Weird Rumor (Firefox as "front end" to IE?)

Discussion in 'Firefox' started by Gwen Morse, Oct 2, 2004.

  1. Gwen Morse

    Gwen Morse Guest

    I'm taking a class on network security at my local college. We (as a
    group) were talking about our favorite browsers during class break,
    and I mentioned liking Firefox. One of the guys in the class said it
    was actually just a "front end" to IE.

    The last time I checked, FF was an open-source browser developed and
    maintained by Mozilla programmers, while IE was a closed-source
    browser developed and maintained by Microsoft programmers.

    Furthermore, I hadn't heard that Microsoft had developed any
    altruistic tendencies as far as releasing their source code to either
    the general public, and/or even a single outside development team. Nor
    had I heard about the Mozilla group scraping together the absolutely
    _massive_ amount of cash necessary to 'buy' any source code off of M$
    (even assuming Microsoft executives would allow that option given how
    relentlessly they pursued the browser wars in the first place).

    When I pointed all this out to him, he said something (not all that
    coherent) about Firefox running "scripts meant for IE" (which he
    specifically said Mozilla does not run) and then the class break
    ended. There was never a chance to revisit the topic and work out
    "what" he was talking about.

    The person in question isn't a Microsoft shill. In fact, he's a
    reasonably die-hard Mac user. It's been nagging at me since that class
    that I _don't_ know what he's talking about. I understand that FF is
    not a front end to IE, what's puzzling me is what his proof (the
    "scripts" that FF and IE run and all other browsers don't run) could
    possibly be?

    Is there any legitimate development/support going on that could be
    "confused" for a suspicious level of IE compatibility by a
    professional Mac administrator reasonably uninterested in open source
    development projects?

    Gwen
    Gwen Morse, Oct 2, 2004
    #1
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  2. Gwen Morse wrote:
    > I'm taking a class on network security at my local college. We (as a
    > group) were talking about our favorite browsers during class break,
    > and I mentioned liking Firefox. One of the guys in the class said it
    > was actually just a "front end" to IE.
    >
    > The last time I checked, FF was an open-source browser developed and
    > maintained by Mozilla programmers, while IE was a closed-source
    > browser developed and maintained by Microsoft programmers.
    >
    > Furthermore, I hadn't heard that Microsoft had developed any
    > altruistic tendencies as far as releasing their source code to either
    > the general public, and/or even a single outside development team. Nor
    > had I heard about the Mozilla group scraping together the absolutely
    > _massive_ amount of cash necessary to 'buy' any source code off of M$
    > (even assuming Microsoft executives would allow that option given how
    > relentlessly they pursued the browser wars in the first place).
    >
    > When I pointed all this out to him, he said something (not all that
    > coherent) about Firefox running "scripts meant for IE" (which he
    > specifically said Mozilla does not run) and then the class break
    > ended. There was never a chance to revisit the topic and work out
    > "what" he was talking about.
    >
    > The person in question isn't a Microsoft shill. In fact, he's a
    > reasonably die-hard Mac user. It's been nagging at me since that class
    > that I _don't_ know what he's talking about. I understand that FF is
    > not a front end to IE, what's puzzling me is what his proof (the
    > "scripts" that FF and IE run and all other browsers don't run) could
    > possibly be?
    >
    > Is there any legitimate development/support going on that could be
    > "confused" for a suspicious level of IE compatibility by a
    > professional Mac administrator reasonably uninterested in open source
    > development projects?
    >
    > Gwen


    Well, basically, your friend has no idea what he's talking about.

    I'm not sure what he means by a "front end". There are many, many
    "browsers" that are simply shells for the IE rendering engine. MyIE2
    Neoplanet, Avant Browser, Slim Browser, NetCaptor, all are attempts to
    dress up IE. Many have excellent functionality additions, but all
    suffer from the security flaws, and increasingly antique rendering of IE.

    If you friend is indicating that he thinks Firefox is one of these, he
    has no idea what he is talking about.

    "scripts meant for IE"

    Well, I wonder exactly what he meant by that? What kind of scripts
    exactly. I run the most recent versions on both Moz and FF, and test
    pages for people a lot. If anything, Moz renders pages that FF can't
    more then the reverse. As far as IE specific javascripting, both Moz
    and FF will generally fail.

    FF uses the same rendering engine as Moz. Developers of both are
    attempting to render as many pages as possible, without compromising
    standards compliance. Since your friend is a Machead (sorry Dan) he is
    probably running Safari, and blissfully happy.

    Lee
    Leonidas Jones, Oct 2, 2004
    #2
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  3. Gwen Morse

    Gunther Guest

    In article <ewn7d.469289$>,
    says...
    > Gwen Morse wrote:
    > > I'm taking a class on network security at my local college. We (as a
    > > group) were talking about our favorite browsers during class break,
    > > and I mentioned liking Firefox. One of the guys in the class said it
    > > was actually just a "front end" to IE.

    ....
    >
    > Well, basically, your friend has no idea what he's talking about.


    You're too nice. The correct phrase is "he's full of shit."

    G
    Gunther, Oct 2, 2004
    #3
  4. Gwen Morse wrote:
    > I'm taking a class on network security at my local college. We (as a
    > group) were talking about our favorite browsers during class break,
    > and I mentioned liking Firefox. One of the guys in the class said it
    > was actually just a "front end" to IE.
    >
    > The last time I checked, FF was an open-source browser developed and
    > maintained by Mozilla programmers, while IE was a closed-source
    > browser developed and maintained by Microsoft programmers.
    >
    > Furthermore, I hadn't heard that Microsoft had developed any
    > altruistic tendencies as far as releasing their source code to either
    > the general public, and/or even a single outside development team. Nor
    > had I heard about the Mozilla group scraping together the absolutely
    > _massive_ amount of cash necessary to 'buy' any source code off of M$
    > (even assuming Microsoft executives would allow that option given how
    > relentlessly they pursued the browser wars in the first place).
    >
    > When I pointed all this out to him, he said something (not all that
    > coherent) about Firefox running "scripts meant for IE" (which he
    > specifically said Mozilla does not run) and then the class break
    > ended. There was never a chance to revisit the topic and work out
    > "what" he was talking about.
    >
    > The person in question isn't a Microsoft shill. In fact, he's a
    > reasonably die-hard Mac user. It's been nagging at me since that class
    > that I _don't_ know what he's talking about. I understand that FF is
    > not a front end to IE, what's puzzling me is what his proof (the
    > "scripts" that FF and IE run and all other browsers don't run) could
    > possibly be?
    >
    > Is there any legitimate development/support going on that could be
    > "confused" for a suspicious level of IE compatibility by a
    > professional Mac administrator reasonably uninterested in open source
    > development projects?
    >
    > Gwen

    As far as I know, MS has nothing to do with Mozilla or FireFox. Its
    Netscape, err, rather AOL that provided the major funding for the
    Mozilla.org. Thats why Netscape and Mozilla the Suite are basically the
    same product, except Net has all the AOL add-ons.

    I would like to know what he meant by FF being a "front end" to IE, and
    what was meant by Firefox running "scripts meant for IE." If he's
    talking about IE Javascripts, then Moz and FF have problems with them.

    I will stand corrected if there is any evidence or proof of this. Then
    again, you might have misunderstood and mis-heard what he was saying.

    Andreas
    --
    Information wanted: http://www.ltinc.net/sass/

    To contact me remove the other name for "Canned Meat"
    Andreas, His Excellency, The Imperial Grand Pooh-B, Oct 2, 2004
    #4
  5. On Fri, 01 Oct 2004 18:03:25 -0700, Gwen Morse wrote:

    > When I pointed all this out to him, he said something (not all that
    > coherent) about Firefox running "scripts meant for IE" (which he
    > specifically said Mozilla does not run) and then the class break ended.
    > There was never a chance to revisit the topic and work out "what" he was
    > talking about.


    The Mozilla team is working on window.all and document.all in quirks mode
    (I forget the exact bug number, but you can search it in bugzilla). If
    this isn't it, I'm clueless as to your friend's complaint.

    La'ie Techie
    =?UTF-8?b?TMSByrtpZSBUZWNoaWU=?=, Oct 2, 2004
    #5
  6. Gwen Morse wrote:

    > On Fri, 01 Oct 2004 22:05:11 -0700, "Andreas, His Excellency, The
    > Imperial Grand Pooh-Bah" <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>>Gwen

    >>
    >>As far as I know, MS has nothing to do with Mozilla or FireFox. Its
    >>Netscape, err, rather AOL that provided the major funding for the

    >
    >
    > Thanks for your (and the other posters responses).
    >
    > Thinking about it "now" (that I was reminded about it, he probably is
    > mistaking Firefox for one of the shells created for IE. That is, while
    > he obviously recognized the name 'Firefox' and that it was the next
    > generation after Mozilla, he didn't really _understand_that it wasn't
    > one of those other programs.
    >
    > That or he just likes baiting other people :).
    >
    >
    >>I would like to know what he meant by FF being a "front end" to IE, and
    >>what was meant by Firefox running "scripts meant for IE." If he's
    >>talking about IE Javascripts, then Moz and FF have problems with them.

    >
    >
    > This is useful to know, as well as a previous comment that FF breaks
    > more often than IE.
    >
    >
    >>I will stand corrected if there is any evidence or proof of this. Then
    >>again, you might have misunderstood and mis-heard what he was saying.

    >
    >
    > I'm pretty sure I didn't. He made the exact statement "Don't you know
    > that Firefox is just a front end for IE". That struck me a bit
    > speechless, and when I recovered enough to start to refute it, he
    > repeated it. Then, he said something about it being an "open secret on
    > the Internet if you just know where to look" and made another comment
    > that I obviously "don't read up on the project". Finally, when I got
    > out a cohesive list of reasons why I didn't think it could possibly be
    > true, he said something about FF and IE running the same scripts (that
    > other browsers couldn't run) and sighed a bit, as if to indicate his
    > disappointment in my blatant ignorance.
    >
    > What worried me about what he was saying was that he _might_ have come
    > across some sort of reference to FF supporting ActiveX controls (which
    > are the only features that I know of that are only supported by IE),
    > and then made a series of WAG to get to the rest.
    >
    > I'll see if I can get a more coherent discussion on the topic on
    > Wednesday (my next class).
    >
    > Thanks again, everyone :)
    >
    > Gwen
    >
    >

    When you get a chance, we'd like to know what is meant by:
    'a "front end" to IE', "open secret on the Internet if you just know
    where to look", and 'about Firefox running "scripts meant for IE"'

    Andreas
    --
    Information wanted: http://www.ltinc.net/sass/

    To contact me remove the other name for "Canned Meat"
    Andreas, His Excellency, The Imperial Grand Pooh-B, Oct 2, 2004
    #6
  7. Gwen Morse

    Gwen Morse Guest

    On Fri, 01 Oct 2004 22:05:11 -0700, "Andreas, His Excellency, The
    Imperial Grand Pooh-Bah" <> wrote:

    >> Gwen

    >As far as I know, MS has nothing to do with Mozilla or FireFox. Its
    >Netscape, err, rather AOL that provided the major funding for the


    Thanks for your (and the other posters responses).

    Thinking about it "now" (that I was reminded about it, he probably is
    mistaking Firefox for one of the shells created for IE. That is, while
    he obviously recognized the name 'Firefox' and that it was the next
    generation after Mozilla, he didn't really _understand_that it wasn't
    one of those other programs.

    That or he just likes baiting other people :).

    >I would like to know what he meant by FF being a "front end" to IE, and
    >what was meant by Firefox running "scripts meant for IE." If he's
    >talking about IE Javascripts, then Moz and FF have problems with them.


    This is useful to know, as well as a previous comment that FF breaks
    more often than IE.

    >I will stand corrected if there is any evidence or proof of this. Then
    >again, you might have misunderstood and mis-heard what he was saying.


    I'm pretty sure I didn't. He made the exact statement "Don't you know
    that Firefox is just a front end for IE". That struck me a bit
    speechless, and when I recovered enough to start to refute it, he
    repeated it. Then, he said something about it being an "open secret on
    the Internet if you just know where to look" and made another comment
    that I obviously "don't read up on the project". Finally, when I got
    out a cohesive list of reasons why I didn't think it could possibly be
    true, he said something about FF and IE running the same scripts (that
    other browsers couldn't run) and sighed a bit, as if to indicate his
    disappointment in my blatant ignorance.

    What worried me about what he was saying was that he _might_ have come
    across some sort of reference to FF supporting ActiveX controls (which
    are the only features that I know of that are only supported by IE),
    and then made a series of WAG to get to the rest.

    I'll see if I can get a more coherent discussion on the topic on
    Wednesday (my next class).

    Thanks again, everyone :)

    Gwen
    Gwen Morse, Oct 2, 2004
    #7
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