2nd RFD: rec.photo.equipment.sigma

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Sarah Molly, Jun 13, 2005.

  1. Sarah Molly

    Sarah Molly Guest

    REQUEST FOR DISCUSSION (RFD)
    unmoderated group rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    This is a formal Request For Discussion (RFD) for the creation of
    the unmoderated Usenet newsgroup rec.photo.equipment.sigma. This
    is not a Call for Votes (CFV); you cannot vote at this time.
    Procedural details are below.

    Newsgroup line:
    rec.photo.equipment.sigma Sigma photography equipment.

    CHANGES FROM FIRST RFD:

    1) Newsgroup line has been changed.
    2) RATIONALE has been changed.
    3) Ban on *all* advertising has been added to charter.

    RATIONALE: rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    The objective of this proposal is to create a newgroup for specialized
    discussions of Sigma photography equipment. Sigma owners and future
    owners would greatly benefit from having access to an isolated
    newsgroup that is not dominated by Canon and Nikon users. If
    created, RPES will cater to both digital and film shooters under
    the same umbrella, which is useful because Sigma digital and 35mm
    camera bodies share a common SA* lens mount and they use the same
    accessories.

    CHARTER: rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    The group rec.photo.equipment.sigma is for the discussion of Sigma
    digital and film photography equipment. Advertisements are not
    permitted. Binary files other than digital signatures or X-Faces
    are not permitted.

    END CHARTER.

    PROCEDURE:

    This is a request for discussion, not a call for votes. In this
    phase of the process, any potential problems with the proposed
    newsgroups should be raised and resolved. The discussion period
    will continue for a minimum of 21 days (starting from when the first
    RFD for this proposal is posted to news.announce.newgroups), after
    which a Call For Votes (CFV) may be posted by a neutral vote taker
    if the discussion warrants it. Please do not attempt to vote until
    this happens.

    All discussion of this proposal should be posted to news.groups.

    This RFD attempts to comply fully with the Usenet newsgroup creation
    guidelines outlined in "How to Create a New Usenet Newsgroup" and
    "How to Format and Submit a New Group Proposal". Please refer to
    these documents if you have any questions about the process.

    DISTRIBUTION:

    This RFD has been posted to:

    news.announce.newgroups
    news.groups
    rec.photo.digital
    rec.photo.equipment.35mm
    rec.photo.digital.slr-systems

    Proponent: Sarah Molly <>
     
    Sarah Molly, Jun 13, 2005
    #1
    1. Advertisements

  2. I really can't see this proposal getting enough legitimate votes to
    pass, but more unusual things have happened before. I will abstain; I
    don't own anything made by Sigma, and I probably never will unless
    Sigma buys Nikon.
     
    Woodchuck Bill, Jun 13, 2005
    #2
    1. Advertisements

  3. Sarah Molly

    Steve Young Guest

    Like 300+ votes for a new rangefinder group?
    Those were some ardent fans ;)
    Bwahahahaha!
     
    Steve Young, Jun 13, 2005
    #3
  4. Sarah Molly

    G.T. Guest

    Irrelevant, unneccesary, and most importantly redundant.

    Opponent: Greg Thomas

    Greg
     
    G.T., Jun 13, 2005
    #4
  5. Woodchuck Bill wrote:
    []
    Same here.

    Had this group been in the .digital hierarchy I would have been more
    likely to vote against.

    David
     
    David J Taylor, Jun 14, 2005
    #5
  6. Sarah Molly

    Bill Aten Guest

    FIRST CALL FOR VOTES (of 2)
    unmoderated group rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    Newsgroups line:
    rec.photo.equipment.sigma Sigma photography equipment.

    Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 5 Sep 2005.

    This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party. Questions about
    the proposed group should be directed to the proponent.

    Proponent: Sarah Molly <>
    Votetaker: Bill Aten <>

    RATIONALE: rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    The objective of this proposal is to create a newgroup for specialized
    discussions of Sigma photography equipment. Sigma owners and future
    owners would greatly benefit from having access to an isolated
    newsgroup that is not dominated by Canon and Nikon users. If
    created, RPES will cater to both digital and film shooters under
    the same umbrella, which is useful because Sigma digital and 35mm
    camera bodies share a common SA* lens mount and they use the same
    accessories.

    CHARTER: rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    The group rec.photo.equipment.sigma is for the discussion of Sigma
    digital and film photography equipment. Advertisements are not
    permitted. Binary files other than digital signatures or X-Faces
    are not permitted.

    END CHARTER.

    HOW TO VOTE:

    In order to vote on this proposal you will first need to request a registered
    ballot. This is accomplished by sending an email to the address specified
    below from the email account that you intend to use when you submit the ballot
    for processing. The Subject: and body of the message does not matter. They
    can both be blank (preferred) if your software will allow that.

    PLEASE, do not send this entire message back to me as this mail is archived.

    Mail your ballot request to: <>
    Just "replying" to this message should work, but check the "To:" line.

    When your email message is received, a reply message will be sent to you with
    further instructions regarding how to vote. You will also receive a copy of
    the CFV which will contain a ballot that is registered for use only for this
    CFV, and only when submitted from the exact same address that originally
    requested it.

    IMPORTANT VOTING PROCEDURE NOTES:

    Standard Guidelines for voting apply. Only one vote per person, no
    more than one vote per account. Votes must be mailed directly from
    the voter to the votetaker. Anonymous, forwarded, or proxy votes
    are not valid. Votes mailed by WWW/HTML/CGI forms are considered
    to be anonymous votes.

    Vote counting is automated. Failure to follow these directions may
    mean that your vote does not get counted. If you do not receive an
    acknowledgment of your vote within three days, contact the votetaker
    about the problem. It's your responsibility to make sure your vote
    is registered correctly. Duplicate votes are resolved in favor of
    the most recent valid vote. Names, addresses, and votes of all voters
    will be published in the final voting RESULT posting.

    DO NOT redistribute this CFV in any manner whatsoever. The purpose of
    a Usenet vote is to determine the genuine interest of persons who would
    read a proposed newsgroup. Soliciting votes from disinterested parties
    defeats this purpose. Only the votetaker, the news.announce.newgroups
    moderator, and the proponent (if specifically authorized by the votetaker)
    are permitted to distribute copies of this CFV.

    Distribution of pre-marked or otherwise modified copies of this CFV is
    generally considered voting fraud and should be reported immediately to
    the votetaker or the UVV <>. In cases where voting fraud
    is determined to have occurred, it is standard operating procedure to
    delete ALL votes submitted by the violator. When in doubt, ask the
    votetaker.

    DISTRIBUTION:

    The only official sources for copies of this CFV are the locations listed
    below, the UVV web site at http://www.uvv.org/, and the votetaker's e-mail
    CFV server which can be reached at <>.

    This CFV has been posted to the following newsgroups:

    news.announce.newgroups
    news.groups
    rec.photo.digital
    rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
    rec.photo.equipment.35mm
     
    Bill Aten, Aug 15, 2005
    #6
  7. Sarah Molly

    Bill Aten Guest

    LAST CALL FOR VOTES (of 2)
    unmoderated group rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    Newsgroups line:
    rec.photo.equipment.sigma Sigma photography equipment.

    Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 5 Sep 2005.

    This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party. Questions about
    the proposed group should be directed to the proponent.

    Proponent: Sarah Molly <>
    Votetaker: Bill Aten <>

    RATIONALE: rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    The objective of this proposal is to create a newgroup for specialized
    discussions of Sigma photography equipment. Sigma owners and future
    owners would greatly benefit from having access to an isolated
    newsgroup that is not dominated by Canon and Nikon users. If
    created, RPES will cater to both digital and film shooters under
    the same umbrella, which is useful because Sigma digital and 35mm
    camera bodies share a common SA* lens mount and they use the same
    accessories.

    CHARTER: rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    The group rec.photo.equipment.sigma is for the discussion of Sigma
    digital and film photography equipment. Advertisements are not
    permitted. Binary files other than digital signatures or X-Faces
    are not permitted.

    END CHARTER.

    HOW TO VOTE:

    In order to vote on this proposal you will first need to request a registered
    ballot. This is accomplished by sending an email to the address specified
    below from the email account that you intend to use when you submit the ballot
    for processing. The Subject: and body of the message does not matter. They
    can both be blank (preferred) if your software will allow that.

    PLEASE, do not send this entire message back to me as this mail is archived.

    Mail your ballot request to: <>
    Just "replying" to this message should work, but check the "To:" line.

    When your email message is received, a reply message will be sent to you with
    further instructions regarding how to vote. You will also receive a copy of
    the CFV which will contain a ballot that is registered for use only for this
    CFV, and only when submitted from the exact same address that originally
    requested it.

    IMPORTANT VOTING PROCEDURE NOTES:

    Standard Guidelines for voting apply. Only one vote per person, no
    more than one vote per account. Votes must be mailed directly from
    the voter to the votetaker. Anonymous, forwarded, or proxy votes
    are not valid. Votes mailed by WWW/HTML/CGI forms are considered
    to be anonymous votes.

    Vote counting is automated. Failure to follow these directions may
    mean that your vote does not get counted. If you do not receive an
    acknowledgment of your vote within three days, contact the votetaker
    about the problem. It's your responsibility to make sure your vote
    is registered correctly. Duplicate votes are resolved in favor of
    the most recent valid vote. Names, addresses, and votes of all voters
    will be published in the final voting RESULT posting.

    DO NOT redistribute this CFV in any manner whatsoever. The purpose of
    a Usenet vote is to determine the genuine interest of persons who would
    read a proposed newsgroup. Soliciting votes from disinterested parties
    defeats this purpose. Only the votetaker, the news.announce.newgroups
    moderator, and the proponent (if specifically authorized by the votetaker)
    are permitted to distribute copies of this CFV.

    Distribution of pre-marked or otherwise modified copies of this CFV is
    generally considered voting fraud and should be reported immediately to
    the votetaker or the UVV <>. In cases where voting fraud
    is determined to have occurred, it is standard operating procedure to
    delete ALL votes submitted by the violator. When in doubt, ask the
    votetaker.

    DISTRIBUTION:

    The only official sources for copies of this CFV are the locations listed
    below, the UVV web site at http://www.uvv.org/, and the votetaker's e-mail
    CFV server which can be reached at <>.

    This CFV has been posted to the following newsgroups:

    news.announce.newgroups
    news.groups
    rec.photo.digital
    rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
    rec.photo.equipment.35mm

    rec.photo.equipment.sigma - Ack Bounce List
     
    Bill Aten, Aug 28, 2005
    #7
  8. Sarah Molly

    Bill Aten Guest

    RESULT
    unmoderated group rec.photo.equipment.sigma fails 9:28

    Voting closed at 23:59:59 UTC, 5 Sep 2005.

    This vote was conducted by a neutral third party. Questions about the
    proposed group should be directed to the proponent.

    Proponent: Sarah Molly <>
    Votetaker: Bill Aten <>

    There were 37 valid YES/NO votes submitted during the voting period. Each
    proposed newsgroup, in order to pass, must have at least 2/3 YES votes and at
    least 50 more YES than NO votes. The results are as follows:

    rec.photo.equipment.sigma results - 37 valid (YES & NO) votes

    Yes No : 2/3? >50? : Pass? : Group
    ---- ---- : ---- ---- : ----- : -------------------------------------------
    9 28 : No No : No : rec.photo.equipment.sigma
    5 abstaining votes

    The proposal failed.

    There is a five day discussion period after these results are posted.
    Unless serious and significant allegations of voting irregularities are
    raised, the proposal may not be voted on again for six months.

    The remainder of the RESULT contains:
    Newsgroups Line
    Rationale
    Charter
    Ballot Submission Irregularities
    Final Voting Acknowledgements

    NEWSGROUPS LINE:
    rec.photo.equipment.sigma Sigma photography equipment.

    RATIONALE: rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    The objective of this proposal is to create a newgroup for specialized
    discussions of Sigma photography equipment. Sigma owners and future
    owners would greatly benefit from having access to an isolated
    newsgroup that is not dominated by Canon and Nikon users. If
    created, RPES will cater to both digital and film shooters under
    the same umbrella, which is useful because Sigma digital and 35mm
    camera bodies share a common SA* lens mount and they use the same
    accessories.

    CHARTER: rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    The group rec.photo.equipment.sigma is for the discussion of Sigma
    digital and film photography equipment. Advertisements are not
    permitted. Binary files other than digital signatures or X-Faces
    are not permitted.

    END CHARTER.

    BALLOT SUBMISSION IRREGULARITIES:

    Ballots invalidated: 3

    3 - Anonymous vote - true source of vote anonymised

    (Note: Anonymous voters were notified of the problem and reminded that
    they could request a new ballot using a different email address)

    FINAL VOTING ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS:

    rec.photo.equipment.sigma - Final Voter List

    NOTE: This is not [to be used as] a mailing list. The email addresses
    are provided only to help verify the validity of the interest poll.

    Voted YES
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    bouvin/daimi$au?kd Niels Olof Bouvin
    deepgeek#bestweb'nte Scotty Fitzgerald
    devnull|vianet*ac Trevor Tymchuk
    frank'fsheff$cmo Frank ess
    michel/baron$videotron#ac Michel Baron
    nicolesgrumpy^aol/cmo Douglas O'Brien
    pan?syix#cmo Pan
    simon'darkmere*gen%zn Simon Lyall
    ymulakaj#yahoo*rf Yves Mulakaj

    Voted NO
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    alan=browne*videotron~ac Alan Browne
    bmailman#sfo$cmo Brian Mailman
    bwr607/hotmail*cmo Woodchuck Bill
    cnw+usenet$pobox'cmo Neil Woods
    david-taylor$blueyonder!co!ku David J Taylor
    fort514|mac*cmo Charles
    gburnore#databasix%cmo Gary L. Burnore
    gprrspw|mindspring%cmo G.P. Ryan
    hezu=iki#if Heikki Kantola
    jdunn'volcano^nte John Dunn
    kowallek#iglou*cmo Dennis Kowallek
    mikael/segercrantz%pp1#inet?if Mikael Segercrantz
    mirwin/fas$harvard%eud Mark Irwin
    patrick|texier*niof Patrick Texier
    patrick_mailinglists|d26%nte pmp
    pete=fenelon$cmo Pete Fenelon
    phil=rahul$nte Phil Gustafson
    pjr?pjr-online*fsnet|co!ku Peter J Ross
    psmyth/gmx$nte Peter Smyth
    rpe-sigmavote^billmail#scconsult#cmo Bill Cole
    ru!igarashi*usask/ac ru igarashi
    sigma-ballot$hnareid|me!ku Helge Nareid
    stainles#realtime/nte Dwight Brown
    stephen|stevedunn/ac Steve Dunn
    tingrinfan$comcast%nte Sam Seiber
    vm9p8lm02~sneakemail|cmo David Harmon
    vpdura/hiwaay^nte Vic Dura
    wwfiv'comcast^nte William W. Farley IV

    Voted ABSTAIN
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    aahz=pobox$cmo Aahz
    ceri=submonkey*nte Ceri Davies
    mbeaudoin~scintrextrace!cmo Marcel Beaudoin
    mmontcha#oregonvos%nte Matthew Montchalin
    van?ette#inter*nl/nte Robert-Jan van Ette
     
    Bill Aten, Sep 13, 2005
    #8
  9. Excellent result. :)
     
    Woodchuck Bill, Sep 13, 2005
    #9
  10. Sarah Molly

    BowTie Guest

    And on the flip side, it's perdy incredible how popular the range finder group
    is ;) How many did it win by? Seems like it was a landslide victory.

    :)x
     
    BowTie, Sep 16, 2005
    #10
  11. Sarah Molly

    Bill Aten Guest

    RESULT
    unmoderated group rec.photo.equipment.sigma fails 9:28

    Voting closed at 23:59:59 UTC, 5 Sep 2005.

    This vote was conducted by a neutral third party. Questions about the
    proposed group should be directed to the proponent.

    Proponent: Sarah Molly <>
    Votetaker: Bill Aten <>

    There were 37 valid YES/NO votes submitted during the voting period. Each
    proposed newsgroup, in order to pass, must have at least 2/3 YES votes and at
    least 100 more YES than NO votes. The results are as follows:

    rec.photo.equipment.sigma results - 37 valid (YES & NO) votes

    Yes No : 2/3? >100? : Pass? : Group
    ---- ---- : ---- ----- : ----- : -------------------------------------------
    9 28 : No No : No : rec.photo.equipment.sigma
    5 abstaining votes

    The proposal failed.

    There is a five day discussion period after these results are posted.
    Unless serious and significant allegations of voting irregularities are
    raised, the proposal may not be voted on again for six months.

    The remainder of the RESULT contains:
    Newsgroups Line
    Rationale
    Charter
    Ballot Submission Irregularities
    Final Voting Acknowledgements

    NEWSGROUPS LINE:
    rec.photo.equipment.sigma Sigma photography equipment.

    RATIONALE: rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    The objective of this proposal is to create a newgroup for specialized
    discussions of Sigma photography equipment. Sigma owners and future
    owners would greatly benefit from having access to an isolated
    newsgroup that is not dominated by Canon and Nikon users. If
    created, RPES will cater to both digital and film shooters under
    the same umbrella, which is useful because Sigma digital and 35mm
    camera bodies share a common SA* lens mount and they use the same
    accessories.

    CHARTER: rec.photo.equipment.sigma

    The group rec.photo.equipment.sigma is for the discussion of Sigma
    digital and film photography equipment. Advertisements are not
    permitted. Binary files other than digital signatures or X-Faces
    are not permitted.

    END CHARTER.

    BALLOT SUBMISSION IRREGULARITIES:

    Ballots invalidated: 3

    3 - Anonymous vote - true source of vote anonymised

    (Note: Anonymous voters were notified of the problem and reminded that
    they could request a new ballot using a different email address)

    FINAL VOTING ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS:

    rec.photo.equipment.sigma - Final Voter List

    NOTE: This is not [to be used as] a mailing list. The email addresses
    are provided only to help verify the validity of the interest poll.

    Voted YES
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    bouvin/daimi$au?kd Niels Olof Bouvin
    deepgeek#bestweb'nte Scotty Fitzgerald
    devnull|vianet*ac Trevor Tymchuk
    frank'fsheff$cmo Frank ess
    michel/baron$videotron#ac Michel Baron
    nicolesgrumpy^aol/cmo Douglas O'Brien
    pan?syix#cmo Pan
    simon'darkmere*gen%zn Simon Lyall
    ymulakaj#yahoo*rf Yves Mulakaj

    Voted NO
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    alan=browne*videotron~ac Alan Browne
    bmailman#sfo$cmo Brian Mailman
    bwr607/hotmail*cmo Woodchuck Bill
    cnw+usenet$pobox'cmo Neil Woods
    david-taylor$blueyonder!co!ku David J Taylor
    fort514|mac*cmo Charles
    gburnore#databasix%cmo Gary L. Burnore
    gprrspw|mindspring%cmo G.P. Ryan
    hezu=iki#if Heikki Kantola
    jdunn'volcano^nte John Dunn
    kowallek#iglou*cmo Dennis Kowallek
    mikael/segercrantz%pp1#inet?if Mikael Segercrantz
    mirwin/fas$harvard%eud Mark Irwin
    patrick|texier*niof Patrick Texier
    patrick_mailinglists|d26%nte pmp
    pete=fenelon$cmo Pete Fenelon
    phil=rahul$nte Phil Gustafson
    pjr?pjr-online*fsnet|co!ku Peter J Ross
    psmyth/gmx$nte Peter Smyth
    rpe-sigmavote^billmail#scconsult#cmo Bill Cole
    ru!igarashi*usask/ac ru igarashi
    sigma-ballot$hnareid|me!ku Helge Nareid
    stainles#realtime/nte Dwight Brown
    stephen|stevedunn/ac Steve Dunn
    tingrinfan$comcast%nte Sam Seiber
    vm9p8lm02~sneakemail|cmo David Harmon
    vpdura/hiwaay^nte Vic Dura
    wwfiv'comcast^nte William W. Farley IV

    Voted ABSTAIN
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    aahz=pobox$cmo Aahz
    ceri=submonkey*nte Ceri Davies
    mbeaudoin~scintrextrace!cmo Marcel Beaudoin
    mmontcha#oregonvos%nte Matthew Montchalin
    van?ette#inter*nl/nte Robert-Jan van Ette
     
    Bill Aten, Sep 16, 2005
    #11
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