RAW Images from 10D

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by street shooter, Sep 1, 2003.

  1. Operating System = Windows XP

    I purchased a 10D and thus far have been photographing everything in
    the Large/Fine JPEG setting. I've been pleased with the images. This
    weekend, I started experimenting with processing RAW images with
    Canon's Zoom Browser EX software. When a RAW image is processed it
    has to be then converted to save the image, usually converted to JPEG
    to view it or to edit it in PS Elements 2.0. So, what is the point of
    shooting in RAW mode if one cannot save the final corrected image as a
    RAW file, and print the final image as a RAW file? Is the purpose of
    RAW image capture simply to facilitate post-process corrections? Can
    images be saved and printed as RAW files? What are the file type
    choices when converting a processed RAW image? Is there a way to crop
    images with the Canon Zoom Browser EX software?

    It seems the only thing more confusing than Canon's software is the
    manual which explains how to use it.

    Michael
     
    street shooter, Sep 1, 2003
    #1
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  2. street shooter

    Dougl Guest

    "street shooter" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Operating System = Windows XP
    >
    > I purchased a 10D and thus far have been photographing everything in
    > the Large/Fine JPEG setting. I've been pleased with the images. This
    > weekend, I started experimenting with processing RAW images with
    > Canon's Zoom Browser EX software. When a RAW image is processed it
    > has to be then converted to save the image, usually converted to JPEG
    > to view it or to edit it in PS Elements 2.0. So, what is the point of
    > shooting in RAW mode if one cannot save the final corrected image as a
    > RAW file, and print the final image as a RAW file?


    Zoom Browser does not view RAW but there is a conversion program packaged
    with it (Canon utilities), from here save as a TIFF file.
    I would only bother using it if you do any significant amount of
    post-processing.
    If you need to use JPEG then convert the final image to JPEG. The down side
    of all of this is file size, they are much bigger than JPEG
     
    Dougl, Sep 1, 2003
    #2
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  3. "street shooter" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Operating System = Windows XP
    >
    > I purchased a 10D and thus far have been photographing everything in
    > the Large/Fine JPEG setting. I've been pleased with the images. This
    > weekend, I started experimenting with processing RAW images with
    > Canon's Zoom Browser EX software. When a RAW image is processed it
    > has to be then converted to save the image, usually converted to JPEG
    > to view it or to edit it in PS Elements 2.0. So, what is the point of
    > shooting in RAW mode if one cannot save the final corrected image as a
    > RAW file, and print the final image as a RAW file? Is the purpose of
    > RAW image capture simply to facilitate post-process corrections? Can
    > images be saved and printed as RAW files? What are the file type
    > choices when converting a processed RAW image? Is there a way to crop
    > images with the Canon Zoom Browser EX software?
    >


    The advantage of RAW is that the camera does no manipulating of the image.
    Just the raw data. An example is the comparison betweeen the Fuji S2 Pro and
    the Nikon D100. In JPEG mode, Fuji has noticeably better resolution that the
    Nikon. In RAW mode, that difference is much less. The implication is that
    the algorithyms applied by the Nikon camera to convert to JPEG end up making
    softer images than the Fuji algorithyms. If no algorithyms are applied such
    as in RAW mode, you have just the raw data and differences in image
    appearance are due primarily to the difference in the resolution
    capabilities of the image sensor.

    One advantage to that is that you can apply your own sharpening, tone, and
    select your own compression scheme in your post-processing program.

    HMc
     
    Howard McCollister, Sep 1, 2003
    #3
  4. street shooter

    HRosita Guest

    > (street shooter) wrote:

    >When a RAW image is processed it
    >has to be then converted to save the image, usually converted to JPEG
    >to view it or to edit it in PS Elements 2.0. So, what is the point of
    >shooting in RAW mode if one cannot save the final corrected image as a
    >RAW file, and print the final image as a RAW file? Is the purpose of
    >RAW image capture simply to facilitate post-process corrections? Can
    >images be saved and printed as RAW files? What are the file type
    >choices when converting a processed RAW image?


    Hi,

    Once you have edited the RAW file it is no longer RAW. RAW by definition is the
    unprocessed image from the CCD. If you want to prevent compression loss when
    you save a post processed RAW image, save it as TIF, or PSD if you work with
    Elements.

    Rosita
     
    HRosita, Sep 1, 2003
    #4
  5. > I purchased a 10D and thus far have been photographing everything in
    > the Large/Fine JPEG setting. I've been pleased with the images. This
    > weekend, I started experimenting with processing RAW images with
    > Canon's Zoom Browser EX software. When a RAW image is processed it
    > has to be then converted to save the image, usually converted to JPEG
    > to view it or to edit it in PS Elements 2.0. So, what is the point of
    > shooting in RAW mode if one cannot save the final corrected image as a
    > RAW file, and print the final image as a RAW file? Is the purpose of
    > RAW image capture simply to facilitate post-process corrections? Can
    > images be saved and printed as RAW files? What are the file type
    > choices when converting a processed RAW image? Is there a way to crop
    > images with the Canon Zoom Browser EX software?


    The Canon software is pretty...uh...crappy.
     
    Randall Ainsworth, Sep 1, 2003
    #5
  6. street shooter

    Stuart Guest

    "street shooter" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Operating System = Windows XP
    >
    > I purchased a 10D and thus far have been photographing everything in
    > the Large/Fine JPEG setting. I've been pleased with the images. This
    > weekend, I started experimenting with processing RAW images with
    > Canon's Zoom Browser EX software. When a RAW image is processed it
    > has to be then converted to save the image, usually converted to JPEG
    > to view it or to edit it in PS Elements 2.0. So, what is the point of
    > shooting in RAW mode if one cannot save the final corrected image as a
    > RAW file, and print the final image as a RAW file? Is the purpose of
    > RAW image capture simply to facilitate post-process corrections? Can
    > images be saved and printed as RAW files? What are the file type
    > choices when converting a processed RAW image? Is there a way to crop
    > images with the Canon Zoom Browser EX software?
    >
    > It seems the only thing more confusing than Canon's software is the
    > manual which explains how to use it.
    >
    > Michael


    Use the Canon software for downloading the Raw file (suffix .CRW) to your PC
    and then use the RAW plugin on Photoshop - you can immediately correct for
    Colour Temperature and Exposure very quickly using slider bars before
    getting into any other processing. I then use Levels and then possibly
    Curves for any subsequent corrections, and, if necessary finishing with
    Unsharp mask. It took a little time on the learning to get up to speed on
    this but I now can process a single photo in a matter just a few minutes
    when using this workflow.
     
    Stuart, Sep 1, 2003
    #6
  7. street shooter

    Guest

    In message <bivnpc$biu$>,
    "Stuart" <> wrote:

    >Use the Canon software for downloading the Raw file (suffix .CRW) to your PC
    >and then use the RAW plugin on Photoshop - you can immediately correct for
    >Colour Temperature and Exposure very quickly using slider bars before
    >getting into any other processing.


    Immediately? You must have a different version than I do; the canon
    software is the slowest thing I've ever seen. There is nothing
    immediate about it. It takes 10 to 15 seconds to see the results of any
    changes you make.
    --

    <>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<>
    John P Sheehy <>
    ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> <>>< ><<> ><<> <>><
     
    , Sep 1, 2003
    #7
  8. > Immediately? You must have a different version than I do; the canon
    > software is the slowest thing I've ever seen. There is nothing
    > immediate about it. It takes 10 to 15 seconds to see the results of any
    > changes you make.


    I've got a Dual G4 and it still taks 10-15 seconds to redraw. One of
    the many reasons I don't use the crappy software.
     
    Randall Ainsworth, Sep 1, 2003
    #8
  9. Well, the final synapse kicked in and I figured out how to get the
    results I'm looking for. I had to sit down with the camera, computer
    and software manual to figure it all out, but I think I've finally got
    it. The hurdle for me was getting my head around post-processing RAW
    images via Canon's File Viewer Utility, then saving with a "do not
    convert" command. The image file can then be converted automatically
    in Canon's Zoom Browser EX for viewing as a JPEG, while still
    retaining the ability to print the image from the processed RAW
    (ImageTitle.CRW) file. I appreciate all the responses.

    Michael

    (street shooter) wrote in message news:<>...
    > Operating System = Windows XP
    >
    > I purchased a 10D and thus far have been photographing everything in
    > the Large/Fine JPEG setting. I've been pleased with the images. This
    > weekend, I started experimenting with processing RAW images with
    > Canon's Zoom Browser EX software. When a RAW image is processed it
    > has to be then converted to save the image, usually converted to JPEG
    > to view it or to edit it in PS Elements 2.0. So, what is the point of
    > shooting in RAW mode if one cannot save the final corrected image as a
    > RAW file, and print the final image as a RAW file? Is the purpose of
    > RAW image capture simply to facilitate post-process corrections? Can
    > images be saved and printed as RAW files? What are the file type
    > choices when converting a processed RAW image? Is there a way to crop
    > images with the Canon Zoom Browser EX software?
    >
    > It seems the only thing more confusing than Canon's software is the
    > manual which explains how to use it.
    >
    > Michael
     
    street shooter, Sep 1, 2003
    #9
  10. street shooter

    Dave Balcom Guest

    On Mon, 01 Sep 2003 15:44:09 GMT, wrote:

    }In message <bivnpc$biu$>,
    }"Stuart" <> wrote:
    }
    }>Use the Canon software for downloading the Raw file (suffix .CRW) to your PC
    }>and then use the RAW plugin on Photoshop - you can immediately correct for...
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^

    }Immediately? You must have a different version than I do; the canon
    }software is the slowest thing I've ever seen.

    Here's a question. Why are some people (and this is a general
    statement and not specific to anyone in this thread) so quick to jump
    on others in this newsgroup??? I have seen it too many times in the
    months I have been following this group.

    That said, I read the "immediately" as meaning done in Photoshop with
    the RAW plugin. Where does it say you have to use the Canon software
    to process the RAW file? The Canon software is slow and not real time
    so that part is true...

    Personally, I use Windows Explorer and a card reader to transfer the
    images to the PC and don't use ANY of the Canon software, but that is
    just me. :)

    Later,
    Dave
     
    Dave Balcom, Sep 2, 2003
    #10
  11. street shooter

    Stuart Guest

    You are quite correct - I used "immediately" to refer to the PS
    processeing - not the downloading of the unprocessed RAW files from the
    camera. Incidentally when possible I prefer to use Remote Capture and shoot
    straight onto my laptop - cuts out that other step - and then use a pc-pc
    datalink cable to tranfer to main PC when I get back.

    I wish Canon had Firewire link or at least a USB 2 link on the 10D.
    Although if it slows us photographers down maybe thats OK - its always a
    disaster if I try to take photo's in a hurry !!


    "Dave Balcom" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Mon, 01 Sep 2003 15:44:09 GMT, wrote:
    >
    > }In message <bivnpc$biu$>,
    > }"Stuart" <> wrote:
    > }
    > }>Use the Canon software for downloading the Raw file (suffix .CRW) to

    your PC
    > }>and then use the RAW plugin on Photoshop - you can immediately correct

    for...
    > ^^^^^^^^^^^^
    >
    > }Immediately? You must have a different version than I do; the canon
    > }software is the slowest thing I've ever seen.
    >
    > Here's a question. Why are some people (and this is a general
    > statement and not specific to anyone in this thread) so quick to jump
    > on others in this newsgroup??? I have seen it too many times in the
    > months I have been following this group.
    >
    > That said, I read the "immediately" as meaning done in Photoshop with
    > the RAW plugin. Where does it say you have to use the Canon software
    > to process the RAW file? The Canon software is slow and not real time
    > so that part is true...
    >
    > Personally, I use Windows Explorer and a card reader to transfer the
    > images to the PC and don't use ANY of the Canon software, but that is
    > just me. :)
    >
    > Later,
    > Dave
     
    Stuart, Sep 2, 2003
    #11
  12. street shooter

    Stuart Guest

    THere is a 3rd-party plugin which is seperate from PS that does the RAW
    format conversion on a number of camera sources - check Adobe website for
    details


    "Brian Z" <REVERSETHIS-ten.tsacmoc@ZLB> wrote in message
    news:...
    > What RAW plugin are you referring to?
    >
    >
    > "Stuart" <> wrote in message
    > news:bivnpc$biu$...
    > > Use the Canon software for downloading the Raw file (suffix .CRW) to

    your
    > PC
    > > and then use the RAW plugin on Photoshop - you can immediately correct

    for
    > > Colour Temperature and Exposure very quickly using slider bars before
    > > getting into any other processing. I then use Levels and then possibly
    > > Curves for any subsequent corrections, and, if necessary finishing with
    > > Unsharp mask. It took a little time on the learning to get up to speed

    on
    > > this but I now can process a single photo in a matter just a few minutes
    > > when using this workflow.
    > >
    > >

    >
    >
     
    Stuart, Sep 3, 2003
    #12
  13. street shooter

    David Lewis Guest

    Stuart wrote:

    > Use the Canon software for downloading the Raw file (suffix .CRW) to
    > your PC and then use the RAW plugin on Photoshop - you can
    > immediately correct for Colour Temperature and Exposure very quickly
    > using slider bars before getting into any other processing. I then
    > use Levels and then possibly Curves for any subsequent corrections,
    > and, if necessary finishing with Unsharp mask. It took a little time
    > on the learning to get up to speed on this but I now can process a
    > single photo in a matter just a few minutes when using this workflow.


    Hi Stuart,

    Are you using this plug in with the Canon 10D? I heard it needed a patch to
    make it compatible with this camera?Also I heard that Photoshop will include
    the RAW processing functionality as standard in the next upgrade-Do you know
    any further about this? Thanks

    --
    Kind Regards,
    David
     
    David Lewis, Sep 3, 2003
    #13
  14. street shooter

    Pat Chaney Guest

    Pat Chaney, Sep 3, 2003
    #14
  15. street shooter

    Pat Chaney Guest

    On 3/9/03 6:49 am, "David Lewis" <>
    wrote:

    > Are you using this plug in with the Canon 10D? I heard it needed a patch to
    > make it compatible with this camera?Also I heard that Photoshop will include
    > the RAW processing functionality as standard in the next upgrade-Do you know
    > any further about this? Thanks


    The 'patch' is simply changing "D60" to "10D" with a hex editor. It is
    almost certain that PS 8 will include the Raw converter and support the 10D
    but I don't believe that Adobe have confirmed that yet.

    The Adobe plug-in is far superior to the crap that Canon supplied with the
    camera, but not free.


    Pat
    --
    Photos at:
    http://www.shuttercity.com/ShowGallery.cfm?Format=Cell&AcctID=1251
     
    Pat Chaney, Sep 3, 2003
    #15
  16. I have a SIIG ISB 2.0 card reader. It's very fast. No problems with XP Pro.
    My main complaint is that it gets hot so I disconnect it from the USB port
    when I'm not using it.

    --
    Albert Wiersch
    AI Internet Solutions

    http://www.htmlvalidator.com/


    "Dave Balcom" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Tue, 02 Sep 2003 10:43:37 -0700, Randall Ainsworth
    > <> wrote:
    >
    > }That's why I have a Firewire card reader.
    >
    > I bought a USB 2.0 card reader from Newegg (cheap off brand) but it
    > crashes my XP Pro system when I use it in the 2.0 port. It works fine
    > in a 1.1 port -- it just takes a while. Maybe I will look for a
    > Firewire reader instead.... :)
     
    Albert Wiersch, Sep 4, 2003
    #16
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