Reccomended titles to compare 480p vs. 1080p?

Discussion in 'DVD Video' started by Doug Jacobs, Feb 15, 2007.

  1. Doug Jacobs

    Doug Jacobs Guest

    Based on reviews and reccomendations, I went ahead and ordered Oppo's
    DV-981 1080p upscaling player.

    It arrived earlier this week, was quickly connected, and looks awesome.

    However, DVDs on our Panasonic VCR/DVD-burner also look awesome.

    I'm not disappointed with the Oppo - we needed a new region free player
    as my old hacked Sony has begun having problems and won't play some of my
    wife's discs at all. The Panasonic has no region-free hack that I could
    find.

    I am, however, curious what titles might better illustrate the difference
    between the Panasonic which does standard progressive scan, and the Oppo
    which upscales to 1080p (TV is 1080p native)

    Best test I came up with was to slap a Babylon5 disc into each player and
    had them play the opening credits. This sequence contains a variety of
    still shots and rapid movements of both real actors and CG elements. In the
    opening, there's a CG shot showing some soliders marching into a ship. On
    the Panasonic, the soliders were blurry. You could still tell there were
    people but the whole line of them was rather blurry. The Oppo was much
    clearer, though there was still some distortion around the soliders' limbs.

    The next test I tried was using our region 5 copy of Spirited Away. The
    Panasonic player wouldn't play this of course, so I played various scenes
    on the Oppo at 480p and then 1080p. To me, 1080p looked sharper, but of
    course, I'm going to be biased. ;)

    Any other ideas of good titles/scenes to try out?

    I was thinking Fifth Element, simply because that was one of the early
    titles I saw on DVD that convinced me to get a DVD player in the first
    place.

    In the meantime, I think I'll dig up some Divx and VCD discs and try them
    out.

    Now I just have to save up money for a better sound system :(
    Doug Jacobs, Feb 15, 2007
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Doug Jacobs

    Joshua Zyber Guest

    "Doug Jacobs" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I am, however, curious what titles might better illustrate the
    > difference
    > between the Panasonic which does standard progressive scan, and the
    > Oppo
    > which upscales to 1080p (TV is 1080p native)


    Since your TV is 1080p, if you feed it a 480p signal it will upscale
    that to the set's native resolution in any case. The picture on the
    screen will always utilize all 1920x1080 pixels. What you're comparing
    here is the quality of the Oppo player's scaling chip against that in
    the TV. It's very possible that they could be equally matched, and
    you'll see little to no difference.
    Joshua Zyber, Feb 16, 2007
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Doug Jacobs

    MassiveProng Guest

    On Thu, 15 Feb 2007 19:08:41 -0000, Doug Jacobs
    <> Gave us:

    >
    >Based on reviews and reccomendations, I went ahead and ordered Oppo's
    >DV-981 1080p upscaling player.
    >
    >It arrived earlier this week, was quickly connected, and looks awesome.
    >
    >However, DVDs on our Panasonic VCR/DVD-burner also look awesome.
    >
    >I'm not disappointed with the Oppo - we needed a new region free player
    >as my old hacked Sony has begun having problems and won't play some of my
    >wife's discs at all. The Panasonic has no region-free hack that I could
    >find.
    >
    >I am, however, curious what titles might better illustrate the difference
    >between the Panasonic which does standard progressive scan, and the Oppo
    >which upscales to 1080p (TV is 1080p native)
    >
    >Best test I came up with was to slap a Babylon5 disc into each player and
    >had them play the opening credits. This sequence contains a variety of
    >still shots and rapid movements of both real actors and CG elements. In the
    >opening, there's a CG shot showing some soliders marching into a ship. On
    >the Panasonic, the soliders were blurry. You could still tell there were
    >people but the whole line of them was rather blurry. The Oppo was much
    >clearer, though there was still some distortion around the soliders' limbs.
    >
    >The next test I tried was using our region 5 copy of Spirited Away. The
    >Panasonic player wouldn't play this of course, so I played various scenes
    >on the Oppo at 480p and then 1080p. To me, 1080p looked sharper, but of
    >course, I'm going to be biased. ;)
    >
    >Any other ideas of good titles/scenes to try out?
    >
    >I was thinking Fifth Element, simply because that was one of the early
    >titles I saw on DVD that convinced me to get a DVD player in the first
    >place.
    >
    >In the meantime, I think I'll dig up some Divx and VCD discs and try them
    >out.
    >
    >Now I just have to save up money for a better sound system :(



    The right comparison would be to actually use hi res source media,
    such as HD DVD. Comparing a 480p disc on a 480 player, and an
    upscaling player doesn't really get you what you asked for in the
    thread title.

    Just thought you'd like to know.
    MassiveProng, Feb 16, 2007
    #3
  4. Doug Jacobs

    MassiveProng Guest

    On Thu, 15 Feb 2007 19:00:01 -0500, "Joshua Zyber"
    <> Gave us:

    >"Doug Jacobs" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> I am, however, curious what titles might better illustrate the
    >> difference
    >> between the Panasonic which does standard progressive scan, and the
    >> Oppo
    >> which upscales to 1080p (TV is 1080p native)

    >
    >Since your TV is 1080p, if you feed it a 480p signal it will upscale
    >that to the set's native resolution in any case. The picture on the
    >screen will always utilize all 1920x1080 pixels. What you're comparing
    >here is the quality of the Oppo player's scaling chip against that in
    >the TV. It's very possible that they could be equally matched, and
    >you'll see little to no difference.
    >



    And I thought at first glance that he wanted a title, like MI3 in
    Std DVD compared to MI3 in HD DVD.

    OR The Forbidden Planet in 480p and the same flic in HD DVD.

    One can upscale the Std DVD or not.

    THAT's the REAL comparison.

    Take a very grainy film like Full Metal Jacket.

    VERY BADLY grainy on the 480 Std DVD. SO much so that viewing it on
    an HD FPD is nearly not possible to bear.

    The HD DVD, however, despite the same glaring graininess (my ass
    hurts from the screw job I got on that one), It is still an order of
    magnitude better than the original.

    Films where not as much difference can be detected are like King
    Kong in DVD against HD DVD. The hi res is better, but not much, so it
    is the sound that makes that disc better. OR look at The Hulk. It is
    better on HD. Not much but certainly discernable.
    MassiveProng, Feb 16, 2007
    #4
  5. Doug Jacobs

    Doug Jacobs Guest

    MassiveProng <> wrote:

    > And I thought at first glance that he wanted a title, like MI3 in
    > Std DVD compared to MI3 in HD DVD.


    I have no doubt that a native HD signal will outperform that of an
    upscaled signal. At this time, however, I don't think the HD video market
    is mature enough.

    I'm just curious how much better the Oppo's scaling chip is compared to
    the one in my TV. So far, I can see small differences, but nothing that's
    as jaw-dropping as comparing a 480i to 720p or 1080i over cable.

    --
    Win cash and giftcards just for clicking your mouse!
    http://www.netwinner.com/?signupCode=amuro98
    Doug Jacobs, Feb 16, 2007
    #5
  6. Doug Jacobs

    MassiveProng Guest

    On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 01:47:53 -0000, Doug Jacobs
    <> Gave us:

    >I'm just curious how much better the Oppo's scaling chip is compared to
    >the one in my TV. So far, I can see small differences, but nothing that's
    >as jaw-dropping as comparing a 480i to 720p or 1080i over cable.


    My cable box feeds my TV 1080i, but the does NOT mean that the
    content being delivered is ever at those resolutions.

    Cable boys are famous for reprocessing their feeds. A good example
    of how bad it can get is Spike TV. They reprocess down at their
    uplink studio, and then the cable boys hit it too. I have never seen
    so many artifacts rear their ugly head.
    MassiveProng, Feb 16, 2007
    #6
  7. Doug Jacobs

    Joshua Zyber Guest

    "Doug Jacobs" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I'm just curious how much better the Oppo's scaling chip is compared
    > to
    > the one in my TV. So far, I can see small differences, but nothing
    > that's
    > as jaw-dropping as comparing a 480i to 720p or 1080i over cable.


    Upscaling does not add real picture detail. It just fills in the empty
    spaces between pixels with new pixels created by borrowing pieces of
    those found in the source. This has advantages over not upscaling, but
    you can't turn a Standard Definition source into true HD.
    Joshua Zyber, Feb 16, 2007
    #7
  8. Doug Jacobs

    AZ Nomad Guest

    On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 07:47:30 -0500, Joshua Zyber <> wrote:


    >"Doug Jacobs" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> I'm just curious how much better the Oppo's scaling chip is compared
    >> to
    >> the one in my TV. So far, I can see small differences, but nothing
    >> that's
    >> as jaw-dropping as comparing a 480i to 720p or 1080i over cable.


    >Upscaling does not add real picture detail. It just fills in the empty
    >spaces between pixels with new pixels created by borrowing pieces of
    >those found in the source. This has advantages over not upscaling, but
    >you can't turn a Standard Definition source into true HD.



    Not only that, but upscaling is done automatically in every current HDTV TV.
    Doing it in the DVD player instead of the TV offers no improvement at all.
    AZ Nomad, Feb 16, 2007
    #8
  9. Doug Jacobs

    Joshua Zyber Guest

    "AZ Nomad" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >>Upscaling does not add real picture detail. It just fills in the empty
    >>spaces between pixels with new pixels created by borrowing pieces of
    >>those found in the source. This has advantages over not upscaling, but
    >>you can't turn a Standard Definition source into true HD.

    >
    > Not only that, but upscaling is done automatically in every current
    > HDTV TV.
    > Doing it in the DVD player instead of the TV offers no improvement at
    > all.


    That depends on the quality of the scaling chips in each component. Many
    TVs have lousy cut-rate scaling chips, in which case a DVD player may do
    a better job.
    Joshua Zyber, Feb 16, 2007
    #9
  10. Doug Jacobs

    AZ Nomad Guest

    On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 18:32:33 -0500, Joshua Zyber <> wrote:


    >"AZ Nomad" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >>>Upscaling does not add real picture detail. It just fills in the empty
    >>>spaces between pixels with new pixels created by borrowing pieces of
    >>>those found in the source. This has advantages over not upscaling, but
    >>>you can't turn a Standard Definition source into true HD.

    >>
    >> Not only that, but upscaling is done automatically in every current
    >> HDTV TV.
    >> Doing it in the DVD player instead of the TV offers no improvement at
    >> all.


    >That depends on the quality of the scaling chips in each component. Many
    >TVs have lousy cut-rate scaling chips, in which case a DVD player may do
    >a better job.


    Any current TVs out that that can't handle this simple function?
    AZ Nomad, Feb 17, 2007
    #10
  11. Doug Jacobs

    Doug Jacobs Guest

    AZ Nomad <> wrote:

    > Any current TVs out that that can't handle this simple function?


    Well, I think I can see a slight difference between the Oppo's scaler chip
    vs. the one in my TV, but I wanted to do some more experiments to see if
    it's just psychological or not ;)


    --
    Win cash and giftcards just for clicking your mouse!
    http://www.netwinner.com/?signupCode=amuro98
    Doug Jacobs, Feb 17, 2007
    #11
  12. Doug Jacobs

    MassiveProng Guest

    On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:21:33 GMT, AZ Nomad
    <> Gave us:

    >On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 07:47:30 -0500, Joshua Zyber <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>"Doug Jacobs" <> wrote in message
    >>news:...
    >>> I'm just curious how much better the Oppo's scaling chip is compared
    >>> to
    >>> the one in my TV. So far, I can see small differences, but nothing
    >>> that's
    >>> as jaw-dropping as comparing a 480i to 720p or 1080i over cable.

    >
    >>Upscaling does not add real picture detail. It just fills in the empty
    >>spaces between pixels with new pixels created by borrowing pieces of
    >>those found in the source. This has advantages over not upscaling, but
    >>you can't turn a Standard Definition source into true HD.

    >
    >
    >Not only that, but upscaling is done automatically in every current HDTV TV.
    >Doing it in the DVD player instead of the TV offers no improvement at all.


    Not if one sets one's array handler to 1 to 1, which my set allows.
    MassiveProng, Feb 17, 2007
    #12
  13. Doug Jacobs

    MassiveProng Guest

    On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 18:32:33 -0500, "Joshua Zyber"
    <> Gave us:

    >"AZ Nomad" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >>>Upscaling does not add real picture detail. It just fills in the empty
    >>>spaces between pixels with new pixels created by borrowing pieces of
    >>>those found in the source. This has advantages over not upscaling, but
    >>>you can't turn a Standard Definition source into true HD.

    >>
    >> Not only that, but upscaling is done automatically in every current
    >> HDTV TV.
    >> Doing it in the DVD player instead of the TV offers no improvement at
    >> all.

    >
    >That depends on the quality of the scaling chips in each component. Many
    >TVs have lousy cut-rate scaling chips, in which case a DVD player may do
    >a better job.
    >

    It likely does as the scaling chips in the FPD are specific to that
    set's array size, so the scaling done points into that fixed set. The
    chip in the DVD player scales from one (480) to another (720 or 1080)
    more precisely. The FPD scales to it array size, which may not be
    1080i at the native level (likely not for older or smaller sets).
    MassiveProng, Feb 17, 2007
    #13
  14. Doug Jacobs

    Joshua Zyber Guest

    "AZ Nomad" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >>That depends on the quality of the scaling chips in each component.
    >>Many
    >>TVs have lousy cut-rate scaling chips, in which case a DVD player may
    >>do
    >>a better job.

    >
    > Any current TVs out that that can't handle this simple function?


    Deinterlacing and scaling are not simple functions. At all.
    Joshua Zyber, Feb 17, 2007
    #14
  15. Doug Jacobs

    AZ Nomad Guest

    On Sat, 17 Feb 2007 10:23:36 -0500, Joshua Zyber <> wrote:


    >"AZ Nomad" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >>>That depends on the quality of the scaling chips in each component.
    >>>Many
    >>>TVs have lousy cut-rate scaling chips, in which case a DVD player may
    >>>do
    >>>a better job.

    >>
    >> Any current TVs out that that can't handle this simple function?


    >Deinterlacing and scaling are not simple functions. At all.


    Where'd you get that insane notion? They functions are well known and and
    adding the functionality to a video processor is trivial.
    AZ Nomad, Feb 17, 2007
    #15
  16. Doug Jacobs

    Joshua Zyber Guest

    "AZ Nomad" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >>> Any current TVs out that that can't handle this simple function?

    >
    >>Deinterlacing and scaling are not simple functions. At all.

    >
    > Where'd you get that insane notion? They functions are well known and
    > and
    > adding the functionality to a video processor is trivial.


    And I will ask you in turn where you got that insane notion? The fact
    that deinterlacing and scaling functions are so variable is why some DVD
    players cost much more than others.
    Joshua Zyber, Feb 18, 2007
    #16
  17. Doug Jacobs

    Alpha Guest

    "Doug Jacobs" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >
    > Based on reviews and reccomendations, I went ahead and ordered Oppo's
    > DV-981 1080p upscaling player.
    >
    > It arrived earlier this week, was quickly connected, and looks awesome.
    >
    > However, DVDs on our Panasonic VCR/DVD-burner also look awesome.



    This is not my experience at all. The OPPO upscaling is dramatically better
    because of patented technology.

    I presume you are HDMI connected (the OPPO does not do this on composite nor
    component).
    Alpha, Feb 18, 2007
    #17
  18. Doug Jacobs

    Doug Jacobs Guest

    Alpha <> wrote:
    > > It arrived earlier this week, was quickly connected, and looks awesome.
    > >
    > > However, DVDs on our Panasonic VCR/DVD-burner also look awesome.



    > This is not my experience at all. The OPPO upscaling is dramatically better
    > because of patented technology.


    > I presume you are HDMI connected (the OPPO does not do this on composite nor
    > component).


    Yes, HDMI for the OPPO, component for the Panasonic. The 981 doesn't even
    have a component output.

    I would also assume that the difference would also depend on the TV in
    use. In my case, it's Sony's KDS-60A2000. It has a native resolution of
    1080p, so anything short of a native 1080p signal is going to get
    upconverted.


    --
    Win cash and giftcards just for clicking your mouse!
    http://www.netwinner.com/?signupCode=amuro98
    Doug Jacobs, Feb 20, 2007
    #18
  19. Doug Jacobs

    MassiveProng Guest

    On Tue, 20 Feb 2007 19:23:47 -0000, Doug Jacobs
    <> Gave us:

    >Yes, HDMI for the OPPO, component for the Panasonic. The 981 doesn't even
    >have a component output.


    Component has sad color purity compared to HDMI or RGB. Extremely
    noticeable.

    I am jaded.
    MassiveProng, Feb 21, 2007
    #19
  20. Doug Jacobs

    MassiveProng Guest

    On Tue, 20 Feb 2007 19:23:47 -0000, Doug Jacobs
    <> Gave us:

    > It has a native resolution of
    >1080p, so anything short of a native 1080p signal is going to get
    >upconverted.
    >

    Badly.
    MassiveProng, Feb 21, 2007
    #20
    1. Advertising

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. Otto Pylot
    Replies:
    1
    Views:
    3,476
    LASERandDVDfan
    Apr 18, 2004
  2. Mike Barnard
    Replies:
    19
    Views:
    1,178
    luminos
    May 2, 2004
  3. Aphelion

    S-Video vs. Component Video w/480p

    Aphelion, Sep 18, 2004, in forum: DVD Video
    Replies:
    3
    Views:
    3,155
    Mark Jones
    Sep 18, 2004
  4. Noon

    Reccomended second hand film scaaner

    Noon, Nov 18, 2005, in forum: Digital Photography
    Replies:
    3
    Views:
    287
    Paul Bartram
    Nov 19, 2005
  5. Replies:
    0
    Views:
    417
Loading...

Share This Page