UPDATE: lcd tv looks crap

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by outofdate, Jan 15, 2006.

  1. outofdate

    outofdate Guest

    Since my original post I have had a chance to play with the controls on a
    lcd 32inch tv in store, the first thing i tried was adjusting the sharpness
    down and I tried nothing else as this was all that was needed to get rid of
    the awful looking compression artefacts in the picture that I seen in all
    the branches I have visited of 5 different chain stores, it was also
    surprising to me that nobody replied to my original post with this simple
    solution, that combined with all stores having the same problem made me
    think that it must be something more significant than a simple out of
    balance setting, you would think the shops would want to make their product
    look as good as possible instead of having it setup so bad that it puts
    buyers off and you would think that lcd tv owners would be able to tell me
    right away what the problem is, I guess they have their tv's setup the same
    at home which seems unbelievable. Also all the tv's in the store that i got
    to play with the controls on were sourced by composite inputs so it would be
    interesting to see the picture quality with a better quality input.
    And by the way I gave up waiting for an answer from newsgroup posters after
    a couple of days so if anybody finally did come up with the solution I was
    unaware.
    outofdate, Jan 15, 2006
    #1
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  2. "outofdate" <outofdate@computer> wrote in message
    news:43cad5c6$...
    > Since my original post I have had a chance to play with the controls on a
    > lcd 32inch tv in store, the first thing i tried was adjusting the

    sharpness
    > down and I tried nothing else as this was all that was needed to get rid

    of
    > the awful looking compression artefacts in the picture that I seen in all
    > the branches I have visited of 5 different chain stores, it was also
    > surprising to me that nobody replied to my original post with this simple
    > solution, that combined with all stores having the same problem made me
    > think that it must be something more significant than a simple out of
    > balance setting, you would think the shops would want to make their

    product
    > look as good as possible instead of having it setup so bad that it puts
    > buyers off and you would think that lcd tv owners would be able to tell me
    > right away what the problem is, I guess they have their tv's setup the

    same
    > at home which seems unbelievable. Also all the tv's in the store that i

    got
    > to play with the controls on were sourced by composite inputs so it would

    be
    > interesting to see the picture quality with a better quality input.
    > And by the way I gave up waiting for an answer from newsgroup posters

    after
    > a couple of days so if anybody finally did come up with the solution I was
    > unaware.
    >


    I find that quite often, TV's all been driven by a composite fed, usually
    amplified and distributed by a cheap box in between to run all the other
    TV's, as S-Video/Component source amplifiers are more expensive to install
    and setup etc... Also a lot of mid price TV's have the
    colour/brightness/contrast all turned down on them to make you want to buy
    the bigger and better (more expensive and mroe sales comission) TV's. These
    are just age old sales tricks.

    Technically, the person in charge of the hi-fi deparment should have a
    colour bar generator to set the TV's brightness/contract/colour corectly to
    the source they are using. This would already improve the quality of an LCD
    appearance heaps. I've visisted a few pioneer/toshiba raod show exibitions
    where they've done this right and the quality on their newer LCD's as very
    impressive. Although they were using high definition material not commonly
    available.

    Gavin.
    Gavin Stephens, Jan 16, 2006
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. "Gavin Stephens" <> wrote in message
    news:XuByf.15175$...
    >
    > "outofdate" <outofdate@computer> wrote in message
    > news:43cad5c6$...
    > > Since my original post I have had a chance to play with the controls on

    a
    > > lcd 32inch tv in store, the first thing i tried was adjusting the

    > sharpness
    > > down and I tried nothing else as this was all that was needed to get rid

    > of
    > > the awful looking compression artefacts in the picture that I seen in

    all
    > > the branches I have visited of 5 different chain stores, it was also
    > > surprising to me that nobody replied to my original post with this

    simple
    > > solution, that combined with all stores having the same problem made me
    > > think that it must be something more significant than a simple out of
    > > balance setting, you would think the shops would want to make their

    > product
    > > look as good as possible instead of having it setup so bad that it puts
    > > buyers off and you would think that lcd tv owners would be able to tell

    me
    > > right away what the problem is, I guess they have their tv's setup the

    > same
    > > at home which seems unbelievable. Also all the tv's in the store that i

    > got
    > > to play with the controls on were sourced by composite inputs so it

    would
    > be
    > > interesting to see the picture quality with a better quality input.
    > > And by the way I gave up waiting for an answer from newsgroup posters

    > after
    > > a couple of days so if anybody finally did come up with the solution I

    was
    > > unaware.
    > >

    >
    > I find that quite often, TV's all been driven by a composite fed, usually
    > amplified and distributed by a cheap box in between to run all the other
    > TV's, as S-Video/Component source amplifiers are more expensive to

    install
    > and setup etc... Also a lot of mid price TV's have the
    > colour/brightness/contrast all turned down on them to make you want to buy
    > the bigger and better (more expensive and mroe sales comission) TV's.

    These
    > are just age old sales tricks.
    >
    > Technically, the person in charge of the hi-fi deparment should have a
    > colour bar generator to set the TV's brightness/contract/colour corectly

    to
    > the source they are using. This would already improve the quality of an

    LCD
    > appearance heaps. I've visisted a few pioneer/toshiba raod show exibitions
    > where they've done this right and the quality on their newer LCD's as very
    > impressive. Although they were using high definition material not commonly
    > available.
    >
    > Gavin.


    My appologies for the quick post with a bunch of typo's.

    Gavin
    Gavin Stephens, Jan 16, 2006
    #3
  4. outofdate

    outofdate Guest

    "Gavin Stephens" <> wrote in message
    news:XuByf.15175$...
    >
    > Technically, the person in charge of the hi-fi deparment should have a
    > colour bar generator to set the TV's brightness/contract/colour corectly

    to
    > the source they are using. This would already improve the quality of an

    LCD
    > appearance heaps. I've visisted a few pioneer/toshiba raod show exibitions
    > where they've done this right and the quality on their newer LCD's as very
    > impressive. Although they were using high definition material not commonly
    > available.
    >
    > Gavin.
    >


    I seen a large plasma tv been with a hidef source, it looked amazing.
    outofdate, Jan 16, 2006
    #4
  5. outofdate

    JD Guest

    outofdate wrote:

    > at home which seems unbelievable. Also all the tv's in the store that i got
    > to play with the controls on were sourced by composite inputs so it would be
    > interesting to see the picture quality with a better quality input.


    What did I tell you? Don't buy from a store which can't be bothered
    using component inputs.
    JD, Jan 16, 2006
    #5
  6. outofdate

    outofdate Guest

    "outofdate" <outofdate@computer> wrote in message
    news:43cad5c6$...
    > Since my original post I have had a chance to play with the controls on a
    > lcd 32inch tv in store, the first thing i tried was adjusting the

    sharpness
    > down and I tried nothing else as this was all that was needed to get rid

    of
    > the awful looking compression artefacts in the picture that I seen in all
    > the branches I have visited of 5 different chain stores, it was also
    > surprising to me that nobody replied to my original post with this simple
    > solution, that combined with all stores having the same problem made me
    > think that it must be something more significant than a simple out of
    > balance setting, you would think the shops would want to make their

    product
    > look as good as possible instead of having it setup so bad that it puts
    > buyers off and you would think that lcd tv owners would be able to tell me
    > right away what the problem is, I guess they have their tv's setup the

    same
    > at home which seems unbelievable. Also all the tv's in the store that i

    got
    > to play with the controls on were sourced by composite inputs so it would

    be
    > interesting to see the picture quality with a better quality input.
    > And by the way I gave up waiting for an answer from newsgroup posters

    after
    > a couple of days so if anybody finally did come up with the solution I was
    > unaware.
    >


    The lcd tv I was looking at was playing a cartoon so in that respect it was
    setup to look it's best.
    outofdate, Jan 16, 2006
    #6
  7. outofdate

    paul Guest

    I have found the same problem as yourself with very bad picture quality
    on all the plasma tv's in my local RetraVision store, that also included the
    hd ones

    Makes one wonder about the people selling these things, surely there must be
    some competent sales staff out there
    and what about the reps of the companies?, dont they even bother to check to
    see what their tv's look like in store?

    paul


    "outofdate" <outofdate@computer> wrote in message
    news:43caf4fa$...
    >
    > "Gavin Stephens" <> wrote in message
    > news:XuByf.15175$...
    >>
    >> Technically, the person in charge of the hi-fi deparment should have a
    >> colour bar generator to set the TV's brightness/contract/colour corectly

    > to
    >> the source they are using. This would already improve the quality of an

    > LCD
    >> appearance heaps. I've visisted a few pioneer/toshiba raod show
    >> exibitions
    >> where they've done this right and the quality on their newer LCD's as
    >> very
    >> impressive. Although they were using high definition material not
    >> commonly
    >> available.
    >>
    >> Gavin.
    >>

    >
    > I seen a large plasma tv been with a hidef source, it looked amazing.
    >
    >
    paul, Jan 16, 2006
    #7
  8. Hi there,

    outofdate wrote:
    > Since my original post I have had a chance to play with the controls on a
    > lcd 32inch tv in store, the first thing i tried was adjusting the sharpness
    > down and I tried nothing else as this was all that was needed to get rid of


    If you soften the picture too much (to try and remove the ghosting and
    picture artifacts) I suspect you will be blurring out detail inherent in
    the source material. Don't mistake a smooth looking picture for a one
    that is crisp and full of detail...

    > you would think the shops would want to make their product
    > look as good as possible instead of having it setup so bad that it puts
    > buyers off


    It seems sales figures would disagree with you...cheap LCD and plasma
    screens appear to be highly popular, which is reflected in the large
    range and increasingly cheaper price you can get them for...

    > Also all the tv's in the store that i got
    > to play with the controls on were sourced by composite inputs so it would be
    > interesting to see the picture quality with a better quality input.


    Why not ask for a demo using a component cable? If that is how you will
    setup your home it isn't unreasonable to ask the shop to provide a demo
    the same way, is it not?

    > And by the way I gave up waiting for an answer from newsgroup posters after
    > a couple of days so if anybody finally did come up with the solution I was
    > unaware.


    So what was the question? :)

    YMMV...every TV is different, so do your homework before buying is all
    I can recommend...I just wouldn't buy a low-res panel because with the
    imminent arrival of HDTV transmission and HD-DVD and all kinds of other
    stuff I'd rather own something that can display those formats in native
    resolutions, rather than scaled down ones...trust me 1080p WMV and DivX
    clips look just great at that res on my PC here. I've scaled down a few
    clips to PAL from 720p and 1080i...the detail you lose is very easy to
    notice...

    --
    Kind regards,

    Chris Wilkinson, Brisbane, Australia.
    Anyone wishing to email me directly can remove the obvious
    spamblocker, and replace it with t p g <dot> c o m <dot> a u
    Chris Wilkinson, Jan 16, 2006
    #8
  9. outofdate

    outofdate Guest

    "Chris Wilkinson" <> wrote in message
    news:43cb3e84$...
    > Hi there,
    >
    > outofdate wrote:
    > > Since my original post I have had a chance to play with the controls on

    a
    > > lcd 32inch tv in store, the first thing i tried was adjusting the

    sharpness
    > > down and I tried nothing else as this was all that was needed to get rid

    of
    >
    > If you soften the picture too much (to try and remove the ghosting and
    > picture artifacts) I suspect you will be blurring out detail inherent in
    > the source material. Don't mistake a smooth looking picture for a one
    > that is crisp and full of detail...


    Of course I will be removing detail, that's the point, I have to in order to
    get rid of the ugly compression artefacts.

    >
    > > you would think the shops would want to make their product
    > > look as good as possible instead of having it setup so bad that it puts
    > > buyers off

    >
    > It seems sales figures would disagree with you...cheap LCD and plasma
    > screens appear to be highly popular, which is reflected in the large
    > range and increasingly cheaper price you can get them for...
    >


    Agreed, I didn't mean to word the statement as I did.
    outofdate, Jan 17, 2006
    #9
  10. outofdate

    XP Guest

    UPDATE: lcd tv looks crap , This is WHY..

    LCD's emphasize any noise in the picture,as they have a harder display than a
    CRT..

    LCD's look there best with a DVD input..

    Of air TV has to much noise and SKY/able has other noises and bad
    resolution..
    XP, Jan 17, 2006
    #10
  11. outofdate

    Mike Guest

    Re: UPDATE: lcd tv looks crap , This is WHY..

    XP wrote:

    > LCD's look there best with a DVD input..


    Thats crazy. Better than with a HD-STB?

    > Of air TV has to much noise and SKY/able has other noises and bad resolution..



    Wow! 7 grammar/spelling errors in two lines! Yeah, many people do those
    stupid apostrophes, and we all make typos, but how hard is "off" and
    "too"?

    Speling Nasi.
    Mike, Jan 17, 2006
    #11
  12. outofdate

    Michael Guest

    Re: UPDATE: lcd tv looks crap , This is WHY..

    "Mike" <> wrote in message
    news:43cc5dce$...
    > XP wrote:
    >
    >> LCD's look there best with a DVD input..

    >
    > Thats crazy. Better than with a HD-STB?


    HDTV's quality varies a bit, but obviously downloaded or half decent
    broadcast stuff is much better than DVD, if your LCD can display it
    properly.

    >> Of air TV has to much noise and SKY/able has other noises and bad
    >> resolution..

    >
    >
    > Wow! 7 grammar/spelling errors in two lines! Yeah, many people do those
    > stupid apostrophes, and we all make typos, but how hard is "off" and
    > "too"?


    Or 'that's'. :)
    Michael, Jan 17, 2006
    #12
  13. Hi there,

    outofdate wrote:
    > "Chris Wilkinson" <> wrote in message
    > news:43cb3e84$...
    >
    >>If you soften the picture too much (to try and remove the ghosting and
    >>picture artifacts) I suspect you will be blurring out detail inherent in
    >>the source material. Don't mistake a smooth looking picture for a one
    >>that is crisp and full of detail...

    >
    > Of course I will be removing detail, that's the point, I have to in order to
    > get rid of the ugly compression artefacts.


    Seeing if the panel will show detailed imagery using a good
    quality component feed direct from a DVD player will be a
    better test - if it fails to resolve nice details its not
    worth buying in my opinion...

    >>>you would think the shops would want to make their product
    >>>look as good as possible instead of having it setup so bad that it puts
    >>>buyers off

    >>
    >>It seems sales figures would disagree with you...cheap LCD and plasma
    >>screens appear to be highly popular, which is reflected in the large
    >>range and increasingly cheaper price you can get them for...

    >
    > Agreed, I didn't mean to word the statement as I did.


    They've become a mass market thing quicker than I expected,
    which explains the proliferation of cheap low-spec panels.
    I'd rather wait until 1920x1080 res panels come down, or
    stick to my tiny 19" CRT PC screen, that does true 1080p
    display...I could get a 24" Dell 1920x1200 widescreen LCD
    monitor for $1400 AUD but even that is too small to use in
    an average loungeroom as a DVD/TV screen...

    --
    Kind regards,

    Chris Wilkinson, Brisbane, Australia.
    Anyone wishing to email me directly can remove the obvious
    spamblocker, and replace it with t p g <dot> c o m <dot> a u
    Chris Wilkinson, Jan 17, 2006
    #13
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