Software "filter" to remove tungsten lighting effects?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Wendie Luter, Sep 8, 2007.

  1. Wendie Luter

    Wendie Luter Guest

    Hi!

    The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    lighting effect into a bareable level.

    I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?

    Thank you,
    Wendie
     
    Wendie Luter, Sep 8, 2007
    #1
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  2. Wendie Luter

    Scott W Guest

    Wendie Luter wrote:
    > Hi!
    >
    > The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    > wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    > red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    > lighting effect into a bareable level.
    >
    > I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    > acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    > lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    > for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?
    >
    > Thank you,
    > Wendie


    Rather then try to fix the problem after the fact why not just set the
    camera's white balance to tungsten. Better yet shoot raw and set the WB
    to whatever you want when converting the raw images.

    If you have photos that have already been taken then look at remove
    color cast, this does not work as well has shooting with the correct WB
    to begin with but it does work OK.

    Scott
     
    Scott W, Sep 8, 2007
    #2
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  3. Wendie Luter

    George Kerby Guest

    On 9/8/07 12:00 PM, in article ,
    "Wendie Luter" <> wrote:

    > Hi!
    >
    > The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    > wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    > red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    > lighting effect into a bareable level.
    >
    > I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    > acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    > lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    > for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?
    >
    > Thank you,
    > Wendie

    Lightroom comes to mind.
     
    George Kerby, Sep 8, 2007
    #3
  4. Wendie Luter

    Ray Fischer Guest

    Wendie Luter <> wrote:
    >The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    >wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    >red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    >lighting effect into a bareable level.


    It's an easy matter to fix.

    >I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    >acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    >lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    >for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?


    You don't need any other tools.

    First, most decent digitial cameras allow you to set the white balance.
    Second, if you're shooting RAW then the RAW converter allows you to set
    the white balance. You can just select tungsten from the pull-down menu.
    Third, you can use the Image>Adjustments>Curves tool. Click on one of
    the three eyedroppers and you can then click on a point in the picture
    that should be white (or gray) and Photoshop will make the needed
    adjustment.
    Fourth, you can use the Color Balance tool (which, IMO, is a pain).

    --
    Ray Fischer
     
    Ray Fischer, Sep 8, 2007
    #4
  5. Wendie Luter

    Mark Guest

    Mark, Sep 8, 2007
    #5
  6. Wendie Luter

    default Guest

    "Wendie Luter" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    > wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    > red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    > lighting effect into a bareable level.
    >
    > I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    > acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    > lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    > for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?


    The ideal solution would be to go back to the same location and situation
    and take a picture of an 18% grey card, or even a white piece of paper under
    the same light and use that to see the colour of the light landing in that
    area. You can then balance the colour cast back to neutral and apply the
    same correction to your photos. This is especially helpful if you have the
    raw images but can be used to correct the jpgs too.

    If you have the RAW files from the camera, then just change the colour
    temperature and tint back to where you like it or click the white balance
    dropper on something white or neutral grey and reconvert the image. This
    will give the best result because it is the same as if you had set the white
    balance correctly in your camera before you started taking pictures. There
    is no loss of image quality.

    If you are stuck with jpg pictures (why would you not have the RAWs?) then
    you can use the photoshop "levels" (image->adjustments->levels) command and
    click the grey point dropper on something white in the image that is not in
    a shadow such as the bride's dress, the groom's shirt, a tablecloth,
    whatever should be white and not the yellow that you see. This will correct
    that image. Just make sure that you don't click on something that is white
    and saturated (blown) or the correction will be wrong.

    If you don't have any white or neutral grey reference in the image, an
    automatic solution in photoshop is to use the "match color" command
    (image->adjustments->match color) and click the neutralize button. This
    will often do a good job of eliminating any colour casts quickly and
    painlessly.

    Finally you can use the colour balance control as a last resort to try to
    affect the colour balance. Adjust the red-blue balance to try to match the
    light, and the green-magenta balance to affect the tint and get the skin
    tones nice.

    If your photoshop is too old to have these commands (these are in CS2 for
    sure), then try the camera maker's software. The Canon zoombrowser software
    is able to set the colour balance and Canon Digital Photo Professional has a
    white balance dropper for jpgs.

    I hope that you have a colour calibrated computer monitor to edit these on.
    It would be a shame if you spent the time and effort to get the iamges
    looking good on your monitor only to find that your monitor has a colour
    cast and your new prints come out with the opposite cast as a result.
     
    default, Sep 8, 2007
    #6
  7. Wendie Luter

    Wendie Luter Guest

    On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 07:13:26 -1000, Scott W <>
    wrote:

    >Wendie Luter wrote:
    >> Hi!
    >>
    >> The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    >> wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    >> red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    >> lighting effect into a bareable level.
    >>
    >> I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    >> acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    >> lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    >> for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?
    >>
    >> Thank you,
    >> Wendie

    >
    >Rather then try to fix the problem after the fact why not just set the
    >camera's white balance to tungsten. Better yet shoot raw and set the WB
    >to whatever you want when converting the raw images.
    >
    >If you have photos that have already been taken then look at remove
    >color cast, this does not work as well has shooting with the correct WB
    >to begin with but it does work OK.
    >
    >Scott



    The photos have been taken, and can't be re-taken. How do I remove
    "color cast?" Is this a PhotoShop option?

    Thank you,
    Wendie
     
    Wendie Luter, Sep 8, 2007
    #7
  8. Wendie Luter

    Wendie Luter Guest

    On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 12:16:11 -0500, George Kerby
    <> wrote:

    >
    >
    >
    >On 9/8/07 12:00 PM, in article ,
    >"Wendie Luter" <> wrote:
    >
    >> Hi!
    >>
    >> The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    >> wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    >> red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    >> lighting effect into a bareable level.
    >>
    >> I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    >> acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    >> lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    >> for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?
    >>
    >> Thank you,
    >> Wendie

    >Lightroom comes to mind.


    At your suggestion, I checked Lightroom out. This looks to be the
    solution.

    Thank you,
    Wendie
     
    Wendie Luter, Sep 8, 2007
    #8
  9. Wendie Luter

    Micro2Macro Guest

    On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 13:00:23 -0400, Wendie Luter <> wrote:

    >Hi!
    >
    >The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    >wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    >red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    >lighting effect into a bareable level.
    >
    >I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    >acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    >lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    >for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?
    >
    >Thank you,
    >Wendie


    Try "ColorWasher v2.0x" plugin from http://thepluginsite.com/

    It's able to balance out some very difficult lighting situations that are
    outside of the control of the photographer or any camera's auto white-balance
    features. I've used it to effectively balance UV lamps + incandescent +
    fluorescent lamps on my subjects when all those light sources were being used
    equally in aggregate to attract and macro-photograph night-flying insects. A
    white-balance lighting nightmare situation that no other editor could even come
    close to resolving properly.

    p.s. Dump that archaic PhotoShop program and any new incarnations of it. Even
    CS3 is no better. It's 16-bit-only math along with its outdated bicubic
    interpolation for all its manipulation and cloning tools is last century's total
    nonsense. Try a better and more advanced editor like PhotoLine 32 from
    www.pl32.net It's been a 32-bit program for over a decade now (hence the name
    PL32) and even has Lanczos8 interpolation for all its tools, to retain any
    details that PhotoShop's bicubic would smear and blur. It also works just fine
    with the ColorWasher plugin.
     
    Micro2Macro, Sep 8, 2007
    #9
  10. Wendie Luter

    Scott W Guest

    Wendie Luter wrote:
    > On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 07:13:26 -1000, Scott W <>
    > wrote:
    >
    >> Wendie Luter wrote:
    >>> Hi!
    >>>
    >>> The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    >>> wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    >>> red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    >>> lighting effect into a bareable level.
    >>>
    >>> I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    >>> acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    >>> lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    >>> for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?
    >>>
    >>> Thank you,
    >>> Wendie

    >> Rather then try to fix the problem after the fact why not just set the
    >> camera's white balance to tungsten. Better yet shoot raw and set the WB
    >> to whatever you want when converting the raw images.
    >>
    >> If you have photos that have already been taken then look at remove
    >> color cast, this does not work as well has shooting with the correct WB
    >> to begin with but it does work OK.
    >>
    >> Scott

    >
    >
    > The photos have been taken, and can't be re-taken. How do I remove
    > "color cast?" Is this a PhotoShop option?


    It should be, I use Photoshop elements, small brother to Photoshop, and
    there it is under the enhance menu, adjust color. You get an eye
    dropper that you then click on something that you know should be white
    in the photo.

    Scott
     
    Scott W, Sep 9, 2007
    #10
  11. "Scott W" <> wrote:
    >
    > It should be, I use Photoshop elements, small brother to Photoshop, and
    > there it is under the enhance menu, adjust color. You get an eye dropper
    > that you then click on something that you know should be white in the
    > photo.


    Have you ever gotten a decent result doing that? I certainly haven't. In
    real life, nothing's actually white* and any daylight scene has both shadow
    and directly lit areas with different color temperatures.

    In raw conversion, checking the overall impression by eye and looking at the
    readouts for areas that should be gray or white to make sure that things are
    reasonable is a pain, but it seems to be required.

    *: I just did a test shot with three reference cards: a resolution test
    image printed on enhanced matte (very blue from the whiteners), a Kodak 18%
    gray card (roughly neutral), and a Kodak gray scale (patches of different
    gray levels in 1/3 stop increments) that is strongly warm toned. Not only
    did all three have different color temperatures, but the differences were
    large.

    David J. Littleboy
    Tokyo, Japan
     
    David J. Littleboy, Sep 9, 2007
    #11
  12. Wendie Luter

    dj_nme Guest

    Wendie Luter wrote:
    > Hi!
    >
    > The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    > wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    > red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    > lighting effect into a bareable level.
    >
    > I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    > acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    > lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    > for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?
    >
    > Thank you,
    > Wendie


    Strangely, it sounds like all your images are in jpeg format.
    Otherwise you would be asking how to set the WB in your raw converter.
    Your raw processing software could have been set to use use a different
    white-balance to result in a neutral image, despite the WB on your camera.

    If you shot in jpeg and were using Corel Photoshop, it would be a five
    second fix.
    "image"->"adjust"->"color balance" move the cyan/red slider to -10% and
    the yellow/blue slider to +10% while leaving the magenta/green slider alone.
    A slight tweeking of the slider settings would fix up the WB completely,
    if that starting poiont WB adjustment wasn't quite correct in first go.
    If the same lighting was used throughout the event, then the same
    settings will fix the lot.

    Adobe Photoshop must have sometehing similar (I don't use it).
    Otherwise you just may have been ripped off, if such a basic editing
    feature has been left out of such a pricey piece of software.
     
    dj_nme, Sep 9, 2007
    #12
  13. Wendie Luter

    JD Guest

    David J. Littleboy wrote:
    > "Scott W" <> wrote:
    >
    >>It should be, I use Photoshop elements, small brother to Photoshop, and
    >>there it is under the enhance menu, adjust color. You get an eye dropper
    >>that you then click on something that you know should be white in the
    >>photo.

    >
    >
    > Have you ever gotten a decent result doing that? I certainly haven't. In
    > real life, nothing's actually white* and any daylight scene has both shadow
    > and directly lit areas with different color temperatures.
    >
    > In raw conversion, checking the overall impression by eye and looking at the
    > readouts for areas that should be gray or white to make sure that things are
    > reasonable is a pain, but it seems to be required.
    >
    > *: I just did a test shot with three reference cards: a resolution test
    > image printed on enhanced matte (very blue from the whiteners), a Kodak 18%
    > gray card (roughly neutral), and a Kodak gray scale (patches of different
    > gray levels in 1/3 stop increments) that is strongly warm toned. Not only
    > did all three have different color temperatures, but the differences were
    > large.
    >
    > David J. Littleboy
    > Tokyo, Japan
    >
    >

    In Elements 3 there is Filters/adjustment/photo filter/
    you can select 80 and 82 cooling filters and play around with them.
    They do have a density setting and if you get one picture to look right
    then applying that setting to sebsequent shots (under that same
    lighting) should - in theory - work as well for them.
    This assumes your memory of what colors looked like is correct and that
    your monitor is calibrated.

    As David points out, nothing is white, this tool allows you to make
    adjustments with your eyes rather than Photoshop's single fix it button.

    JD
     
    JD, Sep 9, 2007
    #13
  14. Wendie Luter

    Wendie Luter Guest

    On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 13:00:23 -0400, Wendie Luter
    <> wrote:

    >Hi!
    >
    >The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    >wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    >red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    >lighting effect into a bareable level.
    >
    >I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    >acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    >lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    >for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?
    >
    >Thank you,
    >Wendie



    I used ColorWasher 2.02b and it did a very good job!

    Thank you to all who responded.

    Wendie
     
    Wendie Luter, Sep 9, 2007
    #14
  15. Wendie Luter

    Scott W Guest

    David J. Littleboy wrote:
    > "Scott W" <> wrote:
    >> It should be, I use Photoshop elements, small brother to Photoshop, and
    >> there it is under the enhance menu, adjust color. You get an eye dropper
    >> that you then click on something that you know should be white in the
    >> photo.

    >
    > Have you ever gotten a decent result doing that? I certainly haven't. In
    > real life, nothing's actually white* and any daylight scene has both shadow
    > and directly lit areas with different color temperatures.
    >
    > In raw conversion, checking the overall impression by eye and looking at the
    > readouts for areas that should be gray or white to make sure that things are
    > reasonable is a pain, but it seems to be required.
    >
    > *: I just did a test shot with three reference cards: a resolution test
    > image printed on enhanced matte (very blue from the whiteners), a Kodak 18%
    > gray card (roughly neutral), and a Kodak gray scale (patches of different
    > gray levels in 1/3 stop increments) that is strongly warm toned. Not only
    > did all three have different color temperatures, but the differences were
    > large.



    I don't have much luck with the remove color cast if the WB is off by
    very much and all I have to work with is a jpeg. If the color is close
    then the remove color cast can work ok. But I far prefer to work with
    the raw image, in which case the eye dropper often gets me close enough
    that I don't feel the need for further adjustments.

    In this version of a photo I used the table cloth as my white reference,
    the resulting color temp comes out at 2050 and looks pretty good to my
    eye.
    http://www.pbase.com/konascott/image/85274129

    If I try to use the tea cup as a white reference I get a color temp of
    1950, and the image look far to blue.
    http://www.pbase.com/konascott/image/85274439
    So you need a good white reference, or you need to adjust by hand.

    If I try to work with a jpeg things are not as good, in this case I see
    the color temp at 2500, which give an image that if far too warm for my
    taste.
    http://www.pbase.com/konascott/image/85274343

    If I then use the remove color cast function, again using the tablecloth
    I get something that is not bad, but not as good as using the raw file.
    http://www.pbase.com/konascott/image/85274345

    I find the remove color cast function is only of real value if it is not
    making large changes in the color.

    I have had pretty good using remove color cast to correct photos taken
    through a windshield, which have a lot of green to them.

    Scott
     
    Scott W, Sep 9, 2007
    #15
  16. Wendie Luter

    George Kerby Guest

    On 9/8/07 3:19 PM, in article ,
    "Wendie Luter" <> wrote:

    > On Sat, 08 Sep 2007 12:16:11 -0500, George Kerby
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> On 9/8/07 12:00 PM, in article ,
    >> "Wendie Luter" <> wrote:
    >>
    >>> Hi!
    >>>
    >>> The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    >>> wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    >>> red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    >>> lighting effect into a bareable level.
    >>>
    >>> I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    >>> acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    >>> lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    >>> for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?
    >>>
    >>> Thank you,
    >>> Wendie

    >> Lightroom comes to mind.

    >
    > At your suggestion, I checked Lightroom out. This looks to be the
    > solution.
    >
    > Thank you,
    > Wendie

    You are welcome.
     
    George Kerby, Sep 9, 2007
    #16
  17. Wendie Luter

    Allen Guest

    David J. Littleboy wrote:
    <snip>
    > Have you ever gotten a decent result doing that? I certainly haven't. In
    > real life, nothing's actually white* and any daylight scene has both shadow
    > and directly lit areas with different color temperatures.
    >

    <snip>
    That is generally true, but I have never been a guest at a wedding in
    the US that didn't have _some_ white. I will say that I have encountered
    some Chinese weddings (quite often held in large restaurants in Austin;
    the restaurants usually continue to serve customers in a small
    segregated area)) where red is the predominant color.
    Allen
     
    Allen, Sep 9, 2007
    #17
  18. Wendie Luter

    Allen Guest

    dj_nme wrote:
    > Wendie Luter wrote:
    >> Hi!
    >>
    >> The photographer was not allowed to use flash during the vows of a
    >> wedding in a chapel with tungsten lighting, so the photos have a
    >> red-orange overcast. I was able to use PS 6.0 to "hack" the tungsten
    >> lighting effect into a bareable level.
    >> I'm only an occasional PS user, and used hit-or-miss to achieve barely
    >> acceptable results. Are there better programs to remove the tungsten
    >> lighting overcast? Are there digital filters or settings or plug-ins
    >> for PS to do this with professional and accurate results?
    >>
    >> Thank you,
    >> Wendie

    >
    > Strangely, it sounds like all your images are in jpeg format.
    > Otherwise you would be asking how to set the WB in your raw converter.
    > Your raw processing software could have been set to use use a different
    > white-balance to result in a neutral image, despite the WB on your camera.
    >
    > If you shot in jpeg and were using Corel Photoshop, it would be a five
    > second fix.


    <I assume you mean Corel Paint Shop Pro.
    Allen
    <snip>
     
    Allen, Sep 9, 2007
    #18
  19. Wendie Luter

    JL Guest

    The Kodak 18% is to dark for white balancing in digital photos when shooting
    under poor lighting conditions: it generates noise on the gray patch.

    I suggest a real neutral digital grey card suited for this usage.
    See here :
    www.digigrey.com

    Jean-Luc Ernst


    "David J. Littleboy" <> a écrit dans le message de news:
    ...
    >

    ..../...

    > *: I just did a test shot with three reference cards: a resolution test
    > image printed on enhanced matte (very blue from the whiteners), a Kodak
    > 18% gray card (roughly neutral), and a Kodak gray scale (patches of
    > different gray levels in 1/3 stop increments) that is strongly warm toned.
    > Not only did all three have different color temperatures, but the
    > differences were large.
    >
    > David J. Littleboy
    > Tokyo, Japan
    >
    >
     
    JL, Sep 9, 2007
    #19
  20. Wendie Luter

    JL Guest

    I suppose you would say "Corel Paint Shop Pro"...
    %:>)

    PS :
    The new Paint Shop Pro Photo X2 (12) is out since a few days:
    www.corel.com

    Jean-Luc Ernst


    "dj_nme" <> a écrit dans le message de news:
    46e3553c$0$14124$...
    ..../...
    > If you shot in jpeg and were using Corel Photoshop,

    ..../...
     
    JL, Sep 9, 2007
    #20
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