Re: Canon G3, Nikon 4500 or 4300? Help me decide.

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Francois Melon, Sep 8, 2003.

  1. I'm now a 2 monthes canon G3 happy owner.
    Really good camera, with a strong autonomy with its battery.
    It's also a very convinient camera with a sharp definition.
    For me it's a good bargain

    ABC a écrit:
    > I want to get a ' prosumer' 4 meg cam. I have been researching into
    > the above at Epinion and dpreview.
    >
    > Please help me decide and let me know how they are different.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > ABC
    > Do not reply by email. Reply to Newsgroup
    Francois Melon, Sep 8, 2003
    #1
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  2. Francois Melon

    Fel Tramain Guest

    > I'm now a 2 monthes canon G3 happy owner.
    > Really good camera, with a strong autonomy with its battery.
    > It's also a very convinient camera with a sharp definition.
    > For me it's a good bargain


    It is also the best of the 3 cameras.
    Fel Tramain, Sep 9, 2003
    #2
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  3. Francois Melon

    Ihor Guest

    Fel Tramain <> wrote in message news:<>...
    > > I'm now a 2 monthes canon G3 happy owner.
    > > Really good camera, with a strong autonomy with its battery.
    > > It's also a very convinient camera with a sharp definition.
    > > For me it's a good bargain

    >
    > It is also the best of the 3 cameras.


    I can't dispute the above comment because I don't own all three
    cameras for comparison.
    But I do own the Nikon Coolpix 4500 and I love it.
    As mentioned before the closeups are awesome. I'm happy with the
    quality of the photos. It has many many features. You can manually
    control many parameters. There are too many to mention here. However,
    If you want to use them all then it takes some learning. But you don't
    have to learn them all at once. Just use what is important to you. The
    swivel feature is real handy.
    It does have a problem with focusing in low light.

    Ihor
    Ihor, Sep 9, 2003
    #3
  4. Francois Melon

    picopirate Guest

    "Don" <> wrote in message
    news:3f5d4cce$0$23613$...
    > Fel Tramain wrote:
    >
    > >> I'm now a 2 monthes canon G3 happy owner.
    > >> Really good camera, with a strong autonomy with its battery.
    > >> It's also a very convinient camera with a sharp definition.
    > >> For me it's a good bargain

    > >
    > > It is also the best of the 3 cameras.
    > >

    >
    > LOL. Your evidence (being none) is not very convincing.
    >
    > Don
    >


    How about www.dpreview.com giving the G3 a solid 9/10 for five of the six
    categories and an 8.5 for the sixth. Where as the Nikon 4500 got two 8's,
    one 8.5, and three 9's. The G3 and 4500 are about equal as far as picture
    quality. But the G3s design is where is excels. The fold away LCD is
    fantastic so you dont have to worry about damaging it. The G3 has much
    better battery life (by over two hours!!!). The G3 comes with a remote
    control. All that and you can find the G3 for a whopping $200 cheaper than
    the 4500 (mysimon shows the best price for the 4500 @ $650 and the best
    price for the G3 @ $455).
    picopirate, Sep 10, 2003
    #4
  5. Francois Melon

    Don Guest

    picopirate wrote:
    > "Don" <> wrote in message
    > news:3f5d4cce$0$23613$...
    >> Fel Tramain wrote:
    >>
    >> >> I'm now a 2 monthes canon G3 happy owner.
    >> >> Really good camera, with a strong autonomy with its battery.
    >> >> It's also a very convinient camera with a sharp definition.
    >> >> For me it's a good bargain
    >> >
    >> > It is also the best of the 3 cameras.
    >> >

    >>
    >> LOL. Your evidence (being none) is not very convincing.
    >>
    >> Don
    >>

    >
    > How about www.dpreview.com giving the G3 a solid 9/10 for five of the six
    > categories and an 8.5 for the sixth. Where as the Nikon 4500 got two 8's,
    > one 8.5, and three 9's.


    There is no perfect digicam. You must choose by feature, which is
    basically what they rated in this case. For example I would never see
    the point in a remote therefore I wouldn't consider it an advantage.

    So what is "best" is extremely subjective, just like the so called
    evidence from dpreview.
    Don, Sep 10, 2003
    #5
  6. Francois Melon

    ABC Guest

    I just added Olympus 4000 in the short list. It has hot shoe, manual,
    and a 2 cm macro.



    ABC
    Please do not reply by email.Reply to NG
    ABC, Sep 10, 2003
    #6
  7. Francois Melon

    Rick Guest

    "Don" <> wrote in message news:3f5e9e50$0$23589$...
    > picopirate wrote:
    > > "Don" <> wrote in message
    > > news:3f5d4cce$0$23613$...
    > >> Fel Tramain wrote:
    > >>
    > >> >> I'm now a 2 monthes canon G3 happy owner.
    > >> >> Really good camera, with a strong autonomy with its battery.
    > >> >> It's also a very convinient camera with a sharp definition.
    > >> >> For me it's a good bargain
    > >> >
    > >> > It is also the best of the 3 cameras.
    > >> >
    > >>
    > >> LOL. Your evidence (being none) is not very convincing.
    > >>
    > >> Don
    > >>

    > >
    > > How about www.dpreview.com giving the G3 a solid 9/10 for five of the six
    > > categories and an 8.5 for the sixth. Where as the Nikon 4500 got two 8's,
    > > one 8.5, and three 9's.

    >
    > There is no perfect digicam. You must choose by feature, which is
    > basically what they rated in this case. For example I would never see
    > the point in a remote therefore I wouldn't consider it an advantage.
    >
    > So what is "best" is extremely subjective, just like the so called
    > evidence from dpreview.


    Have you read the reviews? Standardized testbeds and sample
    images are far from "extremely subjective".

    Rick
    Rick, Sep 10, 2003
    #7
  8. Francois Melon

    Don Guest

    Rick wrote:
    > Have you read the reviews? Standardized testbeds and sample
    > images are far from "extremely subjective".


    Testbeds for what? Features?

    Sample images testing for what exactly? How do they measure things like
    sharpness, color saturation, white balance ... Do you know?
    Don, Sep 10, 2003
    #8
  9. Francois Melon

    Rick Guest

    "Don" <> wrote in message news:3f5eead5$0$23587$...
    > Rick wrote:
    > > Have you read the reviews? Standardized testbeds and sample
    > > images are far from "extremely subjective".

    >
    > Testbeds for what? Features?
    >
    > Sample images testing for what exactly? How do they measure things like
    > sharpness, color saturation, white balance ... Do you know?


    If you need to ask those questions you obviously haven't read
    Phil's reviews. He explains his methodology in detail.

    Rick
    Rick, Sep 10, 2003
    #9
  10. Francois Melon

    Don Guest

    Rick wrote:
    > Have you read the reviews? Standardized testbeds and sample
    > images are far from "extremely subjective".


    And a couple of other observations while I'm at it.

    1. They haven't tested all cameras, even one of the three mentioned in
    this thread.

    2. They don't provide so called "test results" for all digicams that
    they do test.

    Um, so it doesnt' really matter if their tests are objective does it?

    Don
    Don, Sep 10, 2003
    #10
  11. Francois Melon

    Don Guest

    Rick wrote:
    > If you need to ask those questions you obviously haven't read
    > Phil's reviews. He explains his methodology in detail.


    I have browsed thru the reviews, but I haven't stumbled across his so
    called methodology, true. But then again this is all moot in any case,
    as I explained in the other post.
    Don, Sep 10, 2003
    #11
  12. Francois Melon

    DonB Guest

    On Wed, 10 Sep 2003 20:01:44 GMT, Jim Franks <>
    wrote:
    But you don't seem to get the simple point. For some people like me,
    the swivel lens and macro capabilities of the Nikon are more important
    than other features of the Canon, and I accept that a Ford may suit
    you better than a Chrysler.
    DonB
    >Yet, you will still have people that won't get the G3. It's like when you
    >are on the road and see people who buy Chryslers and Fords. You wonder what
    >is wrong with those people.
    >
    >
    DonB, Sep 10, 2003
    #12
  13. Francois Melon

    Tore Lund Guest

    DonB wrote:
    > On Wed, 10 Sep 2003 20:01:44 GMT, Jim Franks <>
    > wrote:
    > But you don't seem to get the simple point. For some people like me,
    > the swivel lens and macro capabilities of the Nikon are more important
    > than other features of the Canon, and I accept that a Ford may suit
    > you better than a Chrysler.
    > DonB
    >>Yet, you will still have people that won't get the G3. It's like when you
    >>are on the road and see people who buy Chryslers and Fords. You wonder what
    >>is wrong with those people.


    Size and weight might also have something to do with it.
    --
    Tore
    Tore Lund, Sep 10, 2003
    #13
  14. The Olympus C-4000 does not have a hot shoe, you dumb asshole. To use
    an external flash you need to spend extra money for an adapter and a
    bracket. Dip shit!



    ABC <> wrote in message news:<>...
    > I just added Olympus 4000 in the short list. It has hot shoe, manual,
    > and a 2 cm macro.
    >
    >
    >
    > ABC
    > Please do not reply by email.Reply to NG
    Monica Krowley, Sep 11, 2003
    #14
  15. Francois Melon

    DonB Guest

    You just go on to reinforce the basic point......choose the camera
    which best suits your needs.
    Both cameras are excellent, horses for courses.
    DonB


    On Wed, 10 Sep 2003 23:51:27 GMT, "picopirate" <>
    wrote:

    >Well the G3 does one better than the swivel lense of the 4500. The G3s LCD
    >is hinged so you can see it from behind, in front, on the side, above, and
    >below the camera. Granted 4500 can focus as close as 2cm in macro mode but
    >the G3 can do 5cm which is more than enough for most people. While I agree
    >one a small number of people may find the 4500 more to their liking I think
    >most people will prefer the G3 for the following reasons:
    >
    >1) Nearly twice the battery life
    >2) Remote Control - great for when you are viewing photos on TV or when
    >taking shots of yourself but dont want to rely on a timer.
    >3) Bigger Memory Card (32MB vs 16MB in the 4500)
    >4) Hot shoe flash mount.
    >5) $200 cheeper.
    >6) Much faster (takes nearly half as long to boot, and one has one third the
    >shudder lag)
    >7) Hinged LCD
    >
    >
    >
    >"DonB" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> On Wed, 10 Sep 2003 20:01:44 GMT, Jim Franks <>
    >> wrote:
    >> But you don't seem to get the simple point. For some people like me,
    >> the swivel lens and macro capabilities of the Nikon are more important
    >> than other features of the Canon, and I accept that a Ford may suit
    >> you better than a Chrysler.
    >> DonB
    >> >Yet, you will still have people that won't get the G3. It's like when

    >you
    >> >are on the road and see people who buy Chryslers and Fords. You wonder

    >what
    >> >is wrong with those people.
    >> >
    >> >

    >>

    >
    >
    DonB, Sep 11, 2003
    #15
  16. Francois Melon

    Ted Stephens Guest

    > >>Yet, you will still have people that won't get the G3. It's like when you
    > >>are on the road and see people who buy Chryslers and Fords. You wonder what
    > >>is wrong with those people.

    >
    > Size and weight might also have something to do with it.


    It is a camera, not a pager, it is supposed to be that size. Anything smaller is
    just a toy for the uneducated consumer. Note how the better the camera, (SLRs,
    etc) the bigger it is. The more directed towards the uneducated consumer, the
    smaller it is.

    When I am shopping for a refrigerator, I don't worry about how heavy one is over
    another, or that it is so large that I can't put it in my shirt pocket either.
    Ted Stephens, Sep 11, 2003
    #16
  17. Francois Melon

    Ted Stephens Guest

    > You just go on to reinforce the basic point......choose the camera
    > which best suits your needs.


    The list he gave is best to suit ANYONE's needs...

    > >1) Nearly twice the battery life


    Who has needs that they prefer less battery life?

    > >2) Remote Control - great for when you are viewing photos on TV or when
    > >taking shots of yourself but dont want to rely on a timer.


    So cameras without remote control are better? You don't HAVE to use it, but it
    is there for those that want it. That makes it better.

    > >3) Bigger Memory Card (32MB vs 16MB in the 4500)


    Then again, there are those that have needs that require smaller memory cards????

    > >4) Hot shoe flash mount.


    Again, cameras without this must be better because some people have different
    needs. ???

    > >5) $200 cheeper.


    But apparently this is not better either, some people prefer throwing away money
    and paying more to get less.

    > >6) Much faster (takes nearly half as long to boot, and one has one third the
    > >shudder lag)


    I can't see where someone would prefer or like the slower times of the other
    camera.

    > >7) Hinged LCD


    Another point that is BETTER and doesn't have to be used if you don't want to.
    You can leave it in the camera facing out and have exactly what the other cameras
    have. Since you have the option and choice (depending on your needs) this is
    again BETTER for everyone.
    Ted Stephens, Sep 11, 2003
    #17
  18. Francois Melon

    George Kerby Guest

    On 9/11/03 11:37 AM, in article , "Ted Stephens"
    <> wrote:

    >> You just go on to reinforce the basic point......choose the camera
    >> which best suits your needs.

    >
    > The list he gave is best to suit ANYONE's needs...
    >
    >>> 1) Nearly twice the battery life

    >
    > Who has needs that they prefer less battery life?
    >
    >>> 2) Remote Control - great for when you are viewing photos on TV or when
    >>> taking shots of yourself but dont want to rely on a timer.

    >
    > So cameras without remote control are better? You don't HAVE to use it, but
    > it
    > is there for those that want it. That makes it better.
    >
    >>> 3) Bigger Memory Card (32MB vs 16MB in the 4500)

    >
    > Then again, there are those that have needs that require smaller memory
    > cards????
    >
    >>> 4) Hot shoe flash mount.

    >
    > Again, cameras without this must be better because some people have different
    > needs. ???
    >
    >>> 5) $200 cheeper.

    >
    > But apparently this is not better either, some people prefer throwing away
    > money
    > and paying more to get less.
    >
    >>> 6) Much faster (takes nearly half as long to boot, and one has one third the
    >>> shudder lag)

    >
    > I can't see where someone would prefer or like the slower times of the other
    > camera.
    >
    >>> 7) Hinged LCD

    >
    > Another point that is BETTER and doesn't have to be used if you don't want to.
    > You can leave it in the camera facing out and have exactly what the other
    > cameras
    > have. Since you have the option and choice (depending on your needs) this
    > is
    > again BETTER for everyone.
    >
    >

    NOTHING you say could be good for ANYONE, schitzo asswipe!!~!


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    George Kerby, Sep 11, 2003
    #18
  19. Francois Melon

    DonB Guest

    I truly don't understand why you are trying to convince me why the
    camera I bought to suit my needs, is not as good as another.
    Most of your points are invalid to my needs.
    Except battery life, grant you that, but I am quite capable of
    planning my day.
    Card size...does the card sold matter....any normal user is going to
    throw either size away and buy a bigger one.
    Sorry, the Nikon 4500 fits me perfectly, I take joy in using it. It's
    a jewel. Besides, in comparison the G3, though a good camera, is for
    me a "clunker"
    DonB


    >> You just go on to reinforce the basic point......choose the camera
    >> which best suits your needs.

    >
    >The list he gave is best to suit ANYONE's needs...
    >
    >> >1) Nearly twice the battery life

    >
    >Who has needs that they prefer less battery life?
    >
    >> >2) Remote Control - great for when you are viewing photos on TV or when
    >> >taking shots of yourself but dont want to rely on a timer.

    >
    >So cameras without remote control are better? You don't HAVE to use it, but it
    >is there for those that want it. That makes it better.
    >
    >> >3) Bigger Memory Card (32MB vs 16MB in the 4500)

    >
    >Then again, there are those that have needs that require smaller memory cards????
    >
    >> >4) Hot shoe flash mount.

    >
    >Again, cameras without this must be better because some people have different
    >needs. ???
    >
    >> >5) $200 cheeper.

    >
    >But apparently this is not better either, some people prefer throwing away money
    >and paying more to get less.
    >
    >> >6) Much faster (takes nearly half as long to boot, and one has one third the
    >> >shudder lag)

    >
    >I can't see where someone would prefer or like the slower times of the other
    >camera.
    >
    >> >7) Hinged LCD

    >
    >Another point that is BETTER and doesn't have to be used if you don't want to.
    >You can leave it in the camera facing out and have exactly what the other cameras
    >have. Since you have the option and choice (depending on your needs) this is
    >again BETTER for everyone.
    >
    >
    DonB, Sep 11, 2003
    #19
  20. Francois Melon

    DonB Guest

    John, I won't go through all your points, because it's pointless.
    You insult me in your last paragraph. Actually, I do use my Nikon
    every couple of days for business, I have armfuls of awkward gear, and
    size\weight DOES make a difference......for me.
    And I have owned Canons...fine machines but in balance, the 4500 has
    more of what is important to my needs. Neither do I like half plastic
    bodies. I would rather have dinner with the Mona Lisa than Barbie
    Doll.
    DonB


    On Thu, 11 Sep 2003 20:15:17 GMT, John Helmann <> wrote:

    >> I truly don't understand why you are trying to convince me why the
    >> camera I bought to suit my needs, is not as good as another.

    >
    >I think what is trying to be pointed out is that the camera is better, not that you
    >can't get the other camera and be happy with it.
    >
    >> Most of your points are invalid to my needs.

    >
    >But they are still better and don't have to be used. But better picture quality and
    >longer battery life are things that seem silly to say don't meet some people's
    >needs. That's all. :)
    >
    >> Except battery life, grant you that, but I am quite capable of
    >> planning my day.

    >
    >That has nothing to do with it. It lasts longer, it is better. Your question
    >should be turned around and you should be asked why are you trying to convince us that
    >having less battery life, and all the other inferior specs suits people better?
    >
    >> Card size...does the card sold matter....any normal user is going to
    >> throw either size away and buy a bigger one.

    >
    >Ok, but they give you more to begin with, which is still better. Seems to me you
    >would prefer the camera that didn't give you any card at all, had batteries that only
    >lasted long enough for 1 or 2 shots then had to be recharged, had slightly less
    >picture quality, cost more, etc.
    >
    >> Sorry, the Nikon 4500 fits me perfectly, I take joy in using it. It's
    >> a jewel.

    >
    >Glad you are happy with it. But perhaps if you got to use a G3 and compare the two,
    >you might end up prefering that camera. I know how it is, once you have a camera,
    >one tends to be more biased with their purchase and think it is the best. I on the
    >other hand am one of the few who actually uses and tries out everything before making
    >the purchase, so although I will appear to have the same ownership bias, I know which
    >one was the best. I also know some that are better than mine and not afraid to
    >admit it, but they cost quite a bit more.
    >
    >> Besides, in comparison the G3, though a good camera, is for
    >> me a "clunker"

    >
    >You should take a look at the SLRs if you think the G3 is big. I don't know how
    >some people can say the G3 is big. It is a camera, it is supposed to be that
    >size. Anything smaller is just a toy, or made for spies and have to lose a lot of
    >quality just so that you can put it in your shirt pocket.
    >
    >Funny too, but the other cameras I compare to the G3 that are in the same range, are
    >actually bigger and bulkier than the G3 anyway, so I don't get where all this talk
    >comes from.
    >
    >It fits in a coat pocket just fine, but the important thing is taking pictures with
    >it, not how it will be resting in a pocket or on a closet shelf when you are not even
    >using it.
    >
    >
    DonB, Sep 12, 2003
    #20
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