Re: What do I need for laserdisc to dvd transfers?

Discussion in 'DVD Video' started by FUGITIVE, Sep 30, 2003.

  1. FUGITIVE

    FUGITIVE Guest

    On Fri, 22 Aug 2003 00:48:03 +0000 (UTC),
    (Matt Ackeret) wrote:

    >In article <cWX0b.211573$>,
    >Edward Holub <@sw.rr.com> wrote:
    >>Hey folks,
    >> There's still a lot of programming on laserdisc that's not available on
    >>DVD and before the day comes when laserdisc players go the way of the
    >>dinosaur, I want them transferred to DVD.
    >> What sort of set-up would I need?

    >
    >There are standalone DVD recorders under $400 nowadays. (There's an
    >Apex one under $300, I think closer to $200, announced but I'm not sure
    >if it's out yet.)
    >
    >There are also standalone DVD recorders that have hard drives in them,
    >so you can record to the hard drive, edit the recordings, and burn to
    >DVD. The one I'm following most closely (Panasonic DMR-E80) is almost
    >at the $500 price point.



    And what about the Macrovision protection ?
    FUGITIVE, Sep 30, 2003
    #1
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  2. FUGITIVE

    Biz Guest

    "FUGITIVE" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Fri, 22 Aug 2003 00:48:03 +0000 (UTC),
    > (Matt Ackeret) wrote:
    >
    > >In article <cWX0b.211573$>,
    > >Edward Holub <@sw.rr.com> wrote:
    > >>Hey folks,
    > >> There's still a lot of programming on laserdisc that's not available

    on
    > >>DVD and before the day comes when laserdisc players go the way of the
    > >>dinosaur, I want them transferred to DVD.
    > >> What sort of set-up would I need?

    > >
    > >There are standalone DVD recorders under $400 nowadays. (There's an
    > >Apex one under $300, I think closer to $200, announced but I'm not sure
    > >if it's out yet.)
    > >
    > >There are also standalone DVD recorders that have hard drives in them,
    > >so you can record to the hard drive, edit the recordings, and burn to
    > >DVD. The one I'm following most closely (Panasonic DMR-E80) is almost
    > >at the $500 price point.

    >
    >
    > And what about the Macrovision protection ?


    Laserdiscs didnt have macrovision copy protection
    Biz, Sep 30, 2003
    #2
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  3. >
    > And what about the Macrovision protection ?


    There is no copy protection on laserdiscs, the format
    does not support it.


    Darrel :)
    Darrel Christenson, Sep 30, 2003
    #3
  4. FUGITIVE

    DarkMatter Guest

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2003 21:30:42 GMT, "Biz" <> Gave
    us:

    >
    >Laserdiscs didnt have macrovision copy protection
    >



    I was under the impression that some did, prior to "the end" of
    their public service career...
    DarkMatter, Oct 1, 2003
    #4
  5. FUGITIVE

    DarkMatter Guest

    On Tue, 30 Sep 2003 21:34:48 GMT, Darrel Christenson
    <> Gave us:

    >>
    >> And what about the Macrovision protection ?

    >
    >There is no copy protection on laserdiscs, the format
    >does not support it.


    Since it is analog, tell us how it wouldn't be supported. I think
    you wanted to say "It was never embraced by the studios for that
    format." As far as I know, the medium would carry it fine, were it
    ever implemented for it.
    DarkMatter, Oct 1, 2003
    #5
  6. On Tue, 30 Sep 2003 18:24:28 -0700, DarkMatter
    <> wrote:

    >On Tue, 30 Sep 2003 21:34:48 GMT, Darrel Christenson
    ><> Gave us:
    >
    >>>
    >>> And what about the Macrovision protection ?

    >>
    >>There is no copy protection on laserdiscs, the format
    >>does not support it.

    >
    > Since it is analog, tell us how it wouldn't be supported. I think
    >you wanted to say "It was never embraced by the studios for that
    >format." As far as I know, the medium would carry it fine, were it
    >ever implemented for it.


    The sync signals as recovered from the laserdisc are used to lock the
    rotation of the disc to the players NTSC or PAL reference. If the
    sync were distorted, as it is in Copyguard or Macrovision, the disc
    could not lock and the picture would be broken up. VHS does not have
    this requirement for off-tape sync since the servo reference comes
    from a separate control Track and a FG pulse created by the rotation
    of the video head. And that is why 3/4" and Betacam tapes can not
    have Macrovision, the off-tape sync is used as a head-switching point
    reference in all Betacam and most 3/4" machines. A few professional
    VHS decks also require off-tape sync, they exhibit breakup and jitter
    when playing Macrovisioned or copyguarded tapes.

    ALL professional analog video devices require clean sync form the
    storage media, Laserdisc is a professional format, as conceived. Note
    that DVD has the sync completely generated outside the media. The
    sync is created by the playback hardware, as is the Macrovision. A
    DVD can not "contain" macrovision, since it has no sync signals on the
    storage media.

    . Steve .
    Steve(JazzHunter), Oct 1, 2003
    #6
  7. Well at the risk of somebody sending a lot of abuse I will answer this as I
    do it myself.
    Firstly I have the Pinnacle DV500 with which I capture my laser discs to the
    hardrive in AVI format. I then use ULead Movie Factory to "render" the AVI
    to DVD and burn it.

    I do not say that this is the only way to do it but I find it near perfect.
    You do not have to worry about macrovision in this case as the laser disc
    does not seem to have it. You will have to do a careful bit of editing when
    you render it if the disc "turnover" is in the middle of a scene which it
    always seems to be. I fyou find that Movie Factory will not accept the
    entire movie within the parameters you want just press cancel once it is
    rendered and then use "Disc Copy" to make your dvd.

    Hope this helps
    DUNCAN MARK MILTON-HEAD, Oct 1, 2003
    #7
  8. FUGITIVE

    Zimmy Guest

    I think the tougher issue that most people want, is to get the AC3/DTS
    tracks from the LD and synch them when making the DVD.
    Getting the video is fairly easy but those digital tracks are a bit
    trickier.
    I always wanted to make a DVD of my Star Wars 5.1 LD Trilogy but I read it
    wasn't worth the time it would take.

    "DUNCAN MARK MILTON-HEAD" <> wrote in
    message news:bledn7$n3p$...
    > Well at the risk of somebody sending a lot of abuse I will answer this as

    I
    > do it myself.
    > Firstly I have the Pinnacle DV500 with which I capture my laser discs to

    the
    > hardrive in AVI format. I then use ULead Movie Factory to "render" the AVI
    > to DVD and burn it.
    >
    > I do not say that this is the only way to do it but I find it near

    perfect.
    > You do not have to worry about macrovision in this case as the laser disc
    > does not seem to have it. You will have to do a careful bit of editing

    when
    > you render it if the disc "turnover" is in the middle of a scene which it
    > always seems to be. I fyou find that Movie Factory will not accept the
    > entire movie within the parameters you want just press cancel once it is
    > rendered and then use "Disc Copy" to make your dvd.
    >
    > Hope this helps
    >
    >
    Zimmy, Oct 1, 2003
    #8
  9. FUGITIVE

    unclejr Guest

    "Zimmy" <> wrote...
    > I think the tougher issue that most people want, is to get the AC3/DTS
    > tracks from the LD and synch them when making the DVD.
    > Getting the video is fairly easy but those digital tracks are a bit
    > trickier.
    > I always wanted to make a DVD of my Star Wars 5.1 LD Trilogy but I read it
    > wasn't worth the time it would take.


    You will have to capture with the CMI 8738 sound card to get a bit for
    bit recording of AC-3 audio (from your RF demodulator) onto your
    computer in PCM (48 kHz 16-bit stereo) format. You will also have to
    get the correct driver for your OS:

    <http://www.cmedia.com.tw/download/OS_e-cmi8738_index.htm>

    Then you have to edit out all of the gaps from the sidebreaks, etc
    with something like Cool Edit. And then you have to transcode the
    edited PCM file with BeSplit to AC3.

    Then, you get to the hard part... you have to sync it to your captured
    video. Yes, a pain and very tedious, but very doable -- I've done it
    once and it worked out pretty well.

    -Junior
    unclejr, Oct 1, 2003
    #9
  10. FUGITIVE

    Zimmy Guest

    "unclejr" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > "Zimmy" <> wrote...
    > > I think the tougher issue that most people want, is to get the AC3/DTS
    > > tracks from the LD and synch them when making the DVD.
    > > Getting the video is fairly easy but those digital tracks are a bit
    > > trickier.
    > > I always wanted to make a DVD of my Star Wars 5.1 LD Trilogy but I read

    it
    > > wasn't worth the time it would take.

    >
    > You will have to capture with the CMI 8738 sound card to get a bit for
    > bit recording of AC-3 audio (from your RF demodulator) onto your
    > computer in PCM (48 kHz 16-bit stereo) format. You will also have to
    > get the correct driver for your OS:
    >
    > <http://www.cmedia.com.tw/download/OS_e-cmi8738_index.htm>
    >
    > Then you have to edit out all of the gaps from the sidebreaks, etc
    > with something like Cool Edit. And then you have to transcode the
    > edited PCM file with BeSplit to AC3.
    >
    > Then, you get to the hard part... you have to sync it to your captured
    > video. Yes, a pain and very tedious, but very doable -- I've done it
    > once and it worked out pretty well.
    >
    > -Junior


    That sounds like too much work. If you are upconverting the AC3 tracks to
    PCM, why not just capture the PCM audio directly?

    What I would want to do is keep the 5.1 tracks and port them over to DVD.
    Zimmy, Oct 6, 2003
    #10
  11. FUGITIVE

    unclejr Guest

    "Zimmy" <> wrote...
    > That sounds like too much work. If you are upconverting the AC3 tracks to
    > PCM, why not just capture the PCM audio directly?


    You are NOT upconverting AC3 to PCM. You are capturing the AC3
    bitstream as a PCM (wav) file (48 kHz, 16-bit, stereo). Most
    computers (that I'm aware of) don't capture straight to AC3 when fed
    the raw AC3 signal from your demodulator. At first glance, the PCM
    wav file that you capture will be wall-to-wall white noise. If you
    zoom in really close to the wav file with an audio editing program
    (like Cool Edit, for example), you will see that the "wall" of white
    noise is actually "packets/bursts" of white noise 32 ms apart
    separated by baseline silence. After you have captured this "wav" of
    AC3 white noise, you need to extract out the AC3 file from the PCM
    (wav) file with BeSplit, ver. 0.82 (look in www.doom9.org under "show
    all audio tools" to download Besplit 0.82). I don't know how BeSplit
    works, but from what I can tell it ignores all of the baseline
    silence, catenates the packets/bursts of white noise, and transcodes
    them into a normal DD 5.1 (AC3) file.

    > What I would want to do is keep the 5.1 tracks and port them over to DVD.


    Once you have your AC3 file from BeSplit, then your authoring program
    remuxes it to the MPEG-2 video file. The only tricky part, as I
    pointed out in my earlier post, was syncing the audio/video. That can
    only be accomplished through trial and error.

    HTH,

    -Junior
    unclejr, Oct 6, 2003
    #11
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