Selling my car - Advice please

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Adam Smith, Dec 11, 2003.

  1. Adam Smith

    Adam Smith Guest

    Hi,

    Sorry for the off topic post, but you all seem pretty knowledgeable about
    most things (and I can't see a nz.cars newsgroup).

    I (after a few months of trying) have sold my car privately. I went to the
    post office, transfered the ownership and recived a bank cheque from the
    buyer. I banked the cheque this morning and am waiting for it to clear (7
    days, whats with that?).

    Now thats all good, but I have finance on the car. I sold it for $9,000 and
    the outstanding finance is $8,000. As the cheque hasn't cleared yet I can't
    pay off the finance. Is it a normal situation for the finance on the car to
    still be in place while the bank cheque clears?

    I haven't missed any payments and the next one isn't due for about 5-6 days
    after the cheque will clear. Once the cheque clears I will pay the loan off
    in full.

    I guess what I am worried about is that the ownership won't have transferred
    properly, or that the new owner will have a tow truck turn up at his garage.

    Are my concerns justified?


    Thanks for your help.

    Adam.
    Adam Smith, Dec 11, 2003
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Adam Smith

    SNOman Guest

    Adam Smith wrote:
    > Hi,
    >
    > Sorry for the off topic post, but you all seem pretty knowledgeable about
    > most things (and I can't see a nz.cars newsgroup).
    >
    > I (after a few months of trying) have sold my car privately. I went to the
    > post office, transfered the ownership and recived a bank cheque from the
    > buyer. I banked the cheque this morning and am waiting for it to clear (7
    > days, whats with that?).
    >
    > Now thats all good, but I have finance on the car. I sold it for $9,000 and
    > the outstanding finance is $8,000. As the cheque hasn't cleared yet I can't
    > pay off the finance. Is it a normal situation for the finance on the car to
    > still be in place while the bank cheque clears?
    >
    > I haven't missed any payments and the next one isn't due for about 5-6 days
    > after the cheque will clear. Once the cheque clears I will pay the loan off
    > in full.
    >
    > I guess what I am worried about is that the ownership won't have transferred
    > properly, or that the new owner will have a tow truck turn up at his garage.
    >
    > Are my concerns justified?
    >
    >
    > Thanks for your help.
    >
    > Adam.
    >
    >

    If you had taken to the cheque to the issuing branch you should have
    been able to cash it straight away, rathering than depositing it in your
    own account and having to wait for it to clear.
    SNOman, Dec 11, 2003
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Adam Smith

    JJD Guest

    On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:13:09 +1300, SNOman <>
    wrote:

    >> Thanks for your help.
    >>
    >> Adam.
    >>
    >>

    >If you had taken to the cheque to the issuing branch you should have
    >been able to cash it straight away, rathering than depositing it in your
    >own account and having to wait for it to clear.


    Which doesn't really address the issue of cheques "clearing".
    Clearing what? Everything in banking is on computer and, as when I
    use my EFTPOS card, it should be resolvable immediately. What's the 7
    days carry-on, or the three days on personal cheques, or even
    overnight? Well, the answer can only be that the bank has all this
    dosh for just the few days it needs to cut a nice slice of interest
    off it from some short term cash investment. Your few thousand, a
    couple of hundred here, a few more thousand there, all adds up to a
    very tidy sum for the bank to cream it off every day.

    Who gave them the right to do this? When they take my bank charges,
    do I have the right to tell them they'll have to wait three days while
    I make sure the funds are cleared? The word "scam" springs to mind,
    but, naturally, I would never use it.

    <rant off>

    Oh, and for the original poster, bank cheques are not like cash - I
    believe they can be stopped. You have received nothing until it shows
    up in your account.

    JJD
    JJD, Dec 11, 2003
    #3
  4. Adam Smith

    Rider Guest

    Re: Selling my car - Advice please WRONG NEWS GROUP..

    "Dumdedo" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >


    Wrong place to put your message :p
    Rider, Dec 11, 2003
    #4
  5. On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:55:42 +1300, JJD <> wrote:


    >Which doesn't really address the issue of cheques "clearing".
    >Clearing what? Everything in banking is on computer and, as when I
    >use my EFTPOS card, it should be resolvable immediately. What's the 7
    >days carry-on, or the three days on personal cheques, or even
    >overnight? Well, the answer can only be that the bank has all this
    >dosh for just the few days it needs to cut a nice slice of interest
    >off it from some short term cash investment. Your few thousand, a
    >couple of hundred here, a few more thousand there, all adds up to a
    >very tidy sum for the bank to cream it off every day.
    >
    >Who gave them the right to do this? When they take my bank charges,
    >do I have the right to tell them they'll have to wait three days while
    >I make sure the funds are cleared? The word "scam" springs to mind,
    >but, naturally, I would never use it.


    That's a nice conspiracy theory but it ignores real practice.
    If you deposit it in an interest bearing account you will be paid
    interest from the day it was deposited, not from the day it was
    cleared (providing it does clear of course). The delay only prevents
    you withdrawing the money before they are sure it really exists.

    ><rant off>
    >
    >Oh, and for the original poster, bank cheques are not like cash - I
    >believe they can be stopped. You have received nothing until it shows
    >up in your account.


    Blank bank cheques have also been stolen in the past, and people have
    been known to alter a legitimately issued cheque.

    It is possible to request express clearance at the time of depositing
    a cheque, it costs money but would have possibly solved the original
    problem.

    Regards
    Malcolm.
    Malcolm Moore, Dec 11, 2003
    #5
  6. Adam Smith

    Adam Smith Guest

    Re: Selling my car - Advice please WRONG NEWS GROUP..

    Noted, thats why I apologised in the first place. If I mentioned that the
    car involved had a 16 bit processor in its fuel management computer would
    that help?

    >Sorry for the off topic post, but you all seem pretty knowledgeable about

    most things (and I can't see a nz.cars newsgroup).

    "Rider" <> wrote in message
    news:brar0e$tf3$...
    >
    > "Dumdedo" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > >

    >
    > Wrong place to put your message :p
    >
    >
    Adam Smith, Dec 11, 2003
    #6
  7. Adam Smith

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Adam Smith wrote:
    > Hi,
    >
    > Sorry for the off topic post, but you all seem pretty knowledgeable
    > about most things (and I can't see a nz.cars newsgroup).
    >
    > I (after a few months of trying) have sold my car privately. I went
    > to the post office, transfered the ownership and recived a bank
    > cheque from the buyer. I banked the cheque this morning and am
    > waiting for it to clear (7 days, whats with that?).
    >
    > Now thats all good, but I have finance on the car. I sold it for
    > $9,000 and the outstanding finance is $8,000. As the cheque hasn't
    > cleared yet I can't pay off the finance. Is it a normal situation
    > for the finance on the car to still be in place while the bank cheque
    > clears?
    >
    > I haven't missed any payments and the next one isn't due for about
    > 5-6 days after the cheque will clear. Once the cheque clears I will
    > pay the loan off in full.
    >
    > I guess what I am worried about is that the ownership won't have
    > transferred properly, or that the new owner will have a tow truck
    > turn up at his garage.
    >
    > Are my concerns justified?
    >
    >
    > Thanks for your help.
    >
    > Adam.


    You'll be fine.
    --
    ~misfit~
    ~misfit~, Dec 12, 2003
    #7
  8. Adam Smith

    Rider Guest

    Re: Selling my car - Advice please WRONG NEWS GROUP..

    "Adam Smith" <> wrote in message
    news:U_6Cb.26491$...
    > Noted, thats why I apologised in the first place. If I mentioned that the
    > car involved had a 16 bit processor in its fuel management computer would
    > that help?
    >
    > >Sorry for the off topic post, but you all seem pretty knowledgeable about

    > most things (and I can't see a nz.cars newsgroup).
    >
    > "Rider" <> wrote in message
    > news:brar0e$tf3$...
    > >
    > > "Dumdedo" <> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > > >

    > >
    > > Wrong place to put your message :p
    > >
    > >

    >
    >


    I actually was refferring to Dumdedo :)
    Rider, Dec 12, 2003
    #8
  9. Adam Smith

    JJD Guest

    On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:38:10 +1300, Malcolm Moore
    <> wrote:

    >>Which doesn't really address the issue of cheques "clearing".
    >>Clearing what? Everything in banking is on computer and, as when I
    >>use my EFTPOS card, it should be resolvable immediately. What's the 7
    >>days carry-on, or the three days on personal cheques, or even
    >>overnight? Well, the answer can only be that the bank has all this
    >>dosh for just the few days it needs to cut a nice slice of interest
    >>off it from some short term cash investment. Your few thousand, a
    >>couple of hundred here, a few more thousand there, all adds up to a
    >>very tidy sum for the bank to cream it off every day.
    >>
    >>Who gave them the right to do this? When they take my bank charges,
    >>do I have the right to tell them they'll have to wait three days while
    >>I make sure the funds are cleared? The word "scam" springs to mind,
    >>but, naturally, I would never use it.

    >
    >That's a nice conspiracy theory but it ignores real practice.
    > If you deposit it in an interest bearing account you will be paid
    >interest from the day it was deposited, not from the day it was
    >cleared (providing it does clear of course). The delay only prevents
    >you withdrawing the money before they are sure it really exists.
    >

    It's not a theory, conspiracy or otherwise, because I have not done
    any research and come bearing no empirical data - it is merely a
    posit. I launched forth on appearances, a shakey platform indeed, but
    you could help steady it by explaining why there is such a delay
    confirming the money exists in these days of computing?

    I can see the reasoning if you were talking about grey little clerks,
    beavering away with quill pens, but we are in the age of instant
    information. You can go to your bank's internet site right now and get
    completely up to date information regarding your account.

    JJD
    JJD, Dec 12, 2003
    #9
  10. Adam Smith

    steve Guest

    Adam Smith allegedly said:

    > Hi,
    >
    > Sorry for the off topic post, but you all seem pretty knowledgeable about
    > most things (and I can't see a nz.cars newsgroup).
    >
    > I (after a few months of trying) have sold my car privately. I went to
    > the post office, transfered the ownership and recived a bank cheque from
    > the
    > buyer. I banked the cheque this morning and am waiting for it to clear (7
    > days, whats with that?).
    >
    > Now thats all good, but I have finance on the car. I sold it for $9,000
    > and
    > the outstanding finance is $8,000. As the cheque hasn't cleared yet I
    > can't
    > pay off the finance. Is it a normal situation for the finance on the car
    > to still be in place while the bank cheque clears?
    >
    > I haven't missed any payments and the next one isn't due for about 5-6
    > days
    > after the cheque will clear. Once the cheque clears I will pay the loan
    > off in full.
    >
    > I guess what I am worried about is that the ownership won't have
    > transferred properly, or that the new owner will have a tow truck turn up
    > at his garage.
    >
    > Are my concerns justified?
    >
    > Thanks for your help.
    >
    > Adam.


    Provided the money ends up in your hands and you immediately pay off the
    loan, there should be no trouble.

    The car would only be re-possessed if you default on the loan...AND the car
    is down on the loan agreement as security for the loan.

    --
    Best Regards,
    Steve Withers
    defenestrate: The act of throwing Windows out the window and replacing it on
    your PC with some other operating system.
    steve, Dec 12, 2003
    #10
  11. Adam Smith

    Max Burke Guest

    > JJD scribbled:

    >> SNOman <>
    >> wrote:


    >>> Thanks for your help.
    >>> Adam.

    >> If you had taken to the cheque to the issuing branch you should have
    >> been able to cash it straight away, rathering than depositing it in
    >> your own account and having to wait for it to clear.


    > Which doesn't really address the issue of cheques "clearing".
    > Clearing what? Everything in banking is on computer and, as when I
    > use my EFTPOS card, it should be resolvable immediately. What's the 7
    > days carry-on, or the three days on personal cheques, or even
    > overnight?


    In case the person who got the bank cheque made out cancels it; In case it's
    a fraudulent bank cheque; Oh and it's the Bankers Assoc. policy, but
    individual banks can set the no. of days for it to clear.

    Best option with a bank cheque? When depositing it ask for it to be cleared
    immediately (note: fees usually apply) so you bank contacts the issuing bank
    and confirms it's a valid cheque that can be cleared immediately.

    > Well, the answer can only be that the bank has all this
    > dosh for just the few days it needs to cut a nice slice of interest
    > off it from some short term cash investment. Your few thousand, a
    > couple of hundred here, a few more thousand there, all adds up to a
    > very tidy sum for the bank to cream it off every day.


    They customer also gets paid interest on the cheque amount while it's
    waiting to clear......
    That's it they have enough sense to deposit it into an interest bearing
    account that is.......

    > Who gave them the right to do this? When they take my bank charges,
    > do I have the right to tell them they'll have to wait three days while
    > I make sure the funds are cleared?


    No. But then you know [the date] when your bank charges apply and should
    endevour to have cleared funds available to cover them whe they're due. (You
    DO know that date and approximately how much your fees will be dont you?)
    It's all included in the terms and conditions of your bank account, and
    something YOU agreed to when you signed the 'contract' with the bank for
    your bank account. (You DO know what what your bank accounts terms and
    conditions are dont you?)


    > The word "scam" springs to mind,
    > but, naturally, I would never use it.


    It isn't, so using that 'description' would be incorrect......

    --
    mlvburke@#%&*.net.nz
    Replace the obvious with paradise to email me.
    See Found Images at:
    http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/~mlvburke/
    Max Burke, Dec 12, 2003
    #11
  12. On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 14:05:15 +1300, JJD <> wrote:

    >On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:38:10 +1300, Malcolm Moore
    ><> wrote:


    >>That's a nice conspiracy theory but it ignores real practice.
    >> If you deposit it in an interest bearing account you will be paid
    >>interest from the day it was deposited, not from the day it was
    >>cleared (providing it does clear of course). The delay only prevents
    >>you withdrawing the money before they are sure it really exists.
    >>

    >It's not a theory, conspiracy or otherwise, because I have not done
    >any research and come bearing no empirical data - it is merely a
    >posit. I launched forth on appearances, a shakey platform indeed, but
    >you could help steady it by explaining why there is such a delay
    >confirming the money exists in these days of computing?
    >
    >I can see the reasoning if you were talking about grey little clerks,
    >beavering away with quill pens, but we are in the age of instant
    >information. You can go to your bank's internet site right now and get
    >completely up to date information regarding your account.
    >
    >JJD


    Saying " Well, the answer can only be" certainly gave me the
    impression that you believed what you were typing! It was a theory, be
    it one with no supporting evidence.

    I am under no obligation to steady your platform. To do so would be to
    do the same as yourself. :)

    I am not defending the time to clear cheques, and I don't know the
    reasoning behind it but cheques are certainly not very secure.
    Signatures are by their nature visible and therefore open to forgery.

    Perhaps someone in the bank data processing world will contribute,
    that would at least make it relevant to this ng.

    Regards
    Malcolm
    --
    Remove sharp objects to get a valid e-mail address
    Malcolm Moore, Dec 12, 2003
    #12
  13. Adam Smith

    SteveM Guest

    SNIP

    > Now thats all good, but I have finance on the car. I sold it for
    > $9,000 and the outstanding finance is $8,000. As the cheque hasn't
    > cleared yet I can't pay off the finance. Is it a normal situation for
    > the finance on the car to still be in place while the bank cheque
    > clears?
    >
    > I haven't missed any payments and the next one isn't due for about 5-6
    > days after the cheque will clear. Once the cheque clears I will pay
    > the loan off in full.
    >
    > I guess what I am worried about is that the ownership won't have
    > transferred properly, or that the new owner will have a tow truck turn
    > up at his garage.
    >
    > Are my concerns justified?
    >
    >
    > Thanks for your help.
    >
    > Adam.
    >


    As the purchaser of the car I would be more worried that YOU
    would default on the finance.

    I paid two seperate cheques once for a car, one to the finance company
    and the balance to the owner. At lease I was covered :)

    SteveM
    SteveM, Dec 12, 2003
    #13
  14. Adam Smith

    JJD Guest

    On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 16:48:32 +1300, Malcolm Moore
    <> wrote:

    >On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 14:05:15 +1300, JJD <> wrote:
    >
    >>On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:38:10 +1300, Malcolm Moore
    >><> wrote:

    >
    >>>That's a nice conspiracy theory but it ignores real practice.
    >>> If you deposit it in an interest bearing account you will be paid
    >>>interest from the day it was deposited, not from the day it was
    >>>cleared (providing it does clear of course). The delay only prevents
    >>>you withdrawing the money before they are sure it really exists.
    >>>

    >>It's not a theory, conspiracy or otherwise, because I have not done
    >>any research and come bearing no empirical data - it is merely a
    >>posit. I launched forth on appearances, a shakey platform indeed, but
    >>you could help steady it by explaining why there is such a delay
    >>confirming the money exists in these days of computing?
    >>
    >>I can see the reasoning if you were talking about grey little clerks,
    >>beavering away with quill pens, but we are in the age of instant
    >>information. You can go to your bank's internet site right now and get
    >>completely up to date information regarding your account.


    >Saying " Well, the answer can only be" certainly gave me the
    >impression that you believed what you were typing! It was a theory, be
    >it one with no supporting evidence.


    Of course it gave you that impression - how else is one to make an
    argument sound convincing in the face of a palpable lack of supporting
    evidence?
    >
    >I am under no obligation to steady your platform. To do so would be to
    >do the same as yourself. :)


    On the contrary, I would the unsteady and you would be the steadier -
    quite a different kettle of thingies.
    >
    >I am not defending the time to clear cheques, and I don't know the
    >reasoning behind it but cheques are certainly not very secure.
    >Signatures are by their nature visible and therefore open to forgery.


    Bollocks! Are you saying it's all down to the signatures? The banks
    don't even look at them. I accidentally used my wife's chequebook
    once and it went through, no trouble. And are you saying you can't
    forge data? (note the constant referral to things digital)
    >
    >Perhaps someone in the bank data processing world will contribute,
    >that would at least make it relevant to this ng.
    >

    I will be accused of spouting unsupported twaddle, but I will not be
    accused of being irrelevant - I talked from the very beginning about
    the computerised nature of banking.

    JJD
    JJD, Dec 12, 2003
    #14
  15. Adam Smith

    PseUDO Guest

    Re: Selling my car - Advice please WRONG NEWS GROUP..

    "Dumdedo" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >


    Does this post ring a bell???

    Nov 9th 2003

    The Talleys Spinach Portions at Pack & Save this week end

    >
    > "Gregory Parker" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >>
    >> Great taste and better than the Block that Watties makes, these are

    individual
    >> chunks frozen in a loose bag.
    >>
    >>
    >> End up buying 3 bags of it..
    >>
    >> Come on Chaps you all need your Spinach..


    Say no more!

    PseUDO
    PseUDO, Dec 12, 2003
    #15
  16. Adam Smith

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Re: Selling my car - Advice please WRONG NEWS GROUP **NEVER STOPS YOU FROM DOING IT **

    J.Clampett wrote:

    <**** all, thank God>

    Plonk again woger.
    --
    ~misfit~
    ~misfit~, Dec 12, 2003
    #16
  17. On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:55:42 +1300, JJD <> wrote:

    >On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:13:09 +1300, SNOman <>
    >wrote:
    >
    >>> Thanks for your help.
    >>>
    >>> Adam.
    >>>
    >>>

    >>If you had taken to the cheque to the issuing branch you should have
    >>been able to cash it straight away, rathering than depositing it in your
    >>own account and having to wait for it to clear.

    >
    >Which doesn't really address the issue of cheques "clearing".
    >Clearing what? Everything in banking is on computer and, as when I
    >use my EFTPOS card, it should be resolvable immediately. What's the 7
    >days carry-on, or the three days on personal cheques, or even
    >overnight? Well, the answer can only be that the bank has all this
    >dosh for just the few days it needs to cut a nice slice of interest
    >off it from some short term cash investment. Your few thousand, a
    >couple of hundred here, a few more thousand there, all adds up to a
    >very tidy sum for the bank to cream it off every day.
    >
    >Who gave them the right to do this? When they take my bank charges,
    >do I have the right to tell them they'll have to wait three days while
    >I make sure the funds are cleared? The word "scam" springs to mind,
    >but, naturally, I would never use it.
    >
    ><rant off>
    >
    >Oh, and for the original poster, bank cheques are not like cash - I
    >believe they can be stopped. You have received nothing until it shows
    >up in your account.
    >
    >JJD


    Taking seven days to clear cheques was a legal thing. Until a few
    years ago electronic transactions (or more correctly electronic copies
    of phyisical transactions) had no legal status in NZ so the phyisical
    cheque had to be delivered to its home branch before it could be
    processed. In the worst case, lets say an ANZ customer in Kaitaia
    writes a cheque to a BNZ customer in Invercargill, the cheque had to
    physically get back to ANZ Kaitaia, be "processed" and some sort of an
    acknowledgement sent back to Invercargill (this bit could be
    electronic) before the BNZ can be sure its good. Various short cuts
    developed and most cheques were processed overnight but that didn't
    change the legal status. With cheque use on the decline I suspect the
    banks don't see much need to change their practices.

    Steve
    Steve Sinclair, Dec 13, 2003
    #17
  18. Adam Smith

    Gordon Guest

    On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:06:14 +1300, Adam Smith wrote:

    > Sorry for the off topic post, but you all seem pretty knowledgeable about
    > most things (and I can't see a nz.cars newsgroup).


    Can you see nz.general?

    --
    Fairy stories exist so children get used to real life
    Gordon, Dec 13, 2003
    #18
  19. Gordon wrote:
    >
    > On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:06:14 +1300, Adam Smith wrote:
    >
    > > Sorry for the off topic post, but you all seem pretty knowledgeable about
    > > most things (and I can't see a nz.cars newsgroup).

    >
    > Can you see nz.general?
    >
    > --
    > Fairy stories exist so children get used to real life


    There ought to be a nz.cars ng - how do you start it?
    Classic Car Fair, Dec 13, 2003
    #19
  20. Adam Smith

    Ralph Fox Guest

    On Sat, 13 Dec 2003 20:43:29 +1300, in article
    <>, Classic Car Fair wrote:

    > There ought to be a nz.cars ng - how do you start it?


    See section 4.0 of the nz.* Usenet Hierarchy FAQ

    http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=
    http://www.faqs.org/faqs/usenet/nz-news-hierarchy/




    --
    Cheers,
    Ralph

    "There is only one boss, the customer. And he can fire everybody in
    the company from the chairman on down, simply by spending his money
    somewhere else." -- Sam Walton
    Ralph Fox, Dec 13, 2003
    #20
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