Adobe and America go from an ownership to a rental economy

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by RichA, May 8, 2013.

  1. RichA

    J. Clarke Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    >
    > On 2013-05-12, android <> wrote:
    >
    > > "J. Clarke" <> wrote:

    >
    > >> In article <>, says...

    >
    > >> > http://www.modbook.com/

    >
    > >> Which is not made by Apple.

    >
    > > Nooo... It''s a third party modification of an Apple product...

    >
    > ....and it's a damn sight far away from being affordable!
    >
    > <http://www.powerbookmedic.com/Modbook-Pro-23GHZ-Core-i5-120GB-SSD-4GB-RAM-p-25898.html>
    >
    > I'll jes buy a used intuos 3 fer $150 and run it on my linux desktop,
    > thank you very much.


    Not really the same. I have an Intuos 3 and while it does tricks that a
    Wacom tablet won't, the feedback is different. The tablet is more like
    a baby Cintiq.
     
    J. Clarke, May 13, 2013
    #41
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  2. RichA

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, J. Clarke
    <> wrote:

    > > <http://www.powerbookmedic.com/Modbook-Pro-23GHZ-Core-i5-120GB-SSD-4GB-RAM-p-
    > > 25898.html>
    > >
    > > I'll jes buy a used intuos 3 fer $150 and run it on my linux desktop,
    > > thank you very much.

    >
    > Not really the same. I have an Intuos 3 and while it does tricks that a
    > Wacom tablet won't, the feedback is different.


    intuos *is* a wacom tablet.

    > The tablet is more like
    > a baby Cintiq.


    right, the modbook is basically a cintiq+macbook.
     
    nospam, May 13, 2013
    #42
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  3. RichA

    J. Clarke Guest

    In article <CDB53020.9B7DC%>,
    says...
    >
    > On 5/12/13 11:22 AM, in article ,
    > "J. Clarke" <> wrote:
    >
    > > In article <CDB51792.9B7B7%>,
    > > says...
    > >>
    > >> On 5/12/13 5:02 AM, in article ,
    > >> "J. Clarke" <> wrote:
    > >>
    > >>> In article <>, tonycooper214
    > >>> @gmail.com says...
    > >>>>
    > >>>> On Sat, 11 May 2013 11:31:49 -0400, nospam <>
    > >>>> wrote:
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> In article <>, Tony Cooper
    > >>>>> <> wrote:
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>>>>>> it has nothing to do with macs. with rare
    > >>>>>>>>> exception, products that do more cost more. no surprise there.
    > >>>>>>>>>
    > >>>>>>>>> if macs are priced too high to attract the user that doesn't need all
    > >>>>>>>>> those specs, then so are similar pcs. why doesn't he mention those?
    > >>>>>>>>
    > >>>>>>>> The lowest priced Mac is higher in price than many PCs.
    > >>>>>>>
    > >>>>>>> only because it has better specs, not because it's a mac.
    > >>>>>>
    > >>>>>> Of course it's because it's a Mac. Who do you think decides what
    > >>>>>> features/specs a model will have?
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>> no, not because it's a mac.
    > >>>>>
    > >>>> We are getting to the point here where I can't believe that you are
    > >>>> serious about what you say. You are denying, apparently, that Apple
    > >>>> isn't making the decision to offer laptops that are priced higher -but
    > >>>> offer more features- than many PC laptops. If the manufacturer of the
    > >>>> product does not make the decision of what to offer, who does?
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> the price is higher because it has better specs, just as a similar spec
    > >>>>> lenovo or acer or sony would be priced higher than the 'many pcs'
    > >>>>> you're talking about.
    > >>>>
    > >>>> Do you deny, though, that many PCs are priced lower than the minimum
    > >>>> offerings by Mac? The question isn't about "why", but about whether
    > >>>> or not the statement is true. You are arguing a point not made.
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>>>> a similar spec pc will have a higher price than those 'many pcs' you're
    > >>>>>>> talking about.
    > >>>>>>
    > >>>>>> Certainly. But that's not what was said. The statement "The lowest
    > >>>>>> priced Mac is higher in price than many PCs" is patently obvious and
    > >>>>>> true.
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>> it's a misleading statement and you aren't going to get away with 'but
    > >>>>> it's true' excuse.
    > >>>>
    > >>>> No, it's not misleading at all. It's absolutely and obviously true
    > >>>> and misleads no one.
    > >>>>
    > >>>>> the lowest price mac also does a whole lot more than many pcs, which is
    > >>>>> why it costs more. that's *also* patently obvious and true.
    > >>>>
    > >>>> Well, I'm not sure that "do a lot more" is necessarily true. All
    > >>>> laptops, essentially, do the same thing. The OS may allow one to do
    > >>>> something better, the screen may present a clearer image, the
    > >>>> mechanical components may be of better quality...but they basically
    > >>>> all do the same thing. There are some things, like a built-in video
    > >>>> camera, that are not present in all laptops, but that's about it for
    > >>>> "do".
    > >>>
    > >>> And where is the Macbook tablet? My Thinkpad tablet is so old that it
    > >>> had XP on it when I got it. But Apple has never put a penabled screen
    > >>> on a Macbook.
    > >>>
    > >>
    > >> It didn't work for PC,

    > >
    > > That's odd, the one in my lap at the moment is working fine. In what
    > > sense did "it" "not work"? Lenovo just brought out another generation
    > > of such machines. So did Fujitsu. They all seem to work fine.
    > >

    >
    > So did the Edsel.


    Except that the Edsel did not go through multiple generations, inspire
    imitators, or get produced by multiple manufacturers.

    > >> why should Apple try such nonsense?

    > >
    > > And that in a nutshell is the problem with Apple fans. The only
    > > "features" that count are the ones that Apple includes, and features
    > > that are more difficult to provide but are not available from Apple are
    > > dismissed as "nonsense".
    > >

    > Because basically NO ONE cares.


    Now you understand. NO ONE CARES about the fancy unnecessary extra
    "features" on your precious little electronic god.

    > If there is no market, why waste production
    > and advertising expense trying to sell ice cubes to Eskimos?


    And yet obviously there is a market. One that Apple ignored.

    > Obviously, by
    > the numbers, the iPad SELLS. If there was a need for a stylus for Apple
    > tablets, there are a number of stylus manufacturers, but the numbers show
    > that most don't give a hoot.


    We were not discussing the kinds of tablets that Apple sells.

    > >> Particularly when
    > >> they have such a commanding success with the iPad line?

    > >
    > > My Thinkpad was working fine four years before the first ipad shipped.
    > > It is the second generation of the Thinkpad to have that feature.
    > >

    >
    > So? Glad that you are happy, you and all of a few hundred others out
    > there...


    So let's see, "a few hundred users" are supporting Lenovo, Panasonic,
    HP, and Fujitsu.
     
    J. Clarke, May 13, 2013
    #43
  4. RichA

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, J. Clarke
    <> wrote:

    > > If there is no market, why waste production
    > > and advertising expense trying to sell ice cubes to Eskimos?

    >
    > And yet obviously there is a market. One that Apple ignored.


    not one big enough for apple to bother with.
     
    nospam, May 13, 2013
    #44
  5. RichA

    android Guest

    In article <>,
    notbob <> wrote:

    > On 2013-05-12, android <> wrote:
    >
    > > "J. Clarke" <> wrote:

    >
    > >> In article <>, says...

    >
    > >> > http://www.modbook.com/

    >
    > >> Which is not made by Apple.

    >
    > > Nooo... It''s a third party modification of an Apple product...

    >
    > ....and it's a damn sight far away from being affordable!
    >
    > <http://www.powerbookmedic.com/Modbook-Pro-23GHZ-Core-i5-120GB-SSD-4GB-RAM-p-2
    > 5898.html>
    >
    > I'll jes buy a used intuos 3 fer $150 and run it on my linux desktop,
    > thank you very much.
    >
    > nb


    I'm not selling it. It's there if you need/want it. Some folks pay
    premium for tools that make them more productive.
    --
    teleportation kills
     
    android, May 13, 2013
    #45
  6. RichA

    android Guest

    In article <120520131331079787%>,
    nospam <> wrote:

    > computers are not like designer clothing where you *do* pay for the
    > logo.


    I don't. Sometimes i do pay extra for stuff that looks good though.
    Sometimes that stuff is "designer"...
    --
    teleportation kills
     
    android, May 13, 2013
    #46
  7. RichA

    Whisky-dave Guest

    On Saturday, May 11, 2013 7:38:37 PM UTC+1, Tony Cooper wrote:
    > On Sat, 11 May 2013 11:31:49 -0400, nospam <>
    >
    > wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > >In article <>, Tony Cooper

    >
    > ><> wrote:

    >
    > >

    >
    > >> >> > it has nothing to do with macs. with rare

    >
    > >> >> >exception, products that do more cost more. no surprise there.

    >
    > >> >> >

    >
    > >> >> >if macs are priced too high to attract the user that doesn't need all

    >
    > >> >> >those specs, then so are similar pcs. why doesn't he mention those?

    >
    > >> >>

    >
    > >> >> The lowest priced Mac is higher in price than many PCs.

    >
    > >> >

    >
    > >> >only because it has better specs, not because it's a mac.

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >> Of course it's because it's a Mac. Who do you think decides what

    >
    > >> features/specs a model will have?

    >
    > >

    >
    > >no, not because it's a mac.

    >
    > >

    >
    > We are getting to the point here where I can't believe that you are
    >
    > serious about what you say. You are denying, apparently, that Apple
    >
    > isn't making the decision to offer laptops that are priced higher -but
    >
    > offer more features- than many PC laptops. If the manufacturer of the
    >
    > product does not make the decision of what to offer, who does?


    Aple are making computers for a particualar range of person, they know thatI know that so who doesn't know that ?.

    I can even tell you the price of the next Apple product it will be a similar price to the previous product that it's replacing, which shows they are after a market. Apple won't be unvailing a sub 500 UKP computer. They'll stick to the mid-high range products. They won;t introcue a very high end product either such as a cray.
    Most companies work within a set price range Apple are no differnt, they also know they can;t make enough profit from low spec computers as teh margins are to low.



    > >the price is higher because it has better specs, just as a similar spec

    >
    > >lenovo or acer or sony would be priced higher than the 'many pcs'

    >
    > >you're talking about.

    >
    >
    >
    > Do you deny, though, that many PCs are priced lower than the minimum
    >
    > offerings by Mac?


    I'd say that's true and I'd say they are also worth less because of that.
    They're build quality will generally be lower and the specs, while they might look the same on the surface won't perform as well.

    > The question isn't about "why", but about whether
    >
    > or not the statement is true. You are arguing a point not made.


    Seems a rather silly to point out such things.


    > >the lowest price mac also does a whole lot more than many pcs, which is

    >
    > >why it costs more. that's *also* patently obvious and true.

    >
    >
    >
    > Well, I'm not sure that "do a lot more" is necessarily true. All
    >
    > laptops, essentially, do the same thing. The OS may allow one to do
    >
    > something better, the screen may present a clearer image, the
    >
    > mechanical components may be of better quality...but they basically
    >
    > all do the same thing. There are some things, like a built-in video
    >
    > camera, that are not present in all laptops, but that's about it for
    >
    > "do".


    Apart from the suplied software, I can;t believe how useless and unuse friendley windows paint is compared to iPhoto and I use both, or maybe I'm using the wrong product on the windows side to do basic photo editing.
    As for doing more well it's certainly easier and more encouraging on a Mac.
    I'm presently attempting to use an Ardunio board, check out how to install ehm on a PC and on a Mac.

    Installing drivers for the Arduino Uno with Windows7, Vista, or XP:

    •Plug in your board and wait for Windows to begin it's driver installation process. Â After a few moments, the process will fail, despite its bestefforts
    •Click on the Start Menu, and open up the Control Panel.
    •While in the Control Panel, navigate to System and Security. Next, clickon System. Once the System window is up, open the Device Manager.
    •Look under Ports (COM & LPT). Â You should see an open port named "Arduino UNO (COMxx)"
    •Right click on the "Arduino UNO (COmxx)" port and choose the "Update Driver Software" option.
    •Next, choose the "Browse my computer for Driver software" option.
    •Finally, navigate to and select the Uno's driver file, named "ArduinoUNO..inf", located in the "Drivers" folder of the Arduino Software download (not the "FTDI USB Drivers" sub-directory).
    •Windows will finish up the driver installation from there.

    ----------------------
    It took 3 atempts before I got this working and every now and again maybe 1in 5 compiles I get errors which are only resolved by unplugging it and plugging it back in again, and I'm not the first to have found this. This is what I was told by those that have used them on macs and PCs.

    On the Mac there's no driver install as such, you just need to
    Select the serial device of the Arduino board from the Tools > Serial Port menu. On the Mac, this should be something with /dev/tty.usbmodem


    maybe not such a big deal once you know, but yet again shows how less painful a Mac computer can be, and that's before we talk about viruses.

    >
    > >> And what, pray tell, do you think determines price tiers? And who

    >
    > >> determines what they will offer?

    >
    > >

    >
    > >features do, not the logo on the box.

    >
    >
    >
    > Bizarre. Who determines what the features will be if not the people
    >
    > in the company whose logo it is? Features don't make any decisions.
    >
    > They are the result of decisions.


    What features can be offered is determined by price.
    You can get a 750K SSD if you wish and can afford it Apple offer the optionof a fusion drive for those that can't afford such a thing and still wnat a reasonal about of overall storage, it's offer for those that can afford it or think the options is worth the extra.

    >
    >
    >
    > --
    >
    > Tony Cooper - Orlando FL
     
    Whisky-dave, May 13, 2013
    #47
  8. RichA

    Whisky-dave Guest

    On Sunday, May 12, 2013 4:51:27 PM UTC+1, PeterN wrote:
    > On 5/12/2013 11:31 AM, nospam wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > >

    >
    > > pick the best tool for the job.

    >
    > >

    >
    >
    >
    > Yup!
    >
    > Last November I was looking for a new lightweight computer.
    >
    > At the Apple store they advised me that their was no Apple product that
    >
    > would meet my needs.


    You wanted it to keep crashing and get infrected by viruses on a regular basis?, well what did you expect ;-)





    Which one did you get and were they any other requirments that an Apple product couldn't meet which you required ?

    I've had a quick look and you're right going by the reviews thre's no way Apple could compete.

    http://shop.lenovo.com/gb/en/laptops/ideapad/u-series/u310/?sb=:000001D4:0001BEEE:#reviews

    --------------------------
    Disappointment
    Date: Dec 30, 2012
    cons (3) Wireless card,Support,poor connectivity

    Considerably dissatisfied because of very poor wireless connection; wouldn't be such any issue had Lenovo been able to resolve. Unable to recommend the U310 and would discourage friends and family from purchasing.
    --------------------------------

    http://shop.lenovo.com/gb/en/laptop...t|z1D630|s#/?facet-5=2&page-index=1&facet-2=3

    Tried to get a review of their top end £1,500 thinkpad X1 carbon

    Cons Screen size, resolution, display performance and price
    And a months delivery, buyer sent it back in the end.

    I guess you're right the's no way Apple could compete with this :)

    >
    > I wound up with my Lenovo.


    Are you sure you don;t mean you were wound up by your Lenovo.
     
    Whisky-dave, May 13, 2013
    #48
  9. RichA

    J. Clarke Guest

    In article <>, says...
    >
    > In article <>,
    > notbob <> wrote:
    >
    > > On 2013-05-12, android <> wrote:
    > >
    > > > "J. Clarke" <> wrote:

    > >
    > > >> In article <>, says...

    > >
    > > >> > http://www.modbook.com/

    > >
    > > >> Which is not made by Apple.

    > >
    > > > Nooo... It''s a third party modification of an Apple product...

    > >
    > > ....and it's a damn sight far away from being affordable!
    > >
    > > <http://www.powerbookmedic.com/Modbook-Pro-23GHZ-Core-i5-120GB-SSD-4GB-RAM-p-2
    > > 5898.html>
    > >
    > > I'll jes buy a used intuos 3 fer $150 and run it on my linux desktop,
    > > thank you very much.
    > >
    > > nb

    >
    > I'm not selling it. It's there if you need/want it. Some folks pay
    > premium for tools that make them more productive.


    The argument presented was that Macs have lots of functionality that PCs
    lack. I pointed out an example where they don't. You pointed out that
    a third party kluges Macs to provide a keyboardless tablet, voiding the
    Apple warranty in the process. If you are willing to go with something
    that is hacked up by a third party and unsupported by Apple, then I can
    just put OSX on my Thinkpad and end up with a more satisfactory result.
     
    J. Clarke, May 13, 2013
    #49
  10. RichA

    J. Clarke Guest

    In article <CDB64684.9B861%>,
    says...
    >
    > On 5/12/13 9:43 PM, in article 120520132243388841%,
    > "nospam" <> wrote:
    >
    > > In article <>, J. Clarke
    > > <> wrote:
    > >
    > >>> If there is no market, why waste production
    > >>> and advertising expense trying to sell ice cubes to Eskimos?
    > >>
    > >> And yet obviously there is a market. One that Apple ignored.

    > >
    > > not one big enough for apple to bother with.

    >
    > Amazing how some people feel that if THEY cherish a toy, then the whole
    > WORLD should also worship their golden calf...


    Yep, described the MacTribesman attitude to a T.
     
    J. Clarke, May 13, 2013
    #50
  11. RichA

    Mayayana Guest

    | Adobe is going to put its software in the Cloud and charge you a user
    | fee to "rent" its use.

    I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but I just came
    across it at TheRegister:

    "One colleague has indeed checked with Adobe and been told that if you allow
    your subscription to drop then you'll not actually be able to open your old
    files."

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/05/13/adobe_cloud_pricing/

    As I understand it, the subscription version is also not
    "in the cloud". It gets installed locally. Which makes sense.
    Editing giant photos over the Internet would be a slow
    process. All taken together, Adobe's move can be seen
    as not only a step toward rental rather than sale, but also
    a move to define any work done with the tool as a part of
    their service, just as webmail companies claim co-copyright
    on all content.

    The Register article doesn't say how Adobe would prevent
    accessing one's files -- whether they just mean that one's
    online storage would be locked down or whether they intend
    to start using some sort of custom, proprietary file type that
    only Photoshop can open.
     
    Mayayana, May 13, 2013
    #51
  12. RichA

    nospam Guest

    In article <kmqrb8$9gt$>, Mayayana
    <> wrote:

    > | Adobe is going to put its software in the Cloud and charge you a user
    > | fee to "rent" its use.
    >
    > I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but I just came
    > across it at TheRegister:
    >
    > "One colleague has indeed checked with Adobe and been told that if you allow
    > your subscription to drop then you'll not actually be able to open your old
    > files."
    >
    > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/05/13/adobe_cloud_pricing/


    with an article titled

    Adobe price hike: Your money or your files, frappuccino sippers

    you know it's going to be completely objective.

    not surprisingly, they get a lot wrong.

    the way it works is if you let your adobe creative cloud subscription
    lapse, you can't use adobe creative cloud apps anymore. that's all. no
    real surprise there.

    your files are still on your hard drive and can be opened by *other*
    apps that can read/write those formats. you just can't use the apps you
    are no longer paying for.

    for photoshop users, that means you can use photoshop elements, apple
    preview and many others. the photoshop .psd format is documented, so
    there can't ever be a lockout.

    photoshop users can also save in tiff, jpg, png, pdf, etc., which can
    be opened with pretty much anything.

    > As I understand it, the subscription version is also not
    > "in the cloud". It gets installed locally. Which makes sense.
    > Editing giant photos over the Internet would be a slow
    > process. All taken together, Adobe's move can be seen
    > as not only a step toward rental rather than sale, but also
    > a move to define any work done with the tool as a part of
    > their service, just as webmail companies claim co-copyright
    > on all content.


    more misinformation. google and yahoo mail do not and i highly doubt
    anyone else does.

    > The Register article doesn't say how Adobe would prevent
    > accessing one's files -- whether they just mean that one's
    > online storage would be locked down or whether they intend
    > to start using some sort of custom, proprietary file type that
    > only Photoshop can open.


    of course they don't say how, because it's complete bullshit.

    there is no custom proprietary type or copy protection or other tinfoil
    hat nonsense. the files are *yours* to do whatever the hell you want
    with them.

    adobe doesn't prevent anything other than not using the apps you aren't
    paying for. you are more than welcome to use any other apps that
    read/write the formats.
     
    nospam, May 13, 2013
    #52
  13. RichA

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, J. Clarke
    <> wrote:

    > > > I'll jes buy a used intuos 3 fer $150 and run it on my linux desktop,
    > > > thank you very much.

    > >
    > > I'm not selling it. It's there if you need/want it. Some folks pay
    > > premium for tools that make them more productive.

    >
    > The argument presented was that Macs have lots of functionality that PCs
    > lack.


    no it wasn't. the issue is apple doesn't make products in every product
    category. they aren't interested in making a pen-enabled laptop. it
    never sold well and the market is tiny. it's a niche product that
    they're happy to leave to someone else. instead, apple has the ipad
    which is vastly more successful, so much so that everyone is trying to
    copy it.

    > I pointed out an example where they don't.


    there are always niche products.

    > You pointed out that
    > a third party kluges Macs to provide a keyboardless tablet, voiding the
    > Apple warranty in the process.


    modbook provides their own warranty in place of apple's.

    > If you are willing to go with something
    > that is hacked up by a third party and unsupported by Apple, then I can
    > just put OSX on my Thinkpad and end up with a more satisfactory result.


    os x on a thinkpad isn't the same as a modbook.
     
    nospam, May 13, 2013
    #53
  14. RichA

    J. Clarke Guest

    In article <2013051308265516807-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom>,
    savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com says...
    >
    > On 2013-05-13 06:58:37 -0700, "Mayayana" <> said:
    >
    > > | Adobe is going to put its software in the Cloud and charge you a user
    > > | fee to "rent" its use.
    > >
    > > I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but I just came
    > > across it at TheRegister:
    > >
    > > "One colleague has indeed checked with Adobe and been told that if you allow
    > > your subscription to drop then you'll not actually be able to open your old
    > > files."

    >
    > That seems strange, and probably only applies to processed files stored
    > in Adobe's "cloud" since once the files are processed and saved
    > (preferably to a HDD archive as well as the "Creative Cloud") There are
    > plenty of graphics editors which will even open current Adobe
    > proprietary file formats.
    > I also suspect that the Creative Suite users who migrate to the
    > "Creative Cloud" are still going to have a hard installation of the CS6
    > Suite on at least one work station.


    All users will have hard installations. The software will request a
    monthly check-in and will die only if three months go by without a
    successful check-in. I don't think that Adobe has any desire to
    maintain enough server capacity and bandwidth to let people run Premiere
    over the net on servers operated by Adobe.

    > Those who will be at the mercy of
    > Adobe will be those new to the game and those involved in part time
    > design work. I would recommend those part time designers and students
    > sitting at "Creative Cloud" work stations, also store their work on a
    > portable drive, or Dropbox.
    >
    > > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/05/13/adobe_cloud_pricing/
    > >
    > > As I understand it, the subscription version is also not
    > > "in the cloud". It gets installed locally. Which makes sense.
    > > Editing giant photos over the Internet would be a slow
    > > process. All taken together, Adobe's move can be seen
    > > as not only a step toward rental rather than sale, but also
    > > a move to define any work done with the tool as a part of
    > > their service, just as webmail companies claim co-copyright
    > > on all content.
    > >
    > > The Register article doesn't say how Adobe would prevent
    > > accessing one's files -- whether they just mean that one's
    > > online storage would be locked down or whether they intend
    > > to start using some sort of custom, proprietary file type that
    > > only Photoshop can open.

    >
    > I believe it means preventing access to files stored in the "cloud".


    Adobe has clearly stated their policies on this. Your local files will
    remain local files--if you have a non-Adobe application that will open
    them it will still open them. Files stored in the cloud will be
    acceesible for a grace period whose duration I forget. Once that grace
    period has elapsed they will still grant you something like 2 gig of
    free storage in the cloud--they did not state how they would determine
    which 2 gig of your cloud-stored content they would make available to
    you if you had more than 2 gig stored when the grace period expired.
     
    J. Clarke, May 13, 2013
    #54
  15. RichA

    android Guest

    In article <>,
    "J. Clarke" <> wrote:

    > In article <>, says...
    > >
    > > In article <>,
    > > notbob <> wrote:
    > >
    > > > On 2013-05-12, android <> wrote:
    > > >
    > > > > "J. Clarke" <> wrote:
    > > >
    > > > >> In article <>, says...
    > > >
    > > > >> > http://www.modbook.com/
    > > >
    > > > >> Which is not made by Apple.
    > > >
    > > > > Nooo... It''s a third party modification of an Apple product...
    > > >
    > > > ....and it's a damn sight far away from being affordable!
    > > >
    > > > <http://www.powerbookmedic.com/Modbook-Pro-23GHZ-Core-i5-120GB-SSD-4GB-RAM
    > > > -p-2
    > > > 5898.html>
    > > >
    > > > I'll jes buy a used intuos 3 fer $150 and run it on my linux desktop,
    > > > thank you very much.
    > > >
    > > > nb

    > >
    > > I'm not selling it. It's there if you need/want it. Some folks pay
    > > premium for tools that make them more productive.

    >
    > The argument presented was that Macs have lots of functionality that PCs
    > lack. I pointed out an example where they don't. You pointed out that
    > a third party kluges Macs to provide a keyboardless tablet, voiding the
    > Apple warranty in the process. If you are willing to go with something
    > that is hacked up by a third party and unsupported by Apple, then I can
    > just put OSX on my Thinkpad and end up with a more satisfactory result.


    Well, OSX on a Thinkpad tablet wouldn't be very hardware optimized at
    all, would it. Whatever... I'm sure some Hackintosh site would be happy
    happy to post your howto...
    --
    teleportation kills
     
    android, May 13, 2013
    #55
  16. RichA

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, J. Clarke
    <> wrote:

    > > > I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but I just came
    > > > across it at TheRegister:
    > > >
    > > > "One colleague has indeed checked with Adobe and been told that if you
    > > > allow your subscription to drop then you'll not actually be able to open your
    > > > old files."

    > >
    > > That seems strange, and probably only applies to processed files stored
    > > in Adobe's "cloud" since once the files are processed and saved
    > > (preferably to a HDD archive as well as the "Creative Cloud") There are
    > > plenty of graphics editors which will even open current Adobe
    > > proprietary file formats.
    > > I also suspect that the Creative Suite users who migrate to the
    > > "Creative Cloud" are still going to have a hard installation of the CS6
    > > Suite on at least one work station.

    >
    > All users will have hard installations. The software will request a
    > monthly check-in and will die only if three months go by without a
    > successful check-in.


    creative cloud checks approximately every 3 months for annual customers
    and every 1 month for monthly customers.

    however, he's saying that creative cloud users might *also* maintain a
    non-cloud version of cs6, just in case.
     
    nospam, May 13, 2013
    #56
  17. RichA

    nospam Guest

    In article <>, Alfred
    Molon <> wrote:

    > > Last November I was looking for a new lightweight computer.
    > > At the Apple store they advised me that their was no Apple product that
    > > would meet my needs. I wound up with my Lenovo.

    >
    > I was looking for an upgrade for my Lenovo X200 and found the X230.
    > Almost ok, if it were not for the fact that it only takes HDDs with a
    > 7mm height. These come in a maximum size of 500GB.


    that will change. there was a time when 500g was the maximum for 9mm
    drives.

    > Already now the 1TB
    > drive in my X200 is almost full. After I discovering that I was tempted
    > for a while to write Lenovo a letter full of insults. What a bunch of
    > clowns. They make a business notebook, but downgrade the max. HDD size.


    people want thin and light, not huge amounts of storage.

    do you really need 1 tb of stuff everywhere you go?

    put some stuff on an external drive (even a flash drive) or a server.

    > Oh, by the way, also all those ultrabooks are out of scope. You can't
    > change the battery


    the battery typically lasts 8+ hours per charge so there's almost never
    a need to change it. the batteries also have an expected lifetime of
    3-5 years, which is likely longer than the useful life of the laptop.

    should the battery prematurely fail, replace it. it's just a few
    screws. not a big deal. if it's under warranty, you won't need to do a
    thing (other than take it somewhere to be fixed).

    > and they do not take large HDDs.


    500g is large.

    > At the moment the only Lenovo unit which might be sort of suitable would
    > be the X200, which however Lenovo have discontinued.


    i just found a review for it, and it cost $1800?? wow.
     
    nospam, May 13, 2013
    #57
  18. RichA

    Tony Cooper Guest

    On Mon, 13 May 2013 05:29:33 -0700 (PDT), Whisky-dave
    <> wrote:

    >> >> And what, pray tell, do you think determines price tiers? And who
    >> >> determines what they will offer?

    >>
    >> >features do, not the logo on the box.

    >>
    >> Bizarre. Who determines what the features will be if not the people
    >>
    >> in the company whose logo it is? Features don't make any decisions.
    >>
    >> They are the result of decisions.

    >
    >What features can be offered is determined by price.


    That's a chicken-or-the-egg question. What features can be offered is
    determined by the price, or, what price can be offered is determined
    by the features.
    --
    Tony Cooper - Orlando FL
     
    Tony Cooper, May 13, 2013
    #58
  19. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    On 5/12/2013 10:24 PM, J. Clarke wrote:


    <>snip>
    >
    > Not really the same. I have an Intuos 3 and while it does tricks that a
    > Wacom tablet won't, the feedback is different. The tablet is more like
    > a baby Cintiq.
    >


    I use an Intuos IV, and wouldn't be without it. Aside from the touch
    screen, what advantage would there be to using a Cintiq. Wacom just came
    out with a small one for about $999.


    --
    PeterN
     
    PeterN, May 14, 2013
    #59
  20. RichA

    PeterN Guest

    On 5/13/2013 9:08 AM, Whisky-dave wrote:
    > On Sunday, May 12, 2013 4:51:27 PM UTC+1, PeterN wrote:
    >> On 5/12/2013 11:31 AM, nospam wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>>

    >>
    >>> pick the best tool for the job.

    >>
    >>>

    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> Yup!
    >>
    >> Last November I was looking for a new lightweight computer.
    >>
    >> At the Apple store they advised me that their was no Apple product that
    >>
    >> would meet my needs.

    >
    > You wanted it to keep crashing and get infrected by viruses on a regular basis?, well what did you expect ;-)
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Which one did you get and were they any other requirments that an Apple product couldn't meet which you required ?
    >
    > I've had a quick look and you're right going by the reviews thre's no way Apple could compete.
    >
    > http://shop.lenovo.com/gb/en/laptops/ideapad/u-series/u310/?sb=:000001D4:0001BEEE:#reviews
    >
    > --------------------------
    > Disappointment
    > Date: Dec 30, 2012
    > cons (3) Wireless card,Support,poor connectivity
    >
    > Considerably dissatisfied because of very poor wireless connection; wouldn't be such any issue had Lenovo been able to resolve. Unable to recommend the U310 and would discourage friends and family from purchasing.
    > --------------------------------
    >
    > http://shop.lenovo.com/gb/en/laptop...t|z1D630|s#/?facet-5=2&page-index=1&facet-2=3
    >
    > Tried to get a review of their top end £1,500 thinkpad X1 carbon
    >
    > Cons Screen size, resolution, display performance and price
    > And a months delivery, buyer sent it back in the end.
    >
    > I guess you're right the's no way Apple could compete with this :)
    >
    >>
    >> I wound up with my Lenovo.

    >
    > Are you sure you don;t mean you were wound up by your Lenovo.
    >


    My prior laptop was a Lenovo. for me the important features were a matte
    display screen, longer battery life and reasonably priced home service.
    I was able to customize my order to get only the features I wanted. I
    did have some issues with WiFi connectivity, which were solved through a
    software re-configuration.
    BTW I had previously reported that my machine shipped without one of the
    features I ordered. IBM service has agreed to correct the problem and is
    sending a service person to my home to do the install. for me this is a
    better solution than sending me a new machine.

    --
    PeterN
     
    PeterN, May 14, 2013
    #60
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