Sunday TV1

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Torrential, Mar 12, 2006.

  1. Torrential

    Torrential Guest

    at least the program touch the Government nerves ?


    Helen Clarke !Helen Clarke !Helen Clarke !
    Sunday TV1
    Torrential, Mar 12, 2006
    #1
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  2. On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 12:33:03 +1300, Torrential wrote:

    > at least the program touch the Government nerves ?


    Several points:

    a/ Statements start with a capital letter and finish with a full stop.

    b/ There are no spaces between punctuation marks and the words that
    preceed them.

    c/ "Program" is a noun in singular form, and as such requires a verb also
    in singular form. Thus "touches" is the correct form for the verb in that
    sentence if you are making an indicitive statement. Is that what you were
    attempting to do? Or were you attempting to make a subjunctive statement?

    d/ Is the indirect object of that sentence really "the Government"?
    If so it doesn't make any sense that a TV programme touch nerves for any
    government letalone for our government. TV programming is not supposed to
    be a propaganda tool.

    e/ What television programme are you referring to?


    Have A Nice Cup of Tea

    --
    1/ Migration to Linux only costs money once. Higher Windows TCO is forever.
    2/ "Shared source" is a poison pill. Open Source is freedom.
    3/ Only the Windows boxes get the worms.
    Have A Nice Cup of Tea, Mar 13, 2006
    #2
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  3. Torrential

    RJ Guest

    In article <>, says...
    > On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 12:33:03 +1300, Torrential wrote:
    >
    > > at least the program touch the Government nerves ?

    >
    > Several points:
    >
    > a/ Statements start with a capital letter and finish with a full stop.
    >
    > b/ There are no spaces between punctuation marks and the words that
    > preceed them.


    The correct spelling is precede.

    >
    > c/ "Program" is a noun in singular form, and as such requires a verb also
    > in singular form. Thus "touches" is the correct form for the verb in that
    > sentence if you are making an indicitive statement. Is that what you were
    > attempting to do? Or were you attempting to make a subjunctive statement?


    The correct spelling is indicative.

    >
    > d/ Is the indirect object of that sentence really "the Government"?
    > If so it doesn't make any sense that a TV programme touch nerves for any
    > government letalone for our government. TV programming is not supposed to
    > be a propaganda tool.


    There is no word such as "letalone". It is two words, "let" and "alone".
    RJ, Mar 13, 2006
    #3
  4. Torrential

    Ritch Fukka Guest

    What a bunch of sad tossers!


    "RJ" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > In article <>, says...
    >> On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 12:33:03 +1300, Torrential wrote:
    >>
    >> > at least the program touch the Government nerves ?

    >>
    >> Several points:
    >>
    >> a/ Statements start with a capital letter and finish with a full stop.
    >>
    >> b/ There are no spaces between punctuation marks and the words that
    >> preceed them.

    >
    > The correct spelling is precede.
    >
    >>
    >> c/ "Program" is a noun in singular form, and as such requires a verb also
    >> in singular form. Thus "touches" is the correct form for the verb in that
    >> sentence if you are making an indicitive statement. Is that what you were
    >> attempting to do? Or were you attempting to make a subjunctive statement?

    >
    > The correct spelling is indicative.
    >
    >>
    >> d/ Is the indirect object of that sentence really "the Government"?
    >> If so it doesn't make any sense that a TV programme touch nerves for any
    >> government letalone for our government. TV programming is not supposed to
    >> be a propaganda tool.

    >
    > There is no word such as "letalone". It is two words, "let" and "alone".
    >
    Ritch Fukka, Mar 13, 2006
    #4
  5. Torrential

    Adam Guest

    On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 14:31:15 +1300, RJ wrote:

    >In article <>, says...
    >> On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 12:33:03 +1300, Torrential wrote:
    >>
    >> > at least the program touch the Government nerves ?

    >>
    >> Several points:
    >>
    >> a/ Statements start with a capital letter and finish with a full stop.
    >>
    >> b/ There are no spaces between punctuation marks and the words that
    >> preceed them.

    >
    >The correct spelling is precede.
    >
    >>
    >> c/ "Program" is a noun in singular form, and as such requires a verb also
    >> in singular form. Thus "touches" is the correct form for the verb in that
    >> sentence if you are making an indicitive statement. Is that what you were
    >> attempting to do? Or were you attempting to make a subjunctive statement?

    >
    >The correct spelling is indicative.
    >
    >>
    >> d/ Is the indirect object of that sentence really "the Government"?
    >> If so it doesn't make any sense that a TV programme touch nerves for any
    >> government letalone for our government. TV programming is not supposed to
    >> be a propaganda tool.

    >
    >There is no word such as "letalone". It is two words, "let" and "alone".


    .... plus the one that everyone missed:

    "program" is the thing wot runs on yer PC.

    "programme" is what yer watches on the telly.

    :)

    Adam.
    Adam, Mar 13, 2006
    #5
  6. Torrential

    RJ Guest

    In article <>, Adam says...
    > On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 14:31:15 +1300, RJ wrote:
    >
    > >In article <>, says...
    > >> On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 12:33:03 +1300, Torrential wrote:
    > >>
    > >> > at least the program touch the Government nerves ?
    > >>
    > >> Several points:
    > >>
    > >> a/ Statements start with a capital letter and finish with a full stop.
    > >>
    > >> b/ There are no spaces between punctuation marks and the words that
    > >> preceed them.

    > >
    > >The correct spelling is precede.
    > >
    > >>
    > >> c/ "Program" is a noun in singular form, and as such requires a verb also
    > >> in singular form. Thus "touches" is the correct form for the verb in that
    > >> sentence if you are making an indicitive statement. Is that what you were
    > >> attempting to do? Or were you attempting to make a subjunctive statement?

    > >
    > >The correct spelling is indicative.
    > >
    > >>
    > >> d/ Is the indirect object of that sentence really "the Government"?
    > >> If so it doesn't make any sense that a TV programme touch nerves for any
    > >> government letalone for our government. TV programming is not supposed to
    > >> be a propaganda tool.

    > >
    > >There is no word such as "letalone". It is two words, "let" and "alone".

    >
    > ... plus the one that everyone missed:
    >
    > "program" is the thing wot runs on yer PC.
    >
    > "programme" is what yer watches on the telly.


    No, these are the US and UK spellings of the same word.
    RJ, Mar 13, 2006
    #6
  7. Torrential

    Adam Guest

    On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 01:28:36 +1300, RJ wrote:

    >In article <>, Adam says...
    >> On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 14:31:15 +1300, RJ wrote:
    >>
    >> >In article <>, says...
    >> >> On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 12:33:03 +1300, Torrential wrote:
    >> >>
    >> >> > at least the program touch the Government nerves ?
    >> >>
    >> >> Several points:
    >> >>
    >> >> a/ Statements start with a capital letter and finish with a full stop.
    >> >>
    >> >> b/ There are no spaces between punctuation marks and the words that
    >> >> preceed them.
    >> >
    >> >The correct spelling is precede.
    >> >
    >> >>
    >> >> c/ "Program" is a noun in singular form, and as such requires a verb also
    >> >> in singular form. Thus "touches" is the correct form for the verb in that
    >> >> sentence if you are making an indicitive statement. Is that what you were
    >> >> attempting to do? Or were you attempting to make a subjunctive statement?
    >> >
    >> >The correct spelling is indicative.
    >> >
    >> >>
    >> >> d/ Is the indirect object of that sentence really "the Government"?
    >> >> If so it doesn't make any sense that a TV programme touch nerves for any
    >> >> government letalone for our government. TV programming is not supposed to
    >> >> be a propaganda tool.
    >> >
    >> >There is no word such as "letalone". It is two words, "let" and "alone".

    >>
    >> ... plus the one that everyone missed:
    >>
    >> "program" is the thing wot runs on yer PC.
    >>
    >> "programme" is what yer watches on the telly.

    >
    >No, these are the US and UK spellings of the same word.


    Wrong! UK English has two words - both meaning different things. US
    English only has the one word for both.

    Adam.
    Adam, Mar 13, 2006
    #7
  8. On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 22:08:54 +1300, Adam wrote:

    > "program" is the thing wot runs on yer PC.
    >
    > "programme" is what yer watches on the telly.


    "Program" is an American-spelling variant of the English word "programme".

    It is the same word.

    A programme is, fundamentally, a running order.

    A programme for a concert is what will take place during that concert,
    and in what sequence.

    A programme for television or radio, is a listing of what is to be
    broadcast, and in what sequence.

    A programme for a computer is a list of instructions in sequence.

    Any attempted distinction between "program" and "programme" is spurious -
    except to say that the Americans don't know how to spell the English
    language. (my own spelling is not the best either)


    Have A Nice Cup of Tea

    --
    1/ Migration to Linux only costs money once. Higher Windows TCO is forever.
    2/ "Shared source" is a poison pill. Open Source is freedom.
    3/ Only the Windows boxes get the worms.
    Have A Nice Cup of Tea, Mar 13, 2006
    #8
  9. On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 03:59:19 +1300, Adam wrote:

    >>No, these are the US and UK spellings of the same word.

    >
    > Wrong! UK English has two words - both meaning different things.


    Sorry, mate. Wrong!

    The correct spelling is "programme." The American spelling is "program".


    Have A Nice Cup of Tea

    --
    1/ Migration to Linux only costs money once. Higher Windows TCO is forever.
    2/ "Shared source" is a poison pill. Open Source is freedom.
    3/ Only the Windows boxes get the worms.
    Have A Nice Cup of Tea, Mar 13, 2006
    #9
  10. Torrential

    Richard Guest

    Adam wrote:

    >>>"program" is the thing wot runs on yer PC.
    >>>
    >>>"programme" is what yer watches on the telly.

    >>
    >>No, these are the US and UK spellings of the same word.

    >
    >
    > Wrong! UK English has two words - both meaning different things. US
    > English only has the one word for both.


    UK added program as a result of PCs
    Richard, Mar 13, 2006
    #10
  11. Torrential

    RJ Guest

    In article <>, Adam says...
    > On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 01:28:36 +1300, RJ wrote:
    >
    > >In article <>, Adam says...
    > >> On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 14:31:15 +1300, RJ wrote:
    > >>
    > >> >In article <>, says...
    > >> >> On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 12:33:03 +1300, Torrential wrote:
    > >> >>
    > >> >> > at least the program touch the Government nerves ?
    > >> >>
    > >> >> Several points:
    > >> >>
    > >> >> a/ Statements start with a capital letter and finish with a full stop.
    > >> >>
    > >> >> b/ There are no spaces between punctuation marks and the words that
    > >> >> preceed them.
    > >> >
    > >> >The correct spelling is precede.
    > >> >
    > >> >>
    > >> >> c/ "Program" is a noun in singular form, and as such requires a verb also
    > >> >> in singular form. Thus "touches" is the correct form for the verb in that
    > >> >> sentence if you are making an indicitive statement. Is that what you were
    > >> >> attempting to do? Or were you attempting to make a subjunctive statement?
    > >> >
    > >> >The correct spelling is indicative.
    > >> >
    > >> >>
    > >> >> d/ Is the indirect object of that sentence really "the Government"?
    > >> >> If so it doesn't make any sense that a TV programme touch nerves for any
    > >> >> government letalone for our government. TV programming is not supposed to
    > >> >> be a propaganda tool.
    > >> >
    > >> >There is no word such as "letalone". It is two words, "let" and "alone".
    > >>
    > >> ... plus the one that everyone missed:
    > >>
    > >> "program" is the thing wot runs on yer PC.
    > >>
    > >> "programme" is what yer watches on the telly.

    > >
    > >No, these are the US and UK spellings of the same word.

    >
    > Wrong! UK English has two words - both meaning different things. US
    > English only has the one word for both.


    No, the reason that program is so well known for computer software is
    that it comes from American usage.
    RJ, Mar 14, 2006
    #11
  12. Torrential

    Adam Guest

    On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 10:29:05 +1300, Have A Nice Cup of Tea wrote:

    >Any attempted distinction between "program" and "programme" is spurious -
    >except to say that the Americans don't know how to spell the English
    >language. (my own spelling is not the best either)


    Hehe ... agreed on both points. I just get a bit tetchy as I see
    Americanisms stomping all over the English-speaking world.

    Adam.
    Adam, Mar 14, 2006
    #12
  13. Torrential

    David Guest

    Adam wrote:
    > On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 10:29:05 +1300, Have A Nice Cup of Tea wrote:
    >
    >> Any attempted distinction between "program" and "programme" is spurious -
    >> except to say that the Americans don't know how to spell the English
    >> language. (my own spelling is not the best either)

    >
    > Hehe ... agreed on both points. I just get a bit tetchy as I see
    > Americanisms stomping all over the English-speaking world.
    >
    > Adam.


    Its nice to see firefox has an en-GB variant, and its offered on the
    main download page. I don't use IE because of the spelling errors, ie.
    "Favorites".
    David, Mar 14, 2006
    #13
  14. Torrential

    Adam Guest

    On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 22:27:21 +1300, David wrote:

    >Adam wrote:
    >> On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 10:29:05 +1300, Have A Nice Cup of Tea wrote:
    >>
    >>> Any attempted distinction between "program" and "programme" is spurious -
    >>> except to say that the Americans don't know how to spell the English
    >>> language. (my own spelling is not the best either)

    >>
    >> Hehe ... agreed on both points. I just get a bit tetchy as I see
    >> Americanisms stomping all over the English-speaking world.
    >>
    >> Adam.

    >
    >Its nice to see firefox has an en-GB variant, and its offered on the
    >main download page. I don't use IE because of the spelling errors, ie.
    >"Favorites".


    Yep. I squirm ever time I have to write a line of HTML that includes
    the word "color" ... and don't even start me on *date* formats!

    Call me pedantic but don't call me Shirley!

    Adam.
    Adam, Mar 14, 2006
    #14
  15. On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 10:29:05 +1300, Have A Nice Cup of Tea <>
    wrote:

    >On Mon, 13 Mar 2006 22:08:54 +1300, Adam wrote:
    >
    >> "program" is the thing wot runs on yer PC.
    >>
    >> "programme" is what yer watches on the telly.

    >
    >"Program" is an American-spelling variant of the English word "programme".
    >
    >It is the same word.
    >
    >A programme is, fundamentally, a running order.
    >
    >A programme for a concert is what will take place during that concert,
    >and in what sequence.
    >
    >A programme for television or radio, is a listing of what is to be
    >broadcast, and in what sequence.
    >
    >A programme for a computer is a list of instructions in sequence.
    >
    >Any attempted distinction between "program" and "programme" is spurious -
    >except to say that the Americans don't know how to spell the English
    >language. (my own spelling is not the best either)
    >
    >
    >Have A Nice Cup of Tea


    Sorry, but if I wrote about a programme to my bosses, they would not
    understand it to be software. In NZ and Aus, and also I suspect in
    the UK, program is software, programme is TV or radio or the like.
    This is now long established usage and I am fairly certain will be in
    any recent dictionary. I first started writing software back in about
    1975 and the usage was long established even by then.
    Stephen Worthington, Mar 14, 2006
    #15
  16. On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 13:13:22 +0000, Stephen Worthington wrote:

    >>A programme is, fundamentally, a running order.
    >>

    <snip>
    >
    > Sorry, but if I wrote about a programme to my bosses, they would not
    > understand it to be software. In NZ and Aus, and also I suspect in
    > the UK, program is software, programme is TV or radio or the like.
    > This is now long established usage and I am fairly certain will be in
    > any recent dictionary.


    As I have already said, a program(me) is a running order. Nothing more.

    You are attempting to narrow it's meaning into either something for
    broadcasting, or an item of software.

    In reality a program(me) is much more than that.

    When you attend a concert (perhaps you have never done that) you usually
    have the opportunity to purchase a program(me) - a booklet which describes
    what will be in the concert and in what order. Such a program(me) is
    neither capable of being broadcast nor can it be executed on a computer.

    As i said, a program(me) is a running order, and nothing more.


    Have A Nice Cup of Tea

    --
    1/ Migration to Linux only costs money once. Higher Windows TCO is forever.
    2/ "Shared source" is a poison pill. Open Source is freedom.
    3/ Only the Windows boxes get the worms.
    Have A Nice Cup of Tea, Mar 14, 2006
    #16
  17. Torrential

    Philip Guest

    Have A Nice Cup of Tea wrote:
    > On Tue, 14 Mar 2006 13:13:22 +0000, Stephen Worthington wrote:
    >
    >>> A programme is, fundamentally, a running order.
    >>>

    > <snip>
    >> Sorry, but if I wrote about a programme to my bosses, they would not
    >> understand it to be software. In NZ and Aus, and also I suspect in
    >> the UK, program is software, programme is TV or radio or the like.
    >> This is now long established usage and I am fairly certain will be in
    >> any recent dictionary.

    >
    > As I have already said, a program(me) is a running order. Nothing more.
    >
    > You are attempting to narrow it's meaning into either something for
    > broadcasting, or an item of software.
    >
    > In reality a program(me) is much more than that.
    >
    > When you attend a concert (perhaps you have never done that) you usually
    > have the opportunity to purchase a program(me) - a booklet which describes
    > what will be in the concert and in what order. Such a program(me) is
    > neither capable of being broadcast nor can it be executed on a computer.
    >
    > As i said, a program(me) is a running order, and nothing more.
    >


    But I find the distinction between "program" - a sequence of
    instructions to a computer,and "programme" - any other running order, to
    be useful.

    The traditional spelling is a Victorian affectation anyway
    http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?l=p&p=32.

    Many of these spelling differences go back to colonial times and before.
    Why do Australians have a Labor party but labour unions and watch colour
    tv? Why do we have Defence forces to take up defensive positions? Why
    does the Resene company sell its colours in ColorShops? Why, when we
    could, did we send telegrams and not telegrammes?

    If the writing is clear and comprehensible I have no problems with
    variant spelling. There's a long tradition of it, going back to Chaucer.
    Language changes and develops, or it atrophies.

    I don't think we should close our minds to new usage and spelling. If it
    adds to our understanding -. as the distinction between program and
    programme - then we should keep it.

    If it doesn't, we should let it die a peaceful death.

    Philip
    Philip, Mar 16, 2006
    #17
  18. On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 14:39:20 +1300, Philip wrote:

    >> As i said, a program(me) is a running order, and nothing more.
    >>

    >
    > But I find the distinction between "program" - a sequence of
    > instructions to a computer,and "programme" - any other running order, to
    > be useful.


    You may do that, but I don't make that sort of distinction in spelling.

    You could always just write computer programme or concert program or
    television programme or washing machine program or knitting machine
    programme or reading program, etc.

    Lets think about what a program - that's pro-gramme - is shall we?

    Gram | Gram |
    Gramme | Gramme |
    (gra^m), n. F. gramme, from Gr.
    gra`mma that which is written, a letter, a small weight, fr.
    gra`fein to write.

    And:

    Pro- | Pro- |
    L. pro, or Gr. ?. See Pro.
    A prefix signifying before, in front, forth, for, in behalf
    of, in place of, according to; as, propose, to place before;
    proceed, to go before or forward; project, to throw forward;
    prologue, part spoken before (the main piece); propel,
    prognathous; provide, to look out for; pronoun, a word
    instead of a noun; proconsul, a person acting in place of a
    consul; proportion, arrangement according to parts.
    1913 Webster

    And:

    Program | Pro"gram |
    n.
    Same as Programme.
    1913 Webster

    And:

    Programme | Pro"gramme |
    n. L. programma a public proclamation,
    manifesto, Gr. pro`gramma, fr. progra`fein to write before or
    in public; pro` before, forth + gra`fein to write; cf. F.
    programme. See Graphic.
    That which is written or printed as a public notice or
    advertisement; a scheme; a prospectus; especially, a brief
    outline or explanation of the order to be pursued, or the
    subjects embraced, in any public exercise, performance, or
    entertainment; a preliminary sketch.
    1913 Webster



    Have A Nice Cup of Tea

    --
    1/ Migration to Linux only costs money once. Higher Windows TCO is forever.
    2/ "Shared source" is a poison pill. Open Source is freedom.
    3/ Only the Windows boxes get the worms.
    Have A Nice Cup of Tea, Mar 16, 2006
    #18
  19. Torrential

    Mutley Guest

    Have A Nice Cup of Tea <> wrote:

    >On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 14:39:20 +1300, Philip wrote:
    >
    >>> As i said, a program(me) is a running order, and nothing more.
    >>>

    >>
    >> But I find the distinction between "program" - a sequence of
    >> instructions to a computer,and "programme" - any other running order, to
    >> be useful.

    >
    >You may do that, but I don't make that sort of distinction in spelling.
    >
    >You could always just write computer programme or concert program or
    >television programme or washing machine program or knitting machine
    >programme or reading program, etc.
    >
    >Lets think about what a program - that's pro-gramme - is shall we?
    >
    >Gram | Gram |
    > Gramme | Gramme |
    > (gra^m), n. F. gramme, from Gr.
    > gra`mma that which is written, a letter, a small weight, fr.
    > gra`fein to write.
    >
    >And:
    >
    >Pro- | Pro- |
    > L. pro, or Gr. ?. See Pro.
    > A prefix signifying before, in front, forth, for, in behalf
    > of, in place of, according to; as, propose, to place before;
    > proceed, to go before or forward; project, to throw forward;
    > prologue, part spoken before (the main piece); propel,
    > prognathous; provide, to look out for; pronoun, a word
    > instead of a noun; proconsul, a person acting in place of a
    > consul; proportion, arrangement according to parts.
    > 1913 Webster
    >
    >And:
    >
    >Program | Pro"gram |
    > n.
    > Same as Programme.
    > 1913 Webster
    >
    >And:
    >
    >Programme | Pro"gramme |
    > n. L. programma a public proclamation,
    > manifesto, Gr. pro`gramma, fr. progra`fein to write before or
    > in public; pro` before, forth + gra`fein to write; cf. F.
    > programme. See Graphic.
    > That which is written or printed as a public notice or
    > advertisement; a scheme; a prospectus; especially, a brief
    > outline or explanation of the order to be pursued, or the
    > subjects embraced, in any public exercise, performance, or
    > entertainment; a preliminary sketch.
    > 1913 Webster
    >
    >
    >
    >Have A Nice Cup of Tea


    Well Tea you can try and be the spelling netcop but I will stick with
    "program" for everything
    Mutley, Mar 16, 2006
    #19
  20. Torrential

    Adam Guest

    On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 16:36:50 +1300, Have A Nice Cup of Tea wrote:

    >And:
    >
    >Program | Pro"gram |
    > n.
    > Same as Programme.
    > 1913 Webster


    Well - it would say that, wouldn't it - Webster is an American
    dictionary (isn't it??).

    Adam.
    Adam, Mar 16, 2006
    #20
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