Zone alarm made me angry

Discussion in 'Computer Support' started by Fred37, Apr 5, 2007.

  1. Fred37

    Fred37 Guest

    I am running the free Zone Alarm on a Toshiba Laptop, P4, Windows XP
    with all of the latest updates. Also Office 2000 using Outlook for
    email.
    This last update of ZA added an email scan to my comuter.
    It is slow, annoying, and slows down everything. It is persistent and
    I can't get rid of it. In my opinion Zone Alarm now belongs in the
    category of malicious software.
    What else can I use so that I can rid my computer of this awful Zone
    Alarm.
    Fred
     
    Fred37, Apr 5, 2007
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Fred37

    sittingduck Guest

    Fred37 wrote:

    > What else can I use so that I can rid my computer of this awful Zone
    > Alarm.


    Zone Alarm is the AOL of firewalls. Good luck getting completley rid of it.
    Re-installing your operating system is probably going to be the easiest way.

    Extended Zone Alarm Uninstall/Outpost Install Instructions
    A few preliminary steps to follow BEFORE uninstallation begins:
    P1. Download a NEW Copy of Outpost from Agnitum.
    P2. If applicable, make sure that you do the uninstallation and the installation with a User account having administrative rights.
    P3. Make sure that Zone Alarm Firewall and the Zone Alarm service are stopped before starting the uninstallation. Right-click on the Zone Alarm icon and 'Shutdown Zone Alarm (Pro)'.
    P4. Go to JV16 Power Tools and download the jv16 Power Tools application. This is an excellent application for getting eliminating registry remnants from old uninstalled programs. Install this on your PC.
    P5. Open Windows Explorer and from the menu choose Tools -> Folder Options. Click on the 'View' tab and make sure that Windows Explorer is setup to view hidden files and folders.
    Uninstallation (after completing steps 1 through 5 above):
    1. Completely follow the Zone Alarm instructions as outlined in Zone Alarm Uninstallation - Zone Labs Customer Care to completely uninstall Zone Alarm and clean the file system.
    2. Clean all files out of C:\Windows\Temp - Covered in link from Zone Labs, but I recommend cleaning the whole Temp directory. NOTE: Files in you temp directories are safe to delete. If Windows is using any specific file it will not allow its deletion and you will get an error message but please delete all others. Any temp file that may be needed later will be regenerated by that specific application when required.
    3. Clean all files out of C:\Windows\Prefetch - Covered in link from Zone Labs, but I recommend cleaning the whole Prefetch directory. Deleted Prefetch files will be re-created as necessary the next time you boot your PC.
    4. Clean all files out of C:\Documents and Settings\youraccount\Local Settings\Temp. The exact path may vary slightly with your Operating System. The point is to try and clean your User accounts Temp directory. This will probably not be applicable on single user 95, 98, or Me systems. Alternatively, you can choose Start -> Accessories -> System Tools -> Disk Cleanup. Just check all of the items and continue the cleaning process. NOTE: Files in you temp directories are safe to delete. If Windows is using any specific file it will not allow its deletion and you will get an error message but please delete all others. Any temp file that may be needed later will be regenerated by that specific application when required.
    5. jv16 Power Tools: Completing Registry Cleaning (THIS IS ENTIRELY OPTIONAL, this step is optional but may be potentially helpful with difficult uninstallation problems. I strongly recommend it.)
    a) Download and install jv16 Power Tools. This should have already been done if you followed the preliminary steps.
    b) Run jv16 Power Tools and click on the 'Registry Tool' button. That will open the main registry tool window.
    c) Now you should see a list of applications that are documented in the registry. Sort this list alphabetically by clicking on the 'Author' item just above the column with the application names. If it appears in reverse alphabetical order, just click on 'Author' one more time and the list of applications will appear alphabetically.
    d) Scroll down until you see the Zone Labs or Zone Alarm entries. Place a check in the box next to every entry with 'Zone Labs' or 'Zone Alarm' appearing either in the 'Author' or 'Software' column. You may need to scroll down. While some entries are recognized as being authored by Zone Labs, others may not. So it is important to scroll through the whole list and mark all entries related to Zone Labs/Zone Alarm. If you are not sure of an entry, do not place a check there. Be sure to look closely at the [Unknown] entries at the end of the list to see if an Agnitum entry is listed there.
    e) After you have found all of the Zone Alarm entries and placed a check in each of the boxes next to them, click the 'Remove' button located at the bottom of the Registry Tools window.
    f) After removal of the application entries is completed, choose Tools -> Registry Cleaner from the menu.
    g) The Registry Cleaner will appear with an 'Options' screen. Please ensure that ONLY the 'I want to verify deleted entries' is checked. NO other option should be checked. Make a setting of 'Sometimes' under 'Update screen while scanning'. When finished with this, press 'Continue'.
    h) Make sure that ALL items are checked under 'Select performed scanned'.
    i) Press the 'Start' button to execute the scan.
    j) After the scan has completed, choose Select -> All from the menu.
    k) Click on the 'Remove' button in the lower right corner of the Registry Cleaner window.
    l) After completing this process, click the 'Close' button to close the Registry Cleaner window.
    m) Then click 'Close' to close the Registry Tools window.
    n) Finally, click 'Exit' to close jv16 Power Tools.
    o) Reboot your PC.
    6. Upon successful system startup, install Outpost using the new installation file that you downloaded in the preliminary steps above.
    At this point, Outpost should function properly. I have personally used
    every step noted to you in this post without incident. I hope that these
    steps help you solve your problem. The same steps can and should be
    repeated in Safe Mode if you are having difficulty. WHENEVER UPGRADING OR
    INSTALLING OUTPOST, I RECOMMEND THE FOLLOWING MEASURES. THESE ARE GOOD
    GENERAL RULES WHEN INSTALLING ANY PROGRAM, BUT FOLLOWING ALL OF THEM MAY
    NOT BE REQUIRED: 1. Make sure that your anti-virus is disabled.
    2. Make sure that your anti-trojan protection is disabled.
    3. Make sure no other applications are running.
    4. Make sure that you disable any sandbox or system access protection application.
    5. Make sure that you disable any ad-monitoring software or proxies.
    6. Make sure that any internet connection information program, packet sniffer, or capture utility is disabled. These should not be used with Outpost at all.
    7. If upgrading using the Auto Update in Outpost feature does not work properly, shutdown and exit Outpost and run the update from the Start Menu.
    8. You must be logged in as Administrator or to any account with Administrative privileges before attempting to install or update Outpost.
    If the steps above do not help, we will continue to help to the limits of
    our ability here in the forum. However, it may become necessary for you to
    contact Agnitum directly if problems with Outpost still exist after
    following this Uninstall/Install procedure and the associated guidelines.
     
    sittingduck, Apr 5, 2007
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Fred37

    meerkat Guest

    "Fred37" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >I am running the free Zone Alarm on a Toshiba Laptop, P4, Windows XP
    > with all of the latest updates. Also Office 2000 using Outlook for
    > email.
    > This last update of ZA added an email scan to my comuter.
    > It is slow, annoying, and slows down everything. It is persistent and
    > I can't get rid of it. In my opinion Zone Alarm now belongs in the
    > category of malicious software.
    > What else can I use so that I can rid my computer of this awful Zone
    > Alarm.
    > Fred
    >

    Well switch it off then !.
    Dbl/click on the ZA icon.
    Click on `E-mail Protection`, and switch it off.
     
    meerkat, Apr 5, 2007
    #3
  4. Fred37

    Kicking Bird Guest

    "Fred37" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >I am running the free Zone Alarm on a Toshiba Laptop, P4, Windows XP
    > with all of the latest updates. Also Office 2000 using Outlook for
    > email.
    > This last update of ZA added an email scan to my comuter.
    > It is slow, annoying, and slows down everything. It is persistent and
    > I can't get rid of it. In my opinion Zone Alarm now belongs in the
    > category of malicious software.
    > What else can I use so that I can rid my computer of this awful Zone
    > Alarm.
    > Fred
    >


    RTFM Fredo-- you can switch off the email check option with two or three
    clicks...
     
    Kicking Bird, Apr 5, 2007
    #4
  5. Fred37

    HEMI-Powered Guest

    Today, sittingduck made these interesting comments ...

    > Fred37 wrote:
    >
    >> What else can I use so that I can rid my computer of this
    >> awful Zone Alarm.

    >
    > Zone Alarm is the AOL of firewalls. Good luck getting
    > completley rid of it. Re-installing your operating system is
    > probably going to be the easiest way.


    Why do you say that? I evaluated a couple of software firewalls
    last summer when I get hit with a still unresolved compromise
    from the Internet and chose both Zone Alarm and eTrust Pest
    Patrol to complement my Norton System Works 2006, Ad-Aware, Spy
    Bot Search & Destroy, and JV16 Powertools utilities. Yes, I know
    what many people think of anything Symantec, and I agree
    somewhat, hence I would not buy their Internet protection suite.
    Some like McAfee, but I do not. Back to ZA. Before I bought the
    commercial product, I did an eval of the free version, it seemed
    to do what I wanted without being majorly annoying (after it was
    "trained", of course) and I've not seen any major slowdowns. It
    peacefully co-exists with Norton Anti-Virus and doesn't try to
    trample it nor double-scan my E-mails. In short, it seems to work
    and appears to do what I bought it for. If course, one never
    really knows if any firewall or malware protection really works;
    you only find that out AFTER you've been hacked.

    > Extended Zone Alarm Uninstall/Outpost Install Instructions
    > A few preliminary steps to follow BEFORE uninstallation
    > begins: P1. Download a NEW Copy of Outpost from Agnitum.
    > P2. If applicable, make sure that you do the uninstallation
    > and the installation with a User account having administrative
    > rights. P3. Make sure that Zone Alarm Firewall and the Zone
    > Alarm service are stopped before starting the uninstallation.
    > Right-click on the Zone Alarm icon and 'Shutdown Zone Alarm
    > (Pro)'. P4. Go to JV16 Power Tools and download the jv16 Power
    > Tools application. This is an excellent application for
    > getting eliminating registry remnants from old uninstalled
    > programs. Install this on your PC. P5. Open Windows Explorer
    > and from the menu choose Tools -> Folder Options. Click on the
    > 'View' tab and make sure that Windows Explorer is setup to
    > view hidden files and folders. Uninstallation (after
    > completing steps 1 through 5 above): 1. Completely follow the
    > Zone Alarm instructions as outlined in Zone Alarm
    > Uninstallation - Zone Labs Customer Care to completely
    > uninstall Zone Alarm and clean the file system. 2. Clean all
    > files out of C:\Windows\Temp - Covered in link from Zone Labs,
    > but I recommend cleaning the whole Temp directory. NOTE: Files
    > in you temp directories are safe to delete. If Windows is
    > using any specific file it will not allow its deletion and you
    > will get an error message but please delete all others. Any
    > temp file that may be needed later will be regenerated by that
    > specific application when required. 3. Clean all files out of
    > C:\Windows\Prefetch - Covered in link from Zone Labs, but I
    > recommend cleaning the whole Prefetch directory. Deleted
    > Prefetch files will be re-created as necessary the next time
    > you boot your PC. 4. Clean all files out of C:\Documents and
    > Settings\youraccount\Local Settings\Temp. The exact path may
    > vary slightly with your Operating System. The point is to try
    > and clean your User accounts Temp directory. This will
    > probably not be applicable on single user 95, 98, or Me
    > systems. Alternatively, you can choose Start -> Accessories ->
    > System Tools -> Disk Cleanup. Just check all of the items and
    > continue the cleaning process. NOTE: Files in you temp
    > directories are safe to delete. If Windows is using any
    > specific file it will not allow its deletion and you will get
    > an error message but please delete all others. Any temp file
    > that may be needed later will be regenerated by that specific
    > application when required. 5. jv16 Power Tools: Completing
    > Registry Cleaning (THIS IS ENTIRELY OPTIONAL, this step is
    > optional but may be potentially helpful with difficult
    > uninstallation problems. I strongly recommend it.) a) Download
    > and install jv16 Power Tools. This should have already been
    > done if you followed the preliminary steps. b) Run jv16 Power
    > Tools and click on the 'Registry Tool' button. That will open
    > the main registry tool window. c) Now you should see a list of
    > applications that are documented in the registry. Sort this
    > list alphabetically by clicking on the 'Author' item just
    > above the column with the application names. If it appears in
    > reverse alphabetical order, just click on 'Author' one more
    > time and the list of applications will appear alphabetically.
    > d) Scroll down until you see the Zone Labs or Zone Alarm
    > entries. Place a check in the box next to every entry with
    > 'Zone Labs' or 'Zone Alarm' appearing either in the 'Author'
    > or 'Software' column. You may need to scroll down. While some
    > entries are recognized as being authored by Zone Labs, others
    > may not. So it is important to scroll through the whole list
    > and mark all entries related to Zone Labs/Zone Alarm. If you
    > are not sure of an entry, do not place a check there. Be sure
    > to look closely at the [Unknown] entries at the end of the
    > list to see if an Agnitum entry is listed there. e) After you
    > have found all of the Zone Alarm entries and placed a check in
    > each of the boxes next to them, click the 'Remove' button
    > located at the bottom of the Registry Tools window. f) After
    > removal of the application entries is completed, choose Tools
    > -> Registry Cleaner from the menu. g) The Registry Cleaner
    > will appear with an 'Options' screen. Please ensure that ONLY
    > the 'I want to verify deleted entries' is checked. NO other
    > option should be checked. Make a setting of 'Sometimes' under
    > 'Update screen while scanning'. When finished with this, press
    > 'Continue'. h) Make sure that ALL items are checked under
    > 'Select performed scanned'. i) Press the 'Start' button to
    > execute the scan. j) After the scan has completed, choose
    > Select -> All from the menu. k) Click on the 'Remove' button
    > in the lower right corner of the Registry Cleaner window. l)
    > After completing this process, click the 'Close' button to
    > close the Registry Cleaner window. m) Then click 'Close' to
    > close the Registry Tools window. n) Finally, click 'Exit' to
    > close jv16 Power Tools. o) Reboot your PC.
    > 6. Upon successful system startup, install Outpost using the
    > new installation file that you downloaded in the preliminary
    > steps above. At this point, Outpost should function properly.
    > I have personally used every step noted to you in this post
    > without incident. I hope that these steps help you solve your
    > problem. The same steps can and should be repeated in Safe
    > Mode if you are having difficulty. WHENEVER UPGRADING OR
    > INSTALLING OUTPOST, I RECOMMEND THE FOLLOWING MEASURES. THESE
    > ARE GOOD GENERAL RULES WHEN INSTALLING ANY PROGRAM, BUT
    > FOLLOWING ALL OF THEM MAY NOT BE REQUIRED: 1. Make sure that
    > your anti-virus is disabled. 2. Make sure that your
    > anti-trojan protection is disabled. 3. Make sure no other
    > applications are running. 4. Make sure that you disable any
    > sandbox or system access protection application. 5. Make sure
    > that you disable any ad-monitoring software or proxies. 6.
    > Make sure that any internet connection information program,
    > packet sniffer, or capture utility is disabled. These should
    > not be used with Outpost at all. 7. If upgrading using the
    > Auto Update in Outpost feature does not work properly,
    > shutdown and exit Outpost and run the update from the Start
    > Menu. 8. You must be logged in as Administrator or to any
    > account with Administrative privileges before attempting to
    > install or update Outpost. If the steps above do not help, we
    > will continue to help to the limits of our ability here in the
    > forum. However, it may become necessary for you to contact
    > Agnitum directly if problems with Outpost still exist after
    > following this Uninstall/Install procedure and the associated
    > guidelines.
    >

    I've not had the need to try an uninstall of ZA, but I have
    needed to uninstall Symantec products before, and they can be a
    bear. But, judicious use of JV16 to find and delete rogue entires
    left behind by Symantec did the trick. Yes, I understand the
    dangers in messing with the Registry, but believe me, I am fully
    backed up if a disaster occurs.

    But, to finish up on-topic, I am interested in what you or others
    feel is so onerous about what I thought was the #1 seller of
    software firewalls.

    --
    HP, aka Jerry
     
    HEMI-Powered, Apr 5, 2007
    #5
  6. Fred37

    sittingduck Guest

    HEMI-Powered wrote:

    > But, to finish up on-topic, I am interested in what you or others
    > feel is so onerous about what I thought was the #1 seller of
    > software firewalls.


    I have read a LOT of complaints about it. It is next to impossible to
    completely remove, (like AOL) and attaches itself to way too many places in
    your computer.

    Then again, software firewalls are typically for the clueless and the newbies
    that do not know any better, so something like that is almost necessary. The
    more flexible, intelligent programs available require configuration that may
    be beyond the typical user.

    Back when I thought it was necessary, I ran ZA because it seemed popular. I
    had problems with it, and tried several others before I came to not need the
    software firewall anymore. Sygate was the best, most trouble free firewall I
    used. Ghostwall was the lightest.
     
    sittingduck, Apr 5, 2007
    #6
  7. Fred37

    Fred37 Guest

    On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 18:18:12 GMT, "meerkat" <> wrote:

    >
    >"Fred37" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >>I am running the free Zone Alarm on a Toshiba Laptop, P4, Windows XP
    >> with all of the latest updates. Also Office 2000 using Outlook for
    >> email.
    >> This last update of ZA added an email scan to my comuter.
    >> It is slow, annoying, and slows down everything. It is persistent and
    >> I can't get rid of it. In my opinion Zone Alarm now belongs in the
    >> category of malicious software.
    >> What else can I use so that I can rid my computer of this awful Zone
    >> Alarm.
    >> Fred
    >>

    >Well switch it off then !.
    >Dbl/click on the ZA icon.
    >Click on `E-mail Protection`, and switch it off.
    >

    Hi,

    I tried that. It keeps comimng back. I deleted it from several other
    places and it still keeps coming back. I deleted every instance I
    could find and told Outlook not to use it. It came back right away.

    I have used Zone Alarm for a long time. I was a huge advocate for
    them. Now, with this latest upgrade, they have done the unpardonable.
    They have taken away what little control I have over my computer. I
    hate that. It is so annoynig and it is actually interfering with my
    business.
    I wish it were not so. They performed flawlessly for a long time.

    Fred
     
    Fred37, Apr 5, 2007
    #7
  8. Fred37

    Fred37 Guest

    On Thu, 5 Apr 2007 14:48:32 -0400, "Kicking Bird" <redman@tipi> wrote:

    >"Fred37" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >>I am running the free Zone Alarm on a Toshiba Laptop, P4, Windows XP
    >> with all of the latest updates. Also Office 2000 using Outlook for
    >> email.
    >> This last update of ZA added an email scan to my comuter.
    >> It is slow, annoying, and slows down everything. It is persistent and
    >> I can't get rid of it. In my opinion Zone Alarm now belongs in the
    >> category of malicious software.
    >> What else can I use so that I can rid my computer of this awful Zone
    >> Alarm.
    >> Fred
    >>

    >
    >RTFM Fredo-- you can switch off the email check option with two or three
    >clicks...
    >

    Thanks for the reply.
    For some reason I can't get rid of it. I have tried that nd a lot
    more, but is judt reappears as part of my Outlook. I removed it from
    the Outlook helper apps too, but it came right back.
    Fred
     
    Fred37, Apr 5, 2007
    #8
  9. Fred37

    Fred37 Guest

    On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 11:17:29 -0700, sittingduck
    <> wrote:

    >Fred37 wrote:
    >
    >> What else can I use so that I can rid my computer of this awful Zone
    >> Alarm.

    >
    >Zone Alarm is the AOL of firewalls. Good luck getting completley rid of it.
    >Re-installing your operating system is probably going to be the easiest way.
    >
    >Extended Zone Alarm Uninstall/Outpost Install Instructions
    >A few preliminary steps to follow BEFORE uninstallation begins:
    >P1. Download a NEW Copy of Outpost from Agnitum.
    >P2. If applicable, make sure that you do the uninstallation and the installation with a User account having administrative rights.
    >P3. Make sure that Zone Alarm Firewall and the Zone Alarm service are stopped before starting the uninstallation. Right-click on the Zone Alarm icon and 'Shutdown Zone Alarm (Pro)'.
    >P4. Go to JV16 Power Tools and download the jv16 Power Tools application. This is an excellent application for getting eliminating registry remnants from old uninstalled programs. Install this on your PC.
    >P5. Open Windows Explorer and from the menu choose Tools -> Folder Options. Click on the 'View' tab and make sure that Windows Explorer is setup to view hidden files and folders.
    >Uninstallation (after completing steps 1 through 5 above):
    >1. Completely follow the Zone Alarm instructions as outlined in Zone Alarm Uninstallation - Zone Labs Customer Care to completely uninstall Zone Alarm and clean the file system.
    >2. Clean all files out of C:\Windows\Temp - Covered in link from Zone Labs, but I recommend cleaning the whole Temp directory. NOTE: Files in you temp directories are safe to delete. If Windows is using any specific file it will not allow its deletion and you will get an error message but please delete all others. Any temp file that may be needed later will be regenerated by that specific application when required.
    >3. Clean all files out of C:\Windows\Prefetch - Covered in link from Zone Labs, but I recommend cleaning the whole Prefetch directory. Deleted Prefetch files will be re-created as necessary the next time you boot your PC.
    >4. Clean all files out of C:\Documents and Settings\youraccount\Local Settings\Temp. The exact path may vary slightly with your Operating System. The point is to try and clean your User accounts Temp directory. This will probably not be applicable on single user 95, 98, or Me systems. Alternatively, you can choose Start -> Accessories -> System Tools -> Disk Cleanup. Just check all of the items and continue the cleaning process. NOTE: Files in you temp directories are safe to delete. If Windows is using any specific file it will not allow its deletion and you will get an error message but please delete all others. Any temp file that may be needed later will be regenerated by that specific application when required.
    >5. jv16 Power Tools: Completing Registry Cleaning (THIS IS ENTIRELY OPTIONAL, this step is optional but may be potentially helpful with difficult uninstallation problems. I strongly recommend it.)
    >a) Download and install jv16 Power Tools. This should have already been done if you followed the preliminary steps.
    >b) Run jv16 Power Tools and click on the 'Registry Tool' button. That will open the main registry tool window.
    >c) Now you should see a list of applications that are documented in the registry. Sort this list alphabetically by clicking on the 'Author' item just above the column with the application names. If it appears in reverse alphabetical order, just click on 'Author' one more time and the list of applications will appear alphabetically.
    >d) Scroll down until you see the Zone Labs or Zone Alarm entries. Place a check in the box next to every entry with 'Zone Labs' or 'Zone Alarm' appearing either in the 'Author' or 'Software' column. You may need to scroll down. While some entries are recognized as being authored by Zone Labs, others may not. So it is important to scroll through the whole list and mark all entries related to Zone Labs/Zone Alarm. If you are not sure of an entry, do not place a check there. Be sure to look closely at the [Unknown] entries at the end of the list to see if an Agnitum entry is listed there.
    >e) After you have found all of the Zone Alarm entries and placed a check in each of the boxes next to them, click the 'Remove' button located at the bottom of the Registry Tools window.
    >f) After removal of the application entries is completed, choose Tools -> Registry Cleaner from the menu.
    >g) The Registry Cleaner will appear with an 'Options' screen. Please ensure that ONLY the 'I want to verify deleted entries' is checked. NO other option should be checked. Make a setting of 'Sometimes' under 'Update screen while scanning'. When finished with this, press 'Continue'.
    >h) Make sure that ALL items are checked under 'Select performed scanned'.
    >i) Press the 'Start' button to execute the scan.
    >j) After the scan has completed, choose Select -> All from the menu.
    >k) Click on the 'Remove' button in the lower right corner of the Registry Cleaner window.
    >l) After completing this process, click the 'Close' button to close the Registry Cleaner window.
    >m) Then click 'Close' to close the Registry Tools window.
    >n) Finally, click 'Exit' to close jv16 Power Tools.
    >o) Reboot your PC.
    >6. Upon successful system startup, install Outpost using the new installation file that you downloaded in the preliminary steps above.
    >At this point, Outpost should function properly. I have personally used
    >every step noted to you in this post without incident. I hope that these
    >steps help you solve your problem. The same steps can and should be
    >repeated in Safe Mode if you are having difficulty. WHENEVER UPGRADING OR
    >INSTALLING OUTPOST, I RECOMMEND THE FOLLOWING MEASURES. THESE ARE GOOD
    >GENERAL RULES WHEN INSTALLING ANY PROGRAM, BUT FOLLOWING ALL OF THEM MAY
    >NOT BE REQUIRED: 1. Make sure that your anti-virus is disabled.
    >2. Make sure that your anti-trojan protection is disabled.
    >3. Make sure no other applications are running.
    >4. Make sure that you disable any sandbox or system access protection application.
    >5. Make sure that you disable any ad-monitoring software or proxies.
    >6. Make sure that any internet connection information program, packet sniffer, or capture utility is disabled. These should not be used with Outpost at all.
    >7. If upgrading using the Auto Update in Outpost feature does not work properly, shutdown and exit Outpost and run the update from the Start Menu.
    >8. You must be logged in as Administrator or to any account with Administrative privileges before attempting to install or update Outpost.
    >If the steps above do not help, we will continue to help to the limits of
    >our ability here in the forum. However, it may become necessary for you to
    >contact Agnitum directly if problems with Outpost still exist after
    >following this Uninstall/Install procedure and the associated guidelines.


    Hi Sitting Duck.
    Because of posts on this NG, I knew better than to install the paid
    version. I thought I could get away using the free version. It worked
    well for a very long time, but now this.
    Thank you very much. I will set out on this quest. I will let you
    know If I win or not.
    Thank you again.
    Fred
     
    Fred37, Apr 5, 2007
    #9
  10. Fred37

    philo Guest

    "Fred37" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I am running the free Zone Alarm on a Toshiba Laptop, P4, Windows XP
    > with all of the latest updates. Also Office 2000 using Outlook for
    > email.
    > This last update of ZA added an email scan to my comuter.
    > It is slow, annoying, and slows down everything. It is persistent and
    > I can't get rid of it. In my opinion Zone Alarm now belongs in the
    > category of malicious software.
    > What else can I use so that I can rid my computer of this awful Zone
    > Alarm.
    > Fred
    >



    Heck...Zone Alarm flaked out on me quite a few versions back...
    I just uninstalled it and re-installed the previous version...
    For my purposes it works fine and I just cancel the upgrade reminder every
    two months...
    no big deal
     
    philo, Apr 5, 2007
    #10
  11. Fred37

    HEMI-Powered Guest

    Today, sittingduck made these interesting comments ...

    > HEMI-Powered wrote:
    >
    >> But, to finish up on-topic, I am interested in what you or
    >> others feel is so onerous about what I thought was the #1
    >> seller of software firewalls.

    >
    > I have read a LOT of complaints about it. It is next to
    > impossible to completely remove, (like AOL) and attaches
    > itself to way too many places in your computer.
    >
    > Then again, software firewalls are typically for the clueless
    > and the newbies that do not know any better, so something like
    > that is almost necessary. The more flexible, intelligent
    > programs available require configuration that may be beyond
    > the typical user.


    Guess you sure told me off, "clueless", huh? OK, since you must be
    "clued", what do YOU recommend for a software firewall? Don't mind
    the technie stuff, I can handle that, but I think that while I'm
    hardly an IT pro, I am also not a "clueless newbie".

    > Back when I thought it was necessary, I ran ZA because it
    > seemed popular. I had problems with it, and tried several
    > others before I came to not need the software firewall
    > anymore. Sygate was the best, most trouble free firewall I
    > used. Ghostwall was the lightest.
    >

    So, you no longer think it is necessary? Can't be XP SP2, so what
    thing(s) do you do now to protect yourself?

    --
    HP, aka Jerry
     
    HEMI-Powered, Apr 6, 2007
    #11
  12. Fred37

    sittingduck Guest

    HEMI-Powered wrote:

    > Guess you sure told me off, "clueless", huh? OK, since you must be
    > "clued", what do YOU recommend for a software firewall? Don't mind
    > the technie stuff, I can handle that, but I think that while I'm
    > hardly an IT pro, I am also not a "clueless newbie".


    Don't cry, I wasn't directing that at you, necessarily. If you read the rest
    of my previous post, I did mention a couple other firewalls.

    > So, you no longer think it is necessary? Can't be XP SP2, so what
    > thing(s) do you do now to protect yourself?


    I am behind a router with ports closed off. The only thing a hardware
    firewall would do is not let things OUT.
    I do run XPSP2, but a very stripped-down version of it. The ISO is only
    175MB, the security center, firewall, all that crap is GONE.
    I don't let other people onto my computer, I have several others around that
    the wife or my kid can use.
    Gasp, HORROR OF HORRORS, I don't run any anti-virus program either. On the
    very slight chance I pick up something nasty, I have regular backups of my
    windows drive that I can restore at any time. In 8 years, I've had one virus
    on my computer, at about year 2, opened an email attachment I shouldn't have.
    I like my system VERY lean and very fast. I have about 24 processes running
    at startup.
    Another really good habit to get into is to keep a windows partition, and
    store all of your documents and critical programs ELSEWHERE. That way if you
    need to restore and image or want to re-install, you don't lose much at all.
    Buy a router, Force all emails to plain text, run firefox with NOSCRIPT, and
    use some common sense, and your security risk is next to zero. (assuming you
    are not surfing warez/porn sites)
    You can download Clamwin Portable to scan the occasional file if you are
    suspicious, and there are also some decent online scanners.
     
    sittingduck, Apr 6, 2007
    #12
  13. Fred37

    HEMI-Powered Guest

    Today, sittingduck made these interesting comments ...

    > HEMI-Powered wrote:
    >
    >> Guess you sure told me off, "clueless", huh? OK, since you
    >> must be "clued", what do YOU recommend for a software
    >> firewall? Don't mind the technie stuff, I can handle that,
    >> but I think that while I'm hardly an IT pro, I am also not a
    >> "clueless newbie".

    >
    > Don't cry, I wasn't directing that at you, necessarily. If you
    > read the rest of my previous post, I did mention a couple
    > other firewalls.
    >
    >> So, you no longer think it is necessary? Can't be XP SP2, so
    >> what thing(s) do you do now to protect yourself?

    >
    > I am behind a router with ports closed off. The only thing a
    > hardware firewall would do is not let things OUT.
    > I do run XPSP2, but a very stripped-down version of it. The
    > ISO is only 175MB, the security center, firewall, all that
    > crap is GONE. I don't let other people onto my computer, I
    > have several others around that the wife or my kid can use.
    > Gasp, HORROR OF HORRORS, I don't run any anti-virus program
    > either. On the very slight chance I pick up something nasty, I
    > have regular backups of my windows drive that I can restore at
    > any time. In 8 years, I've had one virus on my computer, at
    > about year 2, opened an email attachment I shouldn't have. I
    > like my system VERY lean and very fast. I have about 24
    > processes running at startup.
    > Another really good habit to get into is to keep a windows
    > partition, and store all of your documents and critical
    > programs ELSEWHERE. That way if you need to restore and image
    > or want to re-install, you don't lose much at all. Buy a
    > router, Force all emails to plain text, run firefox with
    > NOSCRIPT, and use some common sense, and your security risk is
    > next to zero. (assuming you are not surfing warez/porn sites)
    > You can download Clamwin Portable to scan the occasional file
    > if you are suspicious, and there are also some decent online
    > scanners.
    >

    I do everything you do and more. I am also behind a wired router
    with the ports closed except for what I want to get through. I
    regularly image my C:\ using Acronis True Image 9.0 and backup my
    entire system to one of two external HDs that I traded between my
    bank's safety deposit box to minimize the risk at home. I have
    two extended partitions, one for graphics data only and the other
    for all other non-graphics data. But, I do run NAV 2006 and
    eTrust Pest Patrol running in addition to ZA. I also regularly
    scan my system with Ad-Aware and Spy Bot, plus I do full system
    scans with NAV and eTrust before doing my imaging - no sense
    imaging an infected system.

    --
    HP, aka Jerry
     
    HEMI-Powered, Apr 6, 2007
    #13
  14. Fred37

    sittingduck Guest

    HEMI-Powered wrote:

    > I do run NAV 2006 and
    > eTrust Pest Patrol running in addition to ZA. I also regularly
    > scan my system with Ad-Aware and Spy Bot, plus I do full system
    > scans with NAV and eTrust before doing my imaging - no sense
    > imaging an infected system.


    How often do they find anything? Do you just like playing with those types of
    programs? Do you have newbs using your machine?
     
    sittingduck, Apr 6, 2007
    #14
  15. Fred37

    HEMI-Powered Guest

    Today, sittingduck made these interesting comments ...

    > HEMI-Powered wrote:
    >
    >> I do run NAV 2006 and
    >> eTrust Pest Patrol running in addition to ZA. I also
    >> regularly scan my system with Ad-Aware and Spy Bot, plus I do
    >> full system scans with NAV and eTrust before doing my imaging
    >> - no sense imaging an infected system.

    >
    > How often do they find anything? Do you just like playing with
    > those types of programs? Do you have newbs using your machine?
    >

    They "find" things all the time, some benign, some a minor risk,
    some a major risk. No, I don't like "playing" with these types of
    programs, I feel strongly that they are highly necessary in today's
    world of geometrically increasing malware of every conceivable
    type. I don't "play" with anything on my PC except the pictures I
    collect. The PC system side is a tool to do useful work for me and
    is not in any way a hobby in and of itself.

    I don't know what "newbs" is.

    BTW, I'm curious. You seem to be quite negative about this and
    continue to give me the impression that you're putting me down for
    being somehow too stupid to live. Is that your intent to single me
    out for your wrath or do you view everyone who takes reasonable
    precautions to protect their systems to be newbies or idiots. Well,
    if you do, that's your right, I guess. You are responsible for your
    PC(s) and I am responsible for my two.

    --
    HP, aka Jerry
     
    HEMI-Powered, Apr 6, 2007
    #15
  16. Fred37

    sittingduck Guest

    HEMI-Powered wrote:

    > BTW, I'm curious. You seem to be quite negative about this and
    > continue to give me the impression that you're putting me down for
    > being somehow too stupid to live. Is that your intent to single me
    > out for your wrath or do you view everyone who takes reasonable
    > precautions to protect their systems to be newbies or idiots. Well,
    > if you do, that's your right, I guess. You are responsible for your
    > PC(s) and I am responsible for my two.


    You take me the wrong way.

    I am just trying to understand how your computer is at such high risk.
    Reasonable precautions are fine, but all that stuff you are running would be
    something I would set up for someone that has no idea what they are doing.
    Once you learn where the threats are, they are easy to avoid, and running all
    the extra programs and probably an extra dozen processes "just in case"
    doesn't make sense to me. Like I said, I like my system as lean as possible,
    and running all those extra programs for a non-existent (for me) threat is
    not something I feel necessary.
    It seems to me like wearing a crash helmet on your riding lawnmower...
    Overkill. You can run 3 firewalls and all the AV/anti-spyware programs you
    want, it's YOUR PC, I'm just giving my opinion on them. It's like a lot of
    other things in the world today, no one wants to educate or put in some
    effort to understand things, they would rather just have a quick fix, or a
    pill, or a punishment for things they can't deal with. Much of industry is
    built around this very principle, IMO. I refuse to support it when I can
    avoid doing so.
     
    sittingduck, Apr 6, 2007
    #16
  17. Fred37

    Fred37 Guest

    On Fri, 06 Apr 2007 12:46:23 -0700, sittingduck
    <> wrote:

    >HEMI-Powered wrote:
    >
    >> BTW, I'm curious. You seem to be quite negative about this and
    >> continue to give me the impression that you're putting me down for
    >> being somehow too stupid to live. Is that your intent to single me
    >> out for your wrath or do you view everyone who takes reasonable
    >> precautions to protect their systems to be newbies or idiots. Well,
    >> if you do, that's your right, I guess. You are responsible for your
    >> PC(s) and I am responsible for my two.

    >
    >You take me the wrong way.
    >
    >I am just trying to understand how your computer is at such high risk.
    >Reasonable precautions are fine, but all that stuff you are running would be
    >something I would set up for someone that has no idea what they are doing.
    >Once you learn where the threats are, they are easy to avoid, and running all
    >the extra programs and probably an extra dozen processes "just in case"
    >doesn't make sense to me. Like I said, I like my system as lean as possible,
    >and running all those extra programs for a non-existent (for me) threat is
    >not something I feel necessary.
    >It seems to me like wearing a crash helmet on your riding lawnmower...
    >Overkill. You can run 3 firewalls and all the AV/anti-spyware programs you
    >want, it's YOUR PC, I'm just giving my opinion on them. It's like a lot of
    >other things in the world today, no one wants to educate or put in some
    >effort to understand things, they would rather just have a quick fix, or a
    >pill, or a punishment for things they can't deal with. Much of industry is
    >built around this very principle, IMO. I refuse to support it when I can
    >avoid doing so.

    Hi,
    Me again, the OP.
    These discussions are very interesting. I am glad you and
    HEMI-Powered are having these.
    My computer is the most awesome design tool ever for CAD/CAM.
    If I could invest a reasonable amount of time to learning how to
    protect my computer I would like to do that. I cannot, however, be
    too distracted from my main income producing endeavors. What is the
    best resource for truly understanding computers? Understand that I
    design hardware with embedded processors and write the programs for
    those. That is childs play compared to Windows, internet browsing and
    security.
    Fred
     
    Fred37, Apr 6, 2007
    #17
  18. Fred37

    HEMI-Powered Guest

    Today, sittingduck made these interesting comments ...

    >> BTW, I'm curious. You seem to be quite negative about this
    >> and continue to give me the impression that you're putting me
    >> down for being somehow too stupid to live. Is that your
    >> intent to single me out for your wrath or do you view
    >> everyone who takes reasonable precautions to protect their
    >> systems to be newbies or idiots. Well, if you do, that's your
    >> right, I guess. You are responsible for your PC(s) and I am
    >> responsible for my two.

    >
    > You take me the wrong way.


    OK. I'll back off.

    > I am just trying to understand how your computer is at such
    > high risk.


    I had a MAJOR hit late last summer. Never did figure out what
    happened. The short version is that private E-mails between me
    and my NSP got intercepted somehow and selected parts posted
    publicly to a binary NG. I tried in vain to get my ISP, Comcast,
    to take this seriously and actually got a call - one - from some
    woman claiming to be the Director of Privacy and Abuse, who put
    me in touch with her techie in another city. And, I got one call
    from him. I provided all the docs including messages incoming and
    outgoing, headerrs et al that they needed to investigate but
    neither EVER returned another call nor did they ever tell me what
    the source of the compromise was. It became clear to me that they
    were using caller ID to refuse my repeated calls for a progress
    report and just wrote me off as another nutbag. Fine. They have
    their methods and I have mine.

    I viewed it as either a Comcast issue or my PC had been
    successfully hacked. That is when I bought Zone Alarm and eTrust
    Pest Patrol. That I can tell, nobody ever got into my system nor
    did they plant any malware such as a keylogger or other spyware
    tools that might explain how exact quotes from private E-mails
    got purloined.

    Reasonable precautions are fine, but all that stuff
    > you are running would be something I would set up for someone
    > that has no idea what they are doing. Once you learn where the
    > threats are, they are easy to avoid, and running all the extra
    > programs and probably an extra dozen processes "just in case"
    > doesn't make sense to me. Like I said, I like my system as
    > lean as possible, and running all those extra programs for a
    > non-existent (for me) threat is not something I feel
    > necessary. It seems to me like wearing a crash helmet on your
    > riding lawnmower... Overkill. You can run 3 firewalls and all
    > the AV/anti-spyware programs you want, it's YOUR PC, I'm just
    > giving my opinion on them. It's like a lot of other things in
    > the world today, no one wants to educate or put in some effort
    > to understand things, they would rather just have a quick fix,
    > or a pill, or a punishment for things they can't deal with.
    > Much of industry is built around this very principle, IMO. I
    > refuse to support it when I can avoid doing so.
    >

    When I did info security professionally prior to retiring, I
    heard a really good quote which I think answers your comments -
    "the only people who've never been compromised are the ignorant
    or the arrogant". Well, I ain't arrogant but I sure was ignorant!
    And, despite LOTS of time and energy, and even some big bucks
    with an attorney who specializes in this stuff, I never did learn
    what'd happened. So, to avoid the "ignorant or arogant" problem
    again, I upped my paranoia several notches. Now, if that makes
    you think me the fool, that's OK by me. As I said above, you are
    responsible for your system(s) and I'm responsible (to myself)
    for mine.

    Now, since the gist of this thread was Zone Alarm, and I said I
    wasn't at all dissatisfied with it nor was it an intrusion
    (again, once trained) nor has it slowed down anything on my
    system, the only thing I am out is about $100 for ZA and eTrust,
    and the small amount of time I spend answering "do you want to
    let this in/out?" from either of them. And, my periodic backup
    regimen, which starts with full malware scans, isn't a big deal.
    I just turn them on and let them run while I do other things. Of
    course, I make damn sure the definitions are up-to-date.

    You are right that there is no such thing as absolute security.
    The company I am retired from, The Chrysler Group, got hit by a
    denial of service attack a couple years after I retired. Now,
    these people are not newbies, fools, nor amateurs. They run a
    proxy server, carefully block known bad sites and block site they
    don't want employees playing on, like porn, and the like, and
    they sift ALL the traffic coming in, and scan the outgoing stuff
    to a lesser degree. All this, and literally within about 30
    minutes, the ENTIRE world-wide network was down. What happened
    was the classic spyware infestation that propogates itself by
    scanning your address book and sending itself to that list, then
    scans the address books of those people and sends spyware to
    them, and so on. Using simple binary doubling, it can easily be
    seen how a SINGLE incoming E-mail could cause this much havoc.
    Yes, ONE E-mail. It was eventually traced to its source and, I
    believe, legal action was taken. But, the point is, my friends
    fell prey to the "arrogant" part of my quote. They were clearly
    not ignorant, but they had swelled heads thinking that nothing
    could possibly get past them, but it did.

    In closing, I still cannot figure out if you are lecturing to the
    broader audience lurking in this NG to warn them or to chide
    them, or if you're targeting me somehow. I'll give you the
    benefit of the doubt on this, and assume you're not dinging me
    but trying to educate the "ignorant" folk.

    --
    HP, aka Jerry
     
    HEMI-Powered, Apr 6, 2007
    #18
  19. Fred37

    HEMI-Powered Guest

    Today, Fred37 made these interesting comments ...

    > Hi,
    > Me again, the OP.
    > These discussions are very interesting. I am glad you and
    > HEMI-Powered are having these.
    > My computer is the most awesome design tool ever for CAD/CAM.


    Huh? You would have no way of knowing this, but I've got more
    than a little knowledge about CAD/CAM/CAE and I highly doubt that
    yours is "the most awesome design tool ever". Well written,
    effective, and effficient 2-D and 3-D systems that include
    drafting, 3-D wireframe, surfacing, and solid modeling/rendering
    that I was once the support manager for took thousands and
    thousands and thousands of man-years to write, debug, and
    continuously upgrade. And, you're apparently doing this out of
    your basement in your spare time?

    > If I could invest a reasonable amount of time to learning how
    > to protect my computer I would like to do that. I cannot,
    > however, be too distracted from my main income producing
    > endeavors. What is the best resource for truly understanding
    > computers? Understand that I design hardware with embedded
    > processors and write the programs for those. That is childs
    > play compared to Windows, internet browsing and security.
    > Fred
    >


    Surely you jest, "and, don't call me Shirley!". Understanding the
    basics of hardware and software is one thing, fully understanding
    the relationships between the two, operating systems, networking,
    and the full gamut of systems security is what professionals do
    for a living at salaries into the multiple six figure range, so
    don't expect to get it right without a LOT of effort. But,
    balance what you need to know against the risks you think you
    face.

    So, Fred, I suggest you start by taking some classes. Chances are
    that your city or local computer stores can help you. Go to your
    fav book store and buy a dozen books about all of this. Google
    your brains out for awhile. Whatever it takes, get educated.

    But, here's the bottom line: you, and only you, can make the
    determination of how really valuable your data is, what it would
    cost you to recreate it, and what lost income you would suffer
    should your awesome CAD/CAM system get stolen and sold by a
    competitor.

    (you do have an attorney guiding you, right?)

    My main interest is the usual identity theft stuff and not
    wanting to have my system taken down by the number of new malware
    threats that're expanding so fast that nobody even has an idea of
    how many there are. See my just posted reply for some details of
    how and why I suddenly got religion on this.

    This is a nice discussion to have. I'd prefer that my other
    friend not take quite so negative an attitude, though, toward
    people who are either ignorant comparitively or have differing
    views. I'm afraid there are no simple answers and certainly no
    one-size-fits-all solution.

    There is a difference between stupidity and ignorance (no, I'm
    not calling you either!). And, without having learned from past
    mistakes, one cannot form good judgement to guide them in future.
    So, if I were going to lecture a NG like this one on PC security,
    it would be in the form of trying to educate those who really
    don't understand the risks, and the concept of risk/benefit
    ratios and the like. I do not classify myself as any sort of guru
    on this jazz, but I do have SOME experience in it. What I am,
    though, is woefully out-of-date in the 5 years since I retired
    and stopped worrying about this stuff at the enterprise level. A
    whole LOT has happened since 9/11 and I left active employment
    just a few months later, before today's threats were even
    imagined.

    It is true that if you get paranoid enough, you won't ever leave
    your house nor would you even connect to the Internet at all.
    But, life is a series of compromises, isn't it? And, here's a
    thought for you and my other friend: reality trumps ALL the other
    cards in the game of life, meaning that all it takes is one good
    thumping to make you a believer in PC security. Now, achieving
    the goal of most secure system at least cost in money and time is
    the trick.

    Good luck on marketing your software!

    --
    HP, aka Jerry
     
    HEMI-Powered, Apr 6, 2007
    #19
  20. Fred37

    Sparky Guest

    On Fri, 06 Apr 2007 22:13:20 -0000, "HEMI-Powered" <>
    wrote:

    >Today, Fred37 made these interesting comments ...
    >
    >> Hi,
    >> Me again, the OP.
    >> These discussions are very interesting. I am glad you and
    >> HEMI-Powered are having these.
    >> My computer is the most awesome design tool ever for CAD/CAM.

    >
    >Huh? You would have no way of knowing this, but I've got more
    >than a little knowledge about CAD/CAM/CAE and I highly doubt that
    >yours is "the most awesome design tool ever". Well written,
    >effective, and effficient 2-D and 3-D systems that include
    >drafting, 3-D wireframe, surfacing, and solid modeling/rendering
    >that I was once the support manager for took thousands and
    >thousands and thousands of man-years to write, debug, and
    >continuously upgrade. And, you're apparently doing this out of
    >your basement in your spare time?


    OK, of course you are correct. Within the framework of what I am
    doing right now it is awesome. Beats crawiling around with knee pads
    and tape under a ceiling mounted camera.
    I have used solidworks, 3d printers, etc., but I don't need that right
    now. If I did I would buy it. At $85K per seat it is well woth it if
    one needs that. I don't right now. I am perfecly happy with flawless
    Gerbers and some decent Autocad drawings.
    Fred


    >
    >> If I could invest a reasonable amount of time to learning how
    >> to protect my computer I would like to do that. I cannot,
    >> however, be too distracted from my main income producing
    >> endeavors. What is the best resource for truly understanding
    >> computers? Understand that I design hardware with embedded
    >> processors and write the programs for those. That is childs
    >> play compared to Windows, internet browsing and security.
    >> Fred
    >>

    >
    >Surely you jest, "and, don't call me Shirley!". Understanding the
    >basics of hardware and software is one thing, fully understanding
    >the relationships between the two, operating systems, networking,
    >and the full gamut of systems security is what professionals do
    >for a living at salaries into the multiple six figure range, so
    >don't expect to get it right without a LOT of effort. But,
    >balance what you need to know against the risks you think you
    >face.
    >
    >So, Fred, I suggest you start by taking some classes. Chances are
    >that your city or local computer stores can help you. Go to your
    >fav book store and buy a dozen books about all of this. Google
    >your brains out for awhile. Whatever it takes, get educated.
    >
    >But, here's the bottom line: you, and only you, can make the
    >determination of how really valuable your data is, what it would
    >cost you to recreate it, and what lost income you would suffer
    >should your awesome CAD/CAM system get stolen and sold by a
    >competitor.
    >
    >(you do have an attorney guiding you, right?)
    >
    >My main interest is the usual identity theft stuff and not
    >wanting to have my system taken down by the number of new malware
    >threats that're expanding so fast that nobody even has an idea of
    >how many there are. See my just posted reply for some details of
    >how and why I suddenly got religion on this.
    >
    >This is a nice discussion to have. I'd prefer that my other
    >friend not take quite so negative an attitude, though, toward
    >people who are either ignorant comparitively or have differing
    >views. I'm afraid there are no simple answers and certainly no
    >one-size-fits-all solution.
    >
    >There is a difference between stupidity and ignorance (no, I'm
    >not calling you either!). And, without having learned from past
    >mistakes, one cannot form good judgement to guide them in future.
    >So, if I were going to lecture a NG like this one on PC security,
    >it would be in the form of trying to educate those who really
    >don't understand the risks, and the concept of risk/benefit
    >ratios and the like. I do not classify myself as any sort of guru
    >on this jazz, but I do have SOME experience in it. What I am,
    >though, is woefully out-of-date in the 5 years since I retired
    >and stopped worrying about this stuff at the enterprise level. A
    >whole LOT has happened since 9/11 and I left active employment
    >just a few months later, before today's threats were even
    >imagined.
    >
    >It is true that if you get paranoid enough, you won't ever leave
    >your house nor would you even connect to the Internet at all.
    >But, life is a series of compromises, isn't it? And, here's a
    >thought for you and my other friend: reality trumps ALL the other
    >cards in the game of life, meaning that all it takes is one good
    >thumping to make you a believer in PC security. Now, achieving
    >the goal of most secure system at least cost in money and time is
    >the trick.
    >
    >Good luck on marketing your software!
     
    Sparky, Apr 6, 2007
    #20
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