AA or CRV3 Lithium Ion v NiMh

Has anyone stumbled across a source for the Li-Ion CRV3 batteries
shown on the links below? (scroll down a bit to the portion of the
link in English)
http://www.digit.no/Nyheter/Teknologi/samsung_ipack.htm

There's a similar offering from "Power Vision"
http://pv.apitec.com.tw/product/RCR-V3/manual_e.asp

I'm trying to figure out if those actually exist and if they might be
a practical alternative to 2300 mah AA's which will soon be offered by
Sanyo (and others), The Sanyos in particular would seem to be a good
bet based on their past products.
http://www.sanyo.co.jp/koho/hypertext4-eng/0307news-e/0710-e.html

KF

 

I have also been looking for these and have come to the conclusion that
they are not available in the USA/Canada but apparently are in Europe
and Asia.

Found a place to get PowerVision if you want 1000 units.

Ed

 

Kenfberg asks:

Don't know if they exist or not, but when the claim NiMh hae memory effect,
they lose me.

If they are lying or mistaken, it makes no difference.

Charlie Self

"A people that values its privileges above its principles soon loses both."
Dwight D. Eisenhower, Inaugural Address, January 20, 1953

 

(Charlie Self) wrote in

Judging from the dicey grammer of the website, I doubt they know exactly
what 'memory effect' means. It's just a catch phrase.

Tim

 

As far as I know, all CRV3 batteries are disposable lithium. Makes a
nice backup battery because of long (10 years) shelf life, but rather
expensive to use for general purposes.

 

From my search it appears that they are available in Asia and Europe
but not USA/Canada.

Found a source for the PowerVison RCRV3 is you want 1000 units.

Ed

 

No, that's the whole point. Look at the links I provided. There are
rechargeable Li-Ion CRV3's being promoted, although they are still
somewhat obscure. I have no use for disposable lithiums but
rechargeable Li-Ions would seem to offer the possibility of being far
better than rechargeable NiMH's. That's what I'm trying to get a
handle on.
KF

 

No, that's the whole point. Look at the links I provided. There are

With the new 2200mah AAs currently available (and the 2300s soon-to-be), the
only real advantage I can see to the Li-Ion units would be lighter weight.
I picked up the 2200mah PowerEx units for my Oly 5050, and you simply can't
wear 'em out!!! They just go on and on and on and on...

I tool literally 3 gigs worth of photos (at SHQ mode) on just two sets of
batteries. Actually more like 1.5; the second set are still going strong.
Weird, but in a good way!

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
http://www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

 

Which could be VERY critical when carting them up a climb in a jersey
pocket;-)
Another benefit might be shelf life. In my case, where my camera takes
a pair of AA's, there might also be some slight convenience in not
having to keep track of pairs of batteries. And I agree that the newer
NiMH AA's are very good indeed. It's mind boggling that current
batteries are approaching DOUBLE the capacity of some I was using two
years ago.

But the big question that remains unanswered is whether there will be
any actual capacity benefit in the rechargeable CRV3's. Note that the
numerical comparisons given on the Power Vision website doesn't
specify the nature of the NiMH's being compared- they could be 1200 or
2200 mah.

I did find another Samsung link:
http://www.samsung-kameras.de/service/zubehoer.html
which can be run through
http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/tr
to get a semi-English version.


KF

 

thomasdistributing.com has rechargable Li-ion batteries in various formats,
and chargers for these batteries also.

 

Standard CRV3 batteries are not rechargeable, but they are not LiIon
chemistry either. There are about 5 different battery chemistries that
use lithium, all of which tend to get called "lithium" by people who
aren't being careful, but they're not the same.

The usual CRV3 is one of the 3 V non-rechargeable lithium chemistries,
probably lithium manganese dioxide. On the other hand, the particular
batteries being discussed in this thread *are* LiIon chemistry, which is
3.6 V per cell, and they *are* rechargeable. That's why they are
interesting.

Dave

 

Excellent advice. Might I respectfully suggest that you follow it.
You are confusing the commonly available LITHIUM CRV3's with the
relatively new and relatively unavailable LITHIUM ION CRV3's which
have the benefit of being rechargeable.

Come down off your high horse and go to this link which I noted at the
beginning of this thread:
http://pv.apitec.com.tw/product/RCR-V3/manual_e.asp

And while you are googling, if you discover any other links relating
to rechargeable CRV3's please let us know.

It never ceases to amaze me how certain people can be of what does NOT
exist simply because they have not yet encountered it. It also worries
me that Google is becoming the primary "index" of all the information
that is scattered about the web. Picture yourself trying to do
research at a "brick and mortar" library where the books were randomly
placed on the shelves and the card catalog had been stolen.

KF

 

Excuse me? Are you saying Google isn't a good index? If so, please
point me to one that is better..

I am concerned that cameras made to work well on 2 1.25V NIMH batteries
(2.5 V) would have a problem with a 3.6V Li-Ion battery. Certainly MY
camera manual warns that two AA alkaline batteries (3.2V) are not suitable.

 

The reason that alkalines aren't suitable for most digicams is not
because the voltage is higher, but because the output voltage drops too
much when you draw an amp or two of current. NiMH cells have much lower
internal resistance, and maintain their voltage under heavy load.

LiIon also has low internal resistance, so they work well powering
cameras. Whether the extra voltage is a problem depends on the camera
design. But a 3.6 V LiIon battery in the CR-V3 shape is going to be
used in cameras that are already designed to work properly with the 3 V
disposable CR-V3 - and possibly also a pair of NiMH cells at 2.4 V.

Dave

 

The manual for my camera is quite specific about the reason for not
using alkalines, and they mention that it is not designed for the higher
voltage. When a CRV3 battery is in the camera, the camera can sense it
and, presumably, manage the higher voltage. I don't intend to try any
battery not specifically recommended by the manufacturer. At least not
until I am ready to buy a new camera....

 

I pondered in message

While the folowing links aroused my interest:
http://asia.cnet.com/reviews/digitalcameras/news/story/0,39007239,39128661,00.htm
http://pv.apitec.com.tw/product/RCR-V3/manual_e.asp
http://www.fotosense.co.uk/samsung_sbp1103_battery_set.html

Those below, which suggest an equivalent US price in the range of
$62-88 have certainly dampened my enthusiasm.
http://www.directdial.com/ca/shopsamsung/item/11031.html
http://www.fotosense.co.uk/samsungpower.html
http://hifiphotovideo.kelkoo.fr/b/a...cle/lithium-ion/gamme/ACCESSOIREI/126301.html

Additionally, I looked carefully at the figures provided by Power
Vision on their page noted above which suggest that their rechargeable
"R-CRV3" is good for about 65% of the number of shots of an ordinary
CRV3.

For (rough) comparison I also noted the following from the manual for
a Minolta F200 available at.
http://www.minoltausa.com/eprise/main/MinoltaUSA/MUSAContent/CPG/CPG_SupportCenter/CPGSupport_Manual

"Battery performance (recording): Approximately 230 frames with a
CR-V3 battery, or 140 frames with 1850 mAh Ni-MH batteries: based on
Minolta's standard test method: LCD monitor on, fullsize images (2272
X 1704), standard image quality, no instant playback, no voice memo,
no full-time AF, no subject tracking AF, flash used with 50% of the
frames."

Using the Minolta standards puts 1850 mah NiMH at about 61% of a CRV3
or just under the R-CRV3. Which would suggest that 2100 mah and up
NiMH AA's would probably have the outright advantage in power and a
huge lead in power/cost ratio over the R-CRV3's.

My analysis is based only on a few arbitrary figures that I was able
to find and is provided for amusement purposes only. There's no
telling what the real-world figures may ultimately be.

KF

 

Totally off topic, but have you seen this?
http://www.chainlessbikecompany.co.uk/mainframe.htm

I saw it in someone's forum sig, only a few minutes ago!
Perhaps you could have a race?