Stopping and starting Microsoft updates

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Geopelia, Feb 12, 2009.

  1. Geopelia

    Geopelia Guest

    A Microsoft or Windows update is going to take about 18 hours. I would have
    to use xtra for the download. I can't be connected all that time. (dial up)
    I could do it over two or three nights.

    I can't find anything in FAQ and Help about stopping and starting the
    download.

    Will it continue from where it left off if I restart it ? Or does it start
    again from the beginning?
    If xtra disconnects me or I disconnect, what happens please?
    I don't want to be left with odd bits of download in the works.

    Geopelia
     
    Geopelia, Feb 12, 2009
    #1
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  2. Geopelia

    Tony in Oz Guest

    "Geopelia" <> wrote in message
    news:gn2257$t3v$...
    >A Microsoft or Windows update is going to take about 18 hours. I would
    >have to use xtra for the download. I can't be connected all that time.
    >(dial up) I could do it over two or three nights.
    >
    > I can't find anything in FAQ and Help about stopping and starting the
    > download.
    >
    > Will it continue from where it left off if I restart it ? Or does it
    > start again from the beginning?
    > If xtra disconnects me or I disconnect, what happens please?
    > I don't want to be left with odd bits of download in the works.
    >
    > Geopelia
    >

    Geo, it should stop and resume whenever you are online. When you go
    offline, it will stop, and when you connect up again, it will take up where
    it left off,. The only annoying thing is your dial up will be slower than
    normal while it is downloading. Probably Roger's suggestion would be best.
    Perhaps its time to upgrade to a cheap DSL plan? You'll never want to go
    back to dialup again!
     
    Tony in Oz, Feb 12, 2009
    #2
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  3. Geopelia

    Roger_Nickel Guest

    On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 09:51:42 +1300, Geopelia wrote:

    > A Microsoft or Windows update is going to take about 18 hours. I would
    > have to use xtra for the download. I can't be connected all that time.
    > (dial up) I could do it over two or three nights.
    >
    > I can't find anything in FAQ and Help about stopping and starting the
    > download.
    >
    > Will it continue from where it left off if I restart it ? Or does it
    > start again from the beginning?
    > If xtra disconnects me or I disconnect, what happens please? I don't
    > want to be left with odd bits of download in the works.
    >
    > Geopelia


    My solution for windows XP was :- go to internet cafe, search for ---
    download winxp service pack 3 ---; download and copy to USB key (300 Mb
    file ) and then use this file to update home machine. I also made a boot
    CD which will install XP complete with the updates, drivers and
    activation files needed for complete reinstallation of the Windows system
    on my PC without need for tedious updating and reactivation. This last
    step a bit complicated, but any competent computer tech could do it.
     
    Roger_Nickel, Feb 12, 2009
    #3
  4. Geopelia

    Roger_Nickel Guest

    On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:49:35 +1300, geoff wrote:

    > Roger_Nickel wrote:
    >
    >
    >> My solution for windows XP was :- go to internet cafe, search for ---
    >> download winxp service pack 3 ---; download and copy to USB key (300 Mb
    >> file ) and then use this file to update home machine.

    >
    > But watch out for viruses !
    >
    > geoff


    Good point; download from MS website should be safe, but trying to find
    the files by searching on the website itself is difficult. MS maintain
    these files for their corporate customers but don't publicly advertise
    them.
     
    Roger_Nickel, Feb 13, 2009
    #4
  5. Geopelia

    Dave Doe Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    > Roger_Nickel wrote:
    > > On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:49:35 +1300, geoff wrote:
    > >
    > >> Roger_Nickel wrote:
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>> My solution for windows XP was :- go to internet cafe, search for
    > >>> --- download winxp service pack 3 ---; download and copy to USB key
    > >>> (300 Mb file ) and then use this file to update home machine.
    > >>
    > >> But watch out for viruses !
    > >>
    > >> geoff

    > >
    > > Good point; download from MS website should be safe, but trying to
    > > find the files by searching on the website itself is difficult. MS
    > > maintain these files for their corporate customers but don't publicly
    > > advertise them.

    >
    > I'm talking about plugging a memory stick into a web cafe's PC.


    Hmmm, ok; but you have to trust the web cafe's PC.

    --
    Duncan
     
    Dave Doe, Feb 13, 2009
    #5
  6. Geopelia

    Roger_Nickel Guest

    On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 13:07:12 +1300, geoff wrote:

    > Roger_Nickel wrote:
    >> On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:49:35 +1300, geoff wrote:
    >>
    >>> Roger_Nickel wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> My solution for windows XP was :- go to internet cafe, search for ---
    >>>> download winxp service pack 3 ---; download and copy to USB key (300
    >>>> Mb file ) and then use this file to update home machine.
    >>>
    >>> But watch out for viruses !
    >>>
    >>> geoff

    >>
    >> Good point; download from MS website should be safe, but trying to find
    >> the files by searching on the website itself is difficult. MS maintain
    >> these files for their corporate customers but don't publicly advertise
    >> them.

    >
    > I'm talking about plugging a memory stick into a web cafe's PC.
    >
    >
    > geoff


    I-Play in Wellington reboots computers to a new Windows session for each
    new customer. As far as I can tell the operating system is reloaded fresh
    from the server each time?, so hopefully just the network server to
    secure rather than dozens of desktop machines, although data files on the
    local hard disk are not cleared. Virus checking helps, and I have to say
    that in my time of transporting files back and forth -- no problems yet.
     
    Roger_Nickel, Feb 13, 2009
    #6
  7. Geopelia

    Geopelia Guest

    That you all, but all that is much too complicated for me to try. I'd have
    to ask the computer man to do it.

    But if it continues to download when I am on line, in time it should
    complete the job.
     
    Geopelia, Feb 13, 2009
    #7
  8. Geopelia

    Geopelia Guest

    "Tony in Oz" <> wrote in message
    news:C91ll.20040$...
    >
    > "Geopelia" <> wrote in message
    > news:gn2257$t3v$...
    >>A Microsoft or Windows update is going to take about 18 hours. I would
    >>have to use xtra for the download. I can't be connected all that time.
    >>(dial up) I could do it over two or three nights.
    >>
    >> I can't find anything in FAQ and Help about stopping and starting the
    >> download.
    >>
    >> Will it continue from where it left off if I restart it ? Or does it
    >> start again from the beginning?
    >> If xtra disconnects me or I disconnect, what happens please?
    >> I don't want to be left with odd bits of download in the works.
    >>
    >> Geopelia
    >>

    > Geo, it should stop and resume whenever you are online. When you go
    > offline, it will stop, and when you connect up again, it will take up
    > where it left off,. The only annoying thing is your dial up will be slower
    > than normal while it is downloading. Probably Roger's suggestion would be
    > best. Perhaps its time to upgrade to a cheap DSL plan? You'll never want
    > to go back to dialup again!
    >

    Thank you. That is what I wanted to know, why don't they put these things in
    Help or FAQs?

    We can't afford broadband on the pension, unfortunately. Perhaps the cost
    will eventually come down (some hopes!).
    But it seems it's just as slow as dial up, from what some people are saying.

    Geopelia
     
    Geopelia, Feb 13, 2009
    #8
  9. Geopelia

    Tony in Oz Guest

    "Geopelia" <> wrote in message
    news:gn2nf4$qjm$...
    > That you all, but all that is much too complicated for me to try. I'd have
    > to ask the computer man to do it.
    >
    > But if it continues to download when I am on line, in time it should
    > complete the job.
    >
    >

    Exactly right, Geo, it will.
    >
     
    Tony in Oz, Feb 13, 2009
    #9
  10. Geopelia

    Tony in Oz Guest

    "Geopelia" <> wrote in message
    news:gn2nob$t7s$...
    >
    > "Tony in Oz" <> wrote in message
    > news:C91ll.20040$...
    >>
    >> "Geopelia" <> wrote in message
    >> news:gn2257$t3v$...
    >>>A Microsoft or Windows update is going to take about 18 hours. I would
    >>>have to use xtra for the download. I can't be connected all that time.
    >>>(dial up) I could do it over two or three nights.
    >>>
    >>> I can't find anything in FAQ and Help about stopping and starting the
    >>> download.
    >>>
    >>> Will it continue from where it left off if I restart it ? Or does it
    >>> start again from the beginning?
    >>> If xtra disconnects me or I disconnect, what happens please?
    >>> I don't want to be left with odd bits of download in the works.
    >>>
    >>> Geopelia
    >>>

    >> Geo, it should stop and resume whenever you are online. When you go
    >> offline, it will stop, and when you connect up again, it will take up
    >> where it left off,. The only annoying thing is your dial up will be
    >> slower than normal while it is downloading. Probably Roger's suggestion
    >> would be best. Perhaps its time to upgrade to a cheap DSL plan? You'll
    >> never want to go back to dialup again!
    >>

    > Thank you. That is what I wanted to know, why don't they put these things
    > in Help or FAQs?
    >
    > We can't afford broadband on the pension, unfortunately. Perhaps the cost
    > will eventually come down (some hopes!).
    > But it seems it's just as slow as dial up, from what some people are
    > saying.
    >
    > Geopelia
    >

    Yeah, your right Geo, the cheapest broadband plan, I used to have and it
    wouldn't even stream youtube video without stopping and buffering. The only
    real advantage of it is you can use your phone while on the net. I upgraded
    mine to 1500 down and 256 up, and it works reasonably well, but I wouldn't
    want anything slower than that. I get 12 GB per month, anything over that is
    throttled back, but I haven't used any more than 6 GB yet. Costs me 69 bucks
    a month, but thats a bigpond one, in aussie.. cheers T.
     
    Tony in Oz, Feb 13, 2009
    #10
  11. Geopelia

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Somewhere on teh intarwebs Tony in Oz wrote:
    > "Geopelia" <> wrote in message
    > news:gn2nob$t7s$...
    >>
    >> "Tony in Oz" <> wrote in message
    >> news:C91ll.20040$...
    >>>
    >>> "Geopelia" <> wrote in message
    >>> news:gn2257$t3v$...
    >>>> A Microsoft or Windows update is going to take about 18 hours. I
    >>>> would have to use xtra for the download. I can't be connected all
    >>>> that time. (dial up) I could do it over two or three nights.
    >>>>
    >>>> I can't find anything in FAQ and Help about stopping and starting
    >>>> the download.
    >>>>
    >>>> Will it continue from where it left off if I restart it ? Or does
    >>>> it start again from the beginning?
    >>>> If xtra disconnects me or I disconnect, what happens please?
    >>>> I don't want to be left with odd bits of download in the works.
    >>>>
    >>>> Geopelia
    >>>>
    >>> Geo, it should stop and resume whenever you are online. When you
    >>> go offline, it will stop, and when you connect up again, it will
    >>> take up where it left off,. The only annoying thing is your dial up
    >>> will be slower than normal while it is downloading. Probably
    >>> Roger's suggestion would be best. Perhaps its time to upgrade to a
    >>> cheap DSL plan? You'll never want to go back to dialup again!
    >>>

    >> Thank you. That is what I wanted to know, why don't they put these
    >> things in Help or FAQs?
    >>
    >> We can't afford broadband on the pension, unfortunately. Perhaps the
    >> cost will eventually come down (some hopes!).
    >> But it seems it's just as slow as dial up, from what some people are
    >> saying.
    >>
    >> Geopelia
    >>

    > Yeah, your right Geo, the cheapest broadband plan, I used to have
    > and it wouldn't even stream youtube video without stopping and
    > buffering. The only real advantage of it is you can use your phone
    > while on the net. I upgraded mine to 1500 down and 256 up, and it
    > works reasonably well, but I wouldn't want anything slower than that.
    > I get 12 GB per month, anything over that is throttled back, but I
    > haven't used any more than 6 GB yet. Costs me 69 bucks a month, but
    > thats a bigpond one, in aussie.. cheers T.


    My neighbour has the first plan on this page:

    http://www.actrix.co.nz/page.php?id=144

    The tolls are way cheaper than Telecom and there's no obigation to make any
    calls anyway. He's more than happy with it for light surfing (Trademe etc..)
    and email. The beauty of it is it's 70MB at 256/128 and then throttled to
    64/64, faster than dial-up anyway. Also, the daily cap is re-set *twice* a
    day, at 6pm and again at 2am. Not bad for $27.95/week I reckon. A decent
    step up from dial-up for not much more money.

    Until last week they were doing not only free connection but also free basic
    modem on 12 month contract.

    Cheers,
    --
    Shaun.

    "Build a man a fire, and he`ll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and
    he`ll be warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchett, Jingo.
     
    ~misfit~, Feb 13, 2009
    #11
  12. Geopelia

    peterwn Guest

    On Feb 13, 1:12 pm, Roger_Nickel <>
    wrote:
    > On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:49:35 +1300, geoff wrote:
    >
    > Good point; download from MS website should be safe, but trying to find
    > the files by searching on the website itself is difficult. MS maintain
    > these files for their corporate customers but don't publicly advertise
    > them.


    Micrsoft seems to have forgotten that there are many people reliant on
    dial-up and that downloading updates for XP and Office is a pain to
    say the least. Presumably it is nearly impossible for Vista, and yet
    that is all people can buy unless they go to a 'small format' notebook
    which cannot handle Vista.
    ..
     
    peterwn, Feb 13, 2009
    #12
  13. Geopelia

    Gordon Guest

    On 2009-02-12, geoff <> wrote:
    > Roger_Nickel wrote:
    >
    >>
    >> My solution for windows XP was :- go to internet cafe, search for ---
    >> download winxp service pack 3 ---; download and copy to USB key (300
    >> Mb file ) and then use this file to update home machine.

    >
    > But watch out for viruses !
    >


    !!!!! that is a given
     
    Gordon, Feb 13, 2009
    #13
  14. On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 09:51:42 +1300, "Geopelia" <> wrote:

    >A Microsoft or Windows update is going to take about 18 hours. I would have
    >to use xtra for the download. I can't be connected all that time. (dial up)
    >I could do it over two or three nights.
    >
    >I can't find anything in FAQ and Help about stopping and starting the
    >download.
    >
    >Will it continue from where it left off if I restart it ? Or does it start
    >again from the beginning?
    >If xtra disconnects me or I disconnect, what happens please?
    >I don't want to be left with odd bits of download in the works.
    >
    >Geopelia
    >

    Side-tracking: Geo this is the reason why we got a couple of cheap pay as you go cell phones.
    If anyone wants to get hold of us and I have the landline tied up, they call the cell and I can
    either disconnect or if they are near a computer, go to instant msge.

    Cath

    ....
     
    texan....usenet@texas...removethisbit.usacom.., Feb 13, 2009
    #14
  15. Geopelia

    Gordon Guest

    On 2009-02-13, Geopelia <> wrote:
    >
    > "Tony in Oz" <> wrote in message
    > news:C91ll.20040$...
    >>>

    >> Geo, it should stop and resume whenever you are online. When you go
    >> offline, it will stop, and when you connect up again, it will take up
    >> where it left off,. The only annoying thing is your dial up will be slower
    >> than normal while it is downloading. Probably Roger's suggestion would be
    >> best. Perhaps its time to upgrade to a cheap DSL plan? You'll never want
    >> to go back to dialup again!


    Indeed. In fact the broadband scene is getting better by the day/month/year.

    >>

    > Thank you. That is what I wanted to know, why don't they put these things in
    > Help or FAQs?


    Who are they? ;-)

    >
    > We can't afford broadband on the pension, unfortunately. Perhaps the cost
    > will eventually come down (some hopes!).


    You will need to let inflation work on that task.


    In many ways G's posting raises a point way underneath the broadband radar, and
    the benefits of it, which are debated in the public arena. Namely that the
    Internet is something everyone should be able to afford.

    Having said all that. G. you enjoy your Internet, so may I suggest hard that
    you consider that you see if some other activity/cost has some savings in
    it. Which can be used to upgrade to broadband.



    > But it seems it's just as slow as dial up, from what some people are saying.
    >
    > Geopelia
    >
    >
     
    Gordon, Feb 13, 2009
    #15
  16. Geopelia

    Gordon Guest

    On 2009-02-13, Tony in Oz <> wrote:
    >
    > "Geopelia" <> wrote in message
    > news:gn2nob$t7s$...
    >>
    >> "Tony in Oz" <> wrote in message
    >> news:C91ll.20040$...
    >>>
    >>> "Geopelia" <> wrote in message
    >>> news:gn2257$t3v$...
    >>>>A Microsoft or Windows update is going to take about 18 hours. I would
    >>>>have to use xtra for the download. I can't be connected all that time.
    >>>>(dial up) I could do it over two or three nights.
    >>>>
    >>>> I can't find anything in FAQ and Help about stopping and starting the
    >>>> download.
    >>>>
    >>>> Will it continue from where it left off if I restart it ? Or does it
    >>>> start again from the beginning?
    >>>> If xtra disconnects me or I disconnect, what happens please?
    >>>> I don't want to be left with odd bits of download in the works.
    >>>>
    >>>> Geopelia
    >>>>
    >>> Geo, it should stop and resume whenever you are online. When you go
    >>> offline, it will stop, and when you connect up again, it will take up
    >>> where it left off,. The only annoying thing is your dial up will be
    >>> slower than normal while it is downloading. Probably Roger's suggestion
    >>> would be best. Perhaps its time to upgrade to a cheap DSL plan? You'll
    >>> never want to go back to dialup again!
    >>>

    >> Thank you. That is what I wanted to know, why don't they put these things
    >> in Help or FAQs?
    >>
    >> We can't afford broadband on the pension, unfortunately. Perhaps the cost
    >> will eventually come down (some hopes!).
    >> But it seems it's just as slow as dial up, from what some people are
    >> saying.
    >>
    >> Geopelia
    >>

    > Yeah, your right Geo, the cheapest broadband plan, I used to have and it
    > wouldn't even stream youtube video without stopping and buffering. The only
    > real advantage of it is you can use your phone while on the net. I upgraded
    > mine to 1500 down and 256 up, and it works reasonably well, but I wouldn't
    > want anything slower than that. I get 12 GB per month, anything over that is
    > throttled back, but I haven't used any more than 6 GB yet. Costs me 69 bucks
    > a month, but thats a bigpond one, in aussie.. cheers T.
    >
    >

    Wow! That pond is sure expensive
     
    Gordon, Feb 13, 2009
    #16
  17. Geopelia

    Gordon Guest

    On 2009-02-13, ~misfit~ <> wrote:
    > Somewhere on teh intarwebs Tony in Oz wrote:
    >> "Geopelia" <> wrote in message
    >> news:gn2nob$t7s$...
    >>>
    >>> "Tony in Oz" <> wrote in message
    >>> news:C91ll.20040$...
    >>>>
    >>>> "Geopelia" <> wrote in message
    >>>> news:gn2257$t3v$...
    >>>>> A Microsoft or Windows update is going to take about 18 hours. I
    >>>>> would have to use xtra for the download. I can't be connected all
    >>>>> that time. (dial up) I could do it over two or three nights.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I can't find anything in FAQ and Help about stopping and starting
    >>>>> the download.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Will it continue from where it left off if I restart it ? Or does
    >>>>> it start again from the beginning?
    >>>>> If xtra disconnects me or I disconnect, what happens please?
    >>>>> I don't want to be left with odd bits of download in the works.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Geopelia
    >>>>>
    >>>> Geo, it should stop and resume whenever you are online. When you
    >>>> go offline, it will stop, and when you connect up again, it will
    >>>> take up where it left off,. The only annoying thing is your dial up
    >>>> will be slower than normal while it is downloading. Probably
    >>>> Roger's suggestion would be best. Perhaps its time to upgrade to a
    >>>> cheap DSL plan? You'll never want to go back to dialup again!
    >>>>
    >>> Thank you. That is what I wanted to know, why don't they put these
    >>> things in Help or FAQs?
    >>>
    >>> We can't afford broadband on the pension, unfortunately. Perhaps the
    >>> cost will eventually come down (some hopes!).
    >>> But it seems it's just as slow as dial up, from what some people are
    >>> saying.
    >>>
    >>> Geopelia
    >>>

    >> Yeah, your right Geo, the cheapest broadband plan, I used to have
    >> and it wouldn't even stream youtube video without stopping and
    >> buffering. The only real advantage of it is you can use your phone
    >> while on the net. I upgraded mine to 1500 down and 256 up, and it
    >> works reasonably well, but I wouldn't want anything slower than that.
    >> I get 12 GB per month, anything over that is throttled back, but I
    >> haven't used any more than 6 GB yet. Costs me 69 bucks a month, but
    >> thats a bigpond one, in aussie.. cheers T.

    >
    > My neighbour has the first plan on this page:
    >
    > http://www.actrix.co.nz/page.php?id=144
    >
    > The tolls are way cheaper than Telecom and there's no obigation to make any
    > calls anyway. He's more than happy with it for light surfing (Trademe etc..)
    > and email. The beauty of it is it's 70MB at 256/128 and then throttled to
    > 64/64, faster than dial-up anyway. Also, the daily cap is re-set *twice* a
    > day, at 6pm and again at 2am. Not bad for $27.95/week I reckon.


    I reckon a typo. $27.95 per month. Yes?

    thing makes a goot point, blow the cap, and you still have better than dial
    up. Both in speed and the fact that it connected 24/7 (all the time) for no
    voice blowing (phone use).

    Come on Geo get over the interia you have, move, step out, change. Have not
    you often felt better for it at times in your life when you were younger?

    Ah there in lies the challange. I have thrown it down.

    > Until last week they were doing not only free connection but also free basic
    > modem on 12 month contract.
    >

    Bet my hat, that they would still accept this offer
     
    Gordon, Feb 13, 2009
    #17
  18. Geopelia

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Somewhere on teh intarwebs peterwn wrote:
    > On Feb 13, 1:12 pm, Roger_Nickel <>
    > wrote:
    >> On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:49:35 +1300, geoff wrote:
    >>
    >> Good point; download from MS website should be safe, but trying to
    >> find the files by searching on the website itself is difficult. MS
    >> maintain these files for their corporate customers but don't
    >> publicly advertise them.

    >
    > Micrsoft seems to have forgotten that there are many people reliant on
    > dial-up and that downloading updates for XP and Office is a pain to
    > say the least. Presumably it is nearly impossible for Vista, and yet
    > that is all people can buy unless they go to a 'small format' notebook
    > which cannot handle Vista.


    The last .NET update I downloaded was 238MB (or thereabouts). I'd hate to
    have to download that on dialup.
    --
    Shaun.

    "Build a man a fire, and he`ll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and
    he`ll be warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchett, Jingo.
     
    ~misfit~, Feb 13, 2009
    #18
  19. Geopelia

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Somewhere on teh intarwebs ~misfit~ wrote:
    > My neighbour has the first plan on this page:
    >
    > http://www.actrix.co.nz/page.php?id=144
    >
    > The tolls are way cheaper than Telecom and there's no obigation to
    > make any calls anyway. He's more than happy with it for light surfing
    > (Trademe etc..) and email. The beauty of it is it's 70MB at 256/128
    > and then throttled to 64/64, faster than dial-up anyway. Also, the
    > daily cap is re-set *twice* a day, at 6pm and again at 2am. Not bad
    > for $27.95/week I reckon. A decent step up from dial-up for not much
    > more money.


    Ehhh! That's $27.95 a MONTH. My bad.....
    --
    Shaun.

    "Build a man a fire, and he`ll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and
    he`ll be warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchett, Jingo.

    > Until last week they were doing not only free connection but also
    > free basic modem on 12 month contract.
    >
    > Cheers,
     
    ~misfit~, Feb 13, 2009
    #19
  20. Geopelia

    Enkidu Guest

    Geopelia wrote:
    >
    > A Microsoft or Windows update is going to take about 18 hours. I
    > would have to use xtra for the download. I can't be connected all
    > that time. (dial up) I could do it over two or three nights.
    >
    > I can't find anything in FAQ and Help about stopping and starting the
    > download.
    >
    > Will it continue from where it left off if I restart it ? Or does it
    > start again from the beginning? If xtra disconnects me or I
    > disconnect, what happens please? I don't want to be left with odd
    > bits of download in the works.
    >

    You should be able to select all the updates, *except* the big one. As I
    recall you can set the options to notify you rather than just install
    the updates.

    Cheers,

    Cliff

    --

    Go the girls! Bring back the Rose Bowl!
     
    Enkidu, Feb 13, 2009
    #20
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