Re: Most common CPU type - Slot or Socket?

Discussion in 'A+ Certification' started by WinXP_Powered, Mar 25, 2006.

  1. As far as the test goes, be prepared to know what CPUs go with what
    sockets and slots. Memorizing this is really very important in the real
    world when your customer asks about upgrading an older PC (and isn't
    that all we should expect to see in for repairs, are older PCs?). Some
    CPUs will fit into sockets that they won't work in, but if you put them
    in the wrong socket you can fry that new expensive CPU.

    My personal opinion is that too much emphasis is placed on studying for
    a test, rather than studying to be the best techs we can possibly be.

    FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't it
    be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when they
    walk in your front door and start checking you out before having you
    build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)

    e.g. A customer walks in with an older PC, which has a Celeron 500Mhz
    CPU, and he wants to know about upgrading it to a Pentium 4 using the
    existing motherboard. Are you gonna ask him to wait while you go look it
    up in your books, or are you gonna fire off that it can be upgraded to a
    Pentium III, but not a Pentium 4?

    We joke about the tests in this newsgroup, but they have a lot of real
    world validity. (Dang, and we wished it was just a new high tech way of
    boosting our male egos even more than our wives and gf's already do. LOL)

    John

    -----------

    Paul wrote:
    > I am reading the TestTaker's Guide today and it said that the Slot type
    > was "the standard" today. This confused me. I have only built three
    > computers, but they have all been socket CPU's. Most currently an AMD64
    > 3500+ s939.
    >
    > Now this is for the Core test from 2003. IS the book wrong, or have I
    > for some reason never seen a Slot CPU?
     
    WinXP_Powered, Mar 25, 2006
    #1
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  2. WinXP_Powered

    SBFan2000 Guest


    > FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    > Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't it
    > be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when they
    > walk in your front door and start checking you out before having you
    > build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    > customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)


    I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was serviceing
    it for her for the last couple years but last year I told her that I would
    no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and then
    gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3 months
    ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all her
    old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she would
    have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that would run on
    XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!
     
    SBFan2000, Mar 25, 2006
    #2
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  3. WinXP_Powered

    J. Clarke Guest

    SBFan2000 wrote:

    >
    >> FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    >> Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't it
    >> be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when they
    >> walk in your front door and start checking you out before having you
    >> build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    >> customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)

    >
    > I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was
    > serviceing it for her for the last couple years but last year I told her
    > that I would
    > no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and
    > then
    > gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3 months
    > ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all her
    > old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    > family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she
    > would have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that would
    > run on
    > XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!


    What OS is she running? Most of her old stuff should run fine under her old
    operating system in a virtual machine under vmWare or Virtual PC. If you
    haven't used either of these you should check them out. Simple solution to
    the problem of legacy software.


    --
    --John
    to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
     
    J. Clarke, Mar 26, 2006
    #3
  4. WinXP_Powered

    SBFan2000 Guest

    believe shes running win95. I see alot of machines and they run together
    but I think shes still 95, I may have updated her to 98 at some point.
    Never heard of vmware or VirtualPC. These are programs that run other
    legacy programs under XP? Or are they OSes in their own right?


    "J. Clarke" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > SBFan2000 wrote:
    >
    > >
    > >> FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    > >> Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't it
    > >> be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when they
    > >> walk in your front door and start checking you out before having you
    > >> build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    > >> customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)

    > >
    > > I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was
    > > serviceing it for her for the last couple years but last year I told her
    > > that I would
    > > no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and
    > > then
    > > gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3

    months
    > > ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all

    her
    > > old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    > > family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she
    > > would have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that

    would
    > > run on
    > > XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!

    >
    > What OS is she running? Most of her old stuff should run fine under her

    old
    > operating system in a virtual machine under vmWare or Virtual PC. If you
    > haven't used either of these you should check them out. Simple solution

    to
    > the problem of legacy software.
    >
    >
    > --
    > --John
    > to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    > (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
     
    SBFan2000, Mar 26, 2006
    #4
  5. WinXP_Powered

    J. Clarke Guest

    SBFan2000 wrote:

    > believe shes running win95. I see alot of machines and they run together
    > but I think shes still 95, I may have updated her to 98 at some point.
    > Never heard of vmware or VirtualPC. These are programs that run other
    > legacy programs under XP? Or are they OSes in their own right?


    They let you run one OS as a guest under another. As an example, I have a
    laptop here on which I can have running at the same time XP, DOS, Windows
    98, Linux, OS/X, Novell, and Vista. With that many up it's pretty doggy
    mainly due to insufficient RAM, but with XP and 98 up it zips right along.

    Virtual PC is a Microsoft product, they're going to be bundling it with some
    versions of Vista. vmWare is third party, and arguably the more capable of
    the two. vmWare also has a version that can run as the native OS with all
    others as guests, but it's pretty pricey.

    <http://www.microsoft.com/windows/virtualpc/default.mspx>
    <http://www.vmware.com/>

    Both have free trials available for download.

    > "J. Clarke" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> SBFan2000 wrote:
    >>
    >> >
    >> >> FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    >> >> Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't
    >> >> it be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when
    >> >> they walk in your front door and start checking you out before having
    >> >> you build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    >> >> customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)
    >> >
    >> > I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was
    >> > serviceing it for her for the last couple years but last year I told
    >> > her that I would
    >> > no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and
    >> > then
    >> > gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3

    > months
    >> > ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all

    > her
    >> > old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    >> > family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she
    >> > would have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that

    > would
    >> > run on
    >> > XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!

    >>
    >> What OS is she running? Most of her old stuff should run fine under her

    > old
    >> operating system in a virtual machine under vmWare or Virtual PC. If you
    >> haven't used either of these you should check them out. Simple solution

    > to
    >> the problem of legacy software.
    >>
    >>
    >> --
    >> --John
    >> to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    >> (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)


    --
    --John
    to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
     
    J. Clarke, Mar 26, 2006
    #5
  6. WinXP_Powered

    SBFan2000 Guest

    done dual booting before, matter of fact the computer I'm on right now has
    it. What I've never done or tried (without 3rd party software) would be 98
    (fat32) and XP (ntfs) assume if you do it that way that you can see both
    volume under XP but when in 98 the XP volume won't be visible?

    Also, if she buys dell is there a way to make a second part. and install 98
    in it without losing all the software thats going to come preinstalled? Not
    that that would be a big loss since most of that preinstalled stuff does
    nothing but suck up resources.


    "Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Virtual PC virtualizes the entire PC; I/O ports, disk drives, etc., and
    > will run any OS (even non-MS, such as OS/2, Linux, etc.) under Windows.
    > But dual boot with "real" 95 or 98 is very easy to do, and Virtual PC
    > is somewhat expensive (about $100, I think), while dual-boot of
    > {DOS/95/98} and XP in two different partitions is "free" if you already
    > have the earlier OS.
    >
    >
    > SBFan2000 wrote:
    >
    > > believe shes running win95. I see alot of machines and they run

    together
    > > but I think shes still 95, I may have updated her to 98 at some point.
    > > Never heard of vmware or VirtualPC. These are programs that run other
    > > legacy programs under XP? Or are they OSes in their own right?
    > >
    > >
    > > "J. Clarke" <> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > >
    > >>SBFan2000 wrote:
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>>>FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    > >>>>Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't

    it
    > >>>>be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when they
    > >>>>walk in your front door and start checking you out before having you
    > >>>>build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    > >>>>customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)
    > >>>
    > >>>I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was
    > >>>serviceing it for her for the last couple years but last year I told

    her
    > >>>that I would
    > >>>no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and
    > >>>then
    > >>>gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3

    > >
    > > months
    > >
    > >>>ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all

    > >
    > > her
    > >
    > >>>old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    > >>>family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she
    > >>>would have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that

    > >
    > > would
    > >
    > >>>run on
    > >>>XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!
    > >>
    > >>What OS is she running? Most of her old stuff should run fine under her

    > >
    > > old
    > >
    > >>operating system in a virtual machine under vmWare or Virtual PC. If

    you
    > >>haven't used either of these you should check them out. Simple solution

    > >
    > > to
    > >
    > >>the problem of legacy software.
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>--
    > >>--John
    > >>to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    > >>(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

    > >
    > >
    > >
     
    SBFan2000, Mar 26, 2006
    #6
  7. WinXP_Powered

    J. Clarke Guest

    Barry Watzman wrote:

    > Virtual PC virtualizes the entire PC; I/O ports, disk drives, etc., and
    > will run any OS (even non-MS, such as OS/2, Linux, etc.) under Windows.
    > But dual boot with "real" 95 or 98 is very easy to do, and Virtual PC
    > is somewhat expensive (about $100, I think), while dual-boot of
    > {DOS/95/98} and XP in two different partitions is "free" if you already
    > have the earlier OS.


    Virtual PC is 100 bucks. Vmware server starting with the next release, now
    in beta, and vmware player are free. You can use server to set up the
    virtual machine and then run it with player.

    > SBFan2000 wrote:
    >
    >> believe shes running win95. I see alot of machines and they run together
    >> but I think shes still 95, I may have updated her to 98 at some point.
    >> Never heard of vmware or VirtualPC. These are programs that run other
    >> legacy programs under XP? Or are they OSes in their own right?
    >>
    >>
    >> "J. Clarke" <> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >>
    >>>SBFan2000 wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>>FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    >>>>>Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't it
    >>>>>be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when they
    >>>>>walk in your front door and start checking you out before having you
    >>>>>build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    >>>>>customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)
    >>>>
    >>>>I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was
    >>>>serviceing it for her for the last couple years but last year I told her
    >>>>that I would
    >>>>no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and
    >>>>then
    >>>>gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3

    >>
    >> months
    >>
    >>>>ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all

    >>
    >> her
    >>
    >>>>old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    >>>>family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she
    >>>>would have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that

    >>
    >> would
    >>
    >>>>run on
    >>>>XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!
    >>>
    >>>What OS is she running? Most of her old stuff should run fine under her

    >>
    >> old
    >>
    >>>operating system in a virtual machine under vmWare or Virtual PC. If you
    >>>haven't used either of these you should check them out. Simple solution

    >>
    >> to
    >>
    >>>the problem of legacy software.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>--
    >>>--John
    >>>to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    >>>(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

    >>
    >>
    >>


    --
    --John
    to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
     
    J. Clarke, Mar 26, 2006
    #7
  8. On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 19:04:53 GMT, "SBFan2000"
    <> wrote:

    >done dual booting before, matter of fact the computer I'm on right now has
    >it. What I've never done or tried (without 3rd party software) would be 98
    >(fat32) and XP (ntfs) assume if you do it that way that you can see both
    >volume under XP but when in 98 the XP volume won't be visible?


    There are utilities available (Sysinternals, Winternals) that allow
    read and write access of NTFS from FAT32...some people report
    reliability problems.

    Tom

    >
    >Also, if she buys dell is there a way to make a second part. and install 98
    >in it without losing all the software thats going to come preinstalled? Not
    >that that would be a big loss since most of that preinstalled stuff does
    >nothing but suck up resources.
    >
    >
    >"Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> Virtual PC virtualizes the entire PC; I/O ports, disk drives, etc., and
    >> will run any OS (even non-MS, such as OS/2, Linux, etc.) under Windows.
    >> But dual boot with "real" 95 or 98 is very easy to do, and Virtual PC
    >> is somewhat expensive (about $100, I think), while dual-boot of
    >> {DOS/95/98} and XP in two different partitions is "free" if you already
    >> have the earlier OS.
    >>
    >>
    >> SBFan2000 wrote:
    >>
    >> > believe shes running win95. I see alot of machines and they run

    >together
    >> > but I think shes still 95, I may have updated her to 98 at some point.
    >> > Never heard of vmware or VirtualPC. These are programs that run other
    >> > legacy programs under XP? Or are they OSes in their own right?
    >> >
    >> >
    >> > "J. Clarke" <> wrote in message
    >> > news:...
    >> >
    >> >>SBFan2000 wrote:
    >> >>
    >> >>
    >> >>>>FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    >> >>>>Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't

    >it
    >> >>>>be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when they
    >> >>>>walk in your front door and start checking you out before having you
    >> >>>>build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    >> >>>>customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)
    >> >>>
    >> >>>I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was
    >> >>>serviceing it for her for the last couple years but last year I told

    >her
    >> >>>that I would
    >> >>>no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and
    >> >>>then
    >> >>>gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3
    >> >
    >> > months
    >> >
    >> >>>ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all
    >> >
    >> > her
    >> >
    >> >>>old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    >> >>>family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she
    >> >>>would have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that
    >> >
    >> > would
    >> >
    >> >>>run on
    >> >>>XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!
    >> >>
    >> >>What OS is she running? Most of her old stuff should run fine under her
    >> >
    >> > old
    >> >
    >> >>operating system in a virtual machine under vmWare or Virtual PC. If

    >you
    >> >>haven't used either of these you should check them out. Simple solution
    >> >
    >> > to
    >> >
    >> >>the problem of legacy software.
    >> >>
    >> >>
    >> >>--
    >> >>--John
    >> >>to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    >> >>(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
    >> >
    >> >
    >> >

    >
     
    Tom MacIntyre, Mar 26, 2006
    #8
  9. WinXP_Powered

    J. Clarke Guest

    Barry Watzman wrote:

    > Well, first of all, I often install XP on FAT32 partitions, in fact I'd
    > say most of the time, dual boot or not. And always if I'm running dual
    > boot. When setting up Microsoft's dual boot, you install 98 first on C:
    > and XP 2nd on D:. In that configuration D: can be NTFS, but it doesn't
    > have to be. There is absolutely nothing wrong with installing XP on a
    > FAT32 partition.


    Except that you lose all semblance of file system security.

    > [Of course, 98 can only "see" FAT32 partitions.]
    >
    > On a new PC, you would have to strip everything out and start over,
    > because MS wants the older system installed first. However, some 3rd
    > party boot managers are much more flexible in this regard.
    >
    >
    >
    > SBFan2000 wrote:
    >
    >> done dual booting before, matter of fact the computer I'm on right now
    >> has
    >> it. What I've never done or tried (without 3rd party software) would be
    >> 98 (fat32) and XP (ntfs) assume if you do it that way that you can see
    >> both volume under XP but when in 98 the XP volume won't be visible?
    >>
    >> Also, if she buys dell is there a way to make a second part. and install
    >> 98
    >> in it without losing all the software thats going to come preinstalled?
    >> Not that that would be a big loss since most of that preinstalled stuff
    >> does nothing but suck up resources.
    >>
    >>
    >> "Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >>
    >>>Virtual PC virtualizes the entire PC; I/O ports, disk drives, etc., and
    >>>will run any OS (even non-MS, such as OS/2, Linux, etc.) under Windows.
    >>> But dual boot with "real" 95 or 98 is very easy to do, and Virtual PC
    >>>is somewhat expensive (about $100, I think), while dual-boot of
    >>>{DOS/95/98} and XP in two different partitions is "free" if you already
    >>>have the earlier OS.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>SBFan2000 wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>believe shes running win95. I see alot of machines and they run

    >>
    >> together
    >>
    >>>>but I think shes still 95, I may have updated her to 98 at some point.
    >>>>Never heard of vmware or VirtualPC. These are programs that run other
    >>>>legacy programs under XP? Or are they OSes in their own right?
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>"J. Clarke" <> wrote in message
    >>>>news:...
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>SBFan2000 wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>>>FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    >>>>>>>Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't

    >>
    >> it
    >>
    >>>>>>>be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when they
    >>>>>>>walk in your front door and start checking you out before having you
    >>>>>>>build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    >>>>>>>customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was
    >>>>>>serviceing it for her for the last couple years but last year I told

    >>
    >> her
    >>
    >>>>>>that I would
    >>>>>>no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and
    >>>>>>then
    >>>>>>gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3
    >>>>
    >>>>months
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>>ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all
    >>>>
    >>>>her
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>>old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    >>>>>>family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she
    >>>>>>would have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that
    >>>>
    >>>>would
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>>run on
    >>>>>>XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!
    >>>>>
    >>>>>What OS is she running? Most of her old stuff should run fine under
    >>>>>her
    >>>>
    >>>>old
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>operating system in a virtual machine under vmWare or Virtual PC. If

    >>
    >> you
    >>
    >>>>>haven't used either of these you should check them out. Simple
    >>>>>solution
    >>>>
    >>>>to
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>the problem of legacy software.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>--
    >>>>>--John
    >>>>>to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    >>>>>(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>

    >>
    >>


    --
    --John
    to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
     
    J. Clarke, Mar 27, 2006
    #9
  10. WinXP_Powered

    Paul Guest

    Barry Watzman wrote:
    > Which, for private residential users, is of absolutely zero consequence.
    > In fact, I'd go so far as to say that in a single-user home residential
    > situation, NTFS' security (which by the way you don't have even in XP
    > Home edition) is actually undesireable.


    Maybe not in this persons situation, there is also the partition and
    file size limits that FAT32 has. I believe that FAT32 only allows file
    sizes up to 2GB and partitions around 32GB.

    >
    >
    > J. Clarke wrote:
    >
    >> Barry Watzman wrote:
    >>
    >>> There is absolutely nothing wrong with installing XP on a
    >>> FAT32 partition.

    >>
    >>
    >> Except that you lose all semblance of file system security.
    >>
     
    Paul, Mar 27, 2006
    #10
  11. WinXP_Powered

    J. Clarke Guest

    Barry Watzman wrote:

    > Which, for private residential users, is of absolutely zero consequence.
    > In fact, I'd go so far as to say that in a single-user home
    > residential situation, NTFS' security (which by the way you don't have
    > even in XP Home edition) is actually undesireable.


    XP Home shouldn't exist IMO. I don't know what Microsoft was thinking. I
    don't find NTFS security to be undesirable in a "single user home
    residential situation". Most of the malware problems that people encounter
    with Windows can be avoided by running on a nonprivileged user account when
    not installing applications or performing system management.

    Nobody in his right mind runs as root all the time.

    > J. Clarke wrote:
    >
    >> Barry Watzman wrote:
    >>
    >>>There is absolutely nothing wrong with installing XP on a
    >>>FAT32 partition.

    >>
    >>
    >> Except that you lose all semblance of file system security.
    >>


    --
    --John
    to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
     
    J. Clarke, Mar 27, 2006
    #11
  12. WinXP_Powered

    J. Clarke Guest

    Paul wrote:

    > Barry Watzman wrote:
    >> Which, for private residential users, is of absolutely zero consequence.
    >> In fact, I'd go so far as to say that in a single-user home residential
    >> situation, NTFS' security (which by the way you don't have even in XP
    >> Home edition) is actually undesireable.

    >
    > Maybe not in this persons situation, there is also the partition and
    > file size limits that FAT32 has. I believe that FAT32 only allows file
    > sizes up to 2GB and partitions around 32GB.


    The file size limit is 4 GB but some applications limit the file size to 2.
    I don't recall the partition size limit offhand but it is quite large,
    hundreds of gig if not in the terabyte range. The 32GB limit is an
    artificial one imposed by the XP formatter.

    Personally the only FAT32 partitions on any of my systems these days are
    inside virtual machines.

    >> J. Clarke wrote:
    >>
    >>> Barry Watzman wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> There is absolutely nothing wrong with installing XP on a
    >>>> FAT32 partition.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> Except that you lose all semblance of file system security.
    >>>


    --
    --John
    to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
     
    J. Clarke, Mar 27, 2006
    #12
  13. WinXP_Powered

    J. Clarke Guest

    Barry Watzman wrote:

    > There is absolutely nothing wrong with XP home for most home users who
    > have no need for domain networking, security or remote control.


    If they don't have an internet connection and don't have kids in school then
    it should be fine. If they have an internet connection or have kids in the
    virus distribution centers that the government mistakes for schools then
    they most assuredly _do_ need security.

    You're surprising me. I thought you had enough experience to know why
    security is desirable even in single-user home machines.

    > J. Clarke wrote:
    >
    >> Barry Watzman wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >> XP Home shouldn't exist IMO. I don't know what Microsoft was thinking.
    >> I don't find NTFS security to be undesirable in a "single user home
    >> residential situation". Most of the malware problems that people
    >> encounter with Windows can be avoided by running on a nonprivileged user
    >> account when not installing applications or performing system management.
    >>
    >> Nobody in his right mind runs as root all the time.
    >>
    >>
    >>>J. Clarke wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>Barry Watzman wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>There is absolutely nothing wrong with installing XP on a
    >>>>>FAT32 partition.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>Except that you lose all semblance of file system security.
    >>>>

    >>
    >>


    --
    --John
    to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
     
    J. Clarke, Mar 28, 2006
    #13
  14. WinXP_Powered

    Paul Guest

    J. Clarke wrote:
    > The file size limit is 4 GB but some applications limit the file size to 2.
    > I don't recall the partition size limit offhand but it is quite large,
    > hundreds of gig if not in the terabyte range. The 32GB limit is an
    > artificial one imposed by the XP formatter.
    >

    Now see? I didn't know that about the XP formatter. Thats a prime
    example of why hanging out in these newsrooms are beneficial. I actually
    should have know about the 4GB file size. As soon as I read your line
    saying that, it hit me I was thinking of application specific file size
    limits. Outlook PST files being an example of that.

    Thanks for the info.
     
    Paul, Mar 28, 2006
    #14
  15. WinXP_Powered

    MF Guest

    Barry,

    VPC is not so comfortable with non MSFT OS,s. And it's slow.

    Mike

    "Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Virtual PC virtualizes the entire PC; I/O ports, disk drives, etc., and
    > will run any OS (even non-MS, such as OS/2, Linux, etc.) under Windows.
    > But dual boot with "real" 95 or 98 is very easy to do, and Virtual PC is
    > somewhat expensive (about $100, I think), while dual-boot of {DOS/95/98}
    > and XP in two different partitions is "free" if you already have the
    > earlier OS.
    >
    >
    > SBFan2000 wrote:
    >
    >> believe shes running win95. I see alot of machines and they run together
    >> but I think shes still 95, I may have updated her to 98 at some point.
    >> Never heard of vmware or VirtualPC. These are programs that run other
    >> legacy programs under XP? Or are they OSes in their own right?
    >>
    >>
    >> "J. Clarke" <> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >>
    >>>SBFan2000 wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>>FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    >>>>>Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't it
    >>>>>be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when they
    >>>>>walk in your front door and start checking you out before having you
    >>>>>build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    >>>>>customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)
    >>>>
    >>>>I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was
    >>>>serviceing it for her for the last couple years but last year I told her
    >>>>that I would
    >>>>no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and
    >>>>then
    >>>>gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3

    >>
    >> months
    >>
    >>>>ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all

    >>
    >> her
    >>
    >>>>old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    >>>>family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she
    >>>>would have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that

    >>
    >> would
    >>
    >>>>run on
    >>>>XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!
    >>>
    >>>What OS is she running? Most of her old stuff should run fine under her

    >>
    >> old
    >>
    >>>operating system in a virtual machine under vmWare or Virtual PC. If you
    >>>haven't used either of these you should check them out. Simple solution

    >>
    >> to
    >>
    >>>the problem of legacy software.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>--
    >>>--John
    >>>to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    >>>(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

    >>
    >>
     
    MF, Mar 30, 2006
    #15
  16. WinXP_Powered

    MF Guest

    Is anynone actually suggesting that a user with a 100 megahertz computer run
    either XP or VPC?

    Not impossible, but it would be like me buying a million dollar house. Pain
    pain then catastrophic failure. What have I missed?



    "Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Wrong answer.
    >
    > Setup the new computer dual boot with both Windows 98 and Windows XP in
    > two separate partitions. Then she can run her old stuff under Windows 98
    > (or even "real" DOS, via 98's boot menu) if necessary. But most of the
    > old stuff WILL run under XP.
    >
    > Another option is Virtual PC under XP, running any OS (DOS, 95, 98, ME,
    > etc.)
    >
    >
    > SBFan2000 wrote:
    >
    >>>FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    >>>Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't it
    >>>be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when they
    >>>walk in your front door and start checking you out before having you
    >>>build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    >>>customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)

    >>
    >>
    >> I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was
    >> serviceing
    >> it for her for the last couple years but last year I told her that I
    >> would
    >> no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and
    >> then
    >> gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3
    >> months
    >> ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all
    >> her
    >> old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    >> family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she
    >> would
    >> have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that would run
    >> on
    >> XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!
    >>
     
    MF, Mar 30, 2006
    #16
  17. WinXP_Powered

    SBFan2000 Guest

    I've been responding with the idea that she would buy new and then we would
    dual boot that machine. I think thats what everyone else has had in mind.
    I certainly hope no one meant to suggest I dual boot XP and 98 on a 100Mhz
    machine.


    "MF" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Is anynone actually suggesting that a user with a 100 megahertz computer

    run
    > either XP or VPC?
    >
    > Not impossible, but it would be like me buying a million dollar house.

    Pain
    > pain then catastrophic failure. What have I missed?
    >
    >
    >
    > "Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Wrong answer.
    > >
    > > Setup the new computer dual boot with both Windows 98 and Windows XP in
    > > two separate partitions. Then she can run her old stuff under Windows

    98
    > > (or even "real" DOS, via 98's boot menu) if necessary. But most of the
    > > old stuff WILL run under XP.
    > >
    > > Another option is Virtual PC under XP, running any OS (DOS, 95, 98, ME,
    > > etc.)
    > >
    > >
    > > SBFan2000 wrote:
    > >
    > >>>FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    > >>>Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't it
    > >>>be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when they
    > >>>walk in your front door and start checking you out before having you
    > >>>build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    > >>>customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)
    > >>
    > >>
    > >> I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was
    > >> serviceing
    > >> it for her for the last couple years but last year I told her that I
    > >> would
    > >> no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and
    > >> then
    > >> gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3
    > >> months
    > >> ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all
    > >> her
    > >> old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    > >> family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she
    > >> would
    > >> have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that would

    run
    > >> on
    > >> XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!
    > >>

    >
     
    SBFan2000, Mar 30, 2006
    #17
  18. WinXP_Powered

    Butterfield Guest

    On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 19:04:53 GMT, "SBFan2000"
    <> wrote:

    >Also, if she buys dell is there a way to make a second part. and install 98
    >in it without losing all the software thats going to come preinstalled? Not
    >that that would be a big loss since most of that preinstalled stuff does
    >nothing but suck up resources.


    Get a new PC and a KVM switch. Run both PCs into a router. If you
    can't get the legacy stuff to run on XP then she can still use the old
    machine at will by flipping the switch. This will save you hours of
    grief and can be all done for under $800 (in parts). Heck! She can
    even run them both simultaneously. A real Data Center!

    Butterfield
     
    Butterfield, Mar 30, 2006
    #18
  19. WinXP_Powered

    J. Clarke Guest

    MF wrote:

    > Barry,
    >
    > VPC is not so comfortable with non MSFT OS,s. And it's slow.


    It works fine with every non Microsoft OS I've thrown at it. They aren't
    "supported" in the sense that Microsoft will hold your hand if you come to
    grief, but that doesn't mean that they won't work.

    As for it being slow, yes, compared to running natively on a 3 GHz machine
    it's slow. Running VPC on that same 3 GHz machine though will give
    performance considerably better than the P100 that she's used to.

    > Mike
    >
    > "Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> Virtual PC virtualizes the entire PC; I/O ports, disk drives, etc., and
    >> will run any OS (even non-MS, such as OS/2, Linux, etc.) under Windows.
    >> But dual boot with "real" 95 or 98 is very easy to do, and Virtual PC is
    >> somewhat expensive (about $100, I think), while dual-boot of {DOS/95/98}
    >> and XP in two different partitions is "free" if you already have the
    >> earlier OS.
    >>
    >>
    >> SBFan2000 wrote:
    >>
    >>> believe shes running win95. I see alot of machines and they run
    >>> together but I think shes still 95, I may have updated her to 98 at some
    >>> point.
    >>> Never heard of vmware or VirtualPC. These are programs that run other
    >>> legacy programs under XP? Or are they OSes in their own right?
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> "J. Clarke" <> wrote in message
    >>> news:...
    >>>
    >>>>SBFan2000 wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>>FYI, Pentium IIs came on cards that used those slots you read about.
    >>>>>>Hopefully, you won't have to work on anything that old, but wouldn't
    >>>>>>it be nice to know more than the savvy gamer/overclocker-type when
    >>>>>>they walk in your front door and start checking you out before having
    >>>>>>you build their next extreme PC gaming machine? (Especially, if other
    >>>>>>customers are around listening in to the entire conversation.)
    >>>>>
    >>>>>I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was
    >>>>>serviceing it for her for the last couple years but last year I told
    >>>>>her that I would
    >>>>>no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and
    >>>>>then
    >>>>>gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3
    >>>
    >>> months
    >>>
    >>>>>ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all
    >>>
    >>> her
    >>>
    >>>>>old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    >>>>>family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she
    >>>>>would have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that
    >>>
    >>> would
    >>>
    >>>>>run on
    >>>>>XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!
    >>>>
    >>>>What OS is she running? Most of her old stuff should run fine under her
    >>>
    >>> old
    >>>
    >>>>operating system in a virtual machine under vmWare or Virtual PC. If
    >>>>you
    >>>>haven't used either of these you should check them out. Simple solution
    >>>
    >>> to
    >>>
    >>>>the problem of legacy software.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>--
    >>>>--John
    >>>>to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    >>>>(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
    >>>
    >>>


    --
    --John
    to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
     
    J. Clarke, Mar 30, 2006
    #19
  20. LOL

    I would have told her, "The good news is... now you can get an office
    suite to use at home for FREE... and it's Microsoft Office compatible."

    But I know what you mean. I went through something similar with a
    relative. She went to a discount bookstore and bought an older version
    of the Scrabble game. As Murphy would have it, the darn thing refused to
    run on her new PC. Having last year's version and knowing it runs just
    fine, I recommended she spend the $19.95 on the new version. But she
    still insists on trying to get her $5 "special" working. LOL

    So now she's on her own.

    John

    SBFan2000 wrote:
    >
    > I have an aunt that refuses to upgrade her pentium 100Mhz. I was serviceing
    > it for her for the last couple years but last year I told her that I would
    > no longer work on it. She keeps buying stuff, like a new scanner, and then
    > gets upset her computer can't handle it. She just e-mailed about 3 months
    > ago and says shes ready to update as long as the new computer runs all her
    > old programs. Of course I told her that the old programs (library and
    > family tree programs) likely wouldn't run on the new one and that she would
    > have to check to see if her programs had updated versions that would run on
    > XP. She hasn't e-mailed since!
    >
    >
     
    WinXP_Powered, Apr 1, 2006
    #20
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