50mm pictures with D300

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Sosumi, Jan 21, 2008.

  1. Sosumi

    DaveS Guest

    I'm a relative pup to photography. I've only been doing it for 8 years now.
    So to clarify the "Zooming with your feet" thing. I read that as a
    "creative analogy."

    That's how it was meant, right?

    Also, why do the Beatles start singing in my head whenever I read a post by
    you?

    :O)

    Have fun,
    Dave
     
    DaveS, Jan 22, 2008
    #21
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  2. True, but since we often use zoom not to acquire the specific kind of
    perspective which only a specific focal length can give, but simply to
    catch the object of interest at an image filling size, "zooming with
    the feet" is a perfectly intelligible and useful concept.
     
    Chris Malcolm, Jan 22, 2008
    #22
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  3. Sosumi

    PixelPix Guest

    This where everyone seem to get messed up. Focal length has no
    effect on perspective, so "acquire the specific kind of perspective
    which only a specific focal length can give" is a false statement,
    because it is only subject distance that effects perspective.
    "Filling the frame" is THE important concept here, as it maximises the
    use of the capture medium. "Filling the frame" can be achieved
    "Zooming" OR "Getting closer", but these are mutually exclusive and
    you can't combine the two and "Zoom closer".

    In a nutshell, this whole argument is simply started as a technical
    one based of the incorrect use of the term "Zoom" and it's kinda got
    confused from there.
     
    PixelPix, Jan 22, 2008
    #23
  4. Sosumi

    Dudley Hanks Guest

    The analogy came across crystal clear. And, I think that the 50mm challenge
    is a great one.

    Perhaps everyone on the group should take a few shots with that sorely
    neglected portal and post it somewhere. Subscribers to the group could
    choose the best one.

    Albeit, virtual accalaides just don't have the same effect as a big cheque.

    Take Care,
    Dudley
     
    Dudley Hanks, Jan 22, 2008
    #24
  5. Sosumi

    Dudley Hanks Guest

    In a nutshell, this whole argument is simply started as a technical
    one based of the incorrect use of the term "Zoom" and it's kinda got
    confused from there.

    I'd say it's a case of purists versus pragmatists.

    But, I'd like to know when the term zoom (which probably referred simply to
    the moving of one lens element away from another when applied to the first
    zoom lens) suddenly aquired such a rigidly legalistic and inflexible
    meaning.

    Is it against the law to think of getting closer to the subject as "zooming
    in on it"?

    Sometimes the mould of academia does more to kill creativity than it does to
    foster it.

    So Long Folks,
    Dudley

    Beauty isn't always found in the eye of the beholder. Sometimes, it can be
    found in the mind as well.
     
    Dudley Hanks, Jan 22, 2008
    #25
  6. It's both a creative analogy as well a way to take full advantage of your
    equipment's potential while maximizing yours.
    See above: My suggestion is to put one of your favorite prime lens on and
    go out for a day or two and see how much more you think about your shots and
    the fun you have doing it. If you don't have any primes just set your zoom
    to 35, 50, 85, or 105mm and lock it in place with some electrical tape and
    go out and have fun.
    I'm not sure if that is a compliment but I'll take it as one.





    Rita
     
    Rita Berkowitz, Jan 22, 2008
    #26
  7. Man! It's refreshing to see someone that knows how to read and comprehend
    while not wanting to get into mindless pissing contests.
    Don't be too sure, John has been struggling through life ever since the
    28.8K modem was replaced. He lost his 15-minutes of fame and has been very
    bitter ever since. Life moves on, John.
    Thanks for the support, but what you describe is standard operating
    procedures for Usenet.
    You got it! I love my primes on the D3. And many of these same people
    couldn't comprehend the enjoyment I had when using my Nikkors on the Mk III.
    Getting back to basics can be a very amazing and rewarding experience. Some
    people are simply frightened of manual focus.
    Absolutely! Most of the people fighting the concept are nothing more than
    mindless antagonists that very rarely if ever contribute images to the
    group.





    Rita
     
    Rita Berkowitz, Jan 22, 2008
    #27
  8. Sosumi

    DaveS Guest

    One of my recent self imposed creative chores, is to do some "classic"
    photographs. I've restricted myself to 8X10 format and B&W. Maybe I'll add
    the prime lens bit also. This thread did get me thinking.
    My version... :O)

    Have fun,
    Dave
     
    DaveS, Jan 22, 2008
    #28
  9. Sosumi

    Sosumi Guest


    Thanks Rita.
    My feet are not that great, but it's worth it.
    Ansel Adams had quite a few remarkable expressions that can help taking
    better pictures. When wise men talk, I always listen..

    "A good photograph is knowing where to stand."

    " In my mind's eye, I visualize how a particular... sight and feeling will
    appear on a print. If it excites me, there is a good chance it will make a
    good photograph. It is an intuitive sense, an ability that comes from a lot
    of practice. "

    "You don't take a photograph, you make it."

    "Sometimes I do get to places just when God's ready to have somebody click
    the shutter. "

    As an aid for my own photo's I look at the thumbnails more; if they look
    interesting, there's a chance so is the photo and vice versa.
    Also to look critical at your own pictures can be hazardous. So I look
    quickly at a picture and think if it's possible it was a holiday snapshot.
    If the answer is yes, the picture is not good.

    I'll write you to your mailbox about something that's not for the public.

    Thanks again!
     
    Sosumi, Jan 22, 2008
    #29
  10. Sosumi

    Dudley Hanks Guest

    Now, that's photography in a nutshell.

    If one can't see with the mind, it doesn't matter what technological marvel
    is plopped in front of the eye.

    Take Care,
    Dudley

    Beauty isn't always found in the eye of the beholder. Sometimes it can live
    in the mind as well.
     
    Dudley Hanks, Jan 22, 2008
    #30
  11. What is the "distance to the subject" in the case of a landscape
    photograph ranging from near foreground to distant horizon? Is the
    subject the person leaning against a tree six feet from the camera,
    or the full moon rising over the horizon, some quarter of a million
    miles away?

    The impossibility of answering such questions, plus the theory of
    perspective projection in images which began with the painters and
    geometers of the Renaissance, is the reason many of us consider that
    perspective is a property of the entire image, not just "the subject",
    and certainly not "distance to the subject".
    It's impossible to escape confusion if you think perspective has to do
    with "distance to the subject".
     
    Chris Malcolm, Jan 22, 2008
    #31
  12. Sosumi

    Dudley Hanks Guest

    In a nutshell, this whole argument is simply started as a technical

    It's interesting that, if you talk to 98% of the photographers and camera
    sales persons, they will think about "zooming" in terms of image
    magnification and not perspective. Why else does it say "4x" or "6x" or
    "10x" on the front of most point and shoot cameras? Is the manufacturer
    referring to a six times flattening effect of perspective as you zoom in? I
    think not.

    The remaining 2% of academic photographic purists seem to be confusing the
    telephoto effect of compressing perspective as the most identifiable
    characteristic of a "zoom" lens. True, its one characteristic, but it's
    neither the only characteristic, nor the most significant.

    Why is it that the 2% of academic purists must always think they are right
    and the 98% of practitioners must always be wrong?

    Take Care,
    Dudley

    Beauty isn't always found in the eye of the beholder. Sometimes, it is
    found in the mind as well.
     
    Dudley Hanks, Jan 22, 2008
    #32
  13. Just replace the aol with yahoo and I'll get it.




    Rita
     
    Rita Berkowitz, Jan 22, 2008
    #33
  14. Sosumi

    John Navas Guest

    When someone stoops to insults, all they really accomplish is to make it
    clear to others that they have nothing more meaningful to say and are
    insecure about their own abilities.
    You would of course know, as you've demonstrated in this post.
    Basics have nothing to do with the issue at hand. If you have a prime
    long lens at hand and time to use it, then you may have no need for a
    zoom (no matter how good) or to move closer to the subject (which may
    not be possible).
    So how exactly would you zoom with your feet in these cases:
    <http://img139.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p1040091q8fr5.jpg>
    <http://img408.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p1030792filteredcropge6.jpg>
    <http://img107.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p1030774filterednt2.jpg>
    <http://img256.imageshack.us/my.php?image=p1030708filteredmo8.jpg>
    Again, you would know, as you've demonstrated in this post.

    To suggest zooming with feet is a real substitute for lens zoom as a
    general proposition is both wrongheaded and offensive.
     
    John Navas, Jan 22, 2008
    #34
  15. Sosumi

    John Navas Guest

    Only in a crude snapshot sense -- the perspective difference is all too
    often dramatic.
     
    John Navas, Jan 22, 2008
    #35
  16. Sosumi

    John Navas Guest

    With all due respect, but statements are simply incorrect.

    See <http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/dof2.shtml> for how
    dramatic the difference can be.
     
    John Navas, Jan 22, 2008
    #36
  17. Sosumi

    John Navas Guest

    Unfortunately, you have his meaning backwards. Perspective was very
    important to AA, a big part of what he was talking about. In other
    words, pick where to stand based on composition and perspective, and
    then select the lens needed to get that image. Moving in or out to
    compensate for the wrong lens is not knowing where to stand.
     
    John Navas, Jan 22, 2008
    #37
  18. Sosumi

    Kinon O'Cann Guest

    Dudley, my friend, you can move you feet all you want, but your fixed focal
    length lens will not change focal length. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? DO YOU?
     
    Kinon O'Cann, Jan 22, 2008
    #38
  19. Sosumi

    John Navas Guest

    Apparently not. Or just too stubborn to admit it. ;)
     
    John Navas, Jan 22, 2008
    #39
  20. Sosumi

    JimKramer Guest

    Have you used or heard the term "hot water heater"? Why would you
    need to heat water that is already hot? And yet 98% of water heater
    users refer to the water heater as a "hot water heater."

    I hope the power of analogy is not lost on you. :)
     
    JimKramer, Jan 22, 2008
    #40
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