20D or 5D

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Rob, Aug 23, 2005.

  1. Your are talking about measurement errors. If you take a picture in fog,
    afer sunset, etc. that includes a white piece of paper you still need a
    camera that is capable of capturing 100% reflectance. If is only when you are
    taking pictures of dull gray objects that you can leave out one or more stops
    of head room.

    I can't see the point of a setting that cannot record 100% reflectance.
     
    Philip Homburg, Aug 25, 2005
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  2. Rob

    Leonard Guest

    Skip M wrote:

    Just like the EOS-3.

    - Len
     
    Leonard, Aug 25, 2005
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  3. Rob

    Tony Polson Guest


    Everything Doug tries to "quantify" seems to end up proving precisely
    the opposite of Doug's opinion.
     
    Tony Polson, Aug 25, 2005
  4. Perhaps you should hold your breath, 10 minutes should do.
     
    Paul Schilter, Aug 25, 2005
  5. Rob

    eawckyegcy Guest

    Paul Schilter top posts like a moron:
    Hey, you can drop dead too. No skin off my nose, luser.
     
    eawckyegcy, Aug 25, 2005
  6. Rob

    Tony Polson Guest


    No white paper has *ever* been manufactured that has 100% reflectance.

    The nearest you will get to 100% reflectance is a ...

    .... well, I'll just leave it to you to figure that out.

    ;-)
     
    Tony Polson, Aug 25, 2005
  7. Rob

    JPS Guest

    In message <q3cki3jdps[email protected]_id.stereo.hq.phicoh.net>,
     
    JPS, Aug 26, 2005
  8. Rob

    chrlz Guest

    Note the usual Pixby/Douglas MacDonald approach - as soon as he is
    called on for his usual mistakes and misinfornation, he immediately
    starts slinging the insults and killfiling.

    If you can't debate, insult and change the subject. That's Douglas'
    motto.
     
    chrlz, Aug 26, 2005
  9. Rob

    Skip M Guest

    And the EOS5, too, if I remember right. Now that you mention it...
     
    Skip M, Aug 26, 2005
  10. Rob

    Skip M Guest

    Because the edges are already less sharp than the center. So poor focus, or
    camera shake, or whatever, would diminish the usability by the same amount.
     
    Skip M, Aug 26, 2005
  11. Maybe a 'fog mode' is a good option for a consumer camera, but normally,
    you compensate for errors in exposure meter using the exposure compensation
    setting. There is no point in adding artificially low ISO settings just for
    cases where the camera tends to underexpose.
    It isn't when you are talking about ISO settings. Reflected light should be
    measured using an 18% gray card. Of course you can maximize to use of the
    sensor by measuring the high lights using a spot meter, and setting exposure
    for those. But that only works if the sensor can record 100% reflectance.
    The assumption was that the ISO 50 setting would result in saturation at 50%
    reflectance (i.e. ISO 100 is the lowest setting that actually works, and
    ISO 50 is a 1 stop pull).

    Such a setting is useful only if the highlights are at least one stop below
    'white'.
     
    Philip Homburg, Aug 26, 2005
  12. Rob

    hyperoglyphe Guest

    I don't mind picking up the Pixby slack in a flame grilling. I've never
    owned a Nikon.

    Tell me the letter in my hand from Canon Australia (dated a day after I
    attended) estimating the cleaning of my 8 month old 20D for AU$250 is
    reasonable. This is now day 5 since I dropped it in (to the Canon Australia
    service centre in this state) and all they can say is that it may take more
    than 14 days to do anything about it.

    2 weeks must account for the ultra slo-mo sqeeze on a blower brush.

    The first warranty repair took 6 weeks. Pity that didn't work.

    Abuse the crap out of me if you want, I'm fine with that. I certainly give
    credit where due.

    The Canon 20D gives spectacular results when it works...

    Dave
     
    hyperoglyphe, Aug 26, 2005
  13. Rob

    Alfred Molon Guest

    Obviously an external flash is better, but you might not always carry it
    with you.
     
    Alfred Molon, Aug 26, 2005
  14. Rob

    JPS Guest

    In message <[email protected]_id.stereo.hq.phicoh.net>,
     
    JPS, Aug 26, 2005
  15. Rob

    Jeremy Nixon Guest

    In what way is it wrong? I can't see any way in which a "pulled" ISO 50
    isn't just a more confusing way to dial in +1 EC.
     
    Jeremy Nixon, Aug 26, 2005
  16. Rob

    JPS Guest

    In message <>,
    It is wrong in assuming that by pulling one stop, you can not record
    100% reflectance, as metered with a grey card with an external meter or
    an incident reading.

    Most DSLRs will record up to at least 200% reflectance in the green
    channel, 320% reflectance in the blue channel, and 400% reflectance in
    the red channel, without pulling. Pulling by a stop halves those
    figures.
    It depends on your intentions. If you're shooting a slide, or a JPEG in
    which you have no control over the conversion, then EC can be used to
    register the tonal ranges in a way as to reflect the scene as viewed by
    a human. If you use +1 EC to get a lower exposure index, then you
    really *ARE* shooting at that lower ISO; you're simply over-riding the
    logistics of the camera settings.
    --
     
    JPS, Aug 26, 2005
  17. Rob

    Mark² Guest

    When you dial in +1 compensation, your camera changes either shutter speed
    or aperture, which may not be a good idea.

    What you COULD do is under expose by one stop, and then pull it back up in
    RAW conversion--which is essentially the same as pushing film.
    I've done this with amazingly good results.
     
    Mark², Aug 27, 2005
  18. Rob

    JPS Guest

    In message <[email protected]>,
    Or, it may be exactly part of the shooting at ISO 50 experience.
    Nowhere near as good as pulling by a stop, though. Pulling always
    results in less quantization or posterization, and less noise; pushing
    gives more of all.

    --
     
    JPS, Aug 27, 2005
  19. Rob

    Mark² Guest

    But pulling by a stop assumes that you can still get a usable shutter speed.
    If you're shooting anything with movement, that could be restrictive,
    couldn't it?
     
    Mark², Aug 27, 2005
  20. Rob

    JPS Guest

    In message <[email protected]>,
    Of course it could. You shoot at ISO 50 in ISO 50 conditions. Who
    suggested otherwise?
    --
     
    JPS, Aug 27, 2005
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