VoIPCheap/Stunt/SIPDiscount/Et.al - Mobile - Top-up Expiry Period -- Campaign for Correct Expiry Per

Discussion in 'UK VOIP' started by News Reader, Jun 24, 2006.

  1. News Reader

    News Reader Guest

    Dear All,

    Re: Campaign for Correct Expiry Period on Finarea VOIP Service Mobile
    Top-Ups (and for a working communication channel / responses to enquiries /
    e-mails / etc.!)

    I am sure I am amongst many (or at least several) others who have recently
    used the mobile top-up method with various of the Finarea / Betamax stable
    VoIP service companies only to receive a 60 day credit expiry period against
    the advertised, contracted, agreed 120 days (i.e. on the mobile top-up page
    at the time such top-ups were made the indicated and contracted expiry
    period was / is 120 days).

    I and others as I understand it have attempted to communicate this with the
    organisations concerned without success.

    I am also sure that others have equally serious, significant and legitimate
    / legal issues, queries, etc. that they require to be resolved /
    communicated to / with the various Finarea (VoIPCheap, VoIPStunt,
    SIPDiscount, Internetcalls, etc.) VoIP company services.

    Thus I am seeking some encouragement, support, participation, etc. on a
    concerted effort to open a communications channel to make representations to
    this / these organisations (either group representations on issues that
    affect numerous users similarly or an effective communications channel that
    users / customers can individual use).

    All thoughts, suggestions and input, etc. appreciated and valued.

    A complete list of these organisations internet (VoIP) services would I
    think be quite valuable / useful / etc. (as well as as a bonus a list of
    their landline services).


    Best wishes,



    News Reader



    P.s. I.e. I think strength in numbers should ensure some effective
    resolution / action. A users / customer group / support / community entity
    seems like it might be both useful and a good idea.
    News Reader, Jun 24, 2006
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. News Reader

    Phil Ossifa Guest

    "News Reader" <> wrote in message
    news:e7jfn5$ps7$...
    >
    > Dear All,
    >
    > Re: Campaign for Correct Expiry Period on Finarea VOIP Service Mobile
    > Top-Ups (and for a working communication channel / responses to
    > enquiries /
    > e-mails / etc.!)
    >
    > P.s. I.e. I think strength in numbers should ensure some effective
    > resolution / action. A users / customer group / support / community
    > entity
    > seems like it might be both useful and a good idea.
    >


    I voted with my feet, the first time they pocketed my unused credit.
    I would not touch any of their services again.
    Phil Ossifa, Jun 24, 2006
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. News Reader

    Paul Cupis Guest

    Re: VoIPCheap/Stunt/SIPDiscount/Et.al - Mobile - Top-up Expiry Period-- Campaign for Correct Expiry Period on Finarea VOIP Service Mobile Top-Ups

    News Reader wrote:
    > Re: Campaign for Correct Expiry Period on Finarea VOIP Service Mobile
    > Top-Ups (and for a working communication channel / responses to enquiries /
    > e-mails / etc.!)

    [snip]
    > I and others as I understand it have attempted to communicate this with the
    > organisations concerned without success.


    You get what you pay for. You want them to pay for/subsidise your
    telephone calls AND provide you with good customer service?
    Paul Cupis, Jun 24, 2006
    #3
  4. News Reader

    Tester Guest

    You want them to pay for/subsidise your
    >telephone calls AND provide you with good customer service?




    Hi Paul,
    Yea i do,
    How hard is it for 1 person to check emails, or divert a
    phoneline, or pay 1 person to come in to the office 1 day a week or
    better, to deal with customers queries, and give them more confidence?

    If you look at the customers they are losing, and getting a bad name,
    then i certainly would, go to those efforts.

    Regards
    Tester, Jun 25, 2006
    #4
  5. News Reader

    Paul Cupis Guest

    Re: VoIPCheap/Stunt/SIPDiscount/Et.al - Mobile - Top-up Expiry Period-- Campaign for Correct Expiry Period on Finarea VOIP Service Mobile Top-Ups

    Tester wrote:
    >> You want them to pay for/subsidise your
    >> telephone calls AND provide you with good customer service?

    >
    > How hard is it for 1 person to check emails, or divert a
    > phoneline, or pay 1 person to come in to the office 1 day a week or
    > better, to deal with customers queries, and give them more confidence?


    They are paying for your phone calls and you want them to pay for staff
    to talk to you on the phone/email you? Where do you think this money
    will come from, it doesn't grow on trees.

    > If you look at the customers they are losing, and getting a bad name,
    > then i certainly would, go to those efforts.


    I doubt they care. It is likely that it is cheaper for them to buy
    customers/goodwill with offers than to employ staff to answer phone
    calls/emails.
    Paul Cupis, Jun 25, 2006
    #5
  6. News Reader

    Tester Guest

    On Sun, 25 Jun 2006 12:44:48 +0100, Paul Cupis <>
    wrote:


    >They are paying for your phone calls and you want them to pay for staff
    >to talk to you on the phone/email you? Where do you think this money
    >will come from, it doesn't grow on trees.


    Its not a multi million pound company, only 1 guy at the top, and no
    share holders.
    They could be better than skype, if the wanted to, but are too stupid
    to realize.
    >


    >
    >I doubt they care. It is likely that it is cheaper for them to buy
    >customers/goodwill with offers than to employ staff to answer phone
    >calls/emails.


    No, they don't care, but thats breaking the sales of goods act.
    Providing a service, that dosn't do what it says on the packet.

    I am inquisitive to know, why you seem to justify, bad service, as the
    accepted thing now.

    Just look back 10 years, and even further, and companies, would bend
    over backwards, to help and support.


    Regards
    Tester, Jun 25, 2006
    #6
  7. News Reader

    Ivor Jones Guest

    "Tester" <> wrote in message
    news:eek:

    [snip]

    > No, they don't care, but thats breaking the sales of
    > goods act. Providing a service, that dosn't do what it
    > says on the packet.


    How can they be breaking the Sale of Goods Act when they're not selling
    you anything..?

    > I am inquisitive to know, why you seem to justify, bad
    > service, as the accepted thing now.


    If you want service, you have to pay for it.

    > Just look back 10 years, and even further, and companies,
    > would bend over backwards, to help and support.


    So they will, if you pay them, you aren't paying, you seem to want it all
    for free.

    If you wanted me to do any work for you, do you think I'd come for free as
    well..? Dream on.

    Ivor
    Ivor Jones, Jun 25, 2006
    #7
  8. News Reader

    Tester Guest


    >If you wanted me to do any work for you, do you think I'd come for free as
    >well..? Dream on.
    >
    >Ivor



    Ivor,
    You are being ridiculous, now you know exactly the point i am
    making.
    If i look back at any of your postings, i trust i wont find you
    moaning or complaining, about any of the services, that you use.

    And the question that begs to be answered, is, how much money do we
    have to pay, before the service becomes one that treats customers
    fairly, you tell me?

    They are making profit, which denotes that they are being payed for
    the service, after all the so-called overheads are taken out, which
    means, as i stated at the beginning we have a right to a reasonable
    service.
    I dont know how you would treat customers, but i certainly, wouldnt
    treat them like that, and i dont believe would 1000's of others.


    Regards
    Tester, Jun 25, 2006
    #8
  9. News Reader

    Jono Guest

    Tester was thinking very hard :
    >
    >> If you wanted me to do any work for you, do you think I'd come for free as
    >> well..? Dream on.
    >>
    >> Ivor

    >
    >
    > Ivor,
    > You are being ridiculous, now you know exactly the point i am
    > making.
    > If i look back at any of your postings, i trust i wont find you
    > moaning or complaining, about any of the services, that you use.


    You probably won't, no.

    > And the question that begs to be answered, is, how much money do we
    > have to pay, before the service becomes one that treats customers
    > fairly, you tell me?


    More than E0.0019/MIN

    > They are making profit, which denotes that they are being payed for
    > the service, after all the so-called overheads are taken out, which
    > means, as i stated at the beginning we have a right to a reasonable
    > service.


    They provide a fantastic service. They're just impossible to elicit a
    reply from.

    > I dont know how you would treat customers, but i certainly, wouldnt
    > treat them like that, and i dont believe would 1000's of others.
    >
    > Regards
    Jono, Jun 25, 2006
    #9
  10. News Reader

    Paul Cupis Guest

    Re: VoIPCheap/Stunt/SIPDiscount/Et.al - Mobile - Top-up Expiry Period-- Campaign for Correct Expiry Period on Finarea VOIP Service Mobile Top-Ups

    Tester wrote:
    > On Sun, 25 Jun 2006 12:44:48 +0100, Paul Cupis <>
    > wrote:
    >> They are paying for your phone calls and you want them to pay for staff
    >> to talk to you on the phone/email you? Where do you think this money
    >> will come from, it doesn't grow on trees.

    >
    > Its not a multi million pound company, only 1 guy at the top, and no
    > share holders.
    > They could be better than skype, if the wanted to, but are too stupid
    > to realize.


    None of what you've said there seems to be in response to what I wrote.

    >> I doubt they care. It is likely that it is cheaper for them to buy
    >> customers/goodwill with offers than to employ staff to answer phone
    >> calls/emails.

    >
    > No, they don't care, but thats breaking the sales of goods act.
    > Providing a service, that dosn't do what it says on the packet.
    >
    > I am inquisitive to know, why you seem to justify, bad service, as the
    > accepted thing now.
    >
    > Just look back 10 years, and even further, and companies, would bend
    > over backwards, to help and support.


    I am not trying to justify anything, certainly not bad (customer)
    service, but it just amuses me that you want someone to pay for your
    phone calls and spend money and customer service people etc etc.

    Maybe if you want customer service you should use a company that is not
    selling at less than cost.
    Paul Cupis, Jun 25, 2006
    #10
  11. News Reader

    Paul Cupis Guest

    Re: VoIPCheap/Stunt/SIPDiscount/Et.al - Mobile - Top-up Expiry Period-- Campaign for Correct Expiry Period on Finarea VOIP Service Mobile Top-Ups

    Tester wrote:
    > And the question that begs to be answered, is, how much money do we
    > have to pay, before the service becomes one that treats customers
    > fairly, you tell me?


    You have to pay more than cost, i.e. allow the company to charge for
    overheads and a reasonable profit.

    > They are making profit,


    Really? Where is your evidence of this?
    Paul Cupis, Jun 25, 2006
    #11

  12. >
    >Really? Where is your evidence of this?



    They would be called a charity, and wouldnt have a VAT Number, which
    equates to
    over £52,000 a year
    I am sorry to hear it, Jun 25, 2006
    #12
  13. News Reader

    Paul Cupis Guest

    Re: VoIPCheap/Stunt/SIPDiscount/Et.al - Mobile - Top-up Expiry Period-- Campaign for Correct Expiry Period on Finarea VOIP Service Mobile Top-Ups

    I am sorry to hear it wrote:
    > Paul Cupis wrote:
    >> Tester wrote:
    >>> They are making profit,

    >>
    >> Really? Where is your evidence of this?

    >
    > They would be called a charity, and wouldnt have a VAT Number, which
    > equates to over £52,000 a year


    Pardon?
    Paul Cupis, Jun 25, 2006
    #13
  14. News Reader

    News Reader Guest

    "News Reader" <> wrote in message
    news:e7jfn5$ps7$...
    >
    > Dear All,
    >
    > Re: Campaign for Correct Expiry Period on Finarea VOIP Service Mobile
    > Top-Ups (and for a working communication channel / responses to enquiries

    /
    > e-mails / etc.!)
    >
    > I am sure ...


    ....


    > the advertised, contracted, agreed


    ....


    > the indicated and contracted expiry


    > I am also sure that others have equally serious, significant and

    legitimate
    > / legal issues, queries, etc. that they require to be resolved /
    > communicated to / with the various Finarea (VoIPCheap, VoIPStunt,
    > SIPDiscount, Internetcalls, etc.) VoIP company services.
    >



    The essence of this post is about the requirement of Finarea / Betamax and
    their stable of companies (VoIPCheap, VoIPStunt, SIPDiscount, Internetcalls,
    etc.) to respond to legal issues / enquiries. I.e. particularly where they
    have broken the law.

    That they do not do this / fail to respond to such enquiries is unacceptable
    and I believe illegal as they are trading as a business / represent a legal
    entity contracting with consumer parties (home users).

    I guess registered letters to their head office address may actually be the
    only "sure" or sureish way to serve notices / communications on this
    organisation.

    Any other suggestions or thought about the setting up of a community / user
    / lobby / pressure / group / group representation body / etc. would be
    appreciated / etc.


    Best wishes,



    News Reader



    P.s. A complete list of these organisations internet (VoIP) services would
    still be I
    think quite valuable / useful / etc. (as well as as a bonus a list of
    their landline services).

    P.p.s. As previouosly - I.e. I think strength in numbers should ensure some
    effective
    resolution / action. A users / customer group / support / community entity
    seems like it might be both useful and a good idea.
    News Reader, Jun 26, 2006
    #14
  15. News Reader <> wrote:
    > Thus I am seeking some encouragement, support, participation, etc. on a
    > concerted effort to open a communications channel to make representations to
    > this / these organisations (either group representations on issues that
    > affect numerous users similarly or an effective communications channel that
    > users / customers can individual use).


    If they are misrepresenting their terms, then you may have a case. Do they
    advertise a UK address anywhere? The 18xxx Finarea clones accept Direct
    Debits and so have a London PO Box, which probably means you can complain to
    London Trading Standards, but I don't know if the VOIP ones do. Some seem
    to list a German address: you may have some success under German consumer
    protection laws (which I think are quite strict), but you'd have to find
    out. There might also be some EU-wide legislation, but I don't know about
    that.

    Just because they're cheap is _not_ an excuse for them to lie or not fulfill
    their promises. Just like low cost airlines can't strand you in the middle
    of nowhere (though they seem to try to wriggle out of as much as possible).

    Theo
    Theo Markettos, Jun 26, 2006
    #15
  16. News Reader

    andy Guest

    News Reader wrote:
    >
    > The essence of this post is about the requirement of Finarea / Betamax and
    > their stable of companies (VoIPCheap, VoIPStunt, SIPDiscount, Internetcalls,
    > etc.) to respond to legal issues / enquiries. I.e. particularly where they
    > have broken the law.
    >
    > That they do not do this / fail to respond to such enquiries is unacceptable
    > and I believe illegal as they are trading as a business / represent a legal
    > entity contracting with consumer parties (home users).
    >
    > I guess registered letters to their head office address may actually be the
    > only "sure" or sureish way to serve notices / communications on this
    > organisation.
    >
    > Any other suggestions or thought about the setting up of a community / user
    > / lobby / pressure / group / group representation body / etc. would be
    > appreciated / etc.
    >


    >
    > P.s. A complete list of these organisations internet (VoIP) services would
    > still be I
    > think quite valuable / useful / etc. (as well as as a bonus a list of
    > their landline services).
    >
    > P.p.s. As previouosly - I.e. I think strength in numbers should ensure some
    > effective
    > resolution / action. A users / customer group / support / community entity
    > seems like it might be both useful and a good idea.


    I didn't read anything that made me think they had broken the law.

    You seem to be disputing the advertised validity period of the top-up,
    and it has been mentioned on other forums too. They do seem to alter
    terms and conditions from time to time, sometimes with notice that
    disappoints people, so it is true that there are sometimes problems.

    But does that really need so-called community lobby pressure groups and
    all that overblown stuff, or why don't you just write to the
    organisation, as you yourself suggested?

    And why does any such dispute require a list of all their other
    services? Info on this is available elsewhere on the internet already,
    but I don't see why (for example) landline callthrough prefix
    operations in Belgium, Ireland and Sweden would have any relevance to
    your case.
    andy, Jun 26, 2006
    #16
  17. News Reader

    Paul Cupis Guest

    Re: VoIPCheap/Stunt/SIPDiscount/Et.al - Mobile - Top-up Expiry Period-- Campaign for Correct Expiry Period on Finarea VOIP Service Mobile Top-Ups

    News Reader wrote:
    > I guess registered letters to their head office address may actually be the
    > only "sure" or sureish way to serve notices / communications on this
    > organisation.
    >
    > Any other suggestions or thought about the setting up of a community / user
    > / lobby / pressure / group / group representation body / etc. would be
    > appreciated / etc.


    This will also be a surefire way of ensuring that they stop offering the
    subsidised rates that people are currently benefiting from.

    (N.B. I am not a Betamax customer).
    Paul Cupis, Jun 26, 2006
    #17
    1. Advertising

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. News Reader
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    1,206
    News Reader
    Apr 10, 2006
  2. Paul
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    2,252
  3. News Reader
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    613
    News Reader
    Nov 26, 2006
  4. princes

    Mobile reviews,Secrets,mobile venues, mobile themes

    princes, Jun 2, 2007, in forum: Digital Photography
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    429
    princes
    Jun 2, 2007
  5. Giuen
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    723
    Giuen
    Sep 12, 2008
Loading...

Share This Page