Apple. Is it true that no one can stand their latest op-sys?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by RichA, Dec 9, 2013.

  1. RichA

    Guest Guest

    Some people buy on quality/price ratio.

    You know the saying for tripods ? A great tripod must be light, sturdy,
    and cheap. Pick 2 out of 3 ![/QUOTE]

    there's another saying that you should buy the good tripod first and
    skip the crappy ones because you'll buy the good one anyway.

    the usual way is someone buys a cheap tripod, realizes it's a piece of
    shit and then gets a better one and realizes it's a piece of shit too
    although not quite as bad and then they finally get the expensive and
    solid tripod in the end.

    might as well save the money and dealing with shitty tripods and get
    the good one first and skip all the intermediate ones. plus, a good
    tripod will last for *years* so it's not really that expensive.
     
    Guest, Dec 14, 2013
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  2. RichA

    J. Clarke Guest

    You should have DX.com anywhere. Their offices are in Hong Kong and
    they ship globally.
     
    J. Clarke, Dec 14, 2013
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  3. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    Then please do so, in terms of the need to carry a charged spare battery.
     
    PeterN, Dec 14, 2013
  4. RichA

    David Taylor Guest

    You are welcome to your view, which does not reflect my reality. I'm
    not continuing one of those long pointless arguments.
     
    David Taylor, Dec 14, 2013
  5. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    This was taken about 10 yards from my car. If my battery wen dead, and I
    had to recharge it in the car, I would ask this guy to do it again in
    about 1 hour. He would be happy to accommodate me if I asked him
    nicely. ;-p

    <https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/97242118/pelican landing.jpg>
     
    PeterN, Dec 14, 2013
  6. RichA

    Tony Cooper Guest

    Their lens caps are more expensive and there's a cost to shipping
    that's more than I pay for a lens cap.

    Besides, if I go to that used camera store, I'm going to spend an
    entertaining hour looking at some wonderful old film bodies, pawing
    through bins of used stuff, and chatting with the owner.
     
    Tony Cooper, Dec 14, 2013
  7. RichA

    charles Guest


    Camera-filters.com says they do. It looks like there is a choice of
    slow or expensive. I ran on to them recently looking for odd filter
    step-up rings.
     
    charles, Dec 15, 2013
  8. RichA

    Robert Coe Guest

    : On 12/14/2013 5:19 PM, Eric Stevens wrote:
    : > On Sat, 14 Dec 2013 14:55:26 -0500, nospam <>
    : > wrote:
    : >
    : >> and unless they hiked miles from their car to the campsite (which is
    : >> even more of an edge case), they can charge it in the car.
    : >
    : > People go where the scenery is. That can be days away from a car or
    : > any other civilisation. At any one time there are thousands doing this
    : > sort of thing in New Zealand. Probably far more in North America and
    : > Europe.
    : > http://www.patbarrettimages.co.nz/proofs/westland/tracks/Camping in tussock Mt Adams.jpg
    : > or http://tinyurl.com/l29ma2z
    : >
    :
    : This was taken about 10 yards from my car. If my battery wen dead, and I
    : had to recharge it in the car, I would ask this guy to do it again in
    : about 1 hour. He would be happy to accommodate me if I asked him
    : nicely. ;-p
    :
    : <https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/97242118/pelican landing.jpg>

    and promised him a fish.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 15, 2013
  9. RichA

    Robert Coe Guest

    On 14/12/2013 19:55, nospam wrote:
    : > In article <l8hsd3$e5s$>, David Taylor
    : >
    : >>>> While current cameras are much less likely to run out of battery during
    : >>>> a single day's shoot, I have had that happen, and I would not wish to be
    : >>>> without at least one spare battery during e.g. a ten-day trip away from
    : >>>> home.
    : >>>
    : >>> what for? where are you going that has no power??
    : >>>
    : >>> charge it at night and it's ready for another day's shooting, exactly
    : >>> the same as if you were home.
    : >>
    : >> I would have thought it obvious "why".
    : >>
    : >> (a) if the single battery runs out during the day, you /need/ the spare.
    : >
    : > and if it doesn't run out during the day, then you don't need a spare.
    : >
    : > not everyone shoots thousands of photos per day. very few do.
    : >
    : > if you do that, then get a spare. most people are well served with one
    : > battery.
    : >
    : >> (b) if the single battery develops a fault, the one spare becomes
    : >> invaluable.
    : >
    : > and just how often does that happen?
    : >
    : > what if both batteries develop a fault? you need three. and there's
    : > still a possibility that all three could fail, so you need four...
    : >
    : > do you carry spare cameras? if the single camera develops a fault, the
    : > backup camera becomes invaluable.
    : >
    : >> and yes, people do take camping vacations where overnight power isn't
    : >> guaranteed!
    : >
    : > edge case.
    : >
    : > and unless they hiked miles from their car to the campsite (which is
    : > even more of an edge case), they can charge it in the car.
    : >
    : > or they can bring a portable generator, as cameras aren't the only
    : > electronic device they'll be wanting to use.
    :
    : You are welcome to your view, which does not reflect my reality. I'm
    : not continuing one of those long pointless arguments.

    nospam is telling us that he has difficulty identifying with the situations
    that confront a serious photographer. That's understandable, as his own
    experiences are likely quite different. We should respect that and not harass
    him about it.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 15, 2013
  10. RichA

    Guest Guest

    what you should do is read what i write before saying stupid shit
    that's unrelated to what i actually wrote.

    if you actually read what i wrote, you'd see that i specifically
    spelled out situations where someone might need a second battery.

    however, most people do not, since a single battery will last for far
    more photos than they will shoot in one session, especially with
    cameras that get 1000-2000 photos per charge.
     
    Guest, Dec 15, 2013
  11. RichA

    Robert Coe Guest

    Le 14/12/13 20:55, nospam a écrit :
    : > In article <l8hoof$83a$>,
    : >
    : >>> some people buy on price, not quality.
    : >>
    : >> Some people buy on quality/price ratio.
    : >>
    : >> You know the saying for tripods ? A great tripod must be light, sturdy,
    : >> and cheap. Pick 2 out of 3 !
    : >
    : > there's another saying that you should buy the good tripod first and
    : > skip the crappy ones because you'll buy the good one anyway.
    :
    : This is the "sturdy and heavy" choice :).
    :
    : Noëlle Adam

    I have a couple of "Benro" tripods, made in China. They're not particularly
    light, but they're sturdy and cheap.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 15, 2013
  12. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    ;-)
     
    PeterN, Dec 15, 2013
  13. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    That well may be. But it is fair to assume that most in this group fall
    into the category of serious photographers. (Remember I specifically
    aksed about that.)
    Accordingly, I would think the default answer should be relevant to the
    needs of most serious photographers. To include casual picture takers in
    your statement creates an irrelevancy.
     
    PeterN, Dec 15, 2013
  14. RichA

    Tony Cooper Guest

    If I was intending a photo project of 1,000 photos, you better believe
    that I'll be taking a spare battery.
     
    Tony Cooper, Dec 15, 2013
  15. RichA

    Robert Coe Guest

    : In article <>, Eric Stevens
    :
    : > >> In the early 80's, I was intrigued by Apple, interested in their
    : > >> computers. But an engineer friend of mine who went into re-programming
    : > >> (re-writting software) then said that the system was junk and that the
    : > >> people he met who used them were sub-intelligent.
    : > >
    : > >then he was a moron.
    : > >
    : > >he must think nasa employees are sub-intelligent, because they use a
    : > >lot of macs. landing spacecraft on mars is for stupid people anyway.
    : >
    : > The early 80s was the time of the Apple II
    :
    : missing the point entirely, as always.
    :
    : the moron that rich is referring to is talking about macs.
    :
    : one of the biggest criticisms of the mac, especially in its early days,
    : was that it wasn't a real computer because it lacked a command line and
    : the interface was 'toy like' that was designed for stupid people.

    Well, I'm old enough to remember when the Mac first came out, and I didn't
    hear either of those criticisms. In fact we (computer people) liked the Mac's
    GUI a lot and thought it was one of the nicest technological advances we'd
    ever seen. (For a system that's toy-like and designed for stupid people, see
    Windows 8.)

    What we did find annoying about the Mac, and which generated a fair amount of
    ridicule, was its absence of any form of error reporting. Its sole error
    message was "Sorry, an error has occurred", and the only action it could/would
    take was to reboot. Unix and DOS were bad enough in that respect, but the Mac
    was worse.

    : the belief was that if you weren't smart enough to understand dos or
    : unix, then you shouldn't be using a computer. you were a lesser form of
    : life.

    Maybe some people thought that, but I never heard anybody say it.

    : you still hear the same idiocy now, mostly from linux users.
    :
    : the apple ii was not criticized in the same way. it had a command line
    : and was just as powerful as anything else back then.

    That is pretty much nonsense. There were lots of computers at the time that
    were far more powerful. The Apple ii's innovation, and that of other early
    personal computers, was accessibility, not power.

    : visicalc, the
    : first spreadsheet, was on the apple ii, *before* there was an ibm pc.
    :
    : it turns out that the only 'sub-intelligent' people were the ones with
    : a closed mind that couldn't see just how advanced the mac really was.
    : the graphic interface it introduced is now standard, along with many
    : other things the mac had under the hood.

    That's true, but your strawman assertions about how the Mac was received don't
    hold up very well.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 15, 2013
  16. RichA

    David Taylor Guest

    On 15/12/2013 02:10, Robert Coe wrote:
    []
    Quicker to add him/her to the killfile! Improve the SNR a lot.
     
    David Taylor, Dec 15, 2013
  17. RichA

    J. Clarke Guest

    For me the nearest used camera shop _is_ B&H. But it's still 70 bucks
    worth of gas plus NYC parking (typically around a hundred bucks), and
    six hours of driving (or 86 bucks and six hours on the train). When I
    can get a perfectly adequate lens cap from Hong Kong for 3 bucks,
    including shipping, it's kind of a slam-dunk which to go for.
     
    J. Clarke, Dec 15, 2013
  18. RichA

    J. Clarke Guest

    Name two that were "far more powerful" at the same price point. The
    best CP/M machines were slightly faster but cost more. It wasn't until
    you started getting into mainframes and the larger minis that you were
    getting "far more power" and they weren't cheap.

    I never much liked the Apple II, mostly because I was coming from
    mainframes and already knew CP/M, but it was a decent enough machine.
    I remember one of my professors got one of the first Macs. She liked it
    for the most part but she still used the mainframe for serious work.
     
    J. Clarke, Dec 15, 2013
  19. RichA

    Tony Cooper Guest

    While your economic comparison is valid, who would make that trip for
    a lens cap? What photographer would go into the city, buy a lens cap,
    and return home?

    Even in going the six miles or so I drive to visit the used camera
    shop where I buy my $1 lens caps, I schedule that trip around some
    other errand or a visit to Skycraft.

    http://www.skycraftsurplus.com/index.aspx
     
    Tony Cooper, Dec 15, 2013
  20. RichA

    Guest Guest

    a lot of people thought the mac was fantastic, but not everyone did.

    there were critics who bashed it saying it was a toy, no command line,
    etc.
    your memory has failed you.

    there was *far* more than just one sole error message.

    the errors fell into two groups. the first group was for the ds errors
    which officially stood for dire straits but actually meant deep shit
    where something crashed. usually that meant a reboot but not always.

    the other group was for the normal errors like file not found, trying
    to read past the end of a file, trying to delete a file that's in use,
    etc. those rarely, if ever required a reboot.
    oh, they definitely did. some still do.
    nothing nonsense about it.

    other computers at the time included the commodore pet, trs-80, etc.,
    and they were comparable to the apple ii. even the ibm pc was
    comparable.
    nothing strawman about it. it's how it was.
     
    Guest, Dec 15, 2013
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