Re: Windows Updates

Discussion in 'Computer Support' started by chuckcar, Oct 30, 2008.

  1. chuckcar

    chuckcar Guest

    "Tanel Kagan" <tanelkagan@(nospamatall).hotmail.com> wrote in
    news::

    > Hi group,
    >
    > Does anyone know of an independent (i.e. non-Microsoft) website that
    > gives details about each of the windows updates, and whether it is a
    > good idea to install them?
    >
    > Microsoft pretty much advises you to install everything, but it would be
    > nice to know in fact which ones you should avoid and which are really
    > essential.
    >

    They actually *do* state what they're for at microsoft. If you have
    unistalled and don't use windows media player, you can ignore some. The
    same goes for internet exploder and outhouse express. Only *sort* of
    though, because you *still* need to know a) *exactly* how to avoid
    infection b) the hows and whys of a firewall along with knowing how to set
    it up. c) run a *just* updated virus and malware scan at *least* monthly.
    If you can't recite the above to me *exactly* off the top of your head,
    just take the bloody things, they're *fixes* for security leaks FCS.

    --
    (setq (chuck nil) car(chuck) )
     
    chuckcar, Oct 30, 2008
    #1
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  2. chuckcar

    chuckcar Guest

    "Tanel Kagan" <tanelkagan@(nospamatall).hotmail.com> wrote in
    news::

    > Hi Chuck,
    >
    > Thanks for your input.
    >
    > I actually do have a hardware firewall and perform regular virus and
    > spyware scans using NOD32 and Spybot S&D.


    Get a software one instead. My bet is what you call a firewall on your
    (router?) really isn't. Also you can do *far* more with it

    >
    > It wasn't so much an issue of possible infection, or that I don't trust
    > MS with regard to whether the updates "do what they say on the tin", it
    > was more a case (and I think the debate here has shown this) that I have
    > read about many instances of systems becoming buggy or even worse after
    > certain updates are applied.
    >

    Only way to find out is by trying them - and staying away from "consumer"
    computers - you know the <$1000 name brand ones. You can *always*
    uninstall in safe mode. You should know how to get there by now.

    > Of course, MS recommends all of the updates, but the reality is that
    > many of them aren't really necessary and as I say have caused problems.
    >

    No, that *really* depends on each update. I wouldn't say majority unless
    you have uninstalled all three packages I mentioned before.

    > I think it might be a case of googling each one in more detail, I just
    > thought it would have been a great resource if some experts out there
    > had the info all in one place.


    The actual MS update site *has* as much information about it as there is.
    It's *their* code and nobody else *has* the source code. Entering the kb#
    in technet might tell you a *bit* more.

    http://technet.microsoft.com

    --
    (setq (chuck nil) car(chuck) )
     
    chuckcar, Nov 4, 2008
    #2
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  3. chuckcar wrote:

    > "Tanel Kagan" <tanelkagan@(nospamatall).hotmail.com> wrote in
    > news::
    >
    >> Hi Chuck,
    >>
    >> Thanks for your input.
    >>
    >> I actually do have a hardware firewall and perform regular virus and
    >> spyware scans using NOD32 and Spybot S&D.

    >
    > Get a software one instead. My bet is what you call a firewall on your
    > (router?) really isn't. Also you can do *far* more with it
    >

    BWAHAHAHHH.
    Sorry, a software "firewall" is like a little brick wall built on a wooden
    desk. It will collapse when the desk burns.
    The main purpose of a firewall is to protect against _incoming_ threats,
    with as few as possible other services/programs running. Any extra service
    or program running on a firewall may be vulnerable and should be avoided.
    Therefore, a NAT router makes a much better firewall than a "desktop
    firewall" installed on a pc which is also used to surf and mail.

    Once the "desktop firewall" barfs, it may be too late and the malware is
    already on the system - or it barfs without a real reason, just to justify
    it's usefullness and to remind you buying the update/upgrade.

    Best practice is using a non-admin account for surfing and mailing (and even
    office programs - they _do_ support that), and have a good virus/malware
    watcher installed and active.
    I tend to use spybot s6d and it's teatimer which will monitor the registry
    and block/ask for adding new autostart-type or association-hook entries,
    but there are other programs or security suites as well.
     
    wisdomkiller & pain, Nov 4, 2008
    #3
  4. chuckcar

    M.L. Guest

    >Only way to find out is by trying them - and staying away from "consumer"
    >computers - you know the <$1000 name brand ones.


    That is very bad and wasteful advice.
     
    M.L., Nov 4, 2008
    #4
  5. chuckcar

    chuckcar Guest

    M.L. <> wrote in
    news::

    >>Only way to find out is by trying them - and staying away from
    >>"consumer" computers - you know the <$1000 name brand ones.

    >
    > That is very bad and wasteful advice.
    >

    Prove it. Consumer desktop are cheap because they're built that way full
    stop.

    --
    (setq (chuck nil) car(chuck) )
     
    chuckcar, Nov 5, 2008
    #5
  6. chuckcar

    Evan Platt Guest

    On Wed, 5 Nov 2008 00:10:25 +0000 (UTC), chuckcar <>
    wrote:

    >Prove it. Consumer desktop are cheap because they're built that way full
    >stop.


    I don't get it full stop. Why do you say 'full stop' at the end of
    every sentence full stop? It just is annoying full stop. Especially
    when you don't have a clue what you're talking about full stop.
    --
    To reply via e-mail, remove The Obvious from my e-mail address.
     
    Evan Platt, Nov 5, 2008
    #6
  7. Evan Platt wrote:

    > chuckcar <> wrote:
    >> Prove it. Consumer desktop are cheap because they're built that way
    >> full stop.

    >
    > I don't get it full stop. Why do you say 'full stop' at the end of
    > every sentence full stop? It just is annoying full stop. Especially
    > when you don't have a clue what you're talking about full stop.


    He's a Canadian full stop. That explains it, eh question mark?

    It's *just* as *annoying* as all his *bold* *words* exclamation point!

    --
    -bts
    -Could. Not. Resist.
     
    Beauregard T. Shagnasty, Nov 5, 2008
    #7
  8. chuckcar

    Guest

    chuckcar <> wrote:

    >>>Only way to find out is by trying them - and staying away from
    >>>"consumer" computers - you know the <$1000 name brand ones.


    >> That is very bad and wasteful advice.


    >Prove it.


    My Gateway 507GR. I purchased it because I didn't have an ATX power
    supply. It was cheaper to buy the computer ($800) than to build one
    because of it.

    That was 4 years ago last August, I have not had one problem with it
    (software excluded).

    I Keep building it up (9800 GT video card, 2gigs ram) as it was a
    basic computer and now I need a gaming computer. My next purchase is a
    dual core for the mother board.

    Ironic - I just purchased a 600 watt ATX power supply to power the
    video card :)

    Proof.

    --

    Miss
    http://apina.nwpshost.com/6109.gif
     
    , Nov 5, 2008
    #8
  9. chuckcar

    Evan Platt Guest

    On Tue, 4 Nov 2008 20:35:13 -0500, "Beauregard T. Shagnasty"
    <> wrote:

    >He's a Canadian full stop. That explains it, eh question mark?


    Oh comma yes comma it does partial stop.

    >It's *just* as *annoying* as all his *bold* *words* exclamation point!


    oh *yes*. But then again, chuckcar = annoying full stop.
    --
    To reply via e-mail, remove The Obvious from my e-mail address.
     
    Evan Platt, Nov 5, 2008
    #9
  10. chuckcar

    chuckcar Guest

    wrote in
    news::

    > chuckcar <> wrote:
    >
    >>>>Only way to find out is by trying them - and staying away from
    >>>>"consumer" computers - you know the <$1000 name brand ones.

    >
    >>> That is very bad and wasteful advice.

    >
    >>Prove it.

    >
    > My Gateway 507GR. I purchased it because I didn't have an ATX power
    > supply. It was cheaper to buy the computer ($800) than to build one
    > because of it.
    >
    > That was 4 years ago last August, I have not had one problem with it
    > (software excluded).
    >
    > I Keep building it up (9800 GT video card, 2gigs ram) as it was a
    > basic computer and now I need a gaming computer. My next purchase is a
    > dual core for the mother board.
    >
    > Ironic - I just purchased a 600 watt ATX power supply to power the
    > video card :)
    >

    So you replaced an underpowered power supply, RAM and the video card.
    Hardly the same computer then is it?

    --
    (setq (chuck nil) car(chuck) )
     
    chuckcar, Nov 5, 2008
    #10
  11. chuckcar

    Guest

    chuckcar <> wrote:

    > wrote in
    >news::
    >
    >> chuckcar <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>>>Only way to find out is by trying them - and staying away from
    >>>>>"consumer" computers - you know the <$1000 name brand ones.

    >>
    >>>> That is very bad and wasteful advice.

    >>
    >>>Prove it.

    >>
    >> My Gateway 507GR. I purchased it because I didn't have an ATX power
    >> supply. It was cheaper to buy the computer ($800) than to build one
    >> because of it.
    >>
    >> That was 4 years ago last August, I have not had one problem with it
    >> (software excluded).
    >>
    >> I Keep building it up (9800 GT video card, 2gigs ram) as it was a
    >> basic computer and now I need a gaming computer. My next purchase is a
    >> dual core for the mother board.
    >>
    >> Ironic - I just purchased a 600 watt ATX power supply to power the
    >> video card :)


    >>PROOF


    >So you replaced an underpowered power supply, RAM and the video card.


    I only started this upgrade last February, so it hasn't just run
    flawlessly for 3.5 years it's still upgradeable to the newest
    hardware.

    Underpowered Pwr supply because of the video card - most people have
    to purchase the bundle because of the video card. If you would of
    taken the time to research the card rather than prove yourself an ass
    again, you would understand.

    >Hardly the same computer then is it?


    Still can't read huh? No it's not the same computer I'm using it as a
    game machine now, I've disabled the onboard video and installed a
    video card. Still no problems.

    Freaking loser.
    --

    http://amanita-design.net/samorost-2/
     
    , Nov 5, 2008
    #11
  12. chuckcar

    chuckcar Guest

    wrote in
    news:p:

    > chuckcar <> wrote:
    >
    >> wrote in
    >>news::
    >>>So you replaced an underpowered power supply, RAM and the video card.

    >
    > I only started this upgrade last February, so it hasn't just run
    > flawlessly for 3.5 years it's still upgradeable to the newest
    > hardware.
    >
    > Underpowered Pwr supply because of the video card - most people have
    > to purchase the bundle because of the video card. If you would of
    > taken the time to research the card rather than prove yourself an ass
    > again, you would understand.
    >

    And if you'd ditch the attitude, people might actually deal with you as a
    human being. The point was about consumer desktops. You no longer *have*
    the same computer as it was sold. Hence:

    >>Hardly the same computer then is it?

    >
    > Still can't read huh? No it's not the same computer I'm using it as a
    > game machine now, I've disabled the onboard video and installed a
    > video card. Still no problems.
    >
    > Freaking loser.


    Not really, I won this argument bitch.


    --
    (setq (chuck nil) car(chuck) )
     
    chuckcar, Nov 6, 2008
    #12
  13. chuckcar

    Evan Platt Guest

    On Thu, 6 Nov 2008 00:06:01 +0000 (UTC), chuckcar <>
    wrote:

    >And if you'd ditch the attitude, people might actually deal with you as a
    >human being. The point was about consumer desktops. You no longer *have*
    >the same computer as it was sold. Hence:


    And if you'd admit when you're wrong and not back pedal when you say
    something stupid, people might have more respect for you.

    >Not really, I won this argument bitch.


    You won an argument bitch? What's that?

    Maybe you MEANT to say "I won this argument, bitch."

    The comma changes the entire meaning.
    --
    To reply via e-mail, remove The Obvious from my e-mail address.
     
    Evan Platt, Nov 6, 2008
    #13
  14. chuckcar

    Guest

    chuckcar <> wrote:

    >> Freaking loser.


    >Not really, I won this argument bitch.


    I proved " staying away from "consumer"
    computers - you know the <$1000 name brand ones. "

    Was wrong, and now your cussing cause you can't figure it out.

    Loser.
    --

    http://amanita-design.net/samorost-2/
     
    , Nov 6, 2008
    #14
  15. chuckcar

    chuckcar Guest

    wrote in
    news::

    > chuckcar <> wrote:
    >
    >>> Freaking loser.

    >
    >>Not really, I won this argument bitch.

    >
    > I proved " staying away from "consumer"
    > computers - you know the <$1000 name brand ones. "
    >
    > Was wrong, and now your cussing cause you can't figure it out.
    >

    You were the first person to start calling names. What does *that*
    say about you? Take the retail price of your video card when it came on
    the market, add that and the price of the power supply and the RAM to your
    "under $1000" computer.

    --
    (setq (chuck nil) car(chuck) )
     
    chuckcar, Nov 6, 2008
    #15
  16. chuckcar

    Guest

    chuckcar <> wrote:

    >Take the retail price of your video card when it came on
    >the market, add that and the price of the power supply and the RAM to your
    >"under $1000" computer.


    Your an idiot, I'm thru with this discussion.;
    --

    Saddest picture you'll see all day
    http://i35.tinypic.com/15s57c4.jpg
     
    , Nov 6, 2008
    #16
  17. On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 22:44:08 -0800, Pennywise aided th' terraists with the
    following claims :

    > chuckcar <> wrote:
    >
    >>Take the retail price of your video card when it came on
    >>the market, add that and the price of the power supply and the RAM to your
    >>"under $1000" computer.

    >
    > Your an idiot, I'm thru with this discussion.;


    Heh...you people actually *buy* computers?
    People just give em to me....usually goes something like this:" hey this
    computer seems to be running slow lately...should I buy another one?"

    Me: sure, why not?
    Them: you want the old one?

    Now I'm running out of space to store em...


    --
    "Those who can make you believe absurdities,
    can make you commit atrocities" - Voltaire
    http://i35.tinypic.com/2czc1ua.jpg
     
    §ñühwØ£f, Nov 6, 2008
    #17
  18. chuckcar

    Guest

    §ñühwØ£f <> wrote:

    >On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 22:44:08 -0800, Pennywise:


    >> chuckcar <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>Take the retail price of your video card when it came on
    >>>the market, add that and the price of the power supply and the RAM to your
    >>>"under $1000" computer.


    >> Your an idiot, I'm thru with this discussion.


    With Chucktart

    >Heh...you people actually *buy* computers?
    >People just give em to me....usually goes something like this:" hey this
    >computer seems to be running slow lately...should I buy another one?"
    >
    >Me: sure, why not?
    >Them: you want the old one?
    >
    >Now I'm running out of space to store em...


    I'm the same way, I could put together a few computer right now, but
    they would be 500Mhz or less.

    I have an abundance of computer parts, but all for the AT style
    (Mother boards and Power supplies).

    That's why I had to go out and purchase one (3Ghz HT), I have an extra
    ATX power supply now :) it's a start.


    --

    Saddest picture you'll see all day
    http://i35.tinypic.com/15s57c4.jpg
     
    , Nov 7, 2008
    #18
  19. On Thu, 06 Nov 2008 16:07:13 -0800, Pennywise aided th' terraists with the
    following claims :

    > §ñühwØ£f <> wrote:
    >
    >>On Wed, 05 Nov 2008 22:44:08 -0800, Pennywise:

    >
    >>> chuckcar <> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>Take the retail price of your video card when it came on
    >>>>the market, add that and the price of the power supply and the RAM to your
    >>>>"under $1000" computer.

    >
    >>> Your an idiot, I'm thru with this discussion.

    >
    > With Chucktart
    >
    >>Heh...you people actually *buy* computers?
    >>People just give em to me....usually goes something like this:" hey this
    >>computer seems to be running slow lately...should I buy another one?"
    >>
    >>Me: sure, why not?
    >>Them: you want the old one?
    >>
    >>Now I'm running out of space to store em...

    >
    > I'm the same way, I could put together a few computer right now, but
    > they would be 500Mhz or less.
    >

    Thats where the lightweight linux distros come in...

    > I have an abundance of computer parts, but all for the AT style
    > (Mother boards and Power supplies).
    >

    heh...needs a big case for that kit eh?

    > That's why I had to go out and purchase one (3Ghz HT), I have an extra
    > ATX power supply now :) it's a start.


    Just lower your standards :)
    I'm going to have to retire this 233mhz PII 64mb ram lappy soon as the
    ever-growing size of web pages is causeing some noticable slowness.
    I bet theres a nice PIII in a 2nd hand store waiting for me to rescue it ;)


    --
    "Those who can make you believe absurdities,
    can make you commit atrocities" - Voltaire
    http://i35.tinypic.com/2czc1ua.jpg
     
    §ñühwØ£f, Nov 7, 2008
    #19
  20. nospamatall wrote:

    ......
    > Yes, I have to say that long ago I used to have a software firewall, and
    > everyone was advising to go down the hardware route.
    >
    > This became academic anyway since the software firewall was in place back
    > when we just had the one PC connected to the internet, but once the
    > network developed we started connecting via a router/switch etc.
    >

    Well, standalone computers used or still use to connect via point-to-point
    connections (formerly modems and ppp, nowadays adsl and ppoe). At the
    interconnect point, most ISPs have some kind of firewall in place that at
    least blocks netbios chatter and some common server ports.

    > On a separate note - doesn't Windows XP/Vista have a built-in software
    > firewall anyway?
    >

    Yes, but it is basically a firewall for blocking incoming requests. Ok, they
    made it ask/bug for outgoing ports as well in the meantime.
    However ... have you seen the exception list (programs already allowed
    to "call home" and other more usefuls) accumulated after a standard user
    did some surfing/mailing/gaming?
    The main problem is still: the user gets admin permissions without having to
    show a windows driving license, or at least some common sense.
    Instead, following the standard scheme of "ok-clicking" leads to cozy and
    comfortable feelings, until it turns into "getting rid of hot potatoes by
    winning the fast-clicking-contest". But at this time, the
    famous "one-click-too-many" already made the hell break loose.

    More seriously ... having to read instructions (known as man-pages in the
    *nix world) leads to much better oversight and is less stressful than
    having to click through a chain of "click yes, don't read because it may
    timeout - and don't under any circumstances cl, a half days
    clickedy-session will be lost then and you have forgotten what to fill in
    the first time anyway" - buttons.
     
    wisdomkiller & pain, Nov 10, 2008
    #20
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