Why always Nikon and Canon? What's wrong with Panasonic?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by ABC, Aug 27, 2004.

  1. ABC

    ABC Guest

    I roughly counted the topic of the threads in the NG. I would say
    about 95% goes to Nikon and Canon.

    Just for example, I have been looking at Panasonic. It is not that far
    off in terms of performance and price. A few other brands seem not bad
    too.

    Why is this? Any clue?

    ABC
    Do not reply by email.


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    ABC, Aug 27, 2004
    #1
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  2. ABC

    Charlie Self Guest

    ABC ABC asks:

    >I roughly counted the topic of the threads in the NG. I would say
    >about 95% goes to Nikon and Canon.
    >
    >Just for example, I have been looking at Panasonic. It is not that far
    >off in terms of performance and price. A few other brands seem not bad
    >too.
    >
    >Why is this? Any clue?


    Rough guess: it is plenty far off if you want a real SLR. A good camera
    otherwise, it does not, and cannot, do what an SLR does for many of us.

    Maybe I should complain. My Pentax *istD gets very little attention either,
    even though it is an SLR.

    Charlie Self
    "A judge is a law student who marks his own examination papers." H. L. Mencken
     
    Charlie Self, Aug 27, 2004
    #2
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  3. ABC

    Buster Guest

    I work at a camera store. We are regularly visited by Nikon and Canon
    Sales Reps. We have never seen a Panasonic rep. Panasonic recently
    restructured their sales requirements and we can't even buy them
    through an independent wholesaler. Panasonic only wants to deal with
    extremely large accounts, therefore you will only see them in the big
    chain stores.
    Buster

    On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 20:40:32 +0800, ABC <> wrote:

    >I roughly counted the topic of the threads in the NG. I would say
    >about 95% goes to Nikon and Canon.
    >
    >Just for example, I have been looking at Panasonic. It is not that far
    >off in terms of performance and price. A few other brands seem not bad
    >too.
    >
    >Why is this? Any clue?
    >
    >ABC
    >Do not reply by email.
    >
    >
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    Buster, Aug 27, 2004
    #3
  4. ABC

    Justin Thyme Guest

    "Charlie Self" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Maybe I should complain. My Pentax *istD gets very little attention
    > either,
    > even though it is an SLR.

    Maybe it is because Canon and Nikon owners have to keep reassuring
    themselves that they did make the right decision, hence they have to keep
    saying how much better they are than the other. So while all the Canon &
    Nikon owners are arguing between each other like a couple of schoolkids
    arguing who has the toughest dad, pentax/minolta/olympus/etc owners can
    quietly go about our business of taking photographs.
    >
    > Charlie Self
    > "A judge is a law student who marks his own examination papers." H. L.
    > Mencken
     
    Justin Thyme, Aug 27, 2004
    #4
  5. ABC

    ABC Guest

    On 27 Aug 2004 12:45:11 GMT, otforme (Charlie Self)
    wrotd:

    >Rough guess: it is plenty far off if you want a real SLR. A good camera
    >otherwise, it does not, and cannot, do what an SLR does for many of us.
    >

    What about the prosumer grade and amatuers' fun camera?

    Even for the SLR, we also have Kodak, fuji , Sigma...


    ABC
    Do not reply by email.


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    ABC, Aug 27, 2004
    #5
  6. ABC

    Charlie Self Guest

    ABC ABC asks:

    >>Rough guess: it is plenty far off if you want a real SLR. A good camera
    >>otherwise, it does not, and cannot, do what an SLR does for many of us.
    >>

    >What about the prosumer grade and amatuers' fun camera?
    >
    >Even for the SLR, we also have Kodak, fuji , Sigma.


    Yeah, but the two main pro systems for many years have been Canon & Nikon. The
    competition has always, or nearly always, been between those two. I used
    Olympus and Minolta (manual focus for both) until recently for all my work, but
    I originally started with a Canon F1 back around, IIRC, '70 or '71. Lost that
    in an uninsured fire, so went to Olympus. Anyway, there will be more DSLRs come
    October...Olympus is already out there, and will have another, I'd guess, as
    will Pentax, while Minolta may also get its tootsies wet. But I'll guess that
    once it all settles down, the arguments about which are best will still be
    mostly based on Canon vs. Nikon. More of them out there, for one thing.

    If people who use "prosumer" (what a shitty word) cameras and 'stop and pop'
    cameras want representation on here, I think they'd better get to it. Post. I
    doubt much of the point and shoot crowd will, though. Too likely to get buried
    in the technical detail, which is more likely bore you to death instead of
    teaching you anything really valuable if all you know about your camera is
    where the on switch is, and what kind of batteries it takes.

    Charlie Self
    "A judge is a law student who marks his own examination papers." H. L. Mencken
     
    Charlie Self, Aug 27, 2004
    #6
  7. ABC

    John Doe Guest

    Besides what was said I think most people looking to invest in a high-ish
    end digital camera want to stick with a company that has a long history of
    building cameras. That is companies like Nikon and Canon and even Olympus
    (even though they seem to be falling behind). Panasonic on the other hand is
    a recent entry in to cameras at least when compared to others.

    This is just a guess and it is based on how I feel about it as well.

    John



    "ABC" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I roughly counted the topic of the threads in the NG. I would say
    > about 95% goes to Nikon and Canon.
    >
    > Just for example, I have been looking at Panasonic. It is not that far
    > off in terms of performance and price. A few other brands seem not bad
    > too.
    >
    > Why is this? Any clue?
    >
    > ABC
    > Do not reply by email.
    >
    >
    > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
    > http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
    > -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----
     
    John Doe, Aug 27, 2004
    #7
  8. ABC <> wrote in news:ljaui0p2bpvkv2mbbtap3jmnu0st9vvs8r@
    4ax.com:

    > I roughly counted the topic of the threads in the NG. I would say
    > about 95% goes to Nikon and Canon.
    >
    > Just for example, I have been looking at Panasonic. It is not that far
    > off in terms of performance and price. A few other brands seem not bad
    > too.
    >
    > Why is this? Any clue?


    Most talk here is about DSLR. Panasonic has none.

    I would guess that Nikon and Canon has a very large
    percentage of the sales.

    You forgot Sigma - lots of talk about Sigma here.

    You could ask why so few Pentax and Fuji. Maybe by
    far too few users?

    If you caount the posters her - it is not so many
    regular posters really. So - maybe it is just a
    matter of probability.

    Then - there is also a critical mass. You cannot talk
    about Panasonic alone, even if you are some few not
    everyone will respond. Cameras with more users tend to
    create more replies. So - the more popular cameras
    will stay and the others go elsewhere - to some
    Panasonic web forum maybe?

    Here is one
    http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/forum.asp?forum=1033
    Looks to be quite frequent - 92 posts during the last hour.


    /Roland
     
    Roland Karlsson, Aug 27, 2004
    #8
  9. ABC

    Big Bill Guest

    On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:30:37 GMT, "Justin Thyme"
    <> wrote:

    >
    >"Charlie Self" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> Maybe I should complain. My Pentax *istD gets very little attention
    >> either,
    >> even though it is an SLR.

    >Maybe it is because Canon and Nikon owners have to keep reassuring
    >themselves that they did make the right decision, hence they have to keep
    >saying how much better they are than the other. So while all the Canon &
    >Nikon owners are arguing between each other like a couple of schoolkids
    >arguing who has the toughest dad, pentax/minolta/olympus/etc owners can
    >quietly go about our business of taking photographs.


    Yes, I'm sure that's it.

    Bill Funk
    Change "g" to "a"
     
    Big Bill, Aug 27, 2004
    #9
  10. "ABC" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I roughly counted the topic of the threads in the NG. I would say
    > about 95% goes to Nikon and Canon.
    >
    > Just for example, I have been looking at Panasonic. It is not that far
    > off in terms of performance and price. A few other brands seem not bad
    > too.
    >
    > Why is this? Any clue?
    >
    > ABC
    > Do not reply by email.
    >


    Panasonic makes cameras?

    HMc
     
    Howard McCollister, Aug 27, 2004
    #10
  11. ABC

    G. Innipig Guest

    "Justin Thyme" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Maybe it is because Canon and Nikon owners have to keep reassuring
    > themselves that they did make the right decision, hence they have to keep
    > saying how much better they are than the other. So while all the Canon &
    > Nikon owners are arguing between each other like a couple of schoolkids
    > arguing who has the toughest dad, pentax/minolta/olympus/etc owners can
    > quietly go about our business of taking photographs.


    Ah right. Probably therefore has absolutely nothing to do with the quality
    of the cameras or their results. I saw hundreds of Pentax/Minolta/Olympus
    cameras in use by the pros at Athens ... NOT.
     
    G. Innipig, Aug 27, 2004
    #11
  12. Roland Karlsson, Aug 27, 2004
    #12
  13. ABC

    ABC Guest

    On 27 Aug 2004 14:43:11 -0500, "Howard McCollister"
    <> wrotd:

    >Panasonic makes cameras?
    >
    >HMc


    If Leica does not make television........


    ABC
    Do not reply by email.


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    ABC, Aug 27, 2004
    #13
  14. ABC

    Justin Thyme Guest

    "John Doe" <> wrote in message
    news:QCKXc.10227$...
    > Besides what was said I think most people looking to invest in a high-ish
    > end digital camera want to stick with a company that has a long history of
    > building cameras. That is companies like Nikon and Canon and even Olympus
    > (even though they seem to be falling behind). Panasonic on the other hand
    > is
    > a recent entry in to cameras at least when compared to others.

    At least one of the Pana models (FZ10) is a Pana/Leica corroboration -
    Panasonic responsible for the electronics, and Leica responsible for the
    camera bits. You don't get much longer history with camera's and a much
    better name in camera's than Leica. The exact same camera is also sold as a
    Leica. Trouble is, I have never yet found a store with the Leica on it's
    shelves. The Panasonic however seems to be fairly widespread. I wonder how
    many people would have the exact same camera badged as Leica, if Leica were
    as good at getting their product onto store shelves as Panasonic.
    >
    > This is just a guess and it is based on how I feel about it as well.
    >
    > John
    >
    >
    >
    > "ABC" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> I roughly counted the topic of the threads in the NG. I would say
    >> about 95% goes to Nikon and Canon.
    >>
    >> Just for example, I have been looking at Panasonic. It is not that far
    >> off in terms of performance and price. A few other brands seem not bad
    >> too.
    >>
    >> Why is this? Any clue?
    >>
    >> ABC
    >> Do not reply by email.
    >>
    >>
    >> -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
    >> http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
    >> -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----

    >
    >
     
    Justin Thyme, Aug 27, 2004
    #14
  15. ABC

    Hunt Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    >
    >
    >"John Doe" <> wrote in message
    >news:QCKXc.10227$...
    >> Besides what was said I think most people looking to invest in a high-ish
    >> end digital camera want to stick with a company that has a long history of
    >> building cameras. That is companies like Nikon and Canon and even Olympus
    >> (even though they seem to be falling behind). Panasonic on the other hand
    >> is
    >> a recent entry in to cameras at least when compared to others.

    >At least one of the Pana models (FZ10) is a Pana/Leica corroboration -
    >Panasonic responsible for the electronics, and Leica responsible for the
    >camera bits. You don't get much longer history with camera's and a much
    >better name in camera's than Leica. The exact same camera is also sold as a
    >Leica. Trouble is, I have never yet found a store with the Leica on it's
    >shelves. The Panasonic however seems to be fairly widespread. I wonder how
    >many people would have the exact same camera badged as Leica, if Leica were
    >as good at getting their product onto store shelves as Panasonic.
    >>
    >> This is just a guess and it is based on how I feel about it as well.
    >>
    >> John

    [SNIP]

    I don't know how it is with digital gear, John, but in still products, most
    Leica products are snapped up almost instantly by collectors, most of whom
    SEEM to have more money, than photo-capabilities IMHO. I've only known two
    pros, who used Leica. One was an early Life shooter, and had, at one time, the
    second largest collection of Leica in US. The other was a legacy, who shot for
    a local newspaper.

    Good gear with great optics, but it seems to end up in dark closets to be
    handed down from generation to generation, because mere mortals, can't get it
    in time, then the price has quadrupled, as the collectors sell off.

    Hunt
     
    Hunt, Aug 28, 2004
    #15
  16. Buster <> writes:

    > I work at a camera store. We are regularly visited by Nikon and Canon
    > Sales Reps. We have never seen a Panasonic rep. Panasonic recently
    > restructured their sales requirements and we can't even buy them
    > through an independent wholesaler. Panasonic only wants to deal with
    > extremely large accounts, therefore you will only see them in the big
    > chain stores.
    > Buster


    And the only really big chain store I've seen Panasonic in is Ritz/Wolf.

    --
    Michael Meissner
    email:
    http://www.the-meissners.org
     
    Michael Meissner, Aug 28, 2004
    #16
  17. On Fri, 27 Aug 2004 17:58:08 GMT, "John Doe" <>
    wrote:

    >Besides what was said I think most people looking to invest in a high-ish
    >end digital camera want to stick with a company that has a long history of
    >building cameras. That is companies like Nikon and Canon and even Olympus
    >(even though they seem to be falling behind). Panasonic on the other hand is
    >a recent entry in to cameras at least when compared to others.
    >
    >This is just a guess and it is based on how I feel about it as well.
    >
    >John
    >


    This is most likely true and mimics most human behavior. Sheep
    following sheep and lemmings running to the cliff. It's the same
    reason people still go on and on about PhotoShop yet it clearly lost
    the editor race somewhere back before v5.0. It's very difficult to
    change lemmings from their course. They must be and do what they
    are.

    When first entering the digital photography realm I saw the quality,
    design, and tests of the digital Nikons and quickly realized they
    were now only selling on their past name (which even back then was
    mostly publicity hype). It was easy to walk right past Nikon's
    digitals then, and still today. Others are unable to see beyond what
    they were brainwashed/taught/forced to see. Sighting only Canons and
    Nikons at the Olympics only brings to mind the old saying "Monkey
    see, monkey do".

    I don't blame them though, it's who and what they are -- lemmings
    and sheep. It's all they are and can ever be. The small percentage
    of humanity that doesn't follow the sheep's and lemmings' inbred
    instincts just have to find ways to tolerate and justify why they
    are like they are (the OP's posting motive, no doubt). Mostly, life
    is spent touching bases on occasion with others who know what
    freedom and quality really means. But more often it's just an
    endless series of shaking our heads and walking the other way from
    the mindless following masses.


    The specs (and past info from the FZ10) on the new Panasonic FZ20
    looks really nice. I hope to get to try one soon. Sure, it's not the
    same as my past favorite brand but then that company fell off my
    it's-worth-pursuing-grid when their recent "new and improved"
    changes destroyed the image quality of their previous models. Time
    to jump-ship and swim to better and newer shores.


    Aside: An amusing anecdote -- back in the late 70's I went to buy an
    SLR, I was highly interested in the new Olympus OM-2n at the time.
    Olympus was doing cutting-edge technology and innovations with
    better quality than any other maker. The sales-person was trying to
    push a Nikon on me. Yes, Nikons were still good cameras and optics
    back then (good, not best). But then he made a fatal sales error. He
    brought out a huge 3-ring binder of fine-print pages about 4 inches
    thick. Beaming proudly he said, "See this?! This is a list of ALL
    the thousands and thousands of repair shops that Nikon offers! You
    won't get THAT kind of support if you buy another brand!" I only
    looked at him strangely and asked, "Why do Nikon owners need all
    those thousands and thousands of repair shops?" He said nothing,
    deflatedly put his treasured book back under the counter, and
    eventually sold me the Olympus.

    Sometimes valuable clues come from unexpected sources if you look at
    them the right way. :)

    I'm glad I was so insistent and bought the Olympus back then, as I
    later discovered it was one of the first-run OM-2n's that didn't
    have the >10 minutes auto-exposure limit cut back to 2 minutes. Not
    soon after its release later models were being drastically crippled
    to 2 minutes max because inept photographers complained their
    cameras wouldn't also auto-compensate for reciprocity problems. What
    a loss to those that needed more than what whiners need. Not unlike
    the drastic loss that photographers took when Sony kowtowed to those
    that whined about F-7x7's "Night Shot" mode being used in daylight
    situations. 25 years later, thousands of rolls of film later, and I
    still have that Olympus camera and it still performs flawlessly --
    it's also never needed even one of those "thousands and thousands"
    of repair shops that brand-name-buyers (lemmings & sheep) proudly
    support and need.




    For those in the shake-your-head-and-walk-away category, here's a
    few preaching-to-the-choir quotes that you might like:


    "Man cannot discover new oceans unless he has the courage to lose
    sight of the shore." - Andre' Gide

    "Nature is as prolific with man as she is with the seeds of the
    maple, spores of the mushroom, and eggs of the salmon. To create one
    perfect man she must make a million boobs." -- naturalist Elbert
    Hubbard c. 1906

    "The poet, the artist, the sleuth -- whoever sharpens our perception
    tends to be antisocial ... He cannot go along with currents and
    trends." - Alfred North Whitehead

    "The shallowest streams make the loudest noise." - Unknown
    (This one easily explains the proliferation of Nikon/Canon posts)

    "At every crossway on the road that leads to the future, each
    progressive spirit is opposed by a thousand men appointed to guard
    the past." - Maeterlinck

    "The function of the expert is not to be more right than other
    people, but to be wrong for more sophisticated reasons." - David
    Butler

    "Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from
    mediocre minds." - Albert Einstein

    "Innovators and creative geniuses cannot be reared in schools. They
    are precisely the men who defy what the school has taught them." -
    Ludwig von Mises

    "There are none so lost -- as those who follow." - caMel
     
    JustPassinThru, Aug 28, 2004
    #17
  18. ABC

    Matt Ion Guest

    ABC wrote:

    > I roughly counted the topic of the threads in the NG. I would say
    > about 95% goes to Nikon and Canon.


    Nikon and Canon account for about 95% of the DSLR market, as well as the
    vast majority of the 35mm SLR market. There are plenty of other comers,
    particularly in the film arena, but Canon and Nikon have the widest
    range of equipment, which partially accounts for their wide portion of
    the market.

    Personally, my one overall favorite camera I've ever owned was a tough
    little Minolta X-700; all-manual except for very good AE, from what I've
    heard, it was the first SLR to include both aperture-priority and
    shutter-priority AE. Minolta also pioneered a lot of features in the AF
    SLR market, but they simply aren't as big as Nikon and Canon, and didn't
    have nearly the available number of lenses and add-ons.

    Nikon at one time, I remember, was listed in the Guinness Book of World
    Records as having the largest assortment of available, interchangeable
    accessories for 35mm SLRs.

    > Just for example, I have been looking at Panasonic. It is not that far
    > off in terms of performance and price. A few other brands seem not bad
    > too.
    >
    > Why is this? Any clue?


    Granted the brand selection is a lot broader and more even in the
    "pocket" digital market, but you'll notice a large percentage of the
    discussion here is on DSLRs... see above comment on Canon and Nikon's
    share of the DSLR market.

    This guy has some really good points on both Canon and Nikon and the
    (D)SLR market in general:
    http://photonotes.org/articles/why-canon/
     
    Matt Ion, Aug 28, 2004
    #18
  19. ABC

    Justin Thyme Guest

    "G. Innipig" <> wrote in message
    news:412f8f1a$0$20247$...
    > Ah right. Probably therefore has absolutely nothing to do with the quality
    > of the cameras or their results. I saw hundreds of Pentax/Minolta/Olympus
    > cameras in use by the pros at Athens ... NOT.

    Heard of herd mentality. Do you really think that you can't take good photos
    with Pentax/Minolta/Olympus?
    I heard a story once that illustrates this point. A young woman had just got
    married, and for thanksgiving day decided to cook a turkey. Her husband
    queried why she cut the legs and wings off the turkey before cooking it. She
    responded that that was the way her mother always cooked it. So a few days
    later the husband queried his mother-in-law as to why she cut the legs and
    wings off the turkey before cooking it, she responded that that is what her
    mother always did. So when the husband next saw the grandmother-in-law he
    asked her why - she pointed to her very old and small oven and said "the
    turkey won't fit in there with it's legs and wings on".
    >
    >
     
    Justin Thyme, Aug 28, 2004
    #19
  20. ABC

    ArtKramr Guest

    >Subject: Re: Why always Nikon and Canon? What's wrong with Panasonic?
    >From: JustPassinThru


    > I only
    >looked at him strangely and asked, "Why do Nikon owners need all
    >those thousands and thousands of repair shops?" He said nothing,
    >deflatedly put his treasured book back under the counter, and
    >eventually sold me the Olym


    A dealer will always push the brand that he:

    1 Has the highest profit for him
    2 He is overstocked with that brand
    3 The maker gives him the best PM's (push money)

    He always acts in his own best interests, not yours.


    Arthur Kramer
    344th BG 494th BS
    England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
    Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
    http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer
     
    ArtKramr, Aug 28, 2004
    #20
    1. Advertising

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