RE:MCSE Exam Simulations

Discussion in 'MCSE' started by wgates@dell.com, Nov 18, 2005.

  1. Guest

    Been looking lately at some products like Testking, Actualtests,
    Certificationking and found so many questions duplicated by each
    company. Obviously its pointless buying the same exam sets eg 70 270
    from all three.
    Do they get their questions from MS?
    Do MS sell their past questions to Joe Public?
    How often is a set of questions at a given test centre "recycled"?
    Surely not all the questions over several years can be unique?
    Most important of course can anyone recommend the most cost effective
    way to get sample exams with explanations for the answers?
    Many thanks,
    WG
     
    , Nov 18, 2005
    #1
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  2. CBIC Guest

    wrote:
    > Been looking lately at some products like Testking, Actualtests,
    > Certificationking and found so many questions duplicated by each
    > company. Obviously its pointless buying the same exam sets eg 70 270
    > from all three.
    > Do they get their questions from MS?
    > Do MS sell their past questions to Joe Public?
    > How often is a set of questions at a given test centre "recycled"?
    > Surely not all the questions over several years can be unique?
    > Most important of course can anyone recommend the most cost effective
    > way to get sample exams with explanations for the answers?
    > Many thanks,
    > WG


    I'm sorry but you're only allowed a maximum of three questions per post.
    Stay away from dumps like tk and the other crap. It's cheating plain and
    simple.


    --
    aka
    Doom MCNGP #38
    Is that a burdizzo in your pocket or are you just glad to see me.
     
    CBIC, Nov 18, 2005
    #2
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  3. Frisbee® Guest

    <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Been looking lately at some products like Testking, Actualtests,
    > Certificationking and found so many questions duplicated by each
    > company. Obviously its pointless buying the same exam sets eg 70 270
    > from all three.
    > Do they get their questions from MS?


    It's turtles all the way down.

    > Do MS sell their past questions to Joe Public?



    It's turtles all the way down.

    > How often is a set of questions at a given test centre "recycled"?



    It's turtles all the way down.

    > Surely not all the questions over several years can be unique?



    It's turtles all the way down.

    > Most important of course can anyone recommend the most cost effective
    > way to get sample exams with explanations for the answers?



    It's turtles all the way down.

    > Many thanks,


    Many turtles all the way down.

    > WG


    I'm a turtle. Are you a turtle?
     
    Frisbee®, Nov 18, 2005
    #3
  4. Briscobar Guest

    <> rambled:
    >
    > Been looking lately at some products like Testking, Actualtests,
    > Certificationking and found so many questions duplicated by each
    > company. Obviously its pointless buying the same exam sets eg 70 270
    > from all three.
    > Do they get their questions from MS?
    > Do MS sell their past questions to Joe Public?
    > How often is a set of questions at a given test centre "recycled"?
    > Surely not all the questions over several years can be unique?
    > Most important of course can anyone recommend the most cost effective
    > way to get sample exams with explanations for the answers?
    > Many thanks,
    > WG


    Alright, I'm not going to flame you, as I am wont to do. Because it seems
    you're asking a genuine question, not knowing the answer, as opposed to
    trying to sway us into believing that TestKings are good. Here's the skinny:

    TestKing, Actualtest, and any derivitave thereof ARE actual exam questions.
    And they DO come from Microsoft - but not legally. What happens is these
    idiots pay people to take the tests and write down the questions, word for
    word, and what they think is the answer. Then they publish these, trying to
    prey on peoples' greed. There is no simpler way to say it: This is cheating.
    This is not condoned by Microsoft, nor any well-intentioned MCP or
    MCP-to-be. They are nothing more than the lazy way out. They attempt to
    allow you to skirt actual testing, studying, and more testing. And they
    probably do a fine job. However, once you get out in the real world, you
    won't know how anything works, just that it does. Fat, dumb, and stupid is
    no way to go through life.

    So, any website offering you a 100% passing guarantee or real exam questions
    should be avoided. Tools such as MeasureUp and Transcenders, along with
    Sybex and MSPress books seem to all get good reviews, and are not cheating.

    Good luck.

    --
    KB

    MCNGP #26
    www.mcngp.com's milkshake is better than yours.
     
    Briscobar, Nov 18, 2005
    #4
  5. kpg Guest

    Briscobar <> said something like

    > # Name resolution details: file://c:\temp\178233.htm (11/18/2005
    > 3:55:58 PM) # <> rambled:
    >>
    >> Been looking lately at some products like Testking, Actualtests,
    >> Certificationking and found so many questions duplicated by each
    >> company. Obviously its pointless buying the same exam sets eg 70 270
    >> from all three.
    >> Do they get their questions from MS?
    >> Do MS sell their past questions to Joe Public?
    >> How often is a set of questions at a given test centre "recycled"?
    >> Surely not all the questions over several years can be unique?
    >> Most important of course can anyone recommend the most cost effective
    >> way to get sample exams with explanations for the answers?
    >> Many thanks,
    >> WG

    >
    > Alright, I'm not going to flame you, as I am wont to do. Because it
    > seems you're asking a genuine question, not knowing the answer, as
    > opposed to trying to sway us into believing that TestKings are good.
    > Here's the skinny:
    >
    > TestKing, Actualtest, and any derivitave thereof ARE actual exam
    > questions. And they DO come from Microsoft - but not legally. What
    > happens is these idiots pay people to take the tests and write down
    > the questions, word for word, and what they think is the answer. Then
    > they publish these, trying to prey on peoples' greed. There is no
    > simpler way to say it: This is cheating. This is not condoned by
    > Microsoft, nor any well-intentioned MCP or MCP-to-be. They are nothing
    > more than the lazy way out. They attempt to allow you to skirt actual
    > testing, studying, and more testing. And they probably do a fine job.
    > However, once you get out in the real world, you won't know how
    > anything works, just that it does. Fat, dumb, and stupid is no way to
    > go through life.
    >
    > So, any website offering you a 100% passing guarantee or real exam
    > questions should be avoided. Tools such as MeasureUp and Transcenders,
    > along with Sybex and MSPress books seem to all get good reviews, and
    > are not cheating.
    >



    Mr. Briscobar, that is a lucid, intelligent, well thought-out
    explanation.


    Overruled!


    It's turtles all the way down.
     
    kpg, Nov 18, 2005
    #5
  6. MitchS Guest

    Would this be a good target for some certain someone?

    --
    Mitch "yer such a Jameshole" S.
    MCNGP XLVIII (Now do the other certs REALLY matter?)
    "Place your bet - Ah say - place your bets, gentlemen.
    Winnner plays, loser stays. Everyone's a winne - well, not everyone." - F.
    Leghorn
    <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Been looking lately at some products like Testking, Actualtests,
    > Certificationking and found so many questions duplicated by each
    > company. Obviously its pointless buying the same exam sets eg 70 270
    > from all three.
    > Do they get their questions from MS?
    > Do MS sell their past questions to Joe Public?
    > How often is a set of questions at a given test centre "recycled"?
    > Surely not all the questions over several years can be unique?
    > Most important of course can anyone recommend the most cost effective
    > way to get sample exams with explanations for the answers?
    > Many thanks,
    > WG
     
    MitchS, Nov 18, 2005
    #6
  7. Briscobar Guest

    kpg <ipost@thereforeiam> rambled:
    >
    > Mr. Briscobar, that is a lucid, intelligent, well thought-out
    > explanation.
    >
    >
    > Overruled!
    >
    >
    > It's turtles all the way down.


    Shucks.


    Oh well, Turtles it is!


    --
    KB

    MCNGP #26
    Ben Smith for President!
     
    Briscobar, Nov 18, 2005
    #7
  8. kpg Guest

    MitchS <> said something like

    > Would this be a good target for some certain someone?



    The OP seems innocent, or ignorant, or both.
     
    kpg, Nov 18, 2005
    #8
  9. TechGeekPro Guest

    On Nov 18, 2005 at 4:29pm "" blathered:

    > <snipped>


    That has got to be the worst troll I've ever seen.

    --
    TGP MCNGP #100100
    http://www.techgeekpro.com
    Mr. Osborne, may I be excused? My brain is full.
     
    TechGeekPro, Nov 18, 2005
    #9
  10. TechGeekPro Guest

    On Nov 18, 2005 at 4:35pm "Frisbee®" blathered:

    > It's turtles all the way down.


    Yes, the old lady was right.

    --
    TGP MCNGP #100100
    http://www.techgeekpro.com
    New systems generate new problems.
     
    TechGeekPro, Nov 18, 2005
    #10
  11. TechGeekPro Guest

    On Nov 18, 2005 at 4:57pm "kpg" blathered:

    > that is a lucid, intelligent, well thought-out explanation.


    He must've accidentally posted to the wrong newsgroup.

    --
    TGP MCNGP #100100
    http://www.techgeekpro.com
    Our Lady of Blessed Acceleration, don't fail us now.
     
    TechGeekPro, Nov 18, 2005
    #11
  12. Briscobar Guest

    MitchS <> rambled:
    >
    > Would this be a good target for some certain someone?


    Usually yeah, but I'm getting this innocent vibe from the OP. I think it may
    be better for a "certain someone" to wait for the next definite dumper. It
    shouldn't be too long now.

    --
    KB

    MCNGP #26
    www.mcngp.com will kill you! No, not! Only kidding!
     
    Briscobar, Nov 18, 2005
    #12
  13. LRM Guest

    <> asked in message
    news:...
    > Been looking lately at some products like Testking, Actualtests,
    > Certificationking

    As all were saying T3stking and all those types are for A$$FUSKRS

    LRM
     
    LRM, Nov 18, 2005
    #13
  14. Guest

    Re: MCSE Exam Simulations

    >Alright, I'm not going to flame you, as I am wont to do. Because it seems
    >you're asking a genuine question, not knowing the answer, as opposed to
    >trying to sway us into believing that TestKings are good. Here's the skinny:
    >
    >TestKing, Actualtest, and any derivitave thereof ARE actual exam questions.
    >And they DO come from Microsoft - but not legally. What happens is these
    >idiots pay people to take the tests and write down the questions, word for
    >word, and what they think is the answer. Then they publish these, trying to
    >prey on peoples' greed. There is no simpler way to say it: This is cheating.


    Many thanks for the lucid intelligent reply. I am not trying to cheat
    and have no need to. When I attained a BSc from London University
    years ago that "revered institution" sold their own exam papers from
    previous years and probably still does. Does this not happen
    Stateside? That is all I am asking for - how can reading past papers
    be cheating? I have it on good advice that half the struggle with MS
    exams is grappling with the devious way in which the questions are
    composed, not the material itself.
    And yes I have read study guides, user manuals and gained years of
    experience in IT. This is not the first time I have come across
    posters who make rash and rapid assumptions about people - did I say
    Testking were any good?
    That's three questions in this post BTW but I don't think its me
    that's wasting space here
    OK fourth one - if these cowboys are selling answers written down by
    paid "sitters" is that why so many of the answers in their prodcuts
    are crap or at best highly debatable?!
    Thus he spake: " who climbs a hill without first knowing how steep is
    the hill?". Does a rhetorical question count? I'm losing count here.
    (Answer: A Turtle)

    Honest Joe
     
    , Nov 19, 2005
    #14
  15. LRM Guest

    Re: MCSE Exam Simulations

    <> wrote in message
    news:...

    > Many thanks for the lucid intelligent reply. I am not trying to cheat
    > and have no need to.


    Good, but it seems that that is not always the case.

    >When I attained a BSc from London University
    > years ago that "revered institution" sold their own exam papers from
    > previous years and probably still does. Does this not happen
    > Stateside?


    Probably, but I never have paid for them.

    >That is all I am asking for - how can reading past papers
    > be cheating?


    It wouldn't be if Microsoft were the one's offering them up and they were
    questions that weren't going to be asked again. But that is not the case.

    >I have it on good advice that half the struggle with MS
    > exams is grappling with the devious way in which the questions are
    > composed, not the material itself.


    Not true, the questions as far as I have experienced aren't really devious
    at all. Sometimes they are very complex and you have to know the subject
    extremely well to answer them appropriately. That would be the point of the
    test, to measure knowledge of the product.

    > And yes I have read study guides, user manuals and gained years of
    > experience in IT. This is not the first time I have come across
    > posters who make rash and rapid assumptions about people - did I say
    > Testking were any good?


    No, you didn't. But, A$$FUSKRS don't usually make a point about which is
    good and which is bad. They are just interested in passing the tests in the
    easiest way possible. You do not seem to be one of them. I am sorry I didn't
    notice that first. I'm kinda knew here.

    > That's three questions in this post BTW but I don't think its me
    > that's wasting space here


    Now what does that mean exactly?

    > OK fourth one - if these cowboys are selling answers written down by
    > paid "sitters" is that why so many of the answers in their prodcuts
    > are crap or at best highly debatable?!


    Yes, that's why, and I have forgotten, did someone earlier say that or is
    this something you have noticed by acquiring these products?

    Oh, the most cost effective way to prepare yourself is really to build a
    network as cheaply as possible and use material from your local library and
    the mountain of documentation that comes with the the product in the help
    and support center. Classes are good if you don't know a certain aspect of
    the product. My downfall is still RRAS. I purchased a fifty dollar book that
    I could use at work and to help study and build the test environment as
    though I didn't have anything but windows machines and layer 2 switches.
    Seems weird, but it is Microsoft's product and their test I'm taking so,
    that's why I'm doing it.

    > Does a rhetorical question count? I'm losing count here.


    Ask all the questions you want, but, you may not always like the answers.

    > (Answer: A Turtle)

    I think the answer here is:
    it's turles all the way down.

    LRM
    When they have taken everything all you have left is your honor
     
    LRM, Nov 19, 2005
    #15
  16. Kline Sphere Guest

    Re: MCSE Exam Simulations

    >Many thanks for the lucid intelligent reply. I am not trying to cheat
    >and have no need to. When I attained a BSc from London University
    >years ago that "revered institution" sold their own exam papers from
    >previous years and probably still does. Does this not happen
    >Stateside? That is all I am asking for - how can reading past papers
    >be cheating?
    >I have it on good advice that half the struggle with MS
    >exams is grappling with the devious way in which the questions are
    >composed, not the material itself.


    First of all the format of these ms exams cannot be compared to what
    you have to achieve in order to become a baccalaureate. The format of
    the ms exams is no more than simple point 'n' click/drag 'n' drop type
    questions, with the actual answers actually presented to you up front.
    So, you simple have to choose/construct the answer from what's given
    to you. Nowhere do you 'write' anything about your answers, or
    describe and explain, in your 'own' words, how you came to an answer;
    in other words, answering the question does not prove an understanding
    of the question being answered. In addition there is no course work as
    such that is graded as part of your overall assessment..

    The format of the exams make them very easy, and thus open to
    'practice test' providers being able to exploit them for profit. It is
    also, sadly, very easy for people to cheat using brain dumps or
    'products' from certain 'practice test' providers, which has
    undermined their value to such an extent that the so called
    'certifications' they lead to have become worthless in real world and
    have simply resulted in an endless supply of unqualified, yet so
    called 'ms certified' people who have simply achieved this status by
    memorizing the answers to questions which they don't even understand.

    >And yes I have read study guides, user manuals and gained years of
    >experience in IT.


    Then you will no problem whatsoever in passing these exams. Simply use
    the prep guide for each exam and examine/research the topics you do
    not feel you fully understand.

    >This is not the first time I have come across
    >posters who make rash and rapid assumptions about people - did I say
    >Testking were any good?
    >That's three questions in this post BTW but I don't think its me
    >that's wasting space here


    My own view is that all so called practice test provider, simply
    highlight the fact the format of the exams is [currently] crap.

    >OK fourth one - if these cowboys are selling answers written down by
    >paid "sitters" is that why so many of the answers in their prodcuts
    >are crap or at best highly debatable?!


    They can sell their 'products' because they have a market of people
    willing to affectively 'buy' a pass in the exam(s).

    Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3
     
    Kline Sphere, Nov 21, 2005
    #16
  17. Kline Sphere Guest

    Re: MCSE Exam Simulations

    >Oh, the most cost effective way to prepare yourself is really to build a
    >network as cheaply as possible and use material from your local library and
    >the mountain of documentation that comes with the the product in the help
    >and support center. Classes are good if you don't know a certain aspect of
    >the product. My downfall is still RRAS. I purchased a fifty dollar book that
    >I could use at work and to help study and build the test environment as
    >though I didn't have anything but windows machines and layer 2 switches.
    >Seems weird, but it is Microsoft's product and their test I'm taking so,
    >that's why I'm doing it.


    You missed out the very important point about actual real world
    experience. It's all very well building a 'home lab' in order to
    'learn' about the product, but this hardly counts in the real world
    where situations are completely different.

    Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3
     
    Kline Sphere, Nov 21, 2005
    #17
  18. Guest

    Re: MCSE Exam Simulations

    "TestKing, Actualtest, and any derivitave thereof ARE actual exam
    questions. And they DO come from Microsoft - but not legally"

    Obviously any examing body will want to enforce copyright on their
    papers, either to sell the past questions themselves or to prevent
    others from disseminating them by whatever means. I have had a quick
    look at the websites of the firms mentioned in this thread and others.
    The ones I've seen have USA postal addresses and bona fide telephone
    numbers.
    If they are committing a copyright/piracy offence in the eyes of the
    law, the consumer, MS etc etc then they are doing so "up front" with
    impuity - Why and how is it so easy?

    Examinee
     
    , Nov 21, 2005
    #18
  19. Kline Sphere Guest

    Re: MCSE Exam Simulations

    >The ones I've seen have USA postal addresses and bona fide telephone
    >numbers.
    >If they are committing a copyright/piracy offence in the eyes of the
    >law, the consumer, MS etc etc then they are doing so "up front" with
    >impuity - Why and how is it so easy?


    Beats me. I've always found it a bit strange that such operations
    appear to operate from within, yet nothing is apparently done about
    it.

    Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3
     
    Kline Sphere, Nov 21, 2005
    #19
  20. CBIC Guest

    Re: MCSE Exam Simulations


    > That's three questions in this post BTW but I don't think its me
    > that's wasting space here


    Geez, lighten up Francis.
    --
    aka
    Doom MCNGP #38
    Is that a burdizzo in your pocket or are you just glad to see me.
     
    CBIC, Nov 21, 2005
    #20
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