VoIPCheap Query

Discussion in 'UK VOIP' started by Iceman, Jun 1, 2006.

  1. Iceman

    Iceman Guest

    Hi forum.
    I am totally new to VoIP and SIP and need to ask some questions.
    I have an account with voipcheap.co.uk and I have been using their PC
    software for a few weeks now.
    I wanted to be able to make and receive calls all the time without my PC
    switched on so I replaced my USB modem with a Broadband router and
    bought myself a SIP phone - its a Safecom SDSIP-3000.
    I configured the phone with my voipcheap details, username, password,
    domain voipcheap.com, proxy server sip.voipcheap.com.
    I can make calls to normal phone numbers okay (voip-out) and I can
    receive calls from normal phones via my voipcheap allocated voip-in
    number. All that works okay.
    But how the hell do I make voip to voip calls?
    The voipcheap PC software enables you to make calls to other voipcheap
    users without touching the PSTN - excellent sound quality because its
    not being constrained by the audio bandwidth of the PSTN.
    Lets say for the sake of this conversation my friend's voipcheap
    username is "wibble".
    Using the PC software I can call wibble using my speakers and microphone.
    I have tried putting wibble into my SIP phone's phonebook.
    I have also tried "" and ""
    but none of these works.
    (I did tell you Im new to voip and SIP - assume I know nothing!)
    Perhaps SIP only supports phone-number based calling? I dont know.
    How do I call another voipcheap user without using the PSTN?
    If I get them to apply for a voip-in number from voipcheap and I call
    that number using my SIP phone, can I assume the voipcheap SIP server is
    clever enough to know its the number of another voipcheap user and route
    it straight to them without going anywhere near the PSTN?

    Can anyone validate my assumptions, answer my questions, or teach me all
    I need to know about voip and SIP?
    Iceman, Jun 1, 2006
    #1
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  2. Iceman

    My Name Guest

    I assume you can load your list of contacts for voip to voip calls on
    your phone. This is so for some othe systems. But first you have to
    use your pc to get them into your favourites list.
    My Name, Jun 1, 2006
    #2
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  3. Iceman

    Iceman Guest

    My Name wrote:
    > I assume you can load your list of contacts for voip to voip calls on
    > your phone. This is so for some othe systems. But first you have to
    > use your pc to get them into your favourites list.


    I use my PC web browser to "log onto" the phone's IP address, admin and
    password, and then edit the phone's phonebook.

    Each phonebook entry is a number, eg 1, a name eg fred, and a phone
    number which is freeform text.
    It could be 00441458833666, or it could be user@voipprovider

    The manual that came with the phone is not that great a read.
    One gets the impression it was written by someone who's first language
    is not English!
    I suspect some software has translated it from its native language to
    English via Yiddish, irdu and Double Dutch, and it has enjoyed many
    exciting adventures along the way!

    The manual talks about phone numbers being normal type eg
    00441458833666, or number@provider eg because
    the phone can handle up to 3 voip provider accounts.
    It also says you can do straight peer to peer by entering an IP address.
    The fourth thing it says you can do is DDNS whatever that is.

    Ive tried posting these questions at voipcheap's website but they never
    never answer your mail. Downright rude if you ask me.
    Iceman, Jun 1, 2006
    #3
  4. Recently, Iceman popped out over the fence
    around uk.telecom.voip and said...
    |Hi forum.
    |I am totally new to VoIP and SIP and need to ask some questions.
    |I have an account with voipcheap.co.uk and I have been using their PC
    |software for a few weeks now.
    |I wanted to be able to make and receive calls all the time without my PC
    |switched on so I replaced my USB modem with a Broadband router and
    |bought myself a SIP phone - its a Safecom SDSIP-3000.
    |I configured the phone with my voipcheap details, username, password,
    |domain voipcheap.com, proxy server sip.voipcheap.com.
    |I can make calls to normal phone numbers okay (voip-out) and I can
    |receive calls from normal phones via my voipcheap allocated voip-in
    |number. All that works okay.
    |But how the hell do I make voip to voip calls?
    |The voipcheap PC software enables you to make calls to other voipcheap
    |users without touching the PSTN - excellent sound quality because its
    |not being constrained by the audio bandwidth of the PSTN.
    |Lets say for the sake of this conversation my friend's voipcheap
    |username is "wibble".
    |Using the PC software I can call wibble using my speakers and microphone.
    |I have tried putting wibble into my SIP phone's phonebook.
    |I have also tried "" and ""
    |but none of these works.
    |(I did tell you Im new to voip and SIP - assume I know nothing!)
    |Perhaps SIP only supports phone-number based calling? I dont know.
    |How do I call another voipcheap user without using the PSTN?
    |If I get them to apply for a voip-in number from voipcheap and I call
    |that number using my SIP phone, can I assume the voipcheap SIP server is
    |clever enough to know its the number of another voipcheap user and route
    |it straight to them without going anywhere near the PSTN?
    |
    |Can anyone validate my assumptions, answer my questions, or teach me all
    |I need to know about voip and SIP?
    |
    Just one hint: if you use your VoIP provider to call users on the same
    VoIP provider, it doesn't matter if you use their "alias" or VoIP
    number, or the associated PSTN number.
    The VoIP provider "knows" that the PSTN number you are using is one of
    its numbers, and the call is set up internally in the same provider
    network, through VoIP and - as always - is totally free.
    VoIP wants to be a replacement for the old PSTN network, and all is
    engineered to be as much similar to normal PSTN systems as possible -
    then using only numbers to call someone.

    --
    ßødincµs²°°° - The Y2K Druid
    ßødincµs²°°°, Jun 2, 2006
    #4
  5. Iceman

    Ivor Jones Guest

    "Iceman" <> wrote in message
    news:447f612b$
    > Hi forum.


    Erm.. this is a newsgroup not a forum but never mind ;-)

    > I am totally new to VoIP and SIP and need to ask some
    > questions. I have an account with voipcheap.co.uk and I have been
    > using their PC software for a few weeks now.
    > I wanted to be able to make and receive calls all the
    > time without my PC switched on so I replaced my USB modem
    > with a Broadband router and bought myself a SIP phone -
    > its a Safecom SDSIP-3000. I configured the phone with my voipcheap
    > details,
    > username, password, domain voipcheap.com, proxy server
    > sip.voipcheap.com. I can make calls to normal phone numbers okay
    > (voip-out)
    > and I can receive calls from normal phones via my
    > voipcheap allocated voip-in number. All that works okay.
    > But how the hell do I make voip to voip calls?


    If the person you are calling is using the same VoIP provider as you or is
    with a provider with whom yours has a peering agreement, then the call is
    free whether you dial the allocated phone number or the SIP address.

    > The voipcheap PC software enables you to make calls to
    > other voipcheap users without touching the PSTN -
    > excellent sound quality because its not being constrained
    > by the audio bandwidth of the PSTN. Lets say for the sake of this
    > conversation my friend's
    > voipcheap username is "wibble".
    > Using the PC software I can call wibble using my speakers
    > and microphone. I have tried putting wibble into my SIP
    > phone's phonebook. I have also tried "" and
    > "" but none of these works.
    > (I did tell you Im new to voip and SIP - assume I know
    > nothing!)


    Does the voipcheap site not give you any of this information..? I do not
    use them so know little about them, but I would have thought they would
    have had at least minimal setup information on their site..?

    > Perhaps SIP only supports phone-number based calling? I
    > dont know.


    No, if your equipment supports it you can call using the full SIP address;
    I use Sipgate, so if you want to call me, assuming my address is
    you would call that. Try it, it's a real number and
    routes to my speaking clock..! It can also be reached on the phone number
    020 7043 1320, try both and see if the phone number gets charged for (no
    way of telling you otherwise, sorry..!)

    > How do I call another voipcheap user without using the
    > PSTN?


    Using a PSTN number does not automatically mean the call is routed over
    the PSTN, get that idea out of your head. It may end up being delivered
    over PSTN if there is no peering agreement between providers, but it
    doesn't have to be.

    > If I get them to apply for a voip-in number from
    > voipcheap and I call that number using my SIP phone, can
    > I assume the voipcheap SIP server is clever enough to
    > know its the number of another voipcheap user and route
    > it straight to them without going anywhere near the PSTN?


    As I said above, using a PSTN number does NOT mean the call is being
    routed that way. If the person you are calling is on the same system or is
    available on a peering agreement, then it will be a free call, which is
    the important bit..!

    > Can anyone validate my assumptions, answer my questions,
    > or teach me all I need to know about voip and SIP?


    www.voxilla.com is a good place to start, there are others but that site
    is a good one.

    Ivor
    Ivor Jones, Jun 2, 2006
    #5
  6. Iceman

    linker3000 Guest

    Just out of interest, from where did you purchase your 3000 and how much
    did you pay - I'm possibly after a few.

    Ta

    L3K
    linker3000, Jun 2, 2006
    #6
  7. Iceman

    Iceman Guest

    linker3000 wrote:
    > Just out of interest, from where did you purchase your 3000 and how much
    > did you pay - I'm possibly after a few.
    >
    > Ta
    >
    > L3K


    No probs!
    I got mine from www.qtds.com and I paid 33.99 plus VAT and delivery.
    It came to 46.40 total.

    Mike
    Iceman, Jun 3, 2006
    #7
  8. Iceman

    Jono Guest

    Iceman used his keyboard to write :
    > linker3000 wrote:
    >> Just out of interest, from where did you purchase your 3000 and how much
    >> did you pay - I'm possibly after a few.
    >>
    >> Ta
    >>
    >> L3K

    >
    > No probs!
    > I got mine from www.qtds.com and I paid 33.99 plus VAT and delivery.
    > It came to 46.40 total.
    >
    > Mike


    Have they stopped selling them? Or am I missing something?
    Jono, Jun 3, 2006
    #8
  9. Iceman

    linker3000 Guest

    Iceman wrote:
    > linker3000 wrote:
    >> Just out of interest, from where did you purchase your 3000 and how
    >> much did you pay - I'm possibly after a few.
    >>
    >> Ta
    >>
    >> L3K

    >
    > No probs!
    > I got mine from www.qtds.com and I paid 33.99 plus VAT and delivery.
    > It came to 46.40 total.
    >
    > Mike

    Thanks - I was thinking of using qtds - I am also hanging out for the
    4000 to be available but the ship date from Safecom keeps slipping. I'm
    using 3 of the 5000s at the mo and have just ordered 10 more.
    linker3000, Jun 3, 2006
    #9
  10. Iceman

    Iceman Guest

    linker3000 wrote:
    > Iceman wrote:
    >> linker3000 wrote:
    >>> Just out of interest, from where did you purchase your 3000 and how
    >>> much did you pay - I'm possibly after a few.
    >>>
    >>> Ta
    >>>
    >>> L3K

    >>
    >> No probs!
    >> I got mine from www.qtds.com and I paid 33.99 plus VAT and delivery.
    >> It came to 46.40 total.
    >>
    >> Mike

    > Thanks - I was thinking of using qtds - I am also hanging out for the
    > 4000 to be available but the ship date from Safecom keeps slipping. I'm
    > using 3 of the 5000s at the mo and have just ordered 10 more.


    Yup I wanted a 4000 too but it sounds like it might be new and there's
    no sign of first shipping yet.

    So, Is anyone going to tell me how to call somebody elses VoIPCheap from
    my SIP phone?

    I think I'm going to assume for now that phone numbers are the only
    option and usernames are not supported. So I can only talk to people who
    have a voip-in number then...
    Iceman, Jun 3, 2006
    #10
  11. Iceman

    Jono Guest

    Jono brought next idea :
    > Iceman used his keyboard to write :
    >> linker3000 wrote:
    >>> Just out of interest, from where did you purchase your 3000 and how much
    >>> did you pay - I'm possibly after a few.
    >>>
    >>> Ta
    >>>
    >>> L3K

    >>
    >> No probs!
    >> I got mine from www.qtds.com and I paid 33.99 plus VAT and delivery.
    >> It came to 46.40 total.
    >>
    >> Mike

    >
    > Have they stopped selling them? Or am I missing something?


    Forget it.......thought you were referring to another manufacturer's
    3000
    Jono, Jun 3, 2006
    #11
  12. Iceman

    Jono Guest

    It happens that Iceman formulated :
    > linker3000 wrote:
    >> Iceman wrote:
    >>> linker3000 wrote:
    >>>> Just out of interest, from where did you purchase your 3000 and how much
    >>>> did you pay - I'm possibly after a few.
    >>>>
    >>>> Ta
    >>>>
    >>>> L3K
    >>>
    >>> No probs!
    >>> I got mine from www.qtds.com and I paid 33.99 plus VAT and delivery.
    >>> It came to 46.40 total.
    >>>
    >>> Mike

    >> Thanks - I was thinking of using qtds - I am also hanging out for the 4000
    >> to be available but the ship date from Safecom keeps slipping. I'm using 3
    >> of the 5000s at the mo and have just ordered 10 more.

    >
    > Yup I wanted a 4000 too but it sounds like it might be new and there's no
    > sign of first shipping yet.
    >
    > So, Is anyone going to tell me how to call somebody elses VoIPCheap from my
    > SIP phone?
    >
    > I think I'm going to assume for now that phone numbers are the only option
    > and usernames are not supported. So I can only talk to people who have a
    > voip-in number then...


    Unless they ring your username, of course.
    Jono, Jun 3, 2006
    #12
  13. Iceman

    Ivor Jones Guest

    "Iceman" <> wrote in message
    news:448162c4$

    [snip]

    > So, Is anyone going to tell me how to call somebody elses
    > VoIPCheap from my SIP phone?
    >
    > I think I'm going to assume for now that phone numbers
    > are the only option and usernames are not supported. So I
    > can only talk to people who have a voip-in number then...


    I already answered your question, see my post of 0216 02/6/06.

    Ivor
    Ivor Jones, Jun 3, 2006
    #13
  14. Iceman

    Iceman Guest

    Ivor Jones wrote:
    > "Iceman" <> wrote in message
    > news:448162c4$
    >
    > [snip]
    >
    >> So, Is anyone going to tell me how to call somebody elses
    >> VoIPCheap from my SIP phone?
    >>
    >> I think I'm going to assume for now that phone numbers
    >> are the only option and usernames are not supported. So I
    >> can only talk to people who have a voip-in number then...

    >
    > I already answered your question, see my post of 0216 02/6/06.
    >
    > Ivor
    >
    >


    Ivor,
    I cant see it, could you repost here please.

    Cheers
    Mike
    Iceman, Jun 3, 2006
    #14
  15. Iceman

    Ivor Jones Guest

    "Iceman" <> wrote in message
    news:
    > Ivor Jones wrote:
    > > "Iceman" <> wrote in
    > > message news:448162c4$
    > >
    > > [snip]
    > >
    > > > So, Is anyone going to tell me how to call somebody
    > > > elses VoIPCheap from my SIP phone?
    > > >
    > > > I think I'm going to assume for now that phone numbers
    > > > are the only option and usernames are not supported.
    > > > So I can only talk to people who have a voip-in
    > > > number then...

    > >
    > > I already answered your question, see my post of 0216
    > > 02/6/06. Ivor
    > >
    > >

    >
    > Ivor,
    > I cant see it, could you repost here please.
    >
    > Cheers
    > Mike

    "Iceman" <> wrote in message
    news:447f612b$
    > Hi forum.


    Erm.. this is a newsgroup not a forum but never mind ;-)

    > I am totally new to VoIP and SIP and need to ask some
    > questions. I have an account with voipcheap.co.uk and I have been
    > using their PC software for a few weeks now.
    > I wanted to be able to make and receive calls all the
    > time without my PC switched on so I replaced my USB modem
    > with a Broadband router and bought myself a SIP phone -
    > its a Safecom SDSIP-3000. I configured the phone with my voipcheap
    > details,
    > username, password, domain voipcheap.com, proxy server
    > sip.voipcheap.com. I can make calls to normal phone numbers okay
    > (voip-out)
    > and I can receive calls from normal phones via my
    > voipcheap allocated voip-in number. All that works okay.
    > But how the hell do I make voip to voip calls?


    If the person you are calling is using the same VoIP provider as you or is
    with a provider with whom yours has a peering agreement, then the call is
    free whether you dial the allocated phone number or the SIP address.

    > The voipcheap PC software enables you to make calls to
    > other voipcheap users without touching the PSTN -
    > excellent sound quality because its not being constrained
    > by the audio bandwidth of the PSTN. Lets say for the sake of this
    > conversation my friend's
    > voipcheap username is "wibble".
    > Using the PC software I can call wibble using my speakers
    > and microphone. I have tried putting wibble into my SIP
    > phone's phonebook. I have also tried "" and
    > "" but none of these works.
    > (I did tell you Im new to voip and SIP - assume I know
    > nothing!)


    Does the voipcheap site not give you any of this information..? I do not
    use them so know little about them, but I would have thought they would
    have had at least minimal setup information on their site..?

    > Perhaps SIP only supports phone-number based calling? I
    > dont know.


    No, if your equipment supports it you can call using the full SIP address;
    I use Sipgate, so if you want to call me, assuming my address is
    you would call that. Try it, it's a real number and
    routes to my speaking clock..! It can also be reached on the phone number
    020 7043 1320, try both and see if the phone number gets charged for (no
    way of telling you otherwise, sorry..!)

    > How do I call another voipcheap user without using the
    > PSTN?


    Using a PSTN number does not automatically mean the call is routed over
    the PSTN, get that idea out of your head. It may end up being delivered
    over PSTN if there is no peering agreement between providers, but it
    doesn't have to be.

    > If I get them to apply for a voip-in number from
    > voipcheap and I call that number using my SIP phone, can
    > I assume the voipcheap SIP server is clever enough to
    > know its the number of another voipcheap user and route
    > it straight to them without going anywhere near the PSTN?


    As I said above, using a PSTN number does NOT mean the call is being
    routed that way. If the person you are calling is on the same system or is
    available on a peering agreement, then it will be a free call, which is
    the important bit..!

    > Can anyone validate my assumptions, answer my questions,
    > or teach me all I need to know about voip and SIP?


    www.voxilla.com is a good place to start, there are others but that site
    is a good one.

    Ivor
    Ivor Jones, Jun 3, 2006
    #15
  16. Iceman

    Jono Guest

    Ivor Jones expressed precisely :

    > If the person you are calling is using the same VoIP provider as you or is
    > with a provider with whom yours has a peering agreement, then the call is
    > free whether you dial the allocated phone number or the SIP address.
    >


    Forgive me if I'm barking up the wrong tree........

    That doesn't help if the person he is calling doesn't have a "VoipIn"
    PSTN number for him to call - perhaps they only have a "username"?
    Jono, Jun 3, 2006
    #16
  17. Iceman

    Ivor Jones Guest

    "Jono" <> wrote
    in message
    news:
    > Ivor Jones expressed precisely :
    >
    > > If the person you are calling is using the same VoIP
    > > provider as you or is with a provider with whom yours
    > > has a peering agreement, then the call is free whether
    > > you dial the allocated phone number or the SIP address.

    >
    > Forgive me if I'm barking up the wrong tree........
    >
    > That doesn't help if the person he is calling doesn't
    > have a "VoipIn" PSTN number for him to call - perhaps
    > they only have a "username"?


    ..? Although apart from Skype I don't know of any
    system which doesn't allocate a diallable phone number. (Yes I know Skype
    has the facility but it isn't automatically given when you open an
    account). Having said that, FWD isn't directly reachable from the PSTN
    except by use of alternative services, unless they've changed recently,
    not used my FWD account for a while.

    Ivor
    Ivor Jones, Jun 3, 2006
    #17
  18. Iceman

    Jono Guest

    Ivor Jones explained :
    >
    > "Jono" <> wrote
    > in message
    > news:
    >> Ivor Jones expressed precisely :
    >>
    >> > If the person you are calling is using the same VoIP
    >> > provider as you or is with a provider with whom yours
    >> > has a peering agreement, then the call is free whether
    >> > you dial the allocated phone number or the SIP address.

    >>
    >> Forgive me if I'm barking up the wrong tree........
    >>
    >> That doesn't help if the person he is calling doesn't
    >> have a "VoipIn" PSTN number for him to call - perhaps
    >> they only have a "username"?

    >
    > ..? Although apart from Skype I don't know of any system
    > which doesn't allocate a diallable phone number. (Yes I know Skype has the
    > facility but it isn't automatically given when you open an account). Having
    > said that, FWD isn't directly reachable from the PSTN except by use of
    > alternative services, unless they've changed recently, not used my FWD
    > account for a while.
    >
    > Ivor


    Yeah, but if you read Iceman's request again, you would, I think
    realise, that you've not /quite/ answered his question.

    He's tried what you suggest and can't get it to work, which is why he
    asked in the first place.

    Too much snippy snip, methinks ;-)
    Jono, Jun 3, 2006
    #18
  19. Iceman

    Iceman Guest

    Jono wrote:
    > Ivor Jones explained :
    >>
    >> "Jono" <> wrote
    >> in message
    >> news:
    >>> Ivor Jones expressed precisely :
    >>>
    >>> > If the person you are calling is using the same VoIP
    >>> > provider as you or is with a provider with whom yours
    >>> > has a peering agreement, then the call is free whether
    >>> > you dial the allocated phone number or the SIP address.
    >>>
    >>> Forgive me if I'm barking up the wrong tree........
    >>>
    >>> That doesn't help if the person he is calling doesn't
    >>> have a "VoipIn" PSTN number for him to call - perhaps
    >>> they only have a "username"?

    >>
    >> ..? Although apart from Skype I don't know of any
    >> system which doesn't allocate a diallable phone number. (Yes I know
    >> Skype has the facility but it isn't automatically given when you open
    >> an account). Having said that, FWD isn't directly reachable from the
    >> PSTN except by use of alternative services, unless they've changed
    >> recently, not used my FWD account for a while.
    >>
    >> Ivor

    >
    > Yeah, but if you read Iceman's request again, you would, I think
    > realise, that you've not /quite/ answered his question.
    >
    > He's tried what you suggest and can't get it to work, which is why he
    > asked in the first place.
    >
    > Too much snippy snip, methinks ;-)
    >
    >


    That's right, I put my friend's into my phone's
    phonebook. When I tried to call him, it did 3 beeps like as if a numeric
    phonenumber then stopped and nothing happens for about 40 seconds then I
    get "time out" on the phone's display and a beep beep beep as if engaged.

    If I just dial his real number, a Manchester code 0044161 etc etc the
    call would be free anyway because voipcheap calls to geographical
    numbers are free, but that's not the point. I'm a perfectionist and I
    love a challenge, and I'm going to phone the bugger voip to voip if its
    the last thing I do!!
    Iceman, Jun 3, 2006
    #19
  20. Iceman

    aap Guest

    "Iceman" <> wrote in message
    news:447f612b$...
    > I have tried putting wibble into my SIP phone's phonebook.
    > I have also tried "" and ""
    > but none of these works.


    Try wibble@her_publicipnumber

    Cheers,
    Jack
    aap, Jun 4, 2006
    #20
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