Sigma SD 14

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by S, Jan 5, 2008.

  1. S

    S Guest

    I have the chance of this package below and quite interested, this will be
    my first SLR. It seems a good deal at £499.
    Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.

    thanks

    5114578
    Sigma SD-14 Digital SLR body
    In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £499.99 £499.99

    5000106
    Sigma 18-50mm f/3.5-5.6 DC (Sigma AF)
    In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £79.99 FREE

    1040183
    Sigma UV 58mm EX Filter
    Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £19.99 FREE

    5120472
    Sigma Lens Cleaning Cloth
    Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £5.99 FREE
     
    S, Jan 5, 2008
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. On Jan 5, 7:23 pm, "S" <> wrote:
    > I have the chance of this package below and quite interested, this will be
    > my first SLR. It seems a good deal at £499.
    > Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.
    >
    > thanks
    >
    >      5114578
    >       Sigma SD-14 Digital SLR body
    >       In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £499.99  £499.99
    >
    >      5000106
    >       Sigma 18-50mm f/3.5-5.6 DC (Sigma AF)
    >       In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £79.99  FREE
    >
    >      1040183
    >       Sigma UV 58mm EX Filter
    >       Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £19.99  FREE
    >
    >      5120472
    >       Sigma Lens Cleaning Cloth
    >       Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £5.99  FREE


    Sigma SD14 was my first digital SLR, and I was unimpressed with it. I
    was much more impressed with the cheaper Canon "Digital Rebel". Canon
    was much more user-friendly... which effected my desire to snap more
    and more pictures with it. Though, it (Canon) was not my camera, I
    just borrowed it.

    Buyer beware !
     
    Beladi Nasrallah, Jan 5, 2008
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. S

    Pete D Guest

    "S" <> wrote in message
    news:H0Ifj.79320$...
    >I have the chance of this package below and quite interested, this will be
    >my first SLR. It seems a good deal at £499.
    > Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.
    >
    > thanks
    >
    > 5114578
    > Sigma SD-14 Digital SLR body
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £499.99 £499.99
    >
    > 5000106
    > Sigma 18-50mm f/3.5-5.6 DC (Sigma AF)
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £79.99 FREE
    >
    > 1040183
    > Sigma UV 58mm EX Filter
    > Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £19.99 FREE
    >
    > 5120472
    > Sigma Lens Cleaning Cloth
    > Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £5.99 FREE
    >
    >
    >


    Even free this is not a camera I would foist on a beginner or anyone for
    that matter. Just don't do it, buy any other D-SLR at any price and you will
    be better off.


    Oh and that lens is maybe worth $20 max, they are total dogs.

    Cheers.

    Pete
     
    Pete D, Jan 5, 2008
    #3
  4. S wrote:
    > I have the chance of this package below and quite interested, this
    > will be my first SLR. It seems a good deal at £499.
    > Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.
    >
    > thanks
    >
    > 5114578
    > Sigma SD-14 Digital SLR body
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £499.99 £499.99
    >
    > 5000106
    > Sigma 18-50mm f/3.5-5.6 DC (Sigma AF)
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £79.99 FREE


    A much better deal to me would be a Nikon (or perhaps Canon) equivalent:

    Nikon D40 (6MP) with 18 - 55mm lens - £269
    http://www.warehouseexpress.com/?/photo/digicameras/Nikon.html

    Nikon D40X (10MP) with 18 - 55mm lens - £370
    http://www.warehouseexpress.com/?/photo/digicameras/Nikon.html#d40x

    The Sigma has the reputation of producing poor images (poor colours and
    excessive "jaggies"). Personally, I would not even consider one of their
    DSLRs.

    Be sure to visit a shop and compare the handling of the entry-level
    DSLRs - compare Nikon, Canon and if you have time, the Pentax and Olympus
    offerings as well. See which fits well in your hands, where the controls
    are easy to operate, and which viewfinder suits your eyesight the best.

    Cheers,
    David
     
    David J Taylor, Jan 5, 2008
    #4
  5. S

    Art in MT Guest

    You may wish to read the Amazon reviews of this camera. its appears it
    is not a good all-round camera. I considered its older brother before
    buying a canon 20D - because I wanted the ability to point and shoot
    rapidly.

    On Sat, 05 Jan 2008 09:23:51 GMT, "S" <>
    wrote:

    >I have the chance of this package below and quite interested, this will be
    >my first SLR. It seems a good deal at £499.
    >Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.
    >
    >thanks
    >
    > 5114578
    > Sigma SD-14 Digital SLR body
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £499.99 £499.99
    >
    > 5000106
    > Sigma 18-50mm f/3.5-5.6 DC (Sigma AF)
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £79.99 FREE
    >
    > 1040183
    > Sigma UV 58mm EX Filter
    > Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £19.99 FREE
    >
    > 5120472
    > Sigma Lens Cleaning Cloth
    > Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £5.99 FREE
    >
    >
    >
     
    Art in MT, Jan 5, 2008
    #5
  6. S

    S Guest

    Thanks for the comments guys plenty to think about now.


    <Art in MT> wrote in message
    news:...
    > You may wish to read the Amazon reviews of this camera. its appears it
    > is not a good all-round camera. I considered its older brother before
    > buying a canon 20D - because I wanted the ability to point and shoot
    > rapidly.
    >
    > On Sat, 05 Jan 2008 09:23:51 GMT, "S" <>
    > wrote:
    >
    >>I have the chance of this package below and quite interested, this will be
    >>my first SLR. It seems a good deal at £499.
    >>Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.
    >>
    >>thanks
    >>
    >> 5114578
    >> Sigma SD-14 Digital SLR body
    >> In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £499.99 £499.99
    >>
    >> 5000106
    >> Sigma 18-50mm f/3.5-5.6 DC (Sigma AF)
    >> In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £79.99 FREE
    >>
    >> 1040183
    >> Sigma UV 58mm EX Filter
    >> Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £19.99 FREE
    >>
    >> 5120472
    >> Sigma Lens Cleaning Cloth
    >> Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £5.99 FREE
    >>
    >>
    >>
     
    S, Jan 5, 2008
    #6
  7. S

    flambe Guest

    Forget the anti-Sigma bias.
    As a life long Nikon user I fail to see where Nikon's products are
    universally good or anything near worth what they cost, particuarly the
    lenses. Clearly Nikon low balls many of its camera prices the way printer
    manufacturers low ball printer prices.
    If you know what you are getting and what you will use it for the foveon
    sensor has some specific attributes that may make it desirable.The Sigma
    18-50 is not much worse than the Nikon or Canon kit lens of that ilk, the
    latter being particularly awful.
    However for general use at the usual price this camera sells for there are
    better all round options.
    Ultimately the price you quote is too good to be true, so it probably isn't.
     
    flambe, Jan 5, 2008
    #7
  8. All the anti-Sigma bias can make you think twice, can't it? Try some of the
    people who use one and ask their opinion. I just bought one a few weeks
    ago. I've owned an SD9 for years. Is the SD14 the best camera? Depends on
    what you want to do with it. I have two other DSLRs, a Nikon and an Olympus
    and they are nice cameras but cannot equal the sharpness of the Sigma. The
    SD14 is not the best low-light camera but it is a far cry better than its
    predecessors.

    The lens you indicated will not do justice to the camera. Try the 18-50mm
    EX macro or the 50mm EX and you'll be quite pleased with the results. Stick
    with the EX lenses.

    Visit the Sigma forum on dpreview.com for some opinions or actual users
    rather than opinions of those who've never held the camera, let alone used
    it.

    "S" <> wrote in message
    news:H0Ifj.79320$...
    >I have the chance of this package below and quite interested, this will be
    >my first SLR. It seems a good deal at £499.
    > Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.
    >
    > thanks
    >
    > 5114578
    > Sigma SD-14 Digital SLR body
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £499.99 £499.99
    >
    > 5000106
    > Sigma 18-50mm f/3.5-5.6 DC (Sigma AF)
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £79.99 FREE
    >
    > 1040183
    > Sigma UV 58mm EX Filter
    > Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £19.99 FREE
    >
    > 5120472
    > Sigma Lens Cleaning Cloth
    > Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £5.99 FREE
    >
    >
    >
    >
     
    Peter Stavrakoglou, Jan 5, 2008
    #8
  9. S

    Mr. Strat Guest

    In article <H0Ifj.79320$>,
    <> wrote:

    > I have the chance of this package below and quite interested, this will be
    > my first SLR. It seems a good deal at £499.
    > Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.
    >
    > 5114578
    > Sigma SD-14 Digital SLR body
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £499.99 £499.99
    >
    > 5000106
    > Sigma 18-50mm f/3.5-5.6 DC (Sigma AF)
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £79.99 FREE
    >
    > 1040183
    > Sigma UV 58mm EX Filter
    > Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £19.99 FREE
    >
    > 5120472
    > Sigma Lens Cleaning Cloth
    > Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £5.99 FREE


    Don't waste your money on this crap.
     
    Mr. Strat, Jan 5, 2008
    #9
  10. S

    Mr. Strat Guest

    In article <SzOfj.2998$>, flambe
    <> wrote:

    > Forget the anti-Sigma bias.


    It's justified. Their products are crap, in particular, their digital
    cameras.
     
    Mr. Strat, Jan 5, 2008
    #10
  11. Peter Stavrakoglou wrote:
    > All the anti-Sigma bias can make you think twice, can't it?


    Bias? The camera doesn't even have anti-alias filtering. Avoid.

    David
     
    David J Taylor, Jan 5, 2008
    #11
  12. S

    Mr. Strat Guest

    In article <HqQfj.73044$>, David J
    Taylor <-this-bit.nor-this-bit.co.uk> wrote:

    > Bias? The camera doesn't even have anti-alias filtering. Avoid.


    I guess some people like Homer Simpson skin tones.
     
    Mr. Strat, Jan 5, 2008
    #12
  13. S

    nospam Guest

    In article <477fc460$0$13901$>, Peter Stavrakoglou
    <> wrote:

    > All the anti-Sigma bias can make you think twice, can't it? Try some of the
    > people who use one and ask their opinion. I just bought one a few weeks
    > ago. I've owned an SD9 for years. Is the SD14 the best camera? Depends on
    > what you want to do with it. I have two other DSLRs, a Nikon and an Olympus
    > and they are nice cameras but cannot equal the sharpness of the Sigma. The
    > SD14 is not the best low-light camera but it is a far cry better than its
    > predecessors.


    that's like saying iso 64 film is better than iso 25 film. both would
    be considered very slow these days. also keep in mind that the sigma
    camera lacks an anti-alias filter giving the illusion of additional
    detail and the sigma software adds a hefty dose of sharpening even when
    set to 0, whereas nikon/canon generally leave it for the user to decide
    (and unlike with sigma, 0 sharpening really means 0 sharpening). it
    should be no surprise that if the sigma image has the sharpening
    cranked, it will appear to be sharper than other images, and that's
    certainly not due to the sensor. when comparing objective resolution
    measurements, such as lph, mtf, delta-e, etc., the sigma always comes
    up short.

    the sd14 also has a huge noise handicap, about 2-3 stops compared with
    other cameras, based on estimated well capacities of the sensor itself
    (the top layer is ~8-10k photons, versus 80k per pixel on the canon 5d)
    and corroborated by several reviews that found it noisy past iso 400
    and even noticable at iso 200, along with numerous sample images on
    pbase and elsewhere. although it may be better than the sd9/10, it's
    still very poor.

    other problems include the camera locking up, corrupted images (which
    is unacceptable on any camera), slow write times (~6-7 seconds per
    image!), small image buffer (6 shots, raw or jpg), low frame rate
    (about 2.3 fps at full resolution), clumsy user interface (namely, the
    multiple presses of the func button for commonly used settings), slow
    and unpredictable autofocus, poor battery life (about 200-250 images
    per charge, which is a huge drawback with the new airline restrictions
    on extra batteries) and a limited selection of lenses and accessories.
    although lens adapters can be used (as they can with other cameras),
    autofocus, automatic diaphragm and full aperture metering do not work.


    at photo plus expo in new york last october, sigma had several images
    on display from the sd14 alongside images from 'other cameras.' the
    sigma images were not particularly good, riddled with noise, blotches,
    aliasing and other anomalies. sigma is going to do that comparison
    again at pma later this month.

    and then there's the dp-1, announced september, 2006 for release in
    january/february, 2007. it was delayed and delayed, and ultimately
    never appeared. about a month ago, sigma announced that they are
    redesigning the entire image pipeline due to poor quality images and
    changing the camera's feature set "to return to the simple and original
    product concept." in other words, they completely scrapped the
    original version, presumably due to the pitiful sales of the sd14.

    > Visit the Sigma forum on dpreview.com for some opinions or actual users
    > rather than opinions of those who've never held the camera, let alone used
    > it.


    yet the numerous reviewers who held and used the camera found that it
    wasn't all that great and it could not compete with the offerings from
    nikon/canon/sony/pentax, especially with the latter cameras being half
    the price of the sigma. in fact, there were even quite a few posters
    in the sigma forum who bought the sd14 and promptly returned it. one
    would assume they also held and used the camera before deciding it was
    not all that good.

    if the camera really was so fantastic, why isn't it selling and why are
    stores dumping inventory at a huge loss?
     
    nospam, Jan 5, 2008
    #13
  14. S

    SMS Guest

    S wrote:
    > I have the chance of this package below and quite interested, this will be
    > my first SLR. It seems a good deal at £499.
    > Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.


    Avoid it at _all_ costs.

    Very poor camera. They again forgot to put in anti-alias filtering, in
    order to trick naive buyers into thinking that it produces
    extraordinarily sharp images. It doesn't.

    While you shouldn't get too carried away with megapixels, the SD14, at
    4.7 megapixels, is just not high enough resolution. You want at least 8
    megapixels resolution if you ever want to make even 8x10 prints, let
    alone larger.

    Whatever extra a Nikon D40x or Canon 400D costs it's worth it. You'd
    even be better off with a Pentax or Sony (Konica-Minolta).
     
    SMS, Jan 5, 2008
    #14
  15. S

    Mr. Strat Guest

    In article <477ff37a$0$84192$>, SMS
    <> wrote:

    > Avoid it at _all_ costs.


    Agreed.

    > Very poor camera. They again forgot to put in anti-alias filtering, in
    > order to trick naive buyers into thinking that it produces
    > extraordinarily sharp images. It doesn't.


    "Very poor" is being polite when describing Sigma products.

    > While you shouldn't get too carried away with megapixels, the SD14, at
    > 4.7 megapixels, is just not high enough resolution. You want at least 8
    > megapixels resolution if you ever want to make even 8x10 prints, let
    > alone larger.


    Hmmm...I have 16x20s on my wall made from a 6.3mp camera, and you'd be
    hard pressed to tell they're not from film.

    > Whatever extra a Nikon D40x or Canon 400D costs it's worth it. You'd
    > even be better off with a Pentax or Sony (Konica-Minolta).


    I'd avoid all Sony products, but as bad as they are, they're still
    better than any Sigma camera.
     
    Mr. Strat, Jan 5, 2008
    #15
  16. "SMS" <> wrote in message
    news:477ff37a$0$84192$...
    >S wrote:
    >> I have the chance of this package below and quite interested, this will
    >> be my first SLR. It seems a good deal at £499.
    >> Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.

    >
    > Avoid it at _all_ costs.
    >
    > Very poor camera. They again forgot to put in anti-alias filtering, in
    > order to trick naive buyers into thinking that it produces extraordinarily
    > sharp images. It doesn't.
    >
    > While you shouldn't get too carried away with megapixels, the SD14, at 4.7
    > megapixels, is just not high enough resolution. You want at least 8
    > megapixels resolution if you ever want to make even 8x10 prints, let alone
    > larger.
    >
    > Whatever extra a Nikon D40x or Canon 400D costs it's worth it. You'd even
    > be better off with a Pentax or Sony (Konica-Minolta).


    The opinions I've seen in various magazines here in the UK are that 3MP -
    4MP are fine for A4 size prints.
    Anyone have opinions?

    As far as the Sigma body is concerned, I've personally found the lenses to
    vary in quality and I've had two faulty ones.
    I think that the magazine reviews of the body were of the "some good points
    and some bad points" type. The body did some things very well and other
    things badly. Is the outfit that good a price compared to Nikon and Canon?

    Regards, Ian.
     
    Fred Anonymous, Jan 5, 2008
    #16
  17. S

    acl Guest

    On Jan 5, 9:57 pm, "David J Taylor" <-this-
    bit.nor-this-bit.co.uk> wrote:
    > Peter Stavrakoglou wrote:
    > > All the anti-Sigma bias can make you think twice, can't it?

    >
    > Bias? The camera doesn't even have anti-alias filtering. Avoid.
    >
    > David


    I don't think that this is the major drawback of the sigmas; aliasing
    is a lot less ugly than on a bayer camera (although I still hate it).
    But look at this, for example:
    http://www.pbase.com/rfl/image/76937712
    (look at the full size, in the shadows). I imagine it was lightened,
    but this is too much (and that pbase gallery is by dick lyon).

    And I've very briefly used an sd9. Now I am used to a d200 which
    reacts instantaneously to everything, but even so, the difference was
    extremely noticeable.

    And "sharpness" comparisons done with downsized 10mp bayer camera
    images (for example) tell a very different story than comparing 100%
    crops of the images at their native size... It's not that hard to
    download a few images from sigma cameras and try this.
     
    acl, Jan 5, 2008
    #17
  18. S

    nospam Guest

    In article <flp34u$2qj$1$>, Fred Anonymous
    <> wrote:

    > The opinions I've seen in various magazines here in the UK are that 3MP -
    > 4MP are fine for A4 size prints.
    > Anyone have opinions?


    just about any camera can produce decent a4 prints these days, even
    compact p&s digicams.

    the general rule is 300 pixels per inch is needed for the best quality
    (and some claim even higher but the difference is very small) and 200
    pixels per inch for acceptible quality. thus for an 8x10" image, one
    would need between 3 and 7 megapixels, depending on what level of
    quality is desired (and that assumes no cropping).

    > As far as the Sigma body is concerned, I've personally found the lenses to
    > vary in quality and I've had two faulty ones.
    > I think that the magazine reviews of the body were of the "some good points
    > and some bad points" type. The body did some things very well and other
    > things badly. Is the outfit that good a price compared to Nikon and Canon?


    nikon and canon offer many more cameras that are faster and more
    capable and at multiple price points along with a substantially more
    complete lens lineup (not to mention lenses from tokina, tamron and
    sigma) than sigma does with its lone slr and single source of lenses.
    furthermore, given the very low sales of the sd14 and the vaporware
    dp1, it is very unlikely sigma will be in the camera business for much
    longer. there's just no way they're making a profit with it, and they
    can't pour money into a sinking ship forever...
     
    nospam, Jan 6, 2008
    #18
  19. S

    nospam Guest

    In article
    <>, acl
    <> wrote:

    > I don't think that this is the major drawback of the sigmas; aliasing
    > is a lot less ugly than on a bayer camera (although I still hate it).
    > But look at this, for example:
    > http://www.pbase.com/rfl/image/76937712
    > (look at the full size, in the shadows). I imagine it was lightened,
    > but this is too much (and that pbase gallery is by dick lyon).


    love that purple/green blotching!

    > And I've very briefly used an sd9. Now I am used to a d200 which
    > reacts instantaneously to everything, but even so, the difference was
    > extremely noticeable.


    no doubt. a nikon d50 is even a step up in responsiveness.
     
    nospam, Jan 6, 2008
    #19
  20. I have a Nikon D200 and a Sigma SD14. Both have their strengths and
    weaknesses. You can see shots I've taken with both at:

    http://www.pbase.com/miketuthill

    I'm not a particularly good photographer so you may also want to browse
    the camera database at pbase to see samples of any camera/lens you're
    interested in.

    On 2008-01-05 02:23:51 -0700, "S" <> said:

    > I have the chance of this package below and quite interested, this will be
    > my first SLR. It seems a good deal at £499.
    > Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.
    >
    > thanks
    >
    > 5114578
    > Sigma SD-14 Digital SLR body
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £499.99 £499.99
    >
    > 5000106
    > Sigma 18-50mm f/3.5-5.6 DC (Sigma AF)
    > In Stock for Home Delivery 1 £79.99 FREE
    >
    > 1040183
    > Sigma UV 58mm EX Filter
    > Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £19.99 FREE
    >
    > 5120472
    > Sigma Lens Cleaning Cloth
    > Home Delivery Usually within 10 Days 1 £5.99 FREE
     
    Michael Tuthill, Jan 6, 2008
    #20
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