What is the f/16 rule ?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by RON, Nov 22, 2005.

  1. RON

    RON Guest

    I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.
    Thanks for your time
    RON, Nov 22, 2005
    #1
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  2. RON

    Guest

    RON wrote:

    > I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.


    Your answer can be found at www.justfuckinggoogleit.com

    > Thanks for your time


    You are most welcome.
    , Nov 22, 2005
    #2
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  3. RON

    Scott W Guest

    RON wrote:
    > I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.
    > Thanks for your time


    You are probably thinking of the Sunny 16 rule. If you are out in
    bright sun light you can get close to the right exposure by setting you
    f stop to 16 and shooting your shutter speed the same as 1 over your
    film's iso. As an example if you are shooting iso 400 you would
    shoot at 1/400. If you open your lens a couple of stops to f 8 you
    would shoot at 1/1600.

    This is clearly just a guess but it works ok in many cases.

    Scott
    Scott W, Nov 22, 2005
    #3
  4. On Tue, 22 Nov 2005 09:25:24 -0800, "RON" <>
    wrote:

    >I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.
    > Thanks for your time
    >


    In bright sun shutter speed is 1 over the ISO at f/16. It's some
    times called the "Sunny 16 rule."

    http://www.camerareview.com/templates/sunny16.cfm


    ******************************************************

    "I have been a witness, and these pictures are
    my testimony. The events I have recorded should
    not be forgotten and must not be repeated."

    -James Nachtwey-
    http://www.jamesnachtwey.com/
    John A. Stovall, Nov 22, 2005
    #4
  5. RON

    Bert Hyman Guest

    () wrote in
    news::

    > RON wrote:
    >
    >> I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.

    >
    > Your answer can be found at www.justfuckinggoogleit.com


    As can the answer to just about every question ever posed in this
    newsgroup, or any other newsgroup.

    Are you suggesting that the newsgroup be shut down?

    --
    Bert Hyman | St. Paul, MN |
    Bert Hyman, Nov 22, 2005
    #5
  6. RON

    Guest

    Bert Hyman wrote:

    > () wrote:
    >
    > > RON wrote:
    > >
    > >> I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.

    > >
    > > Your answer can be found at www.justfuckinggoogleit.com

    >
    > As can the answer to just about every question ever posed in this
    > newsgroup, or any other newsgroup.


    I early await your demonstration of this claim.

    > Are you suggesting that the newsgroup be shut down?


    Are you suggesting that it is not sound advice that any question should
    be first given to google? Just type the in, verbatim. What do you
    have to lose?
    , Nov 22, 2005
    #6
  7. RON

    Bert Hyman Guest

    () wrote in
    news::

    > Are you suggesting that it is not sound advice that any question
    > should be first given to google? Just type the in, verbatim. What
    > do you have to lose?


    The joy of having a conversation with the likes of you?

    --
    Bert Hyman | St. Paul, MN |
    Bert Hyman, Nov 22, 2005
    #7
  8. RON

    Matt Ion Guest

    wrote:
    > Bert Hyman wrote:
    >
    >
    >> () wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>RON wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.
    >>>
    >>>Your answer can be found at www.justfuckinggoogleit.com

    >>
    >>As can the answer to just about every question ever posed in this
    >>newsgroup, or any other newsgroup.

    >
    >
    > I early await your demonstration of this claim.


    Well, I googled "why is an asshole" and didn't get
    any sort of satisfactory response. Maybe someone here can answer it.


    ---
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    Matt Ion, Nov 22, 2005
    #8
  9. RON

    Guest

    Matt Ion wrote:

    > Well, I googled "why is an asshole" and didn't get
    > any sort of satisfactory response. Maybe someone here can answer it.


    See, Mr. Hyman, there is a use for the newsgroups after all!
    , Nov 22, 2005
    #9
  10. RON

    Spam Trap Guest

    On Tue, 22 Nov 2005 18:20:40 GMT, Matt Ion wrote:
    > wrote:
    >> Bert Hyman wrote:
    >>> () wrote:
    >>>>RON wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>>I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.
    >>>>
    >>>>Your answer can be found at www.justfuckinggoogleit.com
    >>>
    >>>As can the answer to just about every question ever posed in this
    >>>newsgroup, or any other newsgroup.

    >
    > Well, I googled "why is an asshole" and didn't get
    > any sort of satisfactory response. Maybe someone here can answer it.


    Try:
    http://www.google.com/search?as_q=eawckyegcy abuse&num=50
    Spam Trap, Nov 22, 2005
    #10
  11. RON

    Peter Guest

    RON wrote:
    > I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.
    > Thanks for your time



    The Sunny f/16 rule is the simplified exposure guide often printed
    on the inside of boxes of film or on film datasheets.

    For shutter speed of 1/exposure index

    f/22 - Bright sun on light sand or snow
    f/16 - Bright sun - distinct shadows
    f/11 - Sun with light haze - soft shadows
    f/8 - Cloudy Bright - Blue sky with sun behind white cloud - no shadows
    f/5.6 - Open shade - subject lit by about half the sky with no direct
    sun.

    During the middle part of the day these will usually be within
    about half-a-stop of the reading you would get with an exposure
    meter aimed at a grey card. Lots of people used this rule to shoot
    Kodachrome slides in the 40s and 50s without light meters and many of
    them had a pretty high success rate.

    Estimating light in the morning or evening or with grey skies is a lot
    trickier,
    but you can get reasonably good at it with practice provided that your
    recording medium has a bit of latitude.

    One reason for learning exposure estimation in an era where
    light meters are built into cameras is to provide a reality check on
    the reading your light meter gives you. If you get in the habit of
    making an exposure estimate before checking the meter, you will
    notice if your meter is giving you exposure information that doesn't
    make sense.

    With a digital camera where you can have instant feedback, the
    reality check is not as important as it is with film, but I don't think
    being aware of lighting conditions will ever stop being a useful skill
    for the photographer.

    Peter.
    --
    Peter, Nov 22, 2005
    #11
  12. RON

    Backbone Guest

    f/16th rule <-- never heard of such a thing!! However, a setting at f/16
    will give you a greater DOF or most of the image will be in focus.
    Perhaps you mean the reciprocity law?

    --
    There are no words that can be heard unless someone listens....
    Remove *flaps* to reply
    "RON" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.
    > Thanks for your time
    >
    >
    Backbone, Nov 22, 2005
    #12
  13. RON

    Jim Guest

    "Backbone" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > f/16th rule <-- never heard of such a thing!! However, a setting at f/16
    > will give you a greater DOF or most of the image will be in focus.
    > Perhaps you mean the reciprocity law?

    No, the OP meant the sunny 16 rule which prior posters have explained. By
    the way, the corresponding rule for scenes lit by moonlight (not of the
    moon - the sunny 16 rule applies) is sometimes called the mooney 8 rule.
    That is for a full moon.
    Jim
    >
    > --
    > There are no words that can be heard unless someone listens....
    > Remove *flaps* to reply
    > "RON" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.
    >> Thanks for your time
    >>
    >>

    >
    >
    Jim, Nov 22, 2005
    #13
  14. RON

    imbsysop Guest

    "Matt Ion" <> wrote in message
    news:YjJgf.576392$tl2.337188@pd7tw3no...
    > wrote:
    >> Bert Hyman wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>> () wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>RON wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.
    >>>>
    >>>>Your answer can be found at www.justfuckinggoogleit.com
    >>>
    >>>As can the answer to just about every question ever posed in this
    >>>newsgroup, or any other newsgroup.

    >>
    >>
    >> I early await your demonstration of this claim.

    >
    > Well, I googled "why is an asshole" and didn't get
    > any sort of satisfactory response. Maybe someone here can answer it.


    at least a google search first would cut out 75% of the redundant traffic in
    this group so one doesn't have to wade through the "same question again" mud
    all the time ..
    imbsysop, Nov 22, 2005
    #14
  15. RON

    AustinMN Guest

    AustinMN, Nov 22, 2005
    #15
  16. RON

    Mike Forrest Guest

    On 22 Nov 2005 11:03:27 -0800, "Peter" <> wrote:

    >RON wrote:
    >> I do not know the answer so to me this is not a dumb question.
    >> Thanks for your time

    >
    >
    >The Sunny f/16 rule is the simplified exposure guide often printed
    >on the inside of boxes of film or on film datasheets.
    >
    >For shutter speed of 1/exposure index
    >
    >f/22 - Bright sun on light sand or snow
    >f/16 - Bright sun - distinct shadows
    >f/11 - Sun with light haze - soft shadows
    >f/8 - Cloudy Bright - Blue sky with sun behind white cloud - no shadows
    >f/5.6 - Open shade - subject lit by about half the sky with no direct
    >sun.
    >
    >During the middle part of the day these will usually be within
    >about half-a-stop of the reading you would get with an exposure
    >meter aimed at a grey card. Lots of people used this rule to shoot
    >Kodachrome slides in the 40s and 50s without light meters and many of
    >them had a pretty high success rate.
    >
    >Estimating light in the morning or evening or with grey skies is a lot
    >trickier,
    >but you can get reasonably good at it with practice provided that your
    >recording medium has a bit of latitude.
    >
    >One reason for learning exposure estimation in an era where
    >light meters are built into cameras is to provide a reality check on
    >the reading your light meter gives you. If you get in the habit of
    >making an exposure estimate before checking the meter, you will
    >notice if your meter is giving you exposure information that doesn't
    >make sense.
    >
    >With a digital camera where you can have instant feedback, the
    >reality check is not as important as it is with film, but I don't think
    >being aware of lighting conditions will ever stop being a useful skill
    >for the photographer.
    >
    >Peter.


    Good explanation


    Add on from my film days:

    Look at the shadows:
    Distinct edges F16
    Clear shadow with fuzzy edges open one stop
    Shadow but cannot distinguish the edges open 2 stops
    No shadow or in open shade open three stops
    Side light open one stop
    Back light open 2 stops
    As mentioned above, the only way to beat this is to use a gray card
    and this takes time.

    For quick shoot such as kids etc this is much faster and more accurate
    than the light meter. In daylight, for Kodachrome 64 I would keep my
    camera on 250 at F8, aim, focus then shoot.

    Seems to work well on digital once you calibrate your camera. I am in
    the process of doing this (getting into digital) and am finding that I
    can open one stop and not max the highlights. Testing and time will
    tell.

    BTW it never hurts to ask questions, we were all beginners once and
    usually owe a debt to those who patiently answered our very basic
    questions.

    Hope this is of some help.

    Mike Forrest
    Mike Forrest, Nov 22, 2005
    #16
  17. RON

    Lorem Ipsum Guest

    Lorem Ipsum, Nov 22, 2005
    #17
  18. RON

    Scott W Guest

    Jim wrote:
    > "Backbone" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > f/16th rule <-- never heard of such a thing!! However, a setting at f/16
    > > will give you a greater DOF or most of the image will be in focus.
    > > Perhaps you mean the reciprocity law?

    > No, the OP meant the sunny 16 rule which prior posters have explained. By
    > the way, the corresponding rule for scenes lit by moonlight (not of the
    > moon - the sunny 16 rule applies) is sometimes called the mooney 8 rule.
    > That is for a full moon.
    > Jim


    Ok I have not heard about mooney 8. You are not trying to say that
    under moon light you would open the aperture two stops and be the same
    as in sun light? Under moon light, even full moon light, you need LONG
    exposures.

    Scott
    Scott W, Nov 22, 2005
    #18
  19. RON

    Peter Guest

    Scott W wrote:
    > Jim wrote:
    > > No, the OP meant the sunny 16 rule which prior posters have explained. By
    > > the way, the corresponding rule for scenes lit by moonlight (not of the
    > > moon - the sunny 16 rule applies) is sometimes called the mooney 8 rule.
    > > That is for a full moon.
    > > Jim

    >
    > Ok I have not heard about mooney 8. You are not trying to say that
    > under moon light you would open the aperture two stops and be the same
    > as in sun light? Under moon light, even full moon light, you need LONG
    > exposures.


    The full moon is about 18 stops dimmer than the sun. For film I would
    add a couple extra stops more for reciprocity failure. This should not
    be a concern with digital sensors.

    f/4 for something like 2-4 minutes ought to get you in the ballpark
    with a DSLR set to ISO 100. I don't know what the built-in exposure
    meters on digital cameras are like, but the ones on most film cameras
    tend to be either inoperative or inaccurate at such low light levels.

    There is some good info at Bob M's site:
    <http://medfmt.8k.com/mf/moonlight.html>

    Peter.
    --
    Peter, Nov 22, 2005
    #19
  20. RON

    ASAAR Guest

    On 22 Nov 2005 13:46:44 -0800, Scott W wrote:

    > Ok I have not heard about mooney 8. You are not trying to say that
    > under moon light you would open the aperture two stops and be the same
    > as in sun light? Under moon light, even full moon light, you need LONG
    > exposures.


    It *might* be a simple misunderstanding (by Jim, not you) but I'm
    not sure. You do need a much longer exposure to take pictures by
    moonlight. But if you want to take a picture of the moon (which is
    illuminated by the same sun that illuminates the earth), Mooney 8
    should do nicely. Maybe even Mooney 11. Or maybe he meant that you
    need a Mooney 8 minute exposure? <g> But by the same token, if he
    wants to take a picture of the surface of the sun, he'd better not
    try to use a similar variant of the Sunny 16 rule. :)
    ASAAR, Nov 22, 2005
    #20
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