Setting Up An ISP

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Steve, Dec 18, 2003.

  1. Steve

    Steve Guest

    What is involved in setting up an ISP.

    Steve.
    Steve, Dec 18, 2003
    #1
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  2. Steve

    Enkidu Guest

    On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 17:31:08 +1300, "Steve" <> wrote:
    >
    >What is involved in setting up an ISP.
    >

    Buckets of money.

    Cheers,

    Cliff
    --

    The complete lack of evidence is the surest sign
    that the conspiracy is working.
    Enkidu, Dec 18, 2003
    #2
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  3. Steve

    Steve Guest

    Enkidu wrote
    > Steve wrote:
    > >
    > >What is involved in setting up an ISP.
    > >

    > Buckets of money.


    Why? I just want to have it - not actually use it for much and it
    only needs the minimum of services but it needs to be an ISP in
    its own right.

    Steve.
    Steve, Dec 18, 2003
    #3
  4. Steve

    AD. Guest

    On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 20:35:19 +1300, Steve wrote:

    > Enkidu wrote
    >> Steve wrote:
    >> >
    >> >What is involved in setting up an ISP.
    >> >

    >> Buckets of money.

    >
    > Why? I just want to have it - not actually use it for much and it only
    > needs the minimum of services but it needs to be an ISP in its own right.


    You might have to explain what you need/want in more detail.

    Cheers
    Anton
    AD., Dec 18, 2003
    #4
  5. Steve

    Steve Guest

    AD. wrote
    > Steve wrote:
    >
    > > Enkidu wrote
    > >> Steve wrote:
    > >> >
    > >> >What is involved in setting up an ISP.
    > >> >
    > >> Buckets of money.

    > >
    > > Why? I just want to have it - not actually use it for much and it only
    > > needs the minimum of services but it needs to be an ISP in its own right.

    >
    > You might have to explain what you need/want in more detail.


    I want to not have to use an ISP for an Internet connection and I want
    the ability to allow others to connect to the internet without having
    to pay an ISP. I will have a few users and all will be no commercial (free
    for them). I want mail hosting and connections to the internet. I do not
    want to just have a domain which is hosted somewhere for mail connection.

    Steve.
    Steve, Dec 18, 2003
    #5
  6. Steve

    ChrisOD Guest

    In article <3fe12f53$>, says...
    > What is involved in setting up an ISP.
    >
    > Steve.
    >
    >
    >

    money,....

    Clue....

    Well actually there is really two ways to go
    Roll your own or tailermade
    For the tailermade options people like orcon offer Virtual ISP services,
    so your brand marketing, plans etc but no hardware billing or customer
    software, no dealing with tons of different suppliers. I'm sure if you
    look around there are a few VISP providers.

    The roll your own:
    Router (to connect to Net, peering points DMZs...)
    Servers (DNS, Web, Radius, Mail, News, ...)
    Relationships with:
    Telecom, TelstraClear other ISPs, hardware vendors....
    Clue:
    Lots of Unix knowledge and routing/IP knowledge

    Hybrid:
    There are a few people selling ISP in a box, All above software in a
    boxed set. Dunno how good it is but I recommend clue.

    --

    Chris
    ChrisOD, Dec 18, 2003
    #6
  7. Steve

    Enkidu Guest

    On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 21:14:07 +1300, "Steve" <> wrote:
    >
    >I want to not have to use an ISP for an Internet connection and I want
    >the ability to allow others to connect to the internet without having
    >to pay an ISP. I will have a few users and all will be no commercial (free
    >for them). I want mail hosting and connections to the internet. I do not
    >want to just have a domain which is hosted somewhere for mail connection.
    >

    Almost all organisations get their feed from an ISP. An ISP get *it's*
    feed from a telco or bandwidth provider. The biggest bandwidth
    providers provide the backbone. It's hierarchical.

    If you want to bypass the ISP you will have to buy bulk bandwidth from
    a telco. You will need pretty heavy gear to connect, plus the
    bandwidth will cost you. You will have to acquire a bunch of IPs from
    somewhere. Generally these days you have to do it through an ISP and
    the entry barrier for a new ISP is high. It's not free like it used to
    be.

    You will also have to provide a way for your users to connect to you
    which will probably mean a bank of modems.

    You could set up a mail host and DNS of your own which your users
    could then use. And probably a hosting server for them, I guess.

    Like I said, it would take buckets of money.

    What you and some friends could do is get a Jetstream connection
    through an ISP and a wireless network. Then they could come round to
    you place and share the wireless network. Of course you could run DNS
    and a mailserver off it, but you'd have to cope with a changing IP
    address and your ISP may not approve. And it will still cost quite a
    lot.

    Cheers,

    Cliff
    --

    The complete lack of evidence is the surest sign
    that the conspiracy is working.
    Enkidu, Dec 18, 2003
    #7
  8. Steve

    madknoxie Guest

    In article <3fe163e3$>, "Steve" <>
    wrote:

    > AD. wrote
    > > Steve wrote:
    > >
    > > > Enkidu wrote
    > > >> Steve wrote:
    > > >> >
    > > >> >What is involved in setting up an ISP.
    > > >> >
    > > >> Buckets of money.
    > > >
    > > > Why? I just want to have it - not actually use it for much and it only
    > > > needs the minimum of services but it needs to be an ISP in its own right.

    > >
    > > You might have to explain what you need/want in more detail.

    >
    > I want to not have to use an ISP for an Internet connection and I want
    > the ability to allow others to connect to the internet without having
    > to pay an ISP. I will have a few users and all will be no commercial (free
    > for them). I want mail hosting and connections to the internet. I do not
    > want to just have a domain which is hosted somewhere for mail connection.


    I'm interested, how much (ballpark figure) do you think this will cost
    you?

    --
    madknoxie
    $35 .nz domain names: http://www.ivision.co.nz/
    madknoxie, Dec 18, 2003
    #8
  9. Steve

    Steve Guest

    madknoxie wrote

    > I'm interested, how much (ballpark figure) do you think this will cost
    > you?


    Absolutely no idea. I know that the three + years of abuse I have had
    from this group has been a living hell and this is the first time I have
    had the technical proof of who is doing it. I have the names and
    addresses of most of them and even admissions that they are doing
    things but not the technical proof.

    Steve.
    Steve, Dec 18, 2003
    #9
  10. Steve

    madknoxie Guest

    In article <3fe177a0$>, "Steve" <>
    wrote:

    > madknoxie wrote
    >
    > > I'm interested, how much (ballpark figure) do you think this will cost
    > > you?

    >
    > Absolutely no idea. I know that the three + years of abuse I have had
    > from this group has been a living hell and this is the first time I have
    > had the technical proof of who is doing it. I have the names and
    > addresses of most of them and even admissions that they are doing
    > things but not the technical proof.


    Are you saying this is the reason for wanting your own ISP?

    --
    madknoxie
    $35 .nz domain names: http://www.ivision.co.nz/
    madknoxie, Dec 18, 2003
    #10
  11. Steve

    Steve Guest

    madknoxie wrote
    > Are you saying this is the reason for wanting your own ISP?


    Yes.

    Steve.
    Steve, Dec 18, 2003
    #11
  12. Steve

    T.N.O. Guest

    ChrisOD wrote:
    > Hybrid:
    > There are a few people selling ISP in a box, All above software in a
    > boxed set. Dunno how good it is but I recommend clue.


    Last time I read through the Redhat help they had an "ISP in a single
    box" how to... You could play with that for a trial.
    T.N.O., Dec 18, 2003
    #12
  13. Steve

    T.N.O. Guest

    Steve wrote:
    > I know that the three + years of abuse I have had
    > from this group has been a living hell and this is the first time I have
    > had the technical proof of who is doing it.


    heh, no-one has made you stay.

    > I have the names and
    > addresses of most of them and even admissions that they are doing
    > things but not the technical proof.


    And running your own ISP will help you how?
    T.N.O., Dec 18, 2003
    #13
  14. Steve

    Jason M Guest

    On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 22:38:27 +1300, "Steve" <> wrote:

    >I know that the three + years of abuse I have had
    >from this group has been a living hell and this is the first time I have
    >had the technical proof of who is doing it. I have the names and
    >addresses of most of them and even admissions that they are doing
    >things but not the technical proof.


    Do you have any examples of that abuse?
    Jason M, Dec 18, 2003
    #14
  15. Steve

    steve Guest

    On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 17:31:08 +1300, Steve wrote:

    > What is involved in setting up an ISP.
    >
    > Steve.


    I have a cable modem with a fixed IP....and I run my own mailserver, web
    server....and could run pretty much any server I want. I could even allow
    others to dial into my network...and share my access...or maybe access it
    via a VPN or a wireless LAN if they live nearby.

    Paradise cable makes all of that possible....for about $164 / month with a
    3GB quota.
    steve, Dec 18, 2003
    #15
  16. Steve

    Brendan Guest

    On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 22:38:27 +1300, Steve wrote:

    > Absolutely no idea. I know that the three + years of abuse I have had
    > from this group has been a living hell and this is the first time I have
    > had the technical proof of who is doing it. I have the names and
    > addresses of most of them and even admissions that they are doing
    > things but not the technical proof.


    And having your own ISP helps that, how ?
    --
    ...... Brendan


    Shamelessly stolen quote:
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to
    think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone´s fault.
    If it was Us, what did that make Me ? After all, I´m one of Us. I must be.
    I´ve certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No-one ever thinks
    of themselves as one of Them. We´re always one of Us. It´s Them that do
    the bad things. <=> Terry Pratchett. Jingo.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Note: All comments are copyright 2003, and are opinion only where not
    otherwise stated, and always 'to the best of my reccollection'.
    Brendan, Dec 18, 2003
    #16
  17. Steve

    Steve Guest

    Brendan wrote
    > Steve wrote:
    >
    > > Absolutely no idea. I know that the three + years of abuse I have had
    > > from this group has been a living hell and this is the first time I have
    > > had the technical proof of who is doing it. I have the names and
    > > addresses of most of them and even admissions that they are doing
    > > things but not the technical proof.

    >
    > And having your own ISP helps that, how ?


    The same way this guy is protected from any action I can take if, say,
    you were doing this. I could contact abuse@yourISP and they will
    cancel your account. With him, abuse@hisISP is the same as his
    personal e-mail because he is the owner of the ISP. He makes the
    rules. If he wants to allow mail bombing then he can.

    Steve.
    Steve, Dec 18, 2003
    #17
  18. Steve

    Brendan Guest

    On Fri, 19 Dec 2003 00:56:37 +1300, Steve wrote:

    > The same way this guy is protected from any action I can take if, say,
    > you were doing this. I could contact abuse@yourISP and they will
    > cancel your account. With him, abuse@hisISP is the same as his
    > personal e-mail because he is the owner of the ISP. He makes the
    > rules. If he wants to allow mail bombing then he can.


    I have had similar trouble with the admin of ICONZ some time ago; seldom
    have I been inflicted with a more egregiously abusive imbecile.

    If his actions are illegal, mention to his feeds that they will be required
    to appear in a Court hearing on the matter and may be found liable for his
    defamation as well. Provide examples of the reason for your complaints.

    --

    ...... Brendan


    Shamelessly stolen quote:
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Two wrongs don't make a very good excuse...
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Note: All comments are copyright 2003, and are opinion only where not
    otherwise stated, and always 'to the best of my reccollection'.
    Brendan, Dec 18, 2003
    #18
  19. Steve

    Steve Guest

    Brendan wrote
    > On Fri, 19 Dec 2003 00:56:37 +1300, Steve wrote:
    >
    > > The same way this guy is protected from any action I can take if, say,
    > > you were doing this. I could contact abuse@yourISP and they will
    > > cancel your account. With him, abuse@hisISP is the same as his
    > > personal e-mail because he is the owner of the ISP. He makes the
    > > rules. If he wants to allow mail bombing then he can.

    >
    > I have had similar trouble with the admin of ICONZ some time ago; seldom
    > have I been inflicted with a more egregiously abusive imbecile.
    >
    > If his actions are illegal, mention to his feeds that they will be required
    > to appear in a Court hearing on the matter and may be found liable for his
    > defamation as well. Provide examples of the reason for your complaints.


    Is it illegal to mail bomb someone?

    Steve.
    Steve, Dec 18, 2003
    #19
  20. Steve

    AD. Guest

    On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 21:14:07 +1300, Steve wrote:

    > I want to not have to use an ISP for an Internet connection and I want
    > the ability to allow others to connect to the internet without having to
    > pay an ISP. I will have a few users and all will be no commercial (free
    > for them). I want mail hosting and connections to the internet. I do
    > not want to just have a domain which is hosted somewhere for mail
    > connection.


    I'm not exactly an expert on this, but....

    Well to completely avoid an upstream ISP, you'd have to get an IP address
    range from APNIC, sort out some routing peers, and get yourself some
    bandwidth to those peers. Good luck.

    You'll have to learn about routing protocols, the routers themselves,
    setting up DNS servers, mail servers, etc etc etc.

    You'll then need to get some infrastructure for your 'customers' to
    connect to you.

    None of this will be easy (if even possible in your position) or cheap.
    Most of the smaller NZ ISPs still have an upstream ISP to give them IP
    addresses and outgoing routes.

    So basically the concise answer is: give up now.

    Things get a lot simpler and cheaper if you are willing to have an
    upstream ISP. Hell, having an unsecured wireless network connected to your
    DSL router could count as being an ISP! :)

    Cheers
    Anton
    AD., Dec 18, 2003
    #20
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