Re: an excellent read from the ACLU

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Mike Benveniste, Sep 14, 2011.

  1. Mike Benveniste

    Robert Coe Guest

    On Tue, 20 Dec 2011 11:33:27 +1100, "Trevor" <> wrote:
    :
    : "Robert Coe" <> wrote in message
    : news:...
    : > And where on earth did you get the idea that public sector employees
    : > love flat taxes? I've been a public sector employee for almost 17 years,
    : > and I can't remember the last time I heard one, other than a candidate
    : > pandering to the Tea Party, advocate a flat tax.
    :
    : I said the highly paid public sector employees, ie. the fat cats making
    : the taxation recommendations to politicians.
    : Are YOU one of those?
    : Obviously the lowly public sector employees have no say in the matter.

    Here's the quote, from Tony Cooper, to which you responded:

    "The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
    In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
    employed - usually at rather good salaries - and paying income taxes,
    property taxes, and taxes on purchases."

    The government employees who do the buying are purchasing agents, financial
    analysts, etc. They are not the "fat cats" (almost none of whom are government
    employees) of which you speak. And very few of them are advocates of a flat
    tax.

    Me? I work for a City government as a computer system manager and
    photographer. Is that lowly enough to let me off the hook?

    Bob
     
    Robert Coe, Dec 20, 2011
    1. Advertising

  2. Mike Benveniste

    PeterN Guest

    On 12/19/2011 8:21 AM, Pete Stavrakoglou wrote:
    > "Trevor"<> wrote in message
    > news:jcgokg$s4n$...
    >>
    >> "Pete Stavrakoglou"<> wrote in message
    >> news:jcfgdr$b3g$...
    >>>
    >>> We have a deficit problem in New York State for the same reason we have one
    >>> as a nation. Our governments spend too much. Income is not the problem,
    >>> spending is.

    >>
    >> I suggest a short course in economics so you can discover that income AND
    >> expenditure are related. You would probably be the first to complain if the
    >> government provided NO services at all!
    >> In fact it's the rich who want a police force, fire department etc. far more
    >> than the poor do :)

    >
    > No. The state has a spending problem. Is is that difficult to uinderstand that
    > when you spend more than you earn you need to curb your spending?
    >
    >


    The other side of the coin is to earn more.

    --
    Peter
     
    PeterN, Dec 20, 2011
    1. Advertising

  3. Mike Benveniste

    John A. Guest

    On Mon, 19 Dec 2011 21:19:58 -0500, PeterN
    <> wrote:

    >On 12/19/2011 8:21 AM, Pete Stavrakoglou wrote:
    >> "Trevor"<> wrote in message
    >> news:jcgokg$s4n$...
    >>>
    >>> "Pete Stavrakoglou"<> wrote in message
    >>> news:jcfgdr$b3g$...
    >>>>
    >>>> We have a deficit problem in New York State for the same reason we have one
    >>>> as a nation. Our governments spend too much. Income is not the problem,
    >>>> spending is.
    >>>
    >>> I suggest a short course in economics so you can discover that income AND
    >>> expenditure are related. You would probably be the first to complain if the
    >>> government provided NO services at all!
    >>> In fact it's the rich who want a police force, fire department etc. far more
    >>> than the poor do :)

    >>
    >> No. The state has a spending problem. Is is that difficult to uinderstand that
    >> when you spend more than you earn you need to curb your spending?
    >>
    >>

    >
    >The other side of the coin is to earn more.


    Maybe there should be fees for commercial or industrial use of
    technology developed in government labs. That would raise revenue.
     
    John A., Dec 20, 2011
  4. Mike Benveniste

    Ray Fischer Guest

    Robert Coe <> wrote:
    >On 19 Dec 2011 19:00:02 GMT, (Ray Fischer) wrote:
    >: Robert Coe <> wrote:
    >: >On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 17:02:09 +1100, "Trevor" <> wrote:
    >: >:
    >: >: "tony cooper" <> wrote in message
    >: >: news:p...
    >: >: >>Governments do the buying with taxpayers money, taxpayers rarely have
    >: >: >>any say in it.
    >: >: >
    >: >: > The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
    >: >: > In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
    >: >: > employed - usually at rather good salaries
    >: >:
    >: >: That's the problem, it's not their money they waste, and they usually
    >: >: have a far better life style than many others.
    >: >
    >: >The widespread belief that government employees in the U.S. are lavishly
    >: >compensated is largely myth. Police officers and teachers are usually paid
    >: >more than private sector employees of comparable education and experience,
    >:
    >: No they're not. Teachers are paid little compared to the many years
    >: of training required and the hours that they put in. Police and fire
    >: are paid a lot because they work at dangerous jobs.
    >:
    >: >because they're represented by extremely powerful labor unions.
    >:
    >: You really are a sucker for right-wing propaganda, aren't you?
    >
    >Did you actually say that? I hope it's just your idea of a bad joke.


    Anybody who whines about the power of unions while ignoriong the power
    of corporations and government cannot be very smart. The right to
    choose who you work for and under what terms is fundamental to a free
    society.

    --
    Ray Fischer | None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.
    | Goethe
     
    Ray Fischer, Dec 20, 2011
  5. Mike Benveniste

    Ray Fischer Guest

    George Kerby <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    >On 12/19/11 4:15 PM, in article ,
    >"Robert Coe" <> wrote:
    >
    >> On 19 Dec 2011 19:00:02 GMT, (Ray Fischer) wrote:
    >> : Robert Coe <> wrote:
    >> : >On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 17:02:09 +1100, "Trevor" <> wrote:
    >> : >:
    >> : >: "tony cooper" <> wrote in message
    >> : >: news:p...
    >> : >: >>Governments do the buying with taxpayers money, taxpayers rarely have
    >> : >: >>any say in it.
    >> : >: >
    >> : >: > The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
    >> : >: > In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
    >> : >: > employed - usually at rather good salaries
    >> : >:
    >> : >: That's the problem, it's not their money they waste, and they usually
    >> : >: have a far better life style than many others.
    >> : >
    >> : >The widespread belief that government employees in the U.S. are lavishly
    >> : >compensated is largely myth. Police officers and teachers are usually paid
    >> : >more than private sector employees of comparable education and experience,
    >> :
    >> : No they're not. Teachers are paid little compared to the many years
    >> : of training required and the hours that they put in. Police and fire
    >> : are paid a lot because they work at dangerous jobs.
    >> :
    >> : >because they're represented by extremely powerful labor unions.
    >> :
    >> : You really are a sucker for right-wing propaganda, aren't you?
    >>
    >> Did you actually say that? I hope it's just your idea of a bad joke. If it
    >> isn't, then you must not have read, or at least not have understood, anything
    >> else I've ever said, even in this very thread.
    >>
    >> Or have I simply failed to appreciate an outpouring of your sarcastic wit? If
    >> so, then I guess you'll just have to excuse my obtuseness.
    >>
    >> Bob

    >
    >LeftTards wouldn't know "wit" if it walked up and kicked them in the ass.


    Like a little shitty chihuahua dog that no one pays any attention, you just
    bark on, begging for attention
    kerby explains his childishness in<C6CD2583.33D14%>

    --
    Ray Fischer | None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.
    | Goethe
     
    Ray Fischer, Dec 20, 2011
  6. Mike Benveniste

    Trevor Guest

    "Robert Coe" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > : > And where on earth did you get the idea that public sector employees
    > : > love flat taxes? I've been a public sector employee for almost 17
    > years,
    > : > and I can't remember the last time I heard one, other than a candidate
    > : > pandering to the Tea Party, advocate a flat tax.
    > :
    > : I said the highly paid public sector employees, ie. the fat cats making
    > : the taxation recommendations to politicians.
    > : Are YOU one of those?
    > : Obviously the lowly public sector employees have no say in the matter.
    >
    > Here's the quote, from Tony Cooper, to which you responded:
    >
    > "The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
    > In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
    > employed - usually at rather good salaries - and paying income taxes,
    > property taxes, and taxes on purchases."


    That was already in response to what I wrote, and just like you tried to
    make a straw man out of misrepresnting it.



    > The government employees who do the buying are purchasing agents,
    > financial
    > analysts, etc. They are not the "fat cats" (almost none of whom are
    > government
    > employees) of which you speak. And very few of them are advocates of a
    > flat
    > tax.


    As I said, many of the taxation policy advisors are.


    > Me? I work for a City government as a computer system manager and
    > photographer. Is that lowly enough to let me off the hook?


    I never put you on it. What influence do YOU feel you have over taxation
    policy that you *would* be included?

    Trevor.
     
    Trevor, Dec 20, 2011
  7. "John A." <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    > On Mon, 19 Dec 2011 08:21:16 -0500, "Pete Stavrakoglou"
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>"Trevor" <> wrote in message
    >>news:jcgokg$s4n$...
    >>>
    >>> "Pete Stavrakoglou" <> wrote in message
    >>> news:jcfgdr$b3g$...
    >>>>
    >>>> We have a deficit problem in New York State for the same reason we have one
    >>>> as a nation. Our governments spend too much. Income is not the problem,
    >>>> spending is.
    >>>
    >>> I suggest a short course in economics so you can discover that income AND
    >>> expenditure are related. You would probably be the first to complain if the
    >>> government provided NO services at all!
    >>> In fact it's the rich who want a police force, fire department etc. far more
    >>> than the poor do :)

    >>
    >>No. The state has a spending problem. Is is that difficult to uinderstand
    >>that
    >>when you spend more than you earn you need to curb your spending?

    >
    > When the deficit comes after large tax cuts after there being a budget
    > surplus, it's not hard to understand that those cuts may be part of
    > the problem.


    Which tax cuts are you referring to? New legislation was just signed that will
    give the average family a few extra dollars a week to take home. That's the
    first income tax cut in about 50 years. So, which tax cuts are you referring
    to?
     
    Pete Stavrakoglou, Dec 20, 2011
  8. "David J. Littleboy" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >
    > "PeterN" <> wrote:
    >
    >> My point was that as a matter of humanity, you can't let people starve.

    >
    > But letting people starve is _exactly_ what the right wing in the US wants to
    > do. They feel that failure is the fault of the person, and that the state has
    > no business taking care of people who fail. The right wing has no problem with
    > tens of millions of people have no health insurance and not being able to get
    > simple check ups and basic care. (On one of my recent trips to the US, I took
    > my (uninsured in the US) eyes to my late father's opthamologist and got hit
    > for US$200 (and didn't get told anything my Japanese opthamologist, for whom a
    > similar office visit sets me back US$15 or so, hasn't told me.)


    You left out the part that we conservatives also want dirty air and dirty water,
    bad schools, and that we're all racists.


    >> It is a lot cheaper to give them welfare, than put them in jail.

    >
    > And it would be a lot cheaper to provide affordable medical care so that
    > people could get their eyes checked instead of letting them go blind and
    > having to provide state support. (Although I suppose the soulless rightards
    > are right now working on cutting funding to agencies that provide services to
    > the blind.)
    >
    > --
    > David J. Littleboy
    > Tokyo, Japan
    >
    >
     
    Pete Stavrakoglou, Dec 20, 2011
  9. "PeterN" <> wrote in message
    news:4eeff0d7$0$5545$-secrets.com...
    > On 12/19/2011 8:21 AM, Pete Stavrakoglou wrote:
    >> "Trevor"<> wrote in message
    >> news:jcgokg$s4n$...
    >>>
    >>> "Pete Stavrakoglou"<> wrote in message
    >>> news:jcfgdr$b3g$...
    >>>>
    >>>> We have a deficit problem in New York State for the same reason we have one
    >>>> as a nation. Our governments spend too much. Income is not the problem,
    >>>> spending is.
    >>>
    >>> I suggest a short course in economics so you can discover that income AND
    >>> expenditure are related. You would probably be the first to complain if the
    >>> government provided NO services at all!
    >>> In fact it's the rich who want a police force, fire department etc. far more
    >>> than the poor do :)

    >>
    >> No. The state has a spending problem. Is is that difficult to uinderstand
    >> that
    >> when you spend more than you earn you need to curb your spending?
    >>
    >>

    >
    > The other side of the coin is to earn more.


    Yes, but government doesn't earn, they confiscate. How much is enough? You
    know what it's like to live here in NY. After we payour income taxes, property
    taxes, and all the other miscellaneous fees and taxes 50% of what we earn is
    gone.
     
    Pete Stavrakoglou, Dec 20, 2011
  10. Mike Benveniste

    John A. Guest

    On Tue, 20 Dec 2011 08:12:54 -0500, "Pete Stavrakoglou"
    <> wrote:

    >"David J. Littleboy" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >>
    >> "PeterN" <> wrote:
    >>
    >>> My point was that as a matter of humanity, you can't let people starve.

    >>
    >> But letting people starve is _exactly_ what the right wing in the US wants to
    >> do. They feel that failure is the fault of the person, and that the state has
    >> no business taking care of people who fail. The right wing has no problem with
    >> tens of millions of people have no health insurance and not being able to get
    >> simple check ups and basic care. (On one of my recent trips to the US, I took
    >> my (uninsured in the US) eyes to my late father's opthamologist and got hit
    >> for US$200 (and didn't get told anything my Japanese opthamologist, for whom a
    >> similar office visit sets me back US$15 or so, hasn't told me.)

    >
    >You left out the part that we conservatives also want dirty air and dirty water,
    >bad schools, and that we're all racists.


    Not all, but that seems to be the voting trend. Or at least enough
    seem to think those are fine trade-offs for corps making more money to
    push the trend that way.

    >>> It is a lot cheaper to give them welfare, than put them in jail.

    >>
    >> And it would be a lot cheaper to provide affordable medical care so that
    >> people could get their eyes checked instead of letting them go blind and
    >> having to provide state support. (Although I suppose the soulless rightards
    >> are right now working on cutting funding to agencies that provide services to
    >> the blind.)
    >>
    >> --
    >> David J. Littleboy
    >> Tokyo, Japan
    >>
    >>

    >
     
    John A., Dec 20, 2011
  11. Mike Benveniste

    John A. Guest

    On Tue, 20 Dec 2011 08:07:21 -0500, "Pete Stavrakoglou"
    <> wrote:

    >"John A." <> wrote in message
    >news:p...
    >> On Mon, 19 Dec 2011 08:21:16 -0500, "Pete Stavrakoglou"
    >> <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>"Trevor" <> wrote in message
    >>>news:jcgokg$s4n$...
    >>>>
    >>>> "Pete Stavrakoglou" <> wrote in message
    >>>> news:jcfgdr$b3g$...
    >>>>>
    >>>>> We have a deficit problem in New York State for the same reason we have one
    >>>>> as a nation. Our governments spend too much. Income is not the problem,
    >>>>> spending is.
    >>>>
    >>>> I suggest a short course in economics so you can discover that income AND
    >>>> expenditure are related. You would probably be the first to complain if the
    >>>> government provided NO services at all!
    >>>> In fact it's the rich who want a police force, fire department etc. far more
    >>>> than the poor do :)
    >>>
    >>>No. The state has a spending problem. Is is that difficult to uinderstand
    >>>that
    >>>when you spend more than you earn you need to curb your spending?

    >>
    >> When the deficit comes after large tax cuts after there being a budget
    >> surplus, it's not hard to understand that those cuts may be part of
    >> the problem.

    >
    >Which tax cuts are you referring to? New legislation was just signed that will
    >give the average family a few extra dollars a week to take home. That's the
    >first income tax cut in about 50 years. So, which tax cuts are you referring
    >to?


    Wow. You just completely blanked out during the Bush administration
    didn't you? (And every administration & congress for the last 50
    years, for that matter.)
     
    John A., Dec 20, 2011
  12. Mike Benveniste

    PeterN Guest

    On 12/19/2011 8:50 PM, David J. Littleboy wrote:
    > "PeterN"<> wrote:
    >
    >> My point was that as a matter of humanity, you can't let people starve.

    >
    > But letting people starve is _exactly_ what the right wing in the US wants
    > to do. They feel that failure is the fault of the person, and that the state
    > has no business taking care of people who fail. The right wing has no
    > problem with tens of millions of people have no health insurance and not
    > being able to get simple check ups and basic care. (On one of my recent
    > trips to the US, I took my (uninsured in the US) eyes to my late father's
    > opthamologist and got hit for US$200 (and didn't get told anything my
    > Japanese opthamologist, for whom a similar office visit sets me back US$15
    > or so, hasn't told me.)
    >
    >> It is a lot cheaper to give them welfare, than put them in jail.

    >
    > And it would be a lot cheaper to provide affordable medical care so that
    > people could get their eyes checked instead of letting them go blind and
    > having to provide state support. (Although I suppose the soulless rightards
    > are right now working on cutting funding to agencies that provide services
    > to the blind.)
    >



    Don't get me started.
    In the US it is illegal for Medicare to negotiate rates for
    pharmaceuticals. On two of my prescriptions, which I have been taking
    for years, my co-pay has increased to about $300 per month. and a third
    is now off the list.


    --
    Peter
     
    PeterN, Dec 20, 2011
  13. Mike Benveniste

    John A. Guest

    On Tue, 20 Dec 2011 20:39:48 +1100, "Trevor" <> wrote:

    >
    >"Robert Coe" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> : > And where on earth did you get the idea that public sector employees
    >> : > love flat taxes? I've been a public sector employee for almost 17
    >> years,
    >> : > and I can't remember the last time I heard one, other than a candidate
    >> : > pandering to the Tea Party, advocate a flat tax.
    >> :
    >> : I said the highly paid public sector employees, ie. the fat cats making
    >> : the taxation recommendations to politicians.
    >> : Are YOU one of those?
    >> : Obviously the lowly public sector employees have no say in the matter.
    >>
    >> Here's the quote, from Tony Cooper, to which you responded:
    >>
    >> "The government employees who do the buying are, themselves, taxpayers.
    >> In fact, they are sharing the burden more than many since they are
    >> employed - usually at rather good salaries - and paying income taxes,
    >> property taxes, and taxes on purchases."

    >
    >That was already in response to what I wrote, and just like you tried to
    >make a straw man out of misrepresnting it.
    >
    >
    >
    >> The government employees who do the buying are purchasing agents,
    >> financial
    >> analysts, etc. They are not the "fat cats" (almost none of whom are
    >> government
    >> employees) of which you speak. And very few of them are advocates of a
    >> flat
    >> tax.

    >
    >As I said, many of the taxation policy advisors are.


    Lobbyists? Oh yeah. They're not government employees, though.
    (Government employee employers, maybe.)

    >> Me? I work for a City government as a computer system manager and
    >> photographer. Is that lowly enough to let me off the hook?

    >
    >I never put you on it. What influence do YOU feel you have over taxation
    >policy that you *would* be included?
    >
    >Trevor.
    >
     
    John A., Dec 20, 2011
  14. "John A." <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    > On Tue, 20 Dec 2011 08:07:21 -0500, "Pete Stavrakoglou"
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>"John A." <> wrote in message
    >>news:p...
    >>> On Mon, 19 Dec 2011 08:21:16 -0500, "Pete Stavrakoglou"
    >>> <> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>"Trevor" <> wrote in message
    >>>>news:jcgokg$s4n$...
    >>>>>
    >>>>> "Pete Stavrakoglou" <> wrote in message
    >>>>> news:jcfgdr$b3g$...
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> We have a deficit problem in New York State for the same reason we have
    >>>>>> one
    >>>>>> as a nation. Our governments spend too much. Income is not the problem,
    >>>>>> spending is.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I suggest a short course in economics so you can discover that income AND
    >>>>> expenditure are related. You would probably be the first to complain if
    >>>>> the
    >>>>> government provided NO services at all!
    >>>>> In fact it's the rich who want a police force, fire department etc. far
    >>>>> more
    >>>>> than the poor do :)
    >>>>
    >>>>No. The state has a spending problem. Is is that difficult to uinderstand
    >>>>that
    >>>>when you spend more than you earn you need to curb your spending?
    >>>
    >>> When the deficit comes after large tax cuts after there being a budget
    >>> surplus, it's not hard to understand that those cuts may be part of
    >>> the problem.

    >>
    >>Which tax cuts are you referring to? New legislation was just signed that
    >>will
    >>give the average family a few extra dollars a week to take home. That's the
    >>first income tax cut in about 50 years. So, which tax cuts are you referring
    >>to?

    >
    > Wow. You just completely blanked out during the Bush administration
    > didn't you? (And every administration & congress for the last 50
    > years, for that matter.)


    This part of the thread you referred to was the discussion about New York State.
    I suggest you reread the exchange again.
     
    Pete Stavrakoglou, Dec 20, 2011
  15. Mike Benveniste

    John A. Guest

    On Tue, 20 Dec 2011 16:15:29 -0500, "Pete Stavrakoglou"
    <> wrote:

    >"John A." <> wrote in message
    >news:p...
    >> On Tue, 20 Dec 2011 08:07:21 -0500, "Pete Stavrakoglou"
    >> <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>"John A." <> wrote in message
    >>>news:p...
    >>>> On Mon, 19 Dec 2011 08:21:16 -0500, "Pete Stavrakoglou"
    >>>> <> wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>>"Trevor" <> wrote in message
    >>>>>news:jcgokg$s4n$...
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> "Pete Stavrakoglou" <> wrote in message
    >>>>>> news:jcfgdr$b3g$...
    >>>>>>>
    >>>>>>> We have a deficit problem in New York State for the same reason we have
    >>>>>>> one
    >>>>>>> as a nation. Our governments spend too much. Income is not the problem,
    >>>>>>> spending is.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I suggest a short course in economics so you can discover that income AND
    >>>>>> expenditure are related. You would probably be the first to complain if
    >>>>>> the
    >>>>>> government provided NO services at all!
    >>>>>> In fact it's the rich who want a police force, fire department etc. far
    >>>>>> more
    >>>>>> than the poor do :)
    >>>>>
    >>>>>No. The state has a spending problem. Is is that difficult to uinderstand
    >>>>>that
    >>>>>when you spend more than you earn you need to curb your spending?
    >>>>
    >>>> When the deficit comes after large tax cuts after there being a budget
    >>>> surplus, it's not hard to understand that those cuts may be part of
    >>>> the problem.
    >>>
    >>>Which tax cuts are you referring to? New legislation was just signed that
    >>>will
    >>>give the average family a few extra dollars a week to take home. That's the
    >>>first income tax cut in about 50 years. So, which tax cuts are you referring
    >>>to?

    >>
    >> Wow. You just completely blanked out during the Bush administration
    >> didn't you? (And every administration & congress for the last 50
    >> years, for that matter.)

    >
    >This part of the thread you referred to was the discussion about New York State.
    >I suggest you reread the exchange again.


    I was talking about federal.
     
    John A., Dec 20, 2011
  16. Mike Benveniste

    Trevor Guest

    "Pete Stavrakoglou" <> wrote in message
    news:jcq1o6$8pf$...
    > Yes, but government doesn't earn, they confiscate. How much is enough?
    > You know what it's like to live here in NY. After we payour income taxes,
    > property taxes, and all the other miscellaneous fees and taxes 50% of what
    > we earn is gone.


    You certainly don't have to be rich in most countries for that to happen.
    The REAL problem is whether you get your moneys worth. Some countries are
    far better than the USA in that regard, although Australia is probably not
    one of them :-(

    Trevor.
     
    Trevor, Dec 21, 2011
  17. Mike Benveniste

    Trevor Guest

    "John A." <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >>As I said, many of the taxation policy advisors are.

    >
    > Lobbyists? Oh yeah. They're not government employees, though.
    > (Government employee employers, maybe.)


    NOT party lobbyists, government paid advisors, chief bureaucrats and
    department heads.

    Trevor.
     
    Trevor, Dec 21, 2011
  18. Mike Benveniste

    PeterN Guest

    On 12/19/2011 9:58 PM, John A. wrote:
    > On Mon, 19 Dec 2011 21:19:58 -0500, PeterN
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >> On 12/19/2011 8:21 AM, Pete Stavrakoglou wrote:
    >>> "Trevor"<> wrote in message
    >>> news:jcgokg$s4n$...
    >>>>
    >>>> "Pete Stavrakoglou"<> wrote in message
    >>>> news:jcfgdr$b3g$...
    >>>>>
    >>>>> We have a deficit problem in New York State for the same reason we have one
    >>>>> as a nation. Our governments spend too much. Income is not the problem,
    >>>>> spending is.
    >>>>
    >>>> I suggest a short course in economics so you can discover that income AND
    >>>> expenditure are related. You would probably be the first to complain if the
    >>>> government provided NO services at all!
    >>>> In fact it's the rich who want a police force, fire department etc. far more
    >>>> than the poor do :)
    >>>
    >>> No. The state has a spending problem. Is is that difficult to uinderstand that
    >>> when you spend more than you earn you need to curb your spending?
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> The other side of the coin is to earn more.

    >
    > Maybe there should be fees for commercial or industrial use of
    > technology developed in government labs. That would raise revenue.



    there are:
    A portion of the profits from such commercial use is called.......



    Hold your breath......


    Taxes

    --
    Peter
     
    PeterN, Dec 21, 2011
  19. Mike Benveniste

    PeterN Guest

    On 12/20/2011 9:22 PM, Trevor wrote:
    > "John A."<> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >>> As I said, many of the taxation policy advisors are.

    >>
    >> Lobbyists? Oh yeah. They're not government employees, though.
    >> (Government employee employers, maybe.)

    >
    > NOT party lobbyists, government paid advisors, chief bureaucrats and
    > department heads.
    >
    > Trevor.
    >
    >
    >


    The regulatory process consists of creating regulations that accomplish
    their governmental goal, while allowing the entity room to exist. Except
    of course where allowing the entity to exist would be against public policy.

    --
    Peter
     
    PeterN, Dec 21, 2011
  20. Mike Benveniste

    PeterN Guest

    On 12/20/2011 8:07 AM, Pete Stavrakoglou wrote:
    > "John A."<> wrote in message
    > news:p...
    >> On Mon, 19 Dec 2011 08:21:16 -0500, "Pete Stavrakoglou"
    >> <> wrote:
    >>
    >>> "Trevor"<> wrote in message
    >>> news:jcgokg$s4n$...
    >>>>
    >>>> "Pete Stavrakoglou"<> wrote in message
    >>>> news:jcfgdr$b3g$...
    >>>>>
    >>>>> We have a deficit problem in New York State for the same reason we have one
    >>>>> as a nation. Our governments spend too much. Income is not the problem,
    >>>>> spending is.
    >>>>
    >>>> I suggest a short course in economics so you can discover that income AND
    >>>> expenditure are related. You would probably be the first to complain if the
    >>>> government provided NO services at all!
    >>>> In fact it's the rich who want a police force, fire department etc. far more
    >>>> than the poor do :)
    >>>
    >>> No. The state has a spending problem. Is is that difficult to uinderstand
    >>> that
    >>> when you spend more than you earn you need to curb your spending?

    >>
    >> When the deficit comes after large tax cuts after there being a budget
    >> surplus, it's not hard to understand that those cuts may be part of
    >> the problem.

    >
    > Which tax cuts are you referring to? New legislation was just signed that will
    > give the average family a few extra dollars a week to take home. That's the
    > first income tax cut in about 50 years. So, which tax cuts are you referring
    > to?
    >
    >

    which legislation is that.

    --
    Peter
     
    PeterN, Dec 21, 2011
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