Are you folks MAC or PC?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by baker1, Dec 20, 2005.

  1. baker1

    baker1 Guest

    I'm deciding to switch to MAC from PC and am very trepidatious about
    making that leap. In visiting the Apple store, I'm not convinced that
    everything is so much easier and faster. I want to get into video
    editing and it appears there are plenty of programs for PC, and
    obviously you can get fast PC's much less expensively.

    So, what are you folks using?
     
    baker1, Dec 20, 2005
    #1
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  2. baker1

    Paul Guest

    You forgot to mention SGI computers.

    In all reality you are starting a flame war. In the early days, even though
    the MAC's specs were not as impressive on paper as PC's, MAC's were better
    at processing digital media. However, PC's have overtaken the MAC's on
    speed and have a greater software compatibility (and price).

    I have used MAC's at work and don't like them. Personal choice. But, you
    have opened a HUGE can of worms and asked for an opinion.
     
    Paul, Dec 20, 2005
    #2
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  3. Your correct but:

    The question begged- is software the primary consideration or hardware.

    Imop -Apple still makes superior hardware at a premium price and can be
    counted on to support their product (I've been an Apple user since
    1982). If you can afford the cost of Apple machines they are better
    quality wise -over a longer lifespan, PC's do have more types of
    software and are subject to bugs of all types but are perhaps more cost
    effective for some people.

    That being stated Unix-Linux based OS's are quite superior to either of
    the former Operation Systems if one is inclined to learn and use them
    and from what I know can be installed on both types of hardware.

    Sorry couldn't resist adding some fuel >:-D
     
    Little Green Eyed Dragon, Dec 20, 2005
    #3
  4. I consider myself a Mac guy, but in reality use both platforms, and am
    certified as a systems engineer for both.

    Generally, either will do a good job, provided the software you want is
    available on whatever you choose. My advice is mostly to buy whatever
    you're used to.

    HOWEVER, for the specific task of video editing, the gold standard is
    Apple's Final Cut Pro. (They did a little thing call the Lord of the
    Rings trilogy with it)

    It's not a trivial expense at about a grand, but Apple has a cut-down
    version for a lot less, and iMovie (which comes with each Mac) has a
    similar interface and is often all you need.

    In fact, my very first iMovie project was burned to disk with iDVD
    (also free with each Mac) and became a money-making commercial product.
    A local student I mentored used iMovie (again, HIS first project) to
    win top honors for his senior project.
     
    Scott Schuckert, Dec 20, 2005
    #4
  5. baker1

    GTO Guest

    Since Apple will switch to Intel CPUs this "Apple vs. PC" flame war has lost
    its "appeal" (see http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2005/jun/06intel.html).

    SGI and SUN have already embraced AMD CPU's. Now, you just have to ask
    yourself what OS you want/need. The differences in CPU/bus architecture
    becomes less important.

    Especially when you will purchase your system in '06 (or later), 64-bit is
    standard and Photoshop will soon be available in a 64-bit version on all
    surviving platforms. So, do you like a UNIX-like OS or Microsoft-like OS?
    What threading model serves you best? Remember, kernel scheduling is
    different between all these operating systems (see Bil Lewis book about
    "Multithreaded Programming with pThreads").

    While I prefer HP-UX and Solaris for all server applications, I like Windows
    XP for the best GUI response. So, it all depends what you really want. BTW,
    if you decide on developing SW (not FW!), the Microsoft OS provides you by
    far with the best tools (see VisualStudio 2005).

    Regarding "everything is so much easier and faster", forget this quickly
    when comparing Apples with Oranges. Apple's currently sold computer
    architecture will soon be replaced according to their CEO's blessing of
    Intel's dual core CPUs. Since Apple's PowerPC CPU design is already
    water-cooled at rather low clock rates, Apple needs to switch to a better
    CPU design. AMD and Intel is really all there is for the personal market
    while IBM's PowerPC CPU will prevail in high-end, multi-processor system
    designs that are mainly performing floating point calculations.

    To make this thread at least somewhat relevant for this group, I want to
    mention that I prefer Nikon Capture running on PC's. The version for the MAC
    isn't impressive at all.

    Gregor
     
    GTO, Dec 20, 2005
    #5
  6. baker1

    piperut Guest

    Unix, Linux, FreeBSD, Solaris and the like - the main drawback is
    hardware support.
    You have to be really carefull when purchasing hardware. Some hardware
    (like printers, network cards, modems, and such) will not work, or will
    not work properly under these systems.

    That being said, a number of the Operating Systems come with almost
    everything you need.
    SuSe 10.0 sells for $59,99 and has a double layer install disk, a
    double layer source disk, and 5 install cds. You can also set you
    install source to the packman website for installing additional
    software.

    Scientific Linux you download for free and has 4 or 5 install CDs. It
    has an auto update feature.

    FreeBSD has two install CDs.

    Ubuntu (I am not sure I spelled that one correctly) has one install
    disk, and then does a complete install on-line.

    College Linux has one install disk and does a complete install on-line.

    Redhat is expensive to purchase, but has a similar package to
    Scientific Linux.

    Mandrake is now called something else, but has a similar package to
    Scientific Linux and Redhat. I am not sure of the cost of this one
    since the name change and the ... oh the French have a different name
    for it but it is similar to the Chapther 11 bankruptcy/reorg thing in
    the U.S. This is now called Mandriva Linux.

    There are other distributions available.
    http://www.linux.org/dist/list.html has a listing of most hte linux
    distributions. If one distributions doesn't work, you might try
    another. I am still attempting to get one working on my laptop.
    (Laptops are difficult...)

    I have SuSe 10.0 running on my main computer at home. I use it for
    most computing at home. I have a couple of limitations on it right
    now. Some of the problems I have managed to work out by tryining
    different settings, and others I have not.

    For photo editing programs, GIMP is really close to Adobe Photoshop.
    FL-Photo is similar to Picasa. However, FL-Photo will renumber the
    exported photos while Picasa does not.
    FL-Photo also creates html files in the exported directry. Both of
    these features could be a good or a bad thing depending on how you look
    at it. KDE has some other photo organizing programs.

    GIMP will import Canon RAW files, while FL-PHOTO will not. One of the
    other photo programs, and I forget which one now will also deal with
    Canon Raw files. I do not know about Raw Nikon files.

    Another piece of hardware you have to be careful purchasing is
    scanners. I have a UMAX Astra 2200 scanner that does up to 4x5 slides
    and negatives. This scanner works in both windows and linux. However,
    some of the newer UMAX scanners only work in windows. The 2200 scanner
    will work on either a usb port or a scsi port.
    Most the distributions come with, or you can download Sane, and Kooka
    for scanning.

    Zip drives work fine in linux now. Years ago they did not.
    If you get a printer that does not work, it will be a paper weight.
    Check out printers on www.linuxprinting.org prior to purchasing one or
    you will not like the printer.

    Most the distributions come with OpenOffice as an office suite. Some
    of them also come with Koffice. SuSe 10.0 also has some other office
    packages.

    I am attempting to get something called QDVD author to work to create
    slide shows that will play on a dvd player. I have managed to get
    linux to print 13x19 prints on my Epson Stylus 1160 printer now.
    Printing large format prints was one of the tasks I used to boot into
    windows for. The dvd thing is one of the last few tasks.

    The other task is to create greeting cards... I am unable to find a
    program similar to Printshop or Printmaster for linux.

    Now the SuSe system comes with a whole bunch of software packages that
    you have to pay extra for in Windows. Office software, irc clients,
    desktop publishing, email clients, there is even a program to keep
    track of your beer making recipes (however, the beer making program
    doesn't really adapt itself to mead making recipes...I may need to
    contact the author about that one...)

    Gramps is a genealogy program you can download.
    Mp3 programs, and dvd programs you have to download.

    So there are a number of programs you can find...it is a less expensive
    option.
    However, getting a linux or unix system set up can be a chore.

    roalnd
     
    piperut, Dec 20, 2005
    #6
  7. It's a religious issue. I'm trying to give a non-religious answer,
    but I've never owned a MAC, and found the first one I encountered
    (before I'd used any PC of any sort) terribly hard to use, so that
    probably establishes me as having a position anyway.

    I'm quite happy with my PC (AMD XP 2600+, 2GB dual channel RAM, 300GB
    SATA hard drive for data, Firewire and USB2 for external drives and
    card readers and such).

    I've helped a number of friends with MAC hardware and software
    problems over the years, and the evidence suggests to me that they
    have as much trouble as PC users have; but they have fewer native MAC
    users to go to help for, and those users are mostly less knowledgable
    (hence less helpful). Which is why I ended up trying to help MAC
    users. And I've occasionally found the *same* product in both the MAC
    and PC section at Micro Center, with different prices, and it's always
    higher in the MAC section in that case. I've also followed the
    ongoing sagas of problems and repairs of several of my MAC-using
    friends. I'm not saying they're *more* trouble than Windows systems;
    but it does seem to me that they're *no less* trouble, despite some
    reputation to the contrary. They're certainly more money.

    The new Unix-based OS does get around one of the long-standing
    problems with the MAC -- no easy way to port PC or Unix command-line
    utilities to it, so lots of very useful tools weren't available. They
    are now, mostly, which is a clear improvement.
     
    David Dyer-Bennet, Dec 20, 2005
    #7
  8. Gotta just love that the OP asked about Mac vs PC for video editing -
    and most of the replies 1. Touted an OS he expressed no interest in,
    and 2. Didn't mention his intended application at all. Sigh...
     
    Scott Schuckert, Dec 20, 2005
    #8
  9. baker1

    columbotrek Guest

    I have been into personal computers since 1982. I grew up and old being
    victimized by the CPU arms race. Reminds me of the current digital
    camera race so this time I am not going to bite in a big way until
    Digital is every bit as good in all respects as film and commodity
    priced. I grew tired of dumping money into new CPUs and software. I
    have been through Apple II, Macs to many, PCs to boot. Screw it. Now I
    am using 2 to 3 year old CPU's with some flavor of Linux. I am using
    DebIan at home, SUSE and RedHat, and Microsoft at work. Unless you need
    Photoshop for some work flow purpose, I would have a good look at GIMP.
    GIMP is free, DebIan is free, 3 year old CPUs are just about free. Does
    a great job on the images from my Sony S75 and Oly 2020 and scans from
    my film cameras. In the end, the advice has not changed about what
    platform to buy. Choose your software then buy whatever it runs on.
     
    columbotrek, Dec 20, 2005
    #9
  10. And what did you do positive today-develop a criticism???? ;-)
     
    Little Green Eyed Dragon, Dec 20, 2005
    #10
  11. Sounds like wisdom.
     
    Little Green Eyed Dragon, Dec 20, 2005
    #11
  12. baker1

    Ray Fischer Guest

    Wait a few months and buy an x86-based Mac. It'll almost certainly be
    able to run both Mac OS and Win XP.

    Video editing? iMovie comes with a new Mac and is easy. Final Cut
    from Apple (std and pro) get you all the power you need for additional
    money. On Windows there is Adobe Premiere Elements for cheap and the
    pro version for more.

    See what software works for you then decide on the platform.
     
    Ray Fischer, Dec 21, 2005
    #12
  13. baker1

    Kinon O'cann Guest

    Don't forget to mention peripheral hardware! The driver support for Linux
    does not match that of Windows, or even Mac. Don't buy into a system that
    will limit your choice of printers, scanners, etc.
     
    Kinon O'cann, Dec 21, 2005
    #13
  14. baker1

    Paul Rubin Guest

    Why not? Canon lenses don't fit on Nikon DSLR's and people deal with
    that. There are some crap printers and scanners that don't work with
    Linux. So what, just don't buy those printers or scanners. Buy ones
    that do work.
     
    Paul Rubin, Dec 21, 2005
    #14
  15. baker1

    Bill Funk Guest

    No, it almost certainly will not, unless hacked.
    A TPM (Trusted Platform Module) will be needed on the motherboard to
    let the Mac OS run; no TPM, no Mac OS.
    Not only is this already known (and demonstrated on the units Apple
    supplies to developers), but a quick perusal of Apple's history will
    show that it must maintain control.
    There are a LOT of Windows-based video editors besides those from
    Adobe.
    I use Pinnacle Studio.
     
    Bill Funk, Dec 21, 2005
    #15
  16. baker1

    C Wright Guest

    I switched from PC's to Mac's about two years ago. It really boils down to
    which OS interface you like better - and after running a PC (Win XP) and a
    G5 Mac (OS X) literally side-by-side for awhile I found that I simply liked
    the Mac better!
    That said, with Apple switching to Intel processors perhaps as soon as
    January for notebooks and by mid year for high end machines I would wait for
    one of the new Apples before upgrading.
    Chuck
     
    C Wright, Dec 21, 2005
    #16
  17. baker1

    Leon Guest

    I'm PC... I'm not a fan of Billy Barrier but I'm not a fan of overpriced Apple
    either!

    All of the top video editors run on PCs, Studio and Premier for example, and a
    dual-core Pentium machine can be had for half the price of a non-expandable
    Apple.

    Anyway, Apple is going to switch to Pentium chips, so forgetaboutit!
     
    Leon, Dec 21, 2005
    #17
  18. I'm a switcher. Went from many years of PCs to Macs in 2000 and haven't
    looked back. I still keep a PC around but rarely turn it on.

    Once you go Mac, you'll never go back.
     
    Randall Ainsworth, Dec 21, 2005
    #18
  19. baker1

    Scott W Guest

    Me, I am sticking with CPM.

    Scott
     
    Scott W, Dec 21, 2005
    #19
  20. I prefer ITS or SAIL...

    David J. Littleboy
    Tokyo, Japan
     
    David J. Littleboy, Dec 21, 2005
    #20
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