDs
capable of 2K or 4K lines (which will probably be replaced by something
else!).

Hollywood can boo-hoo all it wants to about piracy, but they will get
no sympathy from me. When an industry keeps reissuing their titles
over and over again in the same format alone (standard 640 x 480 DVD),
with the SPECIAL EDITIONS and DIRECTOR'S CUT, etc., those of us who
purchase movies are actually spending $50 - $100 per movie if we choose
to upgrade to the next special edition(s).