Apple. Is it true that no one can stand their latest op-sys?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by RichA, Dec 9, 2013.

  1. RichA

    Guest Guest

    some people buy on price, not quality.
     
    Guest, Dec 14, 2013
    #81
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  2. RichA

    Guest Guest

    it's not a $15 battery for $80.

    it's $15 battery because it doesn't meet the proper specs and may have
    cut corners with regards to safety (and probably other aspects) and
    therefore can be dangerous.

    there's a reason why the $80 battery costs $80, and not all of it is
    because it's a name brand or profiteering. it's made to a higher
    standard, will likely last longer, and without the risk of exploding.

    some offbrand batteries are fine, but there's no way to tell other than
    taking them apart. you might be able to find a web site that did that,
    and if you do, you can base your buying decision accordingly. otherwise
    it's a crap shoot.
    extra batteries are often redundant anyway.

    unless you have a camera that shoots very few photos per charge (i've
    seen as few as 50 per charge which is laughably bad) or a pro shooting
    thousands of photos at a time, there's not really a need to get a
    second battery.
    standardization of battery sizes would greatly restrict camera design.
    one of the main advantages of lithium batteries is that they can be any
    shape, and therefore the cameras can be made more compact and lower
    cost.
    except they picked a horrible connection standard, and one which is
    oriented differently on each device.
     
    Guest, Dec 14, 2013
    #82
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  3. RichA

    David Taylor Guest

    ============================================

    We don't know what the manufacturing cost is, and how much of the "$80"
    is profit. I've had good experience with "$15" batteries in previous
    cameras, just as good as the $80 one which came with the camera. They
    have lasted just as long. With the price pressure on DSLRs, it seem
    likely that manufacturers will wish to maximise profit on accessories.

    While current cameras are much less likely to run out of battery during
    a single day's shoot, I have had that happen, and I would not wish to be
    without at least one spare battery during e.g. a ten-day trip away from
    home.

    I don't accept that camera design would be "greatly" restricted - with
    many of these batteries being a very similar size, shape, voltage and
    capacity. Some restriction, yes, but look at the benefits to the
    customer if Li-ion battery packs were as standardised as e.g. AA cells.
    Lower cost, greater availability etc. etc.

    Yes, it must be very difficult to insert a micro-USB connector the right
    way up. One wonders how hundreds of millions of people throughout the
    world manage it every day or so.
     
    David Taylor, Dec 14, 2013
    #83
  4. RichA

    Guest Guest

    then you were lucky.

    a lot of the $15 are cheap crap that won't last very long and may even
    explode.

    here's an old article that still applies:
    <http://www.engadget.com/2005/09/26/nikon-d70s-explode-from-knockoff-bat
    teries/>
    According to a Nikon service center, they have recently seen several
    instances of knockoff batteries causing D70 cameras to explode inside
    the user's bag. Since non-certified batteries often lack the safety
    features of their certified counterparts, photogs looking for a sweet
    deal may end up risking life and limb (and eye) if the batteries
    happen to blow during usage.

    even if it just expands (rather than explode), it can still cause
    damage, and the $65 you saved is nothing compared to the camera you
    will have to replace, and if it does explode, you might be replacing
    much more than just a camera.

    i'll never understand why people spend thousands of dollars on cameras
    and lenses and then get the cheapest battery, the cheapest uv filter,
    cheapest tripod, etc.
    what for? where are you going that has no power??

    charge it at night and it's ready for another day's shooting, exactly
    the same as if you were home.
    except that people don't care about any of that. they want the smaller
    devices and rarely replace the battery anyway, if ever.

    it's like phones and computers. they use the battery that comes with
    the device and never get any spares. on the off chance they need a
    spare, they buy one.
    they fumble, because phones don't standardize which way is 'up' so
    people either have to guess (and some force it, breaking things) or
    they have to look at the plug and socket for each device. who wants to
    deal with that shit? it's a broken design.

    that's why the next version of the micro usb connector will be
    reversible. the designers know it's a problem, otherwise, why would
    they bother making it reversible?

    it also means there will be *seven* different usb connectors. seven!
    what an absolute mess.

    <http://www.theverge.com/2013/12/4/5173686/usb-type-c-connector-specific
    ation-announced>
    Work has begun on a new generation of USB that will break
    compatibility with existing connectors in order to improve ease of
    use and allow for thinner devices. The new connector, called Type-C,
    is an addition to the existing USB 3.1 specification and is expected
    to be finalized by the middle of 2014. There aren't any images
    available yet, but Type-C will be around the size of a Micro USB plug
    and, like Apple's Lightning connector, will finally be reversible ‹
    in other words, no more frustrated attempts to charge your phone with
    an upside-down cable.
     
    Guest, Dec 14, 2013
    #84
  5. RichA

    Robert Coe Guest

    On 14/12/2013 05:47, Robert Coe wrote:
    : []
    : > Sure, and why would one take the risk? If you're shooting an event and
    : > your battery craps out, you'll miss shots while you change it (in addition
    : > to the shots you missed while figuring out what the problem was). I carry
    : > two cameras and three spare batteries, which cost, I believe, $80 each.
    : > If I had bought three Brand X batteries for half as much, I would have
    : > saved $120. A good 77mm circular polarizer costs more than that.
    : >
    : > Bob
    :
    : Why? You've already given the answer - cost. It's not the money as
    : such, although that is important, but the feeling that selling a $15
    : battery for $80 is excessive profiteering.

    I disagree. Buying batteries on price because you have to, or because you know
    for a fact that the quality is the the same, is fine. But buying them on price
    just so you can brag that you didn't get rooked, is foolish. The cost of
    batteries represents roundoff error in the average photographer's kit.

    : Not to mention the lack of standardisation which means that, unlike your
    : filter which can be used on any 77 mm lens, each new camera often
    : requires a different battery, meaning that those expensive extras you
    : bought last time are now redundant. Accepted that if you only buy a new
    : camera infrequently, the batteries will be approaching their life's end,
    : but it is still a pity that there is not more standardisation. At least
    : the EU has given us more standardisation in mobile phone chargers and leads!

    Manufacturers seem to be getting a bit better about that, at least within
    their own product lines. I'm pretty sure my 7D's take the same battery as a 5D
    MkIII.

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 14, 2013
    #85
  6. RichA

    Guest Guest

    make that *nine*. i forgot two.

    and then there is the mess of which cable to use.
     
    Guest, Dec 14, 2013
    #86
  7. RichA

    Robert Coe Guest

    : On Thursday, 12 December 2013 07:38:06 UTC, RichA wrote:
    : > On Wednesday, December 11, 2013 9:29:12 AM UTC-5, Mr. Strat wrote:
    : >
    : > > In article <l877na$5cg$>, PAS <>
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > > wrote:
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > > > Hope you've been well Randall.
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > > >
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > > >
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > > I'm more of a lurker these days. Since I know everything there is to
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > > know about photography, I don't comment often . :)
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > >
    : >
    : > > But RichA is such a tard.
    : >
    : >
    : >
    : > Said the fanboy who named himself after a guitar?
    :
    : Oh I thought it was violin related

    That would be "Mr Strad".

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 14, 2013
    #87
  8. RichA

    David Taylor Guest

    On 14/12/2013 14:01, YouDontNeedToKnowButItsNoëlle wrote:
    []
    Certainly - that's why I mentioned $15 rather than $3. I buy from
    suppliers who have a reputation to maintain, not the cheapest available.
    As you say, they are all most likely made in China.

    (I can remember when "Made in Japan" meant rubbish....).

    Interesting about the lens cap, though.
     
    David Taylor, Dec 14, 2013
    #88
  9. RichA

    David Taylor Guest

    With the exception of Apple, who have now two non-standard connector
    types for their iPad, I can charge any of my devices, or my wife's, with
    the iPad charger and Moto G USB lead.

    Oh, that cameras offered that!
     
    David Taylor, Dec 14, 2013
    #89
  10. RichA

    David Taylor Guest

     
    David Taylor, Dec 14, 2013
    #90
  11. RichA

    Hactar Guest

    "recently" -- maybe there's a bad batch out there at Joe's Bait Shop,
    Fish Market, and Battery Emporium.

    Maybe Nikon-approved batteries have also damaged a proportional number of
    cameras.

    Maybe these people are quick to blame it on a faulty battery rather than
    storage among metal shavings, under salt water. Or whatever.
     
    Hactar, Dec 14, 2013
    #91
  12. RichA

    J. Clarke Guest

    There's a similar situation with Canon lens hoods.

    If you haven't discovered DX.com, by the way, you might want to check it
    out. I've bought several items from them, found that the quality was
    good, and the shipping timely (considering that the stuff comes by cheap
    rate from China). Do read the descriptions very carefully, and if there
    are reviews for the particular product, read those as well.
     
    J. Clarke, Dec 14, 2013
    #92
  13. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    Technology fails. I always carry a spare battery. I have had to replace
    it in the field, because my main had been run down, for two reasons.
    1. I did a lot of shooting;
    2. Unlike others here, I am not perfect. I forgot to charge the battery
    the night before.
    (I have even forgotten to erase my CF card after downloading.)
    For clarity, Are you suggesting that it is not necessary to carry a
    spare battery?

    Do you distinguish a serious photographer, from a casual snapshooter?
     
    PeterN, Dec 14, 2013
    #93
  14. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    Apple gets special dispensaton, from some.
     
    PeterN, Dec 14, 2013
    #94
  15. RichA

    David Taylor Guest

    On 14/12/2013 16:47, J. Clarke wrote:
    []
    I haven't found that particular site, but perhaps we have something
    similar in the UK. I've certainly bought RF stuff directly from China
    and manufactured in China, and been very pleased with it, both from the
    value and performance points of view.
     
    David Taylor, Dec 14, 2013
    #95
  16. RichA

    Tony Cooper Guest

    I am forever losing lens caps. There's a used camera store in town
    that handles only film cameras, but they have a box of lens caps in
    various sizes. $1 each. Last time I was there I bought 6 for $5.00.

    I also bought three hard tubular cases for lenses for $1.00 each.
     
    Tony Cooper, Dec 14, 2013
    #96
  17. RichA

    Guest Guest

    I dont know how much it is for a battery.
    But I can tell you a genuine plastic lens cap from Nikon cost 36 ¤ in
    the shop. And it cost 5$, free shipping from China. Go figure !
    I buyed also a compatible AC converter for my camera ( because using a
    remote shooting software from my computer emptied the batteries too fast).
    Cost 30 ¤ instead of 180 ¤.[/QUOTE]

    there's a difference between buying a cheap lens cap that's a piece of
    plastic and no difference other than the logo on the front versus a
    battery which might fail prematurely or worse, explode.

    lens caps are also the type of thing that never wears out. you can buy
    used genuine nikon lens caps for next to nothing. it doesn't matter if
    it's new or 30 years old. if it's the right diameter, it will fit.
    there are differences, and for a battery that can mean the difference
    between lasting a while and going *boom*.
    noname ac converters can be a very big risk, as in death.

    <http://www.zdnet.com/cn/another-iphone-shock-case-in-china-leaves-man-i
    n-coma-7000018276/>
    30-year-old Wu Jiantong remains in ICU in a Beijing hospital, 10 days
    after he received an electric shock while connecting his iPhone 4 to
    a third-party charger. This is the second such case involving an
    iPhone in China, where the first had left a Chinese stewardess dead.
    yep, and sometimes the risk is not worth saving a buck. for a lens cap,
    who cares. for something that involves power, don't go cheap.
     
    Guest, Dec 14, 2013
    #97
  18. RichA

    Guest Guest

    apple has one connector, lightning. the dock connector is for legacy
    devices.

    they do still sell a 3 year old ipad with a dock connector for those
    buying on price, but it's clear that they are buying an outdated model.
    i have a flipphone that uses a custom connector.
    i have an android device that uses mini usb.
    i have another android device that uses micro usb.
    i have an iphone that uses lightning.

    of the bunch, microusb is the worst.

    at least mini usb is easy to tell which way is which and the custom
    connector has a mark on the plug so it's easy too. lightning is
    reversible so it doesn't matter.

    and in a couple of years, there will be yet *another* usb plug, one
    which copies the reversibility of lightning.
     
    Guest, Dec 14, 2013
    #98
  19. RichA

    Guest Guest

    not for normal use.

    when one battery can shoot 1000+ photos, there's no need to carry a
    spare.
    yes.
     
    Guest, Dec 14, 2013
    #99
  20. RichA

    Guest Guest

    and if it doesn't run out during the day, then you don't need a spare.

    not everyone shoots thousands of photos per day. very few do.

    if you do that, then get a spare. most people are well served with one
    battery.
    and just how often does that happen?

    what if both batteries develop a fault? you need three. and there's
    still a possibility that all three could fail, so you need four...

    do you carry spare cameras? if the single camera develops a fault, the
    backup camera becomes invaluable.
    edge case.

    and unless they hiked miles from their car to the campsite (which is
    even more of an edge case), they can charge it in the car.

    or they can bring a portable generator, as cameras aren't the only
    electronic device they'll be wanting to use.
     
    Guest, Dec 14, 2013
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