Switch from Orcon?

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Jamie Kahn Genet, Mar 15, 2006.

  1. These new ADSL prices and caps are crap. Now I DO like Orcon's service
    and support. They're the ISP I've been with the longest, as I've never
    had that moment of great frustration with support - "So you CANNOT help
    me? Ok, fine. I'd like to close my account. I'm switching ISPs." I'm
    sure most everyone else has been there at some point.

    It will be a PITA to switch, though, as they host my domain and other
    stuff for me, so I'll stay, if only there's SOME hope widespread change
    will come before long. Is there?

    Anyway, where can one get a good mix of price/bandwidth/service these
    days? I really can't stand anything less than a 2Mbit plan and would
    prefer a 3.5 Mbit plan (not that I EVER expect to get anywhere near than
    speed). I don't care about the Usenet server as I pay for the top notch,
    very cheap APN service from Forte
    <http://www.forteinc.com/apn/index.php>. I'll also likely get someone
    like DiscountDomains to host my domain, email and web services, so
    domain hosting isn't a big worry, either. Though it couldn't hurt, eh?

    TIA,
    Jamie Kahn Genet
    --
    If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
    Jamie Kahn Genet, Mar 15, 2006
    #1
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  2. Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
    > These new ADSL prices and caps are crap. Now I DO like Orcon's service
    > and support.


    I'm totally stunned to read that. I had to read it about three times. Are
    you sure you're not being sarcastic?

    > They're the ISP I've been with the longest, as I've never
    > had that moment of great frustration with support - "So you CANNOT
    > help me? Ok, fine. I'd like to close my account. I'm switching ISPs."
    > I'm sure most everyone else has been there at some point.


    Several times with Orcon with me but, as one of my favourite bands, Massive
    Attack, would say, "Inertia Creeps". I was annoyed enough to change several
    times but finally did it just over a month ago. Their "service" prompted me
    to coin what I believe is a new term, "Hinderdesk".

    > It will be a PITA to switch, though, as they host my domain and other
    > stuff for me, so I'll stay, if only there's SOME hope widespread
    > change will come before long. Is there?


    Impossible to tell my friend. Define "before long".

    Good luck Jamie, I'm amazed you've had such a good run with OrCON. I hope
    you haven't used up all your luck. ;-)
    --
    Shaun (~misfit~)
    Shaun \(~misfit~\), Mar 15, 2006
    #2
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  3. Shaun (~misfit~) <> wrote:

    > Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
    > > These new ADSL prices and caps are crap. Now I DO like Orcon's service
    > > and support.

    >
    > I'm totally stunned to read that. I had to read it about three times. Are
    > you sure you're not being sarcastic?


    *laughs* Ah, nope.

    > > They're the ISP I've been with the longest, as I've never
    > > had that moment of great frustration with support - "So you CANNOT
    > > help me? Ok, fine. I'd like to close my account. I'm switching ISPs."
    > > I'm sure most everyone else has been there at some point.

    >
    > Several times with Orcon with me but, as one of my favourite bands, Massive
    > Attack, would say, "Inertia Creeps". I was annoyed enough to change several
    > times but finally did it just over a month ago. Their "service" prompted me
    > to coin what I believe is a new term, "Hinderdesk".


    Hinderdesk - I like it! So what was the moment of ultimate frustration
    for you? I must admit their fuckups a while back with their Usenet
    provider annoyed me, but not greatly. I just switched to a cheap, very
    reliable commercial provider - Forte's APN.

    > > It will be a PITA to switch, though, as they host my domain and other
    > > stuff for me, so I'll stay, if only there's SOME hope widespread
    > > change will come before long. Is there?

    >
    > Impossible to tell my friend. Define "before long".


    Before I end up climbing a watertower and taking potshots at Telecom
    staff.

    > Good luck Jamie, I'm amazed you've had such a good run with OrCON. I hope
    > you haven't used up all your luck. ;-)


    Likewise! ;-)

    Regards,
    Jamie Kahn Genet
    --
    If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
    Jamie Kahn Genet, Mar 15, 2006
    #3
  4. Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
    > Shaun (~misfit~) <> wrote:
    >
    >> Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
    >>> These new ADSL prices and caps are crap. Now I DO like Orcon's
    >>> service and support.

    >>
    >> I'm totally stunned to read that. I had to read it about three
    >> times. Are you sure you're not being sarcastic?

    >
    > *laughs* Ah, nope.


    <Speechless>

    >>> They're the ISP I've been with the longest, as I've never
    >>> had that moment of great frustration with support - "So you CANNOT
    >>> help me? Ok, fine. I'd like to close my account. I'm switching
    >>> ISPs." I'm sure most everyone else has been there at some point.

    >>
    >> Several times with Orcon with me but, as one of my favourite bands,
    >> Massive Attack, would say, "Inertia Creeps". I was annoyed enough to
    >> change several times but finally did it just over a month ago. Their
    >> "service" prompted me to coin what I believe is a new term,
    >> "Hinderdesk".

    >
    > Hinderdesk - I like it! So what was the moment of ultimate frustration
    > for you?


    The moment of thruth for me was after just over two weeks of trying to get
    then to sort out why my PPP connection was dropping. They ram through all
    the basic. step-by-step stuff about isolating the modem. I said I'd already
    done that but they insisted I do it again and ring back two days later. (The
    problem wasn't at the DSL level, that connection was fine, it was PPP
    dropping out, DSL was staying up. That fact alone is very telling but they
    didn't even know what I was talking about and wouldn't put me through to
    someone who did)

    After a couple days I dutifully rang them back and, after spending 20
    minutes convincing a different 'driod that I *had* done the isolation test
    and still had 6 drop-outs in that time was told it was my modem/router. I
    was ready for this and tols then that I had already tried a different one
    (true) and it had made no difference, the problem was at their end or the
    DSLAM. I was told that they'd ring me back later that day. After not hearing
    for three days I rang myself and, after doing the same-old-same-ols with a
    new 'driod (bye-bye 20 minutes I'll never get back) I was told they'd ring
    me back. I said they bloody better this time.

    (BTW, at this point I should say that, 80% of the time I spoke to OrCON's
    hinderdesk I got a person who obviously had English as a second (or fourth)
    language) and a lot of the conversation consisted of me saying "could you
    please repeat that" or me re-itterating a point they didn't seem to grasp).

    They did in fact ring me back that day. The next step? Isolate my modem for
    a full week and see if I get drop-outs! This means no telephone and, to my
    mind, doesn't prove anything as I've already done it twice for a couple days
    and had multiple drop-outs during that time.

    Anyway, if that's what it's going to take to get them to fix it that what I
    agree to do. A week later I ring them back, by this time I've had 60+ PPP
    drop-outs in the previous month, and they say they'll talk to their
    technicians and get back to me. (I repeatedly ask to talk to a tech myself,
    told that I can't).

    Two days later I hadn't heard, my connection is dropping as often as a
    whore's drawers, often when I'm gaming, causing me to constantly repeat the
    same part of the game. So I ring them again (I should have mentioned, most
    times I rang I was put on hold for varying times, up to in excess of 20
    minutes. I actually went out and bought a speaker phone just so this was
    bearable) and am told that they haven't spoken to atch yet, they'll ring me
    back.

    I say no way. I'll hold while you do it now. After 30 minutes or so (with
    the 'driod coming back on-line now and then saying "All the techs are busy,
    I can't get through", I finally get a result!!! And what is that result you
    ask?

    OrCON don't consider that 50+ drop-outs a month is excessive and won't be
    doing anything about it. They won't let me speak to a tech and won't
    escalate it to telecom.

    *THAT* was the breaking point, the moment of ultimate frustration. They'd
    dicked me around for over two weeks just to tell me that they wouldn't do
    anything about it anyway. I rang Actrix that day.

    I still got drop-outs with Actrix but waited a couple weeks for things to
    settle. After that time I rang Actrix's helpdesk and told them the story
    (They couldn't believe OrCON said it was acceptable, the Actrix tech I spoke
    to said he'd tell his mate as he was with OrCON). The upshot was that,
    within 24 hours I'd been visited by a Telecom tech in my home who tested my
    line and router and agreed that the problem was probably at the DSLAM and
    who then put me on a different port. Since then I've enjoyed more than a
    week without my connection droppping, (up until the day before yesterday
    when there was a major Telecom outage with Actix's ATMs).

    All along I'd told OrCON that I needed to speak to a tech and that there was
    something wrong with my line/port. I'd done a whole bunch of my own tests,
    including signal-to-noise ratio tests on the line etc. and knew 100% that
    the problem wasn't in my house.

    (Pls excuse up-coming crudity)

    I think the problem is that OrCON is so far up Telecom's ass that they don't
    wan't to wriggle too much as it upsets their "special relationship" with
    Telecom that one of the techs that I spoke to at OrCON (A year ago, when you
    could actually speak with a tech) told me about.

    > I must admit their fuckups a while back with their Usenet
    > provider annoyed me, but not greatly. I just switched to a cheap, very
    > reliable commercial provider - Forte's APN.
    >
    >>> It will be a PITA to switch, though, as they host my domain and
    >>> other stuff for me, so I'll stay, if only there's SOME hope
    >>> widespread change will come before long. Is there?

    >>
    >> Impossible to tell my friend. Define "before long".

    >
    > Before I end up climbing a watertower and taking potshots at Telecom
    > staff.


    You need help getting a rifle? Someone to join you? I suggest you go for the
    board though, not the staff.

    <joke follows>

    It would only take a few bucks each from disgruntled internet users in NZ to
    get a contract put out on Ms Gattung. Maybe Telecom would listen to us then?

    <joke ends>

    >> Good luck Jamie, I'm amazed you've had such a good run with OrCON. I
    >> hope you haven't used up all your luck. ;-)

    >
    > Likewise! ;-)


    Cheers,
    --
    Shaun (~misfit~)
    Shaun \(~misfit~\), Mar 15, 2006
    #4
  5. Jamie Kahn Genet

    Adam Guest

    On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 12:25:18 +1300, Shaun (~misfit~) wrote:

    >I think the problem is that OrCON is so far up Telecom's ass that they don't
    >wan't to wriggle too much as it upsets their "special relationship" with
    >Telecom that one of the techs that I spoke to at OrCON (A year ago, when you
    >could actually speak with a tech) told me about.


    Talking of "special relationships" - I think the relationship between
    the ISP techies and the Telecom techies is the telling one.

    When I first got Jetstream (R.I.P.) from Maxnet, I had similar
    problems to yours. The impression I got from Maxnet was that they were
    on good terms (certainly first name terms) with some key techies at
    Telecom - and I had none of the run-around you had. The problem was at
    exchange level every time. Though it turned out a difficult one to
    solve, I couldn't fault the approach (and efforts made) by both Maxnet
    and the individual Telecom techies.

    Maxnet aren't the cheapest (and their new plans look suspiciously like
    everyone else's "new" plans) but their service has always been good
    for me. The difficulty these days - because of our cr*p infrastructure
    - is working out whether it's an ISP problem, a Telecom problem, or
    just choked up international routes :-((

    Adam.
    Adam, Mar 15, 2006
    #5
  6. Adam wrote:
    > On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 12:25:18 +1300, Shaun (~misfit~) wrote:
    >
    >> I think the problem is that OrCON is so far up Telecom's ass that
    >> they don't wan't to wriggle too much as it upsets their "special
    >> relationship" with Telecom that one of the techs that I spoke to at
    >> OrCON (A year ago, when you could actually speak with a tech) told
    >> me about.

    >
    > Talking of "special relationships" - I think the relationship between
    > the ISP techies and the Telecom techies is the telling one.


    Probably true.

    > When I first got Jetstream (R.I.P.) from Maxnet, I had similar
    > problems to yours. The impression I got from Maxnet was that they were
    > on good terms (certainly first name terms) with some key techies at
    > Telecom - and I had none of the run-around you had. The problem was at
    > exchange level every time. Though it turned out a difficult one to
    > solve, I couldn't fault the approach (and efforts made) by both Maxnet
    > and the individual Telecom techies.


    Good to hear.

    > Maxnet aren't the cheapest (and their new plans look suspiciously like
    > everyone else's "new" plans) but their service has always been good
    > for me. The difficulty these days - because of our cr*p infrastructure
    > - is working out whether it's an ISP problem, a Telecom problem, or
    > just choked up international routes :-((


    Yeah, it can be difficult. That's why I did as much research into it as I
    could before even approaching Orcon. (Checking router, upgrading firmware,
    checking S/N ratio at different times etc.) I was convinced that the problem
    was either at the exchange or ISP. Once OrCON also became convinced they
    decided that they weren't going to do anything about it.
    --
    Shaun (~misfit~)
    Shaun \(~misfit~\), Mar 16, 2006
    #6
  7. Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
    > These new ADSL prices and caps are crap. Now I DO like Orcon's service
    > and support. They're the ISP I've been with the longest, as I've never



    Give it a couple of weeks and see what moves other ISP's make. You may
    find that everyone else's plans become crap too.

    R
    Rimu Atkinson, Mar 18, 2006
    #7
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