'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over 'stolen'images,

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Rob, Jan 24, 2013.

  1. Rob

    Rob Guest

    Its worth reading the article and viewing some of the images.


    http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...s-vent-over-stolen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html

    ..........................................................................


    'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over 'stolen' images

    Karena Colquhoun found her firm’s logo being used on a billboard to
    promote an exhibition at the Shanghai Art Museum.

    Karena Colquhoun found her firm's logo being used on a billboard to
    promote an exhibition.

    How's this for frustrating: you're an Australian graphic designer and
    you find your work used without permission on a billboard to advertise
    an art exhibition in China.

    This is what happened to graphic designer Karena Colquhoun – and she's
    not alone in feeling robbed.

    A story last week about the duping of a Newcastle artist's photo,
    without permission, onto thousands of T-shirts to be sold at menswear
    giant Lowes, prompted emails from dozens of angry artists with similar
    stories.
    Sheila Smart had a UK police department steal her image for a brochure
    on bicycle theft.

    Sheila Smart found a UK police department steal her image for a brochure
    on bicycle theft.

    They reported having their images stolen from the internet without their
    permission and placed, sometimes with small modifications, on T-shirts,
    websites, cigarette cases, stickers, phone covers, posters promoting
    nightclubs, CD album covers and even hardcover books.
    Advertisement

    But fighting copyright infringements was fraught with difficulty, they
    said: offenders often pleaded ignorance, refused to compensate them and
    wouldn't pull the infringing content.

    They said those that were contrite offered very little compensation –
    unless sued.
    Peter Coulson of Victoria has also found one of his photographs in use
    on a T-shirt sold by Nena & Pasadena.

    Peter Coulson found one of his photographs in use on a T-shirt sold by
    Nena & Pasadena.

    Karena Colquhoun, who runs Magic Jelly, an Adelaide design company, last
    year found its logo being used in an adapted form on a billboard to
    promote an exhibition at the Shanghai Art Museum.

    "It's both bizarre and very upsetting to see your work taken without
    permission, so that you not only are not compensated, but lose your
    right to consent and control the quality and context of your work," she
    said.

    Colquhoun discovered the plagiarism using Google's "Search by Image" and
    TinEye's "Reverse Image Search".
    "Complete and utter disbelief" ... photographer Naomi Frost.

    Photographer Naomi Frost had a photo of hers used on shirts sold at
    Lowes. Photo: Dean Osland

    "Every so often I'll randomly search my images, and I always find people
    using them without permission," Colquhoun said.

    Sheila Smart, a professional Sydney photographer, was among the few who
    said they had successfully litigated against offenders.

    A UK police department that used a snapshot of hers in a brochure about
    crime settled for a "fairly large sum" – about ten times more than what
    a legitimate licensing would have cost.
    Sheila Smart found one of her images on the front cover of a Romanian
    book title.

    Sheila Smart found one of her images on the front cover of a Turkish
    book title.

    She has also settled several cases in the US and Canada (with 10 still
    pending). One involved a company that settled with her US lawyer without
    any negotiation when she found a popular image of hers on their Facebook
    page. It cost them $8500.

    In Europe, she has negotiated a $1700 payment from Romanian publishers
    that used one of her images on the front of a book.

    Smart said she didn't pursue Australian offenders as often because laws
    here meant she was only entitled to what she would have received had
    they licensed the image legitimately – unless she could prove "wilful use".
    Norman Pelaez's friends found pictures of his wedding on Sydney busses
    last year being used to advertise a photographer's business who did not
    have anything to do with the images.

    Norman Pelaez's friends found pictures of his wedding on buses
    advertising a photographer's business.

    However, in one instance, a state government tourism website that used
    her images settled for a "nice sum".

    Others have not been so fortunate. Adam Jackson of Tuggerah on the
    Central Coast in NSW said he had a photo of a car taken without
    permission from his website and put on T-shirts sold at Kmart, with the
    car's number plate still visible.

    The owner of the car was "extremely upset" about this, and when Jackson
    contacted the Victorian business who sold the T-shirt to Kmart, he said
    they told him that because his website was free to access, they could do
    what they wanted with his photograph.
    Adam Jackson of Tuggerah in NSW had a photo of a car taken without
    permission from his website about two years ago and put on T-shirts sold
    at Kmart.

    Adam Jackson had a photo of a car taken from his website without
    permission and put on a T-shirt.

    "Since I did not have the money to take this further, nothing has come
    of it yet," Jackson said.

    He added that Kmart were of no help either and said it was "not their
    problem and simply shrugged me off".

    Barbara Read, who lives in British Columbia, Canada, said she regularly
    tracked the unauthorised use of her photos and found them "all over the
    place".
    Harmony Nicholas of Adelaide has been fighting to stop businesses
    stealing her photos and putting them on T-shirts.

    Harmony Nicholas is fighting to stop businesses stealing her model's
    photos and putting them on T-shirts.

    She warned other photographers that low-resolution images, watermarks
    and copyright notices did nothing to stop people from using her images.
    "Folks better expect to lose control of [their photographs] if they post
    them online," she said.

    "There are sophisticated software programs available to upsize small
    images with excellent results and most copyright notices are easily
    cloned or cropped out."

    Harmony Nicholas of Adelaide has been fighting to stop businesses
    stealing her photos and putting them on T-shirts. She's had no luck
    getting compensation and had little success trying to stop those who
    stole from her.
    A photograph Barbara Read of British Columbia, Canada too which was
    taken by Romanian book publisher Editura Herald and used on a book’s cover.

    Barbara Read caught a Romanian book publisher using a picture of hers on
    a book cover.

    "We're being screwed left, right and centre purely because we just have
    our images out there," she said.

    Nicholas first found out about her photos being stolen from a friend who
    in 2010 was on holiday in Brisbane. "She was walking past one of the
    shops and snapped on her phone a picture of a singlet that was in a
    window that [had on it my photograph] of model Sabina Kelley colouring
    in her tattoos with textas," Nicholas said.

    Since then Nicholas has discovered about six of her photos on T-shirts
    and is now reluctant to publish her work online, especially as she
    lacked the money to pursue legal action.
    Photographer Sheila Smart.

    Photographer Sheila Smart.

    Peter Coulson of Victoria said he had also found one of his photographs
    in use on a T-shirt sold by Nena & Pasadena, and others on a giant
    screen behind American heavy metal band Mötley Crüe, when they performed
    during their worldwide concerts.

    When he contacted Nena & Pasadena in 2011 about the infringing photo
    they used, he said they offered him $200 to continue to use it on their
    T-shirts. He refused the offer and requested the company destroy all
    infringing stock, and they complied.

    In a statement provided to Melbourne's Herald Sun in 2011, management
    for Nena and Pasadena blamed a rogue designer for the mix-up. The
    company said the design, called "The Night'', would never make it into
    shops.

    Mötley Crüe's infringement was still under investigation, Coulson said.

    Other examples of copyright infringement included:

    * A Sydney wedding photographer who used another photographer's wedding
    photos to advertise their services after finding them online. (After a
    letter and phone call requesting the removal of all of the images, the
    photographer complied.)

    * A couple who dressed up for a costume party and posted the photo on
    Flickr, then found themselves in a local club's advertising material.

    * Book publishers using photos without permission – even using them as
    cover images.

    Read more:
    http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...olen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html#ixzz2IsoYhXih
    Rob, Jan 24, 2013
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Rob

    Chris Baird Guest

    Chris Baird, Jan 24, 2013
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Rob

    John A. Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over 'stolen' images,

    On Thu, 24 Jan 2013 20:26:53 +1100, Rob <>
    wrote:

    >
    >Its worth reading the article and viewing some of the images.
    >
    >
    >http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...s-vent-over-stolen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html
    >
    >.........................................................................
    >
    >
    >'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over 'stolen' images
    >
    >Karena Colquhoun found her firm’s logo being used on a billboard to
    >promote an exhibition at the Shanghai Art Museum.
    >
    >Karena Colquhoun found her firm's logo being used on a billboard to
    >promote an exhibition.
    >
    >How's this for frustrating: you're an Australian graphic designer and
    >you find your work used without permission on a billboard to advertise
    >an art exhibition in China.
    >
    >This is what happened to graphic designer Karena Colquhoun – and she's
    >not alone in feeling robbed.
    >
    >A story last week about the duping of a Newcastle artist's photo,
    >without permission, onto thousands of T-shirts to be sold at menswear
    >giant Lowes, prompted emails from dozens of angry artists with similar
    >stories.
    >Sheila Smart had a UK police department steal her image for a brochure
    >on bicycle theft.
    >
    >Sheila Smart found a UK police department steal her image for a brochure
    >on bicycle theft.
    >
    >They reported having their images stolen from the internet without their
    >permission and placed, sometimes with small modifications, on T-shirts,
    >websites, cigarette cases, stickers, phone covers, posters promoting
    >nightclubs, CD album covers and even hardcover books.
    >Advertisement
    >
    >But fighting copyright infringements was fraught with difficulty, they
    >said: offenders often pleaded ignorance, refused to compensate them and
    >wouldn't pull the infringing content.
    >
    >They said those that were contrite offered very little compensation –
    >unless sued.
    >Peter Coulson of Victoria has also found one of his photographs in use
    >on a T-shirt sold by Nena & Pasadena.
    >
    >Peter Coulson found one of his photographs in use on a T-shirt sold by
    >Nena & Pasadena.
    >
    >Karena Colquhoun, who runs Magic Jelly, an Adelaide design company, last
    >year found its logo being used in an adapted form on a billboard to
    >promote an exhibition at the Shanghai Art Museum.
    >
    >"It's both bizarre and very upsetting to see your work taken without
    >permission, so that you not only are not compensated, but lose your
    >right to consent and control the quality and context of your work," she
    >said.
    >
    >Colquhoun discovered the plagiarism using Google's "Search by Image" and
    >TinEye's "Reverse Image Search".
    >"Complete and utter disbelief" ... photographer Naomi Frost.
    >
    >Photographer Naomi Frost had a photo of hers used on shirts sold at
    >Lowes. Photo: Dean Osland
    >
    >"Every so often I'll randomly search my images, and I always find people
    >using them without permission," Colquhoun said.
    >
    >Sheila Smart, a professional Sydney photographer, was among the few who
    >said they had successfully litigated against offenders.
    >
    >A UK police department that used a snapshot of hers in a brochure about
    >crime settled for a "fairly large sum" – about ten times more than what
    >a legitimate licensing would have cost.
    >Sheila Smart found one of her images on the front cover of a Romanian
    >book title.
    >
    >Sheila Smart found one of her images on the front cover of a Turkish
    >book title.
    >
    >She has also settled several cases in the US and Canada (with 10 still
    >pending). One involved a company that settled with her US lawyer without
    >any negotiation when she found a popular image of hers on their Facebook
    >page. It cost them $8500.
    >
    >In Europe, she has negotiated a $1700 payment from Romanian publishers
    >that used one of her images on the front of a book.
    >
    >Smart said she didn't pursue Australian offenders as often because laws
    >here meant she was only entitled to what she would have received had
    >they licensed the image legitimately – unless she could prove "wilful use".
    >Norman Pelaez's friends found pictures of his wedding on Sydney busses
    >last year being used to advertise a photographer's business who did not
    >have anything to do with the images.
    >
    >Norman Pelaez's friends found pictures of his wedding on buses
    >advertising a photographer's business.
    >
    >However, in one instance, a state government tourism website that used
    >her images settled for a "nice sum".
    >
    >Others have not been so fortunate. Adam Jackson of Tuggerah on the
    >Central Coast in NSW said he had a photo of a car taken without
    >permission from his website and put on T-shirts sold at Kmart, with the
    >car's number plate still visible.
    >
    >The owner of the car was "extremely upset" about this, and when Jackson
    >contacted the Victorian business who sold the T-shirt to Kmart, he said
    >they told him that because his website was free to access, they could do
    >what they wanted with his photograph.
    >Adam Jackson of Tuggerah in NSW had a photo of a car taken without
    >permission from his website about two years ago and put on T-shirts sold
    >at Kmart.
    >
    >Adam Jackson had a photo of a car taken from his website without
    >permission and put on a T-shirt.
    >
    >"Since I did not have the money to take this further, nothing has come
    >of it yet," Jackson said.
    >
    >He added that Kmart were of no help either and said it was "not their
    >problem and simply shrugged me off".
    >
    >Barbara Read, who lives in British Columbia, Canada, said she regularly
    >tracked the unauthorised use of her photos and found them "all over the
    >place".
    >Harmony Nicholas of Adelaide has been fighting to stop businesses
    >stealing her photos and putting them on T-shirts.
    >
    >Harmony Nicholas is fighting to stop businesses stealing her model's
    >photos and putting them on T-shirts.
    >
    >She warned other photographers that low-resolution images, watermarks
    >and copyright notices did nothing to stop people from using her images.
    >"Folks better expect to lose control of [their photographs] if they post
    >them online," she said.
    >
    >"There are sophisticated software programs available to upsize small
    >images with excellent results and most copyright notices are easily
    >cloned or cropped out."
    >
    >Harmony Nicholas of Adelaide has been fighting to stop businesses
    >stealing her photos and putting them on T-shirts. She's had no luck
    >getting compensation and had little success trying to stop those who
    >stole from her.
    >A photograph Barbara Read of British Columbia, Canada too which was
    >taken by Romanian book publisher Editura Herald and used on a book’s cover.
    >
    >Barbara Read caught a Romanian book publisher using a picture of hers on
    >a book cover.
    >
    >"We're being screwed left, right and centre purely because we just have
    >our images out there," she said.
    >
    >Nicholas first found out about her photos being stolen from a friend who
    >in 2010 was on holiday in Brisbane. "She was walking past one of the
    >shops and snapped on her phone a picture of a singlet that was in a
    >window that [had on it my photograph] of model Sabina Kelley colouring
    >in her tattoos with textas," Nicholas said.
    >
    >Since then Nicholas has discovered about six of her photos on T-shirts
    >and is now reluctant to publish her work online, especially as she
    >lacked the money to pursue legal action.
    >Photographer Sheila Smart.
    >
    >Photographer Sheila Smart.
    >
    >Peter Coulson of Victoria said he had also found one of his photographs
    >in use on a T-shirt sold by Nena & Pasadena, and others on a giant
    >screen behind American heavy metal band Mötley Crüe, when they performed
    >during their worldwide concerts.
    >
    >When he contacted Nena & Pasadena in 2011 about the infringing photo
    >they used, he said they offered him $200 to continue to use it on their
    >T-shirts. He refused the offer and requested the company destroy all
    >infringing stock, and they complied.
    >
    >In a statement provided to Melbourne's Herald Sun in 2011, management
    >for Nena and Pasadena blamed a rogue designer for the mix-up. The
    >company said the design, called "The Night'', would never make it into
    >shops.
    >
    >Mötley Crüe's infringement was still under investigation, Coulson said.
    >
    >Other examples of copyright infringement included:
    >
    >* A Sydney wedding photographer who used another photographer's wedding
    >photos to advertise their services after finding them online. (After a
    >letter and phone call requesting the removal of all of the images, the
    >photographer complied.)
    >
    >* A couple who dressed up for a costume party and posted the photo on
    >Flickr, then found themselves in a local club's advertising material.
    >
    >* Book publishers using photos without permission – even using them as
    >cover images.
    >
    >Read more:
    >http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...olen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html#ixzz2IsoYhXih
    >


    Much of the problem boils down to two things:

    1. Ignorance: too many people equating easy access with free use.
    One solution, if partial, is the obvious one of greater public
    education efforts.
    (Note, though, that ignorance is, in a way, a valid excuse IF it's a
    case of an "apparent agent" - a 3rd party claiming to own the work
    granting or selling the right to use it. In such case it is held to be
    that 3rd party who stole it, not the user, so no penalty or payment to
    the artist is required, though I can see stopping further use.)

    2. The law not being enforced because the little guy lacks the
    resources to do so.
    I'm thinking there needs to be some sort of public resource for
    pursuing these cases, such as empowering law enforcement to
    investigate them as crimes akin to fraud of a corresponding magnitude.
    John A., Jan 25, 2013
    #3
  4. Rob

    Whisky-dave Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    On Friday, January 25, 2013 10:16:53 AM UTC, John A. wrote:
    > On Thu, 24 Jan 2013 20:26:53 +1100, Rob <>
    >
    > wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > >

    >
    > >Its worth reading the article and viewing some of the images.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >

    >
    > >http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...s-vent-over-stolen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html

    >
    > >

    >
    > >..........................................................................

    >
    > >

    >
    > >

    >
    > >'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over 'stolen' images

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Karena Colquhoun found her firm�s logo being used on a billboardto

    >
    > >promote an exhibition at the Shanghai Art Museum.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Karena Colquhoun found her firm's logo being used on a billboard to

    >
    > >promote an exhibition.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >How's this for frustrating: you're an Australian graphic designer and

    >
    > >you find your work used without permission on a billboard to advertise

    >
    > >an art exhibition in China.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >This is what happened to graphic designer Karena Colquhoun � andshe's

    >
    > >not alone in feeling robbed.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >A story last week about the duping of a Newcastle artist's photo,

    >
    > >without permission, onto thousands of T-shirts to be sold at menswear

    >
    > >giant Lowes, prompted emails from dozens of angry artists with similar

    >
    > >stories.

    >
    > >Sheila Smart had a UK police department steal her image for a brochure

    >
    > >on bicycle theft.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Sheila Smart found a UK police department steal her image for a brochure

    >
    > >on bicycle theft.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >They reported having their images stolen from the internet without their

    >
    > >permission and placed, sometimes with small modifications, on T-shirts,

    >
    > >websites, cigarette cases, stickers, phone covers, posters promoting

    >
    > >nightclubs, CD album covers and even hardcover books.

    >
    > >Advertisement

    >
    > >

    >
    > >But fighting copyright infringements was fraught with difficulty, they

    >
    > >said: offenders often pleaded ignorance, refused to compensate them and

    >
    > >wouldn't pull the infringing content.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >They said those that were contrite offered very little compensation �

    >
    > >unless sued.

    >
    > >Peter Coulson of Victoria has also found one of his photographs in use

    >
    > >on a T-shirt sold by Nena & Pasadena.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Peter Coulson found one of his photographs in use on a T-shirt sold by

    >
    > >Nena & Pasadena.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Karena Colquhoun, who runs Magic Jelly, an Adelaide design company, last

    >
    > >year found its logo being used in an adapted form on a billboard to

    >
    > >promote an exhibition at the Shanghai Art Museum.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >"It's both bizarre and very upsetting to see your work taken without

    >
    > >permission, so that you not only are not compensated, but lose your

    >
    > >right to consent and control the quality and context of your work," she

    >
    > >said.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Colquhoun discovered the plagiarism using Google's "Search by Image" and

    >
    > >TinEye's "Reverse Image Search".

    >
    > >"Complete and utter disbelief" ... photographer Naomi Frost.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Photographer Naomi Frost had a photo of hers used on shirts sold at

    >
    > >Lowes. Photo: Dean Osland

    >
    > >

    >
    > >"Every so often I'll randomly search my images, and I always find people

    >
    > >using them without permission," Colquhoun said.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Sheila Smart, a professional Sydney photographer, was among the few who

    >
    > >said they had successfully litigated against offenders.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >A UK police department that used a snapshot of hers in a brochure about

    >
    > >crime settled for a "fairly large sum" � about ten times more than what

    >
    > >a legitimate licensing would have cost.

    >
    > >Sheila Smart found one of her images on the front cover of a Romanian

    >
    > >book title.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Sheila Smart found one of her images on the front cover of a Turkish

    >
    > >book title.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >She has also settled several cases in the US and Canada (with 10 still

    >
    > >pending). One involved a company that settled with her US lawyer without

    >
    > >any negotiation when she found a popular image of hers on their Facebook

    >
    > >page. It cost them $8500.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >In Europe, she has negotiated a $1700 payment from Romanian publishers

    >
    > >that used one of her images on the front of a book.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Smart said she didn't pursue Australian offenders as often because laws

    >
    > >here meant she was only entitled to what she would have received had

    >
    > >they licensed the image legitimately � unless she could prove "wilful use".

    >
    > >Norman Pelaez's friends found pictures of his wedding on Sydney busses

    >
    > >last year being used to advertise a photographer's business who did not

    >
    > >have anything to do with the images.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Norman Pelaez's friends found pictures of his wedding on buses

    >
    > >advertising a photographer's business.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >However, in one instance, a state government tourism website that used

    >
    > >her images settled for a "nice sum".

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Others have not been so fortunate. Adam Jackson of Tuggerah on the

    >
    > >Central Coast in NSW said he had a photo of a car taken without

    >
    > >permission from his website and put on T-shirts sold at Kmart, with the

    >
    > >car's number plate still visible.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >The owner of the car was "extremely upset" about this, and when Jackson

    >
    > >contacted the Victorian business who sold the T-shirt to Kmart, he said

    >
    > >they told him that because his website was free to access, they could do

    >
    > >what they wanted with his photograph.

    >
    > >Adam Jackson of Tuggerah in NSW had a photo of a car taken without

    >
    > >permission from his website about two years ago and put on T-shirts sold

    >
    > >at Kmart.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Adam Jackson had a photo of a car taken from his website without

    >
    > >permission and put on a T-shirt.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >"Since I did not have the money to take this further, nothing has come

    >
    > >of it yet," Jackson said.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >He added that Kmart were of no help either and said it was "not their

    >
    > >problem and simply shrugged me off".

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Barbara Read, who lives in British Columbia, Canada, said she regularly

    >
    > >tracked the unauthorised use of her photos and found them "all over the

    >
    > >place".

    >
    > >Harmony Nicholas of Adelaide has been fighting to stop businesses

    >
    > >stealing her photos and putting them on T-shirts.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Harmony Nicholas is fighting to stop businesses stealing her model's

    >
    > >photos and putting them on T-shirts.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >She warned other photographers that low-resolution images, watermarks

    >
    > >and copyright notices did nothing to stop people from using her images.

    >
    > >"Folks better expect to lose control of [their photographs] if they post

    >
    > >them online," she said.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >"There are sophisticated software programs available to upsize small

    >
    > >images with excellent results and most copyright notices are easily

    >
    > >cloned or cropped out."

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Harmony Nicholas of Adelaide has been fighting to stop businesses

    >
    > >stealing her photos and putting them on T-shirts. She's had no luck

    >
    > >getting compensation and had little success trying to stop those who

    >
    > >stole from her.

    >
    > >A photograph Barbara Read of British Columbia, Canada too which was

    >
    > >taken by Romanian book publisher Editura Herald and used on a book�s cover.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Barbara Read caught a Romanian book publisher using a picture of hers on

    >
    > >a book cover.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >"We're being screwed left, right and centre purely because we just have

    >
    > >our images out there," she said.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Nicholas first found out about her photos being stolen from a friend who

    >
    > >in 2010 was on holiday in Brisbane. "She was walking past one of the

    >
    > >shops and snapped on her phone a picture of a singlet that was in a

    >
    > >window that [had on it my photograph] of model Sabina Kelley colouring

    >
    > >in her tattoos with textas," Nicholas said.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Since then Nicholas has discovered about six of her photos on T-shirts

    >
    > >and is now reluctant to publish her work online, especially as she

    >
    > >lacked the money to pursue legal action.

    >
    > >Photographer Sheila Smart.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Photographer Sheila Smart.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Peter Coulson of Victoria said he had also found one of his photographs

    >
    > >in use on a T-shirt sold by Nena & Pasadena, and others on a giant

    >
    > >screen behind American heavy metal band M�tley Cr�e, when they performed

    >
    > >during their worldwide concerts.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >When he contacted Nena & Pasadena in 2011 about the infringing photo

    >
    > >they used, he said they offered him $200 to continue to use it on their

    >
    > >T-shirts. He refused the offer and requested the company destroy all

    >
    > >infringing stock, and they complied.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >In a statement provided to Melbourne's Herald Sun in 2011, management

    >
    > >for Nena and Pasadena blamed a rogue designer for the mix-up. The

    >
    > >company said the design, called "The Night'', would never make it into

    >
    > >shops.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >M�tley Cr�e's infringement was still under investigation, Coulson said.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Other examples of copyright infringement included:

    >
    > >

    >
    > >* A Sydney wedding photographer who used another photographer's wedding

    >
    > >photos to advertise their services after finding them online. (After a

    >
    > >letter and phone call requesting the removal of all of the images, the

    >
    > >photographer complied.)

    >
    > >

    >
    > >* A couple who dressed up for a costume party and posted the photo on

    >
    > >Flickr, then found themselves in a local club's advertising material.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >* Book publishers using photos without permission � even using them as

    >
    > >cover images.

    >
    > >

    >
    > >Read more:

    >
    > >http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...olen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html#ixzz2IsoYhXih

    >
    > >

    >
    >
    >
    > Much of the problem boils down to two things:
    >
    >
    >
    > 1. Ignorance: too many people equating easy access with free use.
    >
    > One solution, if partial, is the obvious one of greater public
    >
    > education efforts.


    Would that really help the avergae person. What would this education be notto post to flickr, not to facebook in fact never put yuor images anywhere others can see them.


    >
    > (Note, though, that ignorance is, in a way, a valid excuse IF it's a
    >
    > case of an "apparent agent" - a 3rd party claiming to own the work
    >
    > granting or selling the right to use it. In such case it is held to be
    >
    > that 3rd party who stole it, not the user, so no penalty or payment to
    >
    > the artist is required, though I can see stopping further use.)
    >
    >
    >
    > 2. The law not being enforced because the little guy lacks the
    >
    > resources to do so.
    >
    > I'm thinking there needs to be some sort of public resource for
    >
    > pursuing these cases, such as empowering law enforcement to
    >
    > investigate them as crimes akin to fraud of a corresponding magnitude.


    Who pays for such things that's the main point.
    Must be plenty of solicitors/lawyers etc.. willing to work for nothing ;-)
    Whisky-dave, Jan 25, 2013
    #4
  5. Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over 'stolen' images,

    Whisky-dave <> wrote:
    > On Friday, January 25, 2013 10:16:53 AM UTC, John A. wrote:
    >> On Thu, 24 Jan 2013 20:26:53 +1100, Rob <>
    >>
    >> wrote:
    >> >Its worth reading the article and viewing some of the images.

    >>
    >> >http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...s-vent-over-stolen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html


    [snip]

    > Who pays for such things that's the main point.
    > Must be plenty of solicitors/lawyers etc.. willing to work for nothing ;-)


    I was recently talking to a friend who's a lawyer about protecting my
    photographs from unauthorised use. For example I currently have a lot
    of images on Flickr. I declare that I reserve all rights and those
    wishing to use my images should get in touch, but there's nothing
    except conscience to stop anyone from stealing them. Should I perhaps
    add a copyright watermark to the image itself?

    "Wrong strategy!" he said. "You'll make FAR more money than you'd get
    from selling your images by letting people steal them and then suing
    them!"
    Chris Malcolm, Jan 25, 2013
    #5
  6. Rob

    Whisky-dave Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    On Friday, January 25, 2013 1:44:10 PM UTC, Chris Malcolm wrote:
    > Whisky-dave <> wrote:
    >
    > > On Friday, January 25, 2013 10:16:53 AM UTC, John A. wrote:

    >
    > >> On Thu, 24 Jan 2013 20:26:53 +1100, Rob <>

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >> wrote:

    >
    > >> >Its worth reading the article and viewing some of the images.

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >> >http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...s-vent-over-stolen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html

    >
    >
    >
    > [snip]
    >
    >
    >
    > > Who pays for such things that's the main point.

    >
    > > Must be plenty of solicitors/lawyers etc.. willing to work for nothing ;-)

    >
    >
    >
    > I was recently talking to a friend who's a lawyer about protecting my
    >
    > photographs from unauthorised use. For example I currently have a lot
    >
    > of images on Flickr. I declare that I reserve all rights and those
    >
    > wishing to use my images should get in touch, but there's nothing
    >
    > except conscience to stop anyone from stealing them. Should I perhaps
    >
    > add a copyright watermark to the image itself?
    >
    >
    >
    > "Wrong strategy!" he said. "You'll make FAR more money than you'd get
    >
    > from selling your images by letting people steal them and then suing
    >
    > them!"


    of course he'll say that as he'll make a fair bit from such a thing he'll make nothing if the watermarks effect an image enough for it not to be used.

    Sounds very much like certain investment bankers saying how wonderful wind farms are regarding the furtue or renewable energy.
    Whisky-dave, Jan 25, 2013
    #6
  7. Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    The problem is common sense:

    If you don't want your pictures to be used without payment,
    only show them to prospective buyers in hard copy form where
    you retain physical possession, or, if on the web, in
    uselessly small versions (smaller than say 80 pixels
    smallest dimension.) If you sell them for digital use
    in large size, make sure you get enough to cover their
    value from the first sale.

    Or else be a billion dollar corporation than can afford
    to intimidate.

    Doug McDonald
    Doug McDonald, Jan 25, 2013
    #7
  8. Rob

    GMAN Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over 'stolen' images,

    In article <>, John A. <> wrote:
    >On Thu, 24 Jan 2013 20:26:53 +1100, Rob <>
    >wrote:
    >
    >>
    >>Its worth reading the article and viewing some of the images.
    >>
    >>
    >>http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/were-being-screwed-photograph

    >ers-and-designers-vent-over-stolen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html
    >>
    >>.........................................................................
    >>
    >>
    >>'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over 'stolen' images
    >>
    >>Karena Colquhoun found her firm’s logo being used on a billboard to
    >>promote an exhibition at the Shanghai Art Museum.
    >>
    >>Karena Colquhoun found her firm's logo being used on a billboard to
    >>promote an exhibition.
    >>
    >>How's this for frustrating: you're an Australian graphic designer and
    >>you find your work used without permission on a billboard to advertise
    >>an art exhibition in China.
    >>
    >>This is what happened to graphic designer Karena Colquhoun – and she's
    >>not alone in feeling robbed.
    >>
    >>A story last week about the duping of a Newcastle artist's photo,
    >>without permission, onto thousands of T-shirts to be sold at menswear
    >>giant Lowes, prompted emails from dozens of angry artists with similar
    >>stories.
    >>Sheila Smart had a UK police department steal her image for a brochure
    >>on bicycle theft.
    >>
    >>Sheila Smart found a UK police department steal her image for a brochure
    >>on bicycle theft.
    >>
    >>They reported having their images stolen from the internet without their
    >>permission and placed, sometimes with small modifications, on T-shirts,
    >>websites, cigarette cases, stickers, phone covers, posters promoting
    >>nightclubs, CD album covers and even hardcover books.
    >>Advertisement
    >>
    >>But fighting copyright infringements was fraught with difficulty, they
    >>said: offenders often pleaded ignorance, refused to compensate them and
    >>wouldn't pull the infringing content.
    >>
    >>They said those that were contrite offered very little compensation –
    >>unless sued.
    >>Peter Coulson of Victoria has also found one of his photographs in use
    >>on a T-shirt sold by Nena & Pasadena.
    >>
    >>Peter Coulson found one of his photographs in use on a T-shirt sold by
    >>Nena & Pasadena.
    >>
    >>Karena Colquhoun, who runs Magic Jelly, an Adelaide design company, last
    >>year found its logo being used in an adapted form on a billboard to
    >>promote an exhibition at the Shanghai Art Museum.
    >>
    >>"It's both bizarre and very upsetting to see your work taken without
    >>permission, so that you not only are not compensated, but lose your
    >>right to consent and control the quality and context of your work," she
    >>said.
    >>
    >>Colquhoun discovered the plagiarism using Google's "Search by Image" and
    >>TinEye's "Reverse Image Search".
    >>"Complete and utter disbelief" ... photographer Naomi Frost.
    >>
    >>Photographer Naomi Frost had a photo of hers used on shirts sold at
    >>Lowes. Photo: Dean Osland
    >>
    >>"Every so often I'll randomly search my images, and I always find people
    >>using them without permission," Colquhoun said.
    >>
    >>Sheila Smart, a professional Sydney photographer, was among the few who
    >>said they had successfully litigated against offenders.
    >>
    >>A UK police department that used a snapshot of hers in a brochure about
    >>crime settled for a "fairly large sum" – about ten times more than what
    >>a legitimate licensing would have cost.
    >>Sheila Smart found one of her images on the front cover of a Romanian
    >>book title.
    >>
    >>Sheila Smart found one of her images on the front cover of a Turkish
    >>book title.
    >>
    >>She has also settled several cases in the US and Canada (with 10 still
    >>pending). One involved a company that settled with her US lawyer without
    >>any negotiation when she found a popular image of hers on their Facebook
    >>page. It cost them $8500.
    >>
    >>In Europe, she has negotiated a $1700 payment from Romanian publishers
    >>that used one of her images on the front of a book.
    >>
    >>Smart said she didn't pursue Australian offenders as often because laws
    >>here meant she was only entitled to what she would have received had
    >>they licensed the image legitimately – unless she could prove "wilful use".
    >>Norman Pelaez's friends found pictures of his wedding on Sydney busses
    >>last year being used to advertise a photographer's business who did not
    >>have anything to do with the images.
    >>
    >>Norman Pelaez's friends found pictures of his wedding on buses
    >>advertising a photographer's business.
    >>
    >>However, in one instance, a state government tourism website that used
    >>her images settled for a "nice sum".
    >>
    >>Others have not been so fortunate. Adam Jackson of Tuggerah on the
    >>Central Coast in NSW said he had a photo of a car taken without
    >>permission from his website and put on T-shirts sold at Kmart, with the
    >>car's number plate still visible.
    >>
    >>The owner of the car was "extremely upset" about this, and when Jackson
    >>contacted the Victorian business who sold the T-shirt to Kmart, he said
    >>they told him that because his website was free to access, they could do
    >>what they wanted with his photograph.
    >>Adam Jackson of Tuggerah in NSW had a photo of a car taken without
    >>permission from his website about two years ago and put on T-shirts sold
    >>at Kmart.
    >>
    >>Adam Jackson had a photo of a car taken from his website without
    >>permission and put on a T-shirt.
    >>
    >>"Since I did not have the money to take this further, nothing has come
    >>of it yet," Jackson said.
    >>
    >>He added that Kmart were of no help either and said it was "not their
    >>problem and simply shrugged me off".
    >>
    >>Barbara Read, who lives in British Columbia, Canada, said she regularly
    >>tracked the unauthorised use of her photos and found them "all over the
    >>place".
    >>Harmony Nicholas of Adelaide has been fighting to stop businesses
    >>stealing her photos and putting them on T-shirts.
    >>
    >>Harmony Nicholas is fighting to stop businesses stealing her model's
    >>photos and putting them on T-shirts.
    >>
    >>She warned other photographers that low-resolution images, watermarks
    >>and copyright notices did nothing to stop people from using her images.
    >>"Folks better expect to lose control of [their photographs] if they post
    >>them online," she said.
    >>
    >>"There are sophisticated software programs available to upsize small
    >>images with excellent results and most copyright notices are easily
    >>cloned or cropped out."
    >>
    >>Harmony Nicholas of Adelaide has been fighting to stop businesses
    >>stealing her photos and putting them on T-shirts. She's had no luck
    >>getting compensation and had little success trying to stop those who
    >>stole from her.
    >>A photograph Barbara Read of British Columbia, Canada too which was
    >>taken by Romanian book publisher Editura Herald and used on a book’s cover.
    >>
    >>Barbara Read caught a Romanian book publisher using a picture of hers on
    >>a book cover.
    >>
    >>"We're being screwed left, right and centre purely because we just have
    >>our images out there," she said.
    >>
    >>Nicholas first found out about her photos being stolen from a friend who
    >>in 2010 was on holiday in Brisbane. "She was walking past one of the
    >>shops and snapped on her phone a picture of a singlet that was in a
    >>window that [had on it my photograph] of model Sabina Kelley colouring
    >>in her tattoos with textas," Nicholas said.
    >>
    >>Since then Nicholas has discovered about six of her photos on T-shirts
    >>and is now reluctant to publish her work online, especially as she
    >>lacked the money to pursue legal action.
    >>Photographer Sheila Smart.
    >>
    >>Photographer Sheila Smart.
    >>
    >>Peter Coulson of Victoria said he had also found one of his photographs
    >>in use on a T-shirt sold by Nena & Pasadena, and others on a giant
    >>screen behind American heavy metal band Mötley Crüe, when they performed
    >>during their worldwide concerts.
    >>
    >>When he contacted Nena & Pasadena in 2011 about the infringing photo
    >>they used, he said they offered him $200 to continue to use it on their
    >>T-shirts. He refused the offer and requested the company destroy all
    >>infringing stock, and they complied.
    >>
    >>In a statement provided to Melbourne's Herald Sun in 2011, management
    >>for Nena and Pasadena blamed a rogue designer for the mix-up. The
    >>company said the design, called "The Night'', would never make it into
    >>shops.
    >>
    >>Mötley Crüe's infringement was still under investigation, Coulson said.
    >>
    >>Other examples of copyright infringement included:
    >>
    >>* A Sydney wedding photographer who used another photographer's wedding
    >>photos to advertise their services after finding them online. (After a
    >>letter and phone call requesting the removal of all of the images, the
    >>photographer complied.)
    >>
    >>* A couple who dressed up for a costume party and posted the photo on
    >>Flickr, then found themselves in a local club's advertising material.
    >>
    >>* Book publishers using photos without permission – even using them as
    >>cover images.
    >>
    >>Read more:
    >>http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/were-being-screwed-photograph

    >ers-and-designers-vent-over-stolen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html#ixzz2IsoYhXih
    >>

    >
    >Much of the problem boils down to two things:
    >
    >1. Ignorance: too many people equating easy access with free use.
    > One solution, if partial, is the obvious one of greater public
    >education efforts.
    >(Note, though, that ignorance is, in a way, a valid excuse IF it's a
    >case of an "apparent agent" - a 3rd party claiming to own the work
    >granting or selling the right to use it. In such case it is held to be
    >that 3rd party who stole it, not the user, so no penalty or payment to
    >the artist is required, though I can see stopping further use.)
    >
    >2. The law not being enforced because the little guy lacks the
    >resources to do so.
    > I'm thinking there needs to be some sort of public resource for
    >pursuing these cases, such as empowering law enforcement to
    >investigate them as crimes akin to fraud of a corresponding magnitude.



    I just caught Harley Davidson using one of my images.
    GMAN, Jan 25, 2013
    #8
  9. Rob

    sobriquet Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    On Thursday, January 24, 2013 10:26:53 AM UTC+1, Rob wrote:
    > Its worth reading the article and viewing some of the images.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...s-vent-over-stolen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html
    >


    The problem is not copyright infringement. But copyright.
    Copyright is retarded and people who complain about copyright
    infringement are totally clueless and shouldn't be allowed to use
    the internet or computers in the first place.
    sobriquet, Jan 26, 2013
    #9
  10. Rob

    sobriquet Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    On Saturday, January 26, 2013 1:21:52 AM UTC+1, sobriquet wrote:
    > [..]
    > The problem is not copyright infringement, but copyright.
    >


    Erroneous punctuation fixed for clarity.
    sobriquet, Jan 26, 2013
    #10
  11. Rob

    PeterN Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    On 1/25/2013 4:49 PM, GMAN wrote:

    <snip>

    >
    > I just caught Harley Davidson using one of my images.
    >


    Go get 'em.

    --
    PeterN
    PeterN, Jan 26, 2013
    #11
  12. Rob

    sobriquet Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    On Saturday, January 26, 2013 7:28:39 AM UTC+1, Eric Stevens wrote:
    > On Fri, 25 Jan 2013 16:21:52 -0800 (PST), sobriquet
    >
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > >On Thursday, January 24, 2013 10:26:53 AM UTC+1, Rob wrote:

    >
    > >> Its worth reading the article and viewing some of the images.

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >> http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...s-vent-over-stolen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >

    >
    > >The problem is not copyright infringement. But copyright.

    >
    > >Copyright is retarded and people who complain about copyright

    >
    > >infringement are totally clueless and shouldn't be allowed to use

    >
    > >the internet or computers in the first place.

    >
    >
    >
    > Says someone who believes cutting and pasting other people's images is
    >
    > 'art'.


    Employing, manipulating and remixing images one encounters in
    one's environment (like on the internet or on the streets)
    constitutes artistic freedom.

    Besides, famous artists have always been known to appropriate and
    manipulate the creations of others:

    http://imgur.com/a/xDass#0

    There can be no true freedom of expression if certain images are
    declared to be off-limits because they are claimed to be
    proprietary.

    >
    > --
    >
    >
    >
    > Regards,
    >
    >
    >
    > Eric Stevens
    sobriquet, Jan 26, 2013
    #12
  13. Rob

    Noons Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    PeterN wrote,on my timestamp of 26/01/2013 11:51 AM:
    > On 1/25/2013 4:49 PM, GMAN wrote:
    >
    > <snip>
    >
    >>
    >> I just caught Harley Davidson using one of my images.
    >>

    >
    > Go get 'em.
    >



    Thanks for snipping, I was just about to start yelling...
    Noons, Jan 26, 2013
    #13
  14. Rob

    sobriquet Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    On Saturday, January 26, 2013 9:19:13 AM UTC+1, Eric Stevens wrote:
    > [..]
    > Quite right. There is no true freedom of freedom or anything else. Try
    >
    > taking all your clothes off and going into the crowded theatre of your
    >
    > choice and shouting 'FIRE' when no fire is present.
    >


    There are good reasons to put certain limits on freedom of expression, for
    instance in case where people abuse freedom of expression
    to promote hate or violence. But copyright is not a good reason to limit
    freedom of expression, just like attempts to criminalize art based on
    the argument that it lacks artistic merit (like the way the nazis
    in former nazi germany banned 'degenerate art').

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degenerate_art

    > --
    >
    >
    >
    > Regards,
    >
    >
    >
    > Eric Stevens
    sobriquet, Jan 26, 2013
    #14
  15. Rob

    Robert Coe Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over 'stolen' images,

    On 25 Jan 2013 13:44:10 GMT, Chris Malcolm <> wrote:
    : Whisky-dave <> wrote:
    : > On Friday, January 25, 2013 10:16:53 AM UTC, John A. wrote:
    : >> On Thu, 24 Jan 2013 20:26:53 +1100, Rob <>
    : >>
    : >> wrote:
    : >> >Its worth reading the article and viewing some of the images.
    : >>
    : >> >http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...s-vent-over-stolen-images-20130118-2cx6x.html
    :
    : [snip]
    :
    : > Who pays for such things that's the main point.
    : > Must be plenty of solicitors/lawyers etc.. willing to work for nothing ;-)
    :
    : I was recently talking to a friend who's a lawyer about protecting my
    : photographs from unauthorised use. For example I currently have a lot
    : of images on Flickr. I declare that I reserve all rights and those
    : wishing to use my images should get in touch, but there's nothing
    : except conscience to stop anyone from stealing them. Should I perhaps
    : add a copyright watermark to the image itself?
    :
    : "Wrong strategy!" he said. "You'll make FAR more money than you'd get
    : from selling your images by letting people steal them and then suing
    : them!"

    That's what you say if you think like a lawyer. But I can't imagine any
    photographer wanting to get tied into the legal system to try to defend his
    work. (Well, with the possible exception of Peter N, who would know what he's
    doing in a way that the rest of us wouldn't.)

    Of course half my work gets labelled with a "City of Cambridge" copyright
    notice. (Thanks, EOS Utility, for making that fairly easy.) And we have a
    cadre of in-house lawyers, if we ever have to make trouble for a thief. ;^)

    Bob
    Robert Coe, Jan 26, 2013
    #15
  16. Rob

    Robert Coe Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over 'stolen' images,

    On Fri, 25 Jan 2013 10:51:00 -0600, Doug McDonald <>
    wrote:
    :
    : The problem is common sense:
    :
    : If you don't want your pictures to be used without payment,
    : only show them to prospective buyers in hard copy form
    : where you retain physical possession, or, if on the web,
    : in uselessly small versions (smaller than say 80 pixels
    : smallest dimension.) If you sell them for digital use
    : in large size, make sure you get enough to cover their
    : value from the first sale.

    And what is "their value" in that context?

    Bob
    Robert Coe, Jan 26, 2013
    #16
  17. Rob

    Robert Coe Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over 'stolen' images,

    On Fri, 25 Jan 2013 16:21:52 -0800 (PST), sobriquet <>
    wrote:
    :
    : The problem is not copyright infringement. But copyright.
    : Copyright is retarded and people who complain about copyright
    : infringement are totally clueless

    Says someone who has never produced anything worth protecting or infringing
    on.

    : and shouldn't be allowed to use the internet or computers in
    : the first place.

    Says someone who has never had the slightest role in creating or improving
    either computers or the internet.

    Bob
    Robert Coe, Jan 26, 2013
    #17
  18. Rob

    sobriquet Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    On Saturday, January 26, 2013 9:32:25 PM UTC+1, Robert Coe wrote:
    > On Fri, 25 Jan 2013 16:21:52 -0800 (PST), sobriquet <>
    >
    > wrote:
    >
    > :
    >
    > : The problem is not copyright infringement. But copyright.
    >
    > : Copyright is retarded and people who complain about copyright
    >
    > : infringement are totally clueless
    >
    >
    >
    > Says someone who has never produced anything worth protecting or infringing
    >
    > on.
    >


    So, what have you ever produced that is worth protecting or infringing on?

    >
    >
    > : and shouldn't be allowed to use the internet or computers in
    >
    > : the first place.
    >
    >
    >
    > Says someone who has never had the slightest role in creating or improving
    >
    > either computers or the internet.
    >
    >
    >
    > Bob



    So, what is your role in creating or improving either computers or
    the internet?

    Seems like you have no substantial arguments contradicting my point
    of view and hence you resort to attacking me personally instead of
    refuting my arguments.
    sobriquet, Jan 26, 2013
    #18
  19. Rob

    sobriquet Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    On Saturday, January 26, 2013 11:48:43 PM UTC+1, Savageduck wrote:
    > On 2013-01-26 12:58:24 -0800, sobriquet <> said:
    >
    > >

    >
    > >

    >
    > > So, what is your role in creating or improving either computers or

    >
    > > the internet?

    >
    > >

    >
    > > Seems like you have no substantial arguments contradicting my point

    >
    > > of view and hence you resort to attacking me personally instead of

    >
    > > refuting my arguments.

    >
    >
    >
    > It's that irresistible self adhered target on your forehead. It makes
    >
    > you SO attackable when it comes to this subject.
    >
    >
    >
    > The issue of this thread is not your puerile game playing, but
    >
    > photographs lifted by corporate entities to use in and on their
    >
    > products, from book covers to brochures, to advertising to billboards
    >
    > without paying the creators. Those photographers and graphic artists
    >
    > depend on [payment for the use of their work so they can earn a living.
    >
    > A living you seem to feel they don't deserve, so you can continue to
    >
    > cut and paste in your parents' basement.
    >


    Those photographers and graphic artists shouldn't be on the internet to
    begin with and then this whole problem wouldn't occur.
    It's clueless people who put their work on the internet and subsequently
    complain about copyright infringement, instead of acknowledging that
    there is no copyright on the internet and people can share things freely
    with no consequences whatsoever in the vast majority of cases.

    >
    >
    > --
    >
    > Regards,
    >
    >
    >
    > Savageduck
    sobriquet, Jan 26, 2013
    #19
  20. Rob

    sobriquet Guest

    Re: 'We're being screwed': photographers and designers vent over'stolen' images,

    On Saturday, January 26, 2013 11:47:47 PM UTC+1, Eric Stevens wrote:
    > On Sat, 26 Jan 2013 08:25:21 -0800 (PST), sobriquet
    >
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    > >On Saturday, January 26, 2013 9:19:13 AM UTC+1, Eric Stevens wrote:

    >
    > >> [..]

    >
    > >> Quite right. There is no true freedom of freedom or anything else. Try

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >> taking all your clothes off and going into the crowded theatre of your

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >> choice and shouting 'FIRE' when no fire is present.

    >
    > >>

    >
    > >

    >
    > >There are good reasons to put certain limits on freedom of expression, for

    >
    > >instance in case where people abuse freedom of expression

    >
    > >to promote hate or violence. But copyright is not a good reason to limit

    >
    > >freedom of expression, ....

    >
    >
    >
    > That's your opinion. The consensus of other people as expressed in law
    >
    > is that works of art deserve certain defined protection against
    >
    > copying. The problem is that you don't agree with this.
    >


    That's not my opinion. That's the way information technology works in
    practice. The law is lagging behind the latest developments in information
    technology and since most politicians have their head stuck up their ass,
    there is no reason to expect the law to change any time soon.

    This protection is a figment of your lively imagination. Attempts to
    enforce copyright online are merely proof that there are no limits
    to human stupidity.

    In the vast majority of cases, people can share information freely and
    there is no effective way to impose a kind of monopoly on the reproduction
    and distribution of information, unless you want to ban computers
    altogether.

    I've been up- and downloading terrabytes of information to piratebay
    and other torrent sites and there are millions of others who are
    violating these spurious copyrights on a daily basis with virtually
    no adverse consequences whatsoever.

    >
    >
    > > ... just like attempts to criminalize art based on

    >
    > >the argument that it lacks artistic merit (like the way the nazis

    >
    > >in former nazi germany banned 'degenerate art').

    >
    > >

    >
    > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degenerate_art

    >
    > >

    >
    > You are dangerously close to bringing Godwin's Law down on yourself.
    >


    I don't care about Godwin's law. That's just a cheap way for fascists to
    avoid a discussion that questions their fascist outlook on things.

    >
    >
    > http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/godwins-law
    >
    > --
    >
    >
    >
    > Regards,
    >
    >
    >
    > Eric Stevens
    sobriquet, Jan 26, 2013
    #20
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